Islamic Discussion Thread ٥: Free Tajweed, Absolutely Halaal

[Proctopeo]

*** 3 day ban for political nicknaming. ***

Did you really think that calling Trump "the Orange man" added weight and a certain piquant je ne sais quoi to your post? Well, it didn't. You're into ban territory now, what with your shenanigans this month. Think about it on your vacation and straighten up.

So the mods harp on about this forum being English and banned Arabic to the point where we might not be able to say salaams to each other and then Farn whips out a "je ne sais quoi"????? وااااااو، هَذا لا خَيْر

Je ne seis quoi is a recognizable phrase used rather commonly in general discussion.

Friendly reminder: the rules apply to telegrams as well.

Never mind then

Send it by pony express.

[Jolthig]

Now that I know giving salaam isnt included under that ban, I was going to make a resignation post but that was reversed. However, since NSG is quite toxic lately (its toxic all the time yes, but toxicity levels can vary), I will still go on my hiatus. I might consider still leaving as well.

However in the meantime, I'll be on my RP nation, Tarvadia for now.

[New Tetraland]

It seems like at odd religion to say the least. Slavery, spousal rape, killing homosexuals, threatening people with death to stop them from leaving it, polygamy (but not the other way around), holy war. To me, it seem like Islam was just created to appease some warlords in dark ages Arabia. Christianity used to be pretty violent, but it has modernized and is pretty tame. I wonder why Islam can't do the same.

[Jolthig]

The kind words of Katganistan have convinced me to stay. Further Kyrusia's response to the whole situation in moderation was a satisfying answer.

So I'm back after a 4 hour hiatus lol

[Jolthig]

It seems like at odd religion to say the least. Slavery, spousal rape, killing homosexuals, threatening people with death to stop them from leaving it, polygamy (but not the other way around), holy war. To me, it seem like Islam was just created to appease some warlords in dark ages Arabia. Christianity used to be pretty violent, but it has modernized and is pretty tame. I wonder why Islam can't do the same.

Because I don't feel like debating this over and over with various people. Read my Factbook posts in the links in my sig.

[New Tetraland]

It seems like at odd religion to say the least. Slavery, spousal rape, killing homosexuals, threatening people with death to stop them from leaving it, polygamy (but not the other way around), holy war. To me, it seem like Islam was just created to appease some warlords in dark ages Arabia. Christianity used to be pretty violent, but it has modernized and is pretty tame. I wonder why Islam can't do the same.

Because I don't feel like debating this over and over with various people. Read my Factbook posts in the links in my sig.

I have already read the koran. It only made me view Islam as even more messed up than I already thought it was. The rest your links seem like apologist propaganda.

[Diarcesia]

It seems like at odd religion to say the least. Slavery, spousal rape, killing homosexuals, threatening people with death to stop them from leaving it, polygamy (but not the other way around), holy war. To me, it seem like Islam was just created to appease some warlords in dark ages Arabia. Christianity used to be pretty violent, but it has modernized and is pretty tame. I wonder why Islam can't do the same.

There is a visible sector of Christians who don't approve of this 'modernization' and branding it at worst as a heresy. Don't be surprised that Muslims would feel similar with respect to Islam, especially those who come from more conservative/orthodox cultures.

[Jolthig]

Because I don't feel like debating this over and over with various people. Read my Factbook posts in the links in my sig.

I have already read the koran. It only made me view Islam as even more messed up than I already thought it was. The rest your links seem like apologist propaganda.

I have too several times, and it doesn't add up to the allegations posted by critics of Islam.

Firstly, what translation have you read, and who translated it. Although it may not be relevant to your viewpoint, it can give me an idea of how you formed your viewpoint.

[Kowani]

Because I don't feel like debating this over and over with various people. Read my Factbook posts in the links in my sig.

I have already read the koran. It only made me view Islam as even more messed up than I already thought it was. The rest your links seem like apologist propaganda.

Any defense of any belief is gonna be apologist propaganda. Try harder.

