Islamic Discussion Thread ٥: Free Tajweed, Absolutely Halaal

[The Huskar Social Union]

And of course they all just went to his god all of their own accord.

The massive armies of zealous warriors and the fact they were just defeated by them and whether or not they lived or died depended on their actions had nothing to do with it.

Yes his evil zealotry than criminalized killing unwanted girl children.

....which doesnt prove that he was not a fanatic?

[Jolthig]

I'm still waiting for a valid argument against Ahmadiyya, or are you just gonna be inconsistent as usual?

[Al Mumtahanah]

More like how Muhammad dealt with Muslims who turned against the Ummah.

There is nothing in Ahmadiyya that goes against the Shariah.

Most scholars interpret 5:17 as referring specifically to traitors, not simply to apostates or enemies (here the British). Not that this would apply to Ahmadiyya generally necessarily, but to their prophet at the very least.

[North German Realm]

I'm pretty sure that account is a puppet by a user who got banned recently.

But theres actually people that do think like him. Especially in Pakistan and India.

It reeks of El amin

Those countries should sort out their fucking religions then shouldnt they, because that is an absolutely barbaric and outdated viewpoint to hold.

I wouldn't assume him to be Amin, to be honest. He's nowhere near dissociative enough in his fanaticism to be even remotely like Amin.

Was the Prophet (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) a fanatic?

Almost definitely. And "Fanatic" is like, the most polite word that can be used for what he was.

And of course they all just went to his god all of their own accord.

The massive armies of zealous warriors and the fact they were just defeated by them and whether or not they lived or died depended on their actions had nothing to do with it.

Yes his evil zealotry tht criminalized killing unwanted girl children!

Not this ahistorical meme again.

[Jolthig]

There is nothing in Ahmadiyya that goes against the Shariah.

Most scholars interpret 5:17 as referring specifically to traitors, not simply to apostates or enemies (here the British). Not that this would apply to Ahmadiyya generally necessarily, but to their prophet at the very least.

Ok, just repeat yourself man. Alright.

You wondered why Pakistan prosecuted Ahmadiyya: besides denying Muhammad (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) was the final Prophet, it is because they are a religion founded by an express traitor to and therefore enemy of the Ummah, whom they believe is the Messiah and Prophet.

Why do you lie, man? You are quite inconsistent.

And that's not what 5:17 says.

[Al Mumtahanah]

Yes his evil zealotry than criminalized killing unwanted girl children.

....which doesnt prove that he was not a fanatic?

You are apperently defining fanatic as anyone who stands up for what is righteous. In that case he was.

[The Huskar Social Union]

....which doesnt prove that he was not a fanatic?

You are apperently defining fanatic as anyone who stands up for what is righteous. In that case he was.

No im defining a fanatic for what it is:

fanatic
/fəˈnatɪk/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
a person filled with excessive and single-minded zeal, especially for an extreme religious or political cause.
"religious fanatics"
synonyms: zealot, extremist, militant, dogmatist, devotee, sectarian, bigot, chauvinist, partisan, radical, diehard, ultra, activist, apologist, adherent; More

Mohammad, who led wars of fucking conquest in the name of his god, is a fucking fanatic. Deal with it.

[Al Mumtahanah]

Most scholars interpret 5:17 as referring specifically to traitors, not simply to apostates or enemies (here the British). Not that this would apply to Ahmadiyya generally necessarily, but to their prophet at the very least.

You wondered why Pakistan prosecuted Ahmadiyya: besides denying Muhammad (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) was the final Prophet, it is because they are a religion founded by an express traitor to and therefore enemy of the Ummah, whom they believe is the Messiah and Prophet.

Why do you lie, man? You are quite inconsistent.

And that's not what 5:17 says.

There are multiple levels of traitor. There were those in France who actively comprised the Vichy government and killed Frenchmen who opppsed it there are those who just collaborated, and there are those who spread propaganda for it. Yoi shouldn't accuse someone of lyibg so lightly

[Jolthig]

Why do you lie, man? You are quite inconsistent.

And that's not what 5:17 says.

There are multiple levels of traitor. There were those in France who actively comprised the Vichy government and killed Frenchmen who opppsed it there are those who just collaborated, and there are those who spread propaganda for it. Yoi shouldn't accuse someone of lyibg so lightly

Yet, you still lie, and now you're making up excuses. Do yourself a favor: Stop lying, and then we can have a fruitful discussion.

[Al Mumtahanah]

You are apperently defining fanatic as anyone who stands up for what is righteous. In that case he was.

No im defining a fanatic for what it is:

fanatic
/fəˈnatɪk/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
a person filled with excessive and single-minded zeal, especially for an extreme religious or political cause.
"religious fanatics"
synonyms: zealot, extremist, militant, dogmatist, devotee, sectarian, bigot, chauvinist, partisan, radical, diehard, ultra, activist, apologist, adherent; More

Mohammad, who led wars of fucking conquest in the name of his god, is a fucking fanatic. Deal with it.