[ECKU]

It seems like at odd religion to say the least. Slavery

Islamic slavery, which is very different from the conventional form of slavery.

spousal rape

That's Haraam.

killing homosexuals

Also Haraam.

threatening people with death to stop them from leaving it

Also Haraam

polygamy (but not the other way around)

Correct

holy war

Correct

I have a factbook that addresses these issues and many more, New Tetraland. You should read it.

[Diarcesia]

It seems like at odd religion to say the least. Slavery

Islamic slavery, which is very different from the conventional form of slavery.

spousal rape

That's Haraam.

killing homosexuals

Also Haraam.

threatening people with death to stop them from leaving it

Also Haraam

polygamy (but not the other way around)

Correct

holy war

Correct

I have a factbook that addresses these issues, New Tetraland. You should read it.

That's the theoretical. The practical is that Muslims are usually perceived to condone or even partake on these actions. Non-Muslims look more at how Muslims practice their religion than what's in the Quran.

[New Tetraland]

I have already read the koran. It only made me view Islam as even more messed up than I already thought it was. The rest your links seem like apologist propaganda.

I have too several times, and it doesn't add up to the allegations posted by critics of Islam.

Firstly, what translation have you read, and who translated it. Although it may not be relevant to your viewpoint, it can give me an idea of how you formed your viewpoint.

Some guy named Ali or Ahmad or Ackmad something. It was pretty plain. Sura 4, women are worth half as much as men and men can beat their wives into submission. Sura 9, kill all infidels where ever you find them and show no mercy. Some other place I forget, women must always say yes to their husbands no matter what. Islamic rape. Lots of slavery and raping of slaves too.

[ECKU]

I have too several times, and it doesn't add up to the allegations posted by critics of Islam.

Firstly, what translation have you read, and who translated it. Although it may not be relevant to your viewpoint, it can give me an idea of how you formed your viewpoint.

Some guy named Ali or Ahmad or Ackmad something. It was pretty plain. Sura 4, women are worth half as much as men and men can beat their wives into submission. Sura 9, kill all infidels where ever you find them and show no mercy. Some other place I forget, women must always say yes to their husbands no matter what. Islamic rape. Lots of slavery and raping of slaves too.

All of this is false.

[New Tetraland]

Some guy named Ali or Ahmad or Ackmad something. It was pretty plain. Sura 4, women are worth half as much as men and men can beat their wives into submission. Sura 9, kill all infidels where ever you find them and show no mercy. Some other place I forget, women must always say yes to their husbands no matter what. Islamic rape. Lots of slavery and raping of slaves too.

All of this is false.

Its right there in the koran.

[ECKU]

Islamic slavery, which is very different from the conventional form of slavery.

That's Haraam.

Also Haraam.

Also Haraam

Correct

Correct

I have a factbook that addresses these issues, New Tetraland. You should read it.

That's the theoretical. The practical is that Muslims are usually perceived to condone or even partake on these actions. Non-Muslims look more at how Muslims practice their religion than what's in the Quran.

And that's a nonsensical way to judge Al-Islam, religion and any philosophy in general. Al-Islam already has set rule on how to worship Allah SWT. There's no need to look at a Muslim when you have the Holy Qur'an and Sunnah as resources.

[ECKU]

All of this is false.

Its right there in the koran.

No it's not. Again, I have a factbook about this stuff, please read it.

Also, all you said was surah 4 and 9. Which ayat are they though?

[Kowani]

That's the theoretical. The practical is that Muslims are usually perceived to condone or even partake on these actions. Non-Muslims look more at how Muslims practice their religion than what's in the Quran.

And that's a nonsensical way to judge Al-Islam, religion and any philosophy in general. Al-Islam already has set rule on how to worship Allah SWT. There's no need to look at a Muslim when you have the Holy Qur'an and Sunnah as resources.

Wrong. Nobody judges a movement by its propaganda. You judge it by its results.

[New Tetraland]

Its right there in the koran.

No it's not. Again, I have a factbook about this stuff, please read it.

Also, all you said was surah 4 and 9. Which ayat are they though?

What the hell is an ayaht? It's in the koran. You never read your own book?

[ECKU]

And that's a nonsensical way to judge Al-Islam, religion and any philosophy in general. Al-Islam already has set rule on how to worship Allah SWT. There's no need to look at a Muslim when you have the Holy Qur'an and Sunnah as resources.

Wrong. Nobody judges a movement by its propaganda. You judge it by its results.

I didn't say anything about a movement nor propaganda.

[Diarcesia]

That's the theoretical. The practical is that Muslims are usually perceived to condone or even partake on these actions. Non-Muslims look more at how Muslims practice their religion than what's in the Quran.

And that's a nonsensical way to judge Al-Islam, religion and any philosophy in general. Al-Islam already has set rule on how to worship Allah SWT. There's no need to look at a Muslim when you have the Holy Qur'an and Sunnah as resources.

It may be nonsensical, but it's a fact. And it's not unique to Islam either.

[ECKU]

No it's not. Again, I have a factbook about this stuff, please read it.

Also, all you said was surah 4 and 9. Which ayat are they though?

What the h*ll is an ayaht? It's in the koran. You never read your own book?

There's no need to get mad. An ayah is a verse. Like, 24:5, or 8:62. "Ayat" is plural. So which ayah of surat 4 and 9 did you get that information from?

[Kowani]

Wrong. Nobody judges a movement by its propaganda. You judge it by its results.

I didn't say anything about a movement nor propaganda.

1: Islam, a religion is still a movement, Amin.
2: The Qu’ran is propaganda.

[New Tetraland]

What the h*ll is an ayaht? It's in the koran. You never read your own book?

There's no need to get mad. An ayah is a verse. Like, 24:5, or 8:62. "Ayat" is plural. So which ayah of surat 4 and 9 did you get that information from?

'
Who said I was mad? And like I said it was the korean. You don't even need a specific ayeat. The whole book is messed up. I recommend it for horror stories.

[ECKU]

There's no need to get mad. An ayah is a verse. Like, 24:5, or 8:62. "Ayat" is plural. So which ayah of surat 4 and 9 did you get that information from?

'
Who said I was mad? And like I said it was the korean. You don't even need a specific ayeat. The whole book is messed up. I recommend it for horror stories.

Do you know which ayat those words are said or not?

[Jolthig]

I have too several times, and it doesn't add up to the allegations posted by critics of Islam.

Firstly, what translation have you read, and who translated it. Although it may not be relevant to your viewpoint, it can give me an idea of how you formed your viewpoint.

Some guy named Ali or Ahmad or Ackmad something. It was pretty plain. Sura 4, women are worth half as much as men and men can beat their wives into submission. Sura 9, kill all infidels where ever you find them and show no mercy. Some other place I forget, women must always say yes to their husbands no matter what. Islamic rape. Lots of slavery and raping of slaves too.

There is Yusuf Ali.

Surah 4:34 is the verse you are speaking of. The verse doesn't say women must always say yes to their husbands. Secondly, the first doesn't say husbands can beat their wives into submission only. It says if there is drama started by the wife, the husband must admonish her. If that doesn't work, he must separate from her by sleeping in another bed, taking time away from one another for the wife to cool her anger. If that doesn't work, then the husbands can hit their wives, and it can only be lightly. Even then, if that doesn't work, then arbitrators from both the husband and wife's families are sent to help resolve the dispute between the two. If none of these methods work, then comes to divorce and the rest is history.

9:5 does not say kill all infidels as 9:6 says, if anyone wants to hear the message of islam and if they come with peaceful means, they can be taught it and then sent back to their people so it does not say to kill every infidel. Also, 9:3-4 discusses treaties with pagans so we know it does not say to kill every single disbeliever.

There is no rape in Islam neither to slaves or non slaves.