Then all states are based on fatanticism because they all use a military to force obedience.

[Al Mumtahanah]

The Prophet said, "The Israelis used to be ruled and guided by prophets: Whenever a prophet died, another would take over his place. There will be no prophet after me, but there will be Caliphs who will increase in number." The people asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What do you order us (to do)?" He said, "Obey the one who will be given the pledge of allegiance first. Fulfil their (i.e. the Caliphs) rights, for Allah will ask them about (any shortcoming) in ruling those Allah has put under their guardianship." (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 56, Number 661)

[Kowani]

No im defining a fanatic for what it is:



Mohammad, who led wars of fucking conquest in the name of his god, is a fucking fanatic. Deal with it.

Then all states are based on fatanticism because they all use a military to force obedience.

Oh, enough false equivalences.

[North German Realm]

No im defining a fanatic for what it is:



Mohammad, who led wars of fucking conquest in the name of his god, is a fucking fanatic. Deal with it.

Then all states are based on fatanticism because they all use a military to force obedience.

Nice meme, but no. That's not how it works.

[Al Mumtahanah]

The Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) told us that: “Every innovation is going astray, and every going astray will be in the Fire.” Narrated by Muslim (867) and an-Nasaa’i (1578)

Then all states are based on fatanticism because they all use a military to force obedience.

Oh, enough false equivalences.

There is none, you only despise Muhammad (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) because you despise Islam. If any other man established an orderly state out of his people who were before feuding tribes akin to gangs, you would extol it.

[Kowani]

The Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) told us that: “Every innovation is going astray, and every going astray will be in the Fire.” Narrated by Muslim (867) and an-Nasaa’i (1578)

Oh, enough false equivalences.

There is none, you only despise Muhammad (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) because you despise Islam. If any other man established an orderly state out of his people who were before feuding tribes akin to gangs, you would extol it.

I don’t extol Genghis Khan, Shaka Zulu, or Gajah Nada, yet they did the exact same thing. Don’t act like you can read my mind ‘cross the screen, ‘cause it’s not gonna work.

[Al Mumtahanah]

The Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) told us that: “Every innovation is going astray, and every going astray will be in the Fire.” Narrated by Muslim (867) and an-Nasaa’i (1578)


There is none, you only despise Muhammad (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) because you despise Islam. If any other man established an orderly state out of his people who were before feuding tribes akin to gangs, you would extol it.

I don’t extol Genghis Khan, Shaka Zulu, or Gajah Nada, yet they did the exact same thing. Don’t act like you can read my mind ‘cross the screen, ‘cause it’s not gonna work.

No, not at all, they were mass murderers. Muhammad only executed his enemies if they broke treaties.

[Jolthig]

The Prophet said, "The Israelis used to be ruled and guided by prophets: Whenever a prophet died, another would take over his place. There will be no prophet after me, but there will be Caliphs who will increase in number." The people asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What do you order us (to do)?" He said, "Obey the one who will be given the pledge of allegiance first. Fulfil their (i.e. the Caliphs) rights, for Allah will ask them about (any shortcoming) in ruling those Allah has put under their guardianship." (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 56, Number 661)

Yeah, independent prophets that is. And Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was a khalifa himself and the greatest of all khalifas just as Muhammad was the greatest of all prophets.

[Jolthig]

Jesus and his companions would then be besieged here (at Tur, and they would be so much hard pressed) that the head of the ox would be dearer to them than one hundred dinars and Allah’s Apostle, Jesus, and his companions would supplicate Allah, Who would send to them insects (which would attack their necks) and in the morning they would perish like one single person. Allah’s Apostle, Jesus, and his companions would then come down to the earth and they would not find in the earth as much space as a single span which is not filled with their putrefaction and stench. Allah’s Apostle, Jesus, and his companions would then again beseech Allah” (Sahih Muslim 2937a)

In the arabic, Jesus is called prophet 4 times, meaning a latter day prophet subservient to Muhammad would come in the latter days. that prophet was Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as)

[Kowani]

I don’t extol Genghis Khan, Shaka Zulu, or Gajah Nada, yet they did the exact same thing. Don’t act like you can read my mind ‘cross the screen, ‘cause it’s not gonna work.

No, not at all, they were mass murderers. Muhammad only executed his enemies if they broke treaties.

Welp, I tried. You all saw me.

[Jolthig]

Now in all seriousness, before I keep getting swallowed into it, I'm done for good debating you. Your arguments are just like nonsense memes. I won't bother. Salaam for real.

[Al Mumtahanah]

The Prophet said, "The Israelis used to be ruled and guided by prophets: Whenever a prophet died, another would take over his place. There will be no prophet after me, but there will be Caliphs who will increase in number." The people asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What do you order us (to do)?" He said, "Obey the one who will be given the pledge of allegiance first. Fulfil their (i.e. the Caliphs) rights, for Allah will ask them about (any shortcoming) in ruling those Allah has put under their guardianship." (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 56, Number 661)

Yeah, independent prophets that is. And Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was a khalifa himself and the greatest of all khalifas just as Muhammad was the greatest of all prophets.

A Khalifa? He accepted the Queen as his sovereign, that's not a khalifa.

[Farnhamia]

Ok, just repeat yourself man. Alright.

You wondered why Pakistan prosecuted Ahmadiyya: besides denying Muhammad (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) was the final Prophet, it is because they are a religion founded by an express traitor to and therefore enemy of the Ummah, whom they believe is the Messiah and Prophet.

*** Warned for trolling. ***

You'd be livid if someone made similar remarks about the Prophet.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

I have a topic to discuss:

What do y'all brothers and sisters think about the Iran-US tensions? War or no war? Who's side are you on? What else do you think on the situation? More importantly, what will this mean for our Ummah? Also, can someone explain yo me what this shooting down a plane business is all about?

Against war but if it comes to it Iran is the enemy of the Ummah

There's a lot of Muslim nations that are enemies of the Ummah. Also your name is very familiar to me, do I know you from somewhere?

Are the Barelvi even Muslims, it is obvious the Deobandi are correct

I'll have to reread on the Barelvi, but I heard that they did a lotta bid'ah. Also, aren't Deobandis extremists?

The last bit is just silly. Supporters of LGBT are liberals while Muslims who are still in their right minds are either neutral or conservative...sometimes too conservative.

I consider myself in a right mind, but I am muslim who supports LGBTQ+ rights.

By "LGBTQ+ rights" what do you mean?

I consider myself in a right mind, but I am muslim who supports LGBTQ+ rights.

The supporting part is quite subjective, I believe. I just looking it up on the internet, and the ayah on the People of Lot has many interpretations than simply condemnation on homosexuality, but also rapes and showing inhospitability towards one's guests.

Rapes definitely harm more than simply acts of LGBTQ+, so I guess you're safe. I'm leaning towards neutral on this matter, btw.

I'd say that homosexuality was the main theme for LooT AS. Either way rape and inhospitality are Haraam anyway so it doesn't really matter.

I'm sorry for potentially derailing our current topic, but does anyone have a citation on the fact that Shariah cannot be imposed on non-Muslims? Thanks.

Well, you have this and this. You also have this and this.

Narrated Ibn 'Abbas: The Prophet cursed effeminate men; those men who are in the similitude (assume the manners of women) and those women who assume the manners of men, and he said, "Turn them out of your houses." The Prophet turned out such-and-such man, and 'Umar turned out such-and-such woman.
Sahih Bukhari 7:72:774

It was narrated from Abu Hurairah that the Prophet said concerning those who do the action of the people of Lut: “Stone the upper and the lower, stone them both.” (Hasan)
Sunan Ibn Majah 3:20:256

Whoever is found conducting himself in the manner of the people of Lot, kill the doer and the receiver.
Tirmidhi 1:152

It was narrated from Ibn`Abbas that the Messenger of Allah said: “Whoever you find doing the action of the people of Lut, kill the one who does it, and the one to whom it is done.” (Hasan)
Sunan Ibn Majah 3:20:2561

You shouldn't quote non-SaHeeH aHaadith.

You are apperently defining fanatic as anyone who stands up for what is righteous. In that case he was.

No im defining a fanatic for what it is:

fanatic
/fəˈnatɪk/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
a person filled with excessive and single-minded zeal, especially for an extreme religious or political cause.
"religious fanatics"
synonyms: zealot, extremist, militant, dogmatist, devotee, sectarian, bigot, chauvinist, partisan, radical, diehard, ultra, activist, apologist, adherent; More

Mohammad, who led wars of f*cking conquest in the name of his god, is a f*cking fanatic. Deal with it.

extreme religious or political cause

Prophet Muhammad SAWS did not have this quality.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

It reeks of El amin

Those countries should sort out their fucking religions then shouldnt they, because that is an absolutely barbaric and outdated viewpoint to hold.

He is far worse imo. Even amin would call him out.

Well I agree with most of what the brother/sister said, excluding stoning, the enkief that women being forbidden from driving was an ok fatwa, and the denial (?) of Ahmadi persecution in Pakistan. Everything else they said is pretty spot on.

And no, I'm not Al-Mumtahanah. I haven't been here in the past 2 - 3 days cuz I broke my phone.

[Jolthig]

He is far worse imo. Even amin would call him out.

Well I agree with most of what the brother/sister said, excluding stoning, the enkief that women being forbidden from driving was an ok fatwa, and the denial (?) of Ahmadi persecution in Pakistan. Everything else they said is pretty spot on.

And no, I'm not Al-Mumtahanah. I haven't been here in the past 2 - 3 days cuz I broke my phone.

Welcome back