Islamic Discussion Thread ٥: Free Tajweed, Absolutely Halaal

[Greater Cesnica]

The Saudis may have excellent education, but they commit crimes in the Middle East like bombing Yemeni children. Not to mention, they have rather bizarre ways of enforcing the Shariah like giving a man 1000 lashes for speaking out against the government. Something that isn't prescribed by the Quran or Sunnah of the Holy Prophet (saw). They're also known for helping to spread terrorism despite them continously denying it. Their monopoly on the Ummah through that education you mentioned is disgraceful.

As for their war in Yemen I do not want to get into that discussion, I have no issue what soever with their war, and it is endorsed by the Sharia it is against a Satanic force. But I will not discuss this any further as my stance on Iran related things on this forum tend to get me into trouble with moderation, and I don't want that.

Out of all the governments there are however I am glad knowing it is the Saudis who are running Mekkah and Medina.

Are you defending the Saudis bombing schoolchildren?

[Jolthig]

The Saudis may have excellent education, but they commit crimes in the Middle East like bombing Yemeni children. Not to mention, they have rather bizarre ways of enforcing the Shariah like giving a man 1000 lashes for speaking out against the government. Something that isn't prescribed by the Quran or Sunnah of the Holy Prophet (saw). They're also known for helping to spread terrorism despite them continously denying it. Their monopoly on the Ummah through that education you mentioned is disgraceful.

I did say they are far from perfect, they have issues they have imprisoned scholars and put them aside, they went to war with Iraq even though the invasion of Kuwait was wrong, it was wrong for the Saudis to call upon US forces to go to Saudi Arabia and fight Iraqi forces this was an issue that could have been resolved without arms in a Shari'i manner much like the arbitration made between Ali and Muawiya (May Allah be pleased with them), and yes indeed it is wrong for them to punish people for criticizing them.

As for their war in Yemen I do not want to get into that discussion, I have no issue what soever with their war, and it is endorsed by the Sharia it is against a Satanic force. But I will not discuss this any further as my stance on Iran related things on this forum tend to get me into trouble with moderation, and I don't want that.

Out of all the governments there are however I am glad knowing it is the Saudis who are running Mekkah and Medina.

That's what I'm saying the Saudis, particularly the royal family, tend to be money driven.

And could not Saudi Arabia not be any more satanic than Iran is? Are they both just as bad? Vying for influence in the region for their own interests and their mullahs? Resulting in thousands of deaths in nations like Yemen?

[Khataiy]

As for their war in Yemen I do not want to get into that discussion, I have no issue what soever with their war, and it is endorsed by the Sharia it is against a Satanic force. But I will not discuss this any further as my stance on Iran related things on this forum tend to get me into trouble with moderation, and I don't want that.

Out of all the governments there are however I am glad knowing it is the Saudis who are running Mekkah and Medina.

Are you defending the Saudis bombing schoolchildren?

Nice strawman please don't go there, I support Yemen's sovereignty from Iranian backed proxies that openly praise the man gassing of children in Syria, and I support Yemen's right to self-defense, and the cooperation between Arab and Islamic countries against the Houthis who I do sincerely believe are servants of Satan.

[Greater Cesnica]

I did say they are far from perfect, they have issues they have imprisoned scholars and put them aside, they went to war with Iraq even though the invasion of Kuwait was wrong, it was wrong for the Saudis to call upon US forces to go to Saudi Arabia and fight Iraqi forces this was an issue that could have been resolved without arms in a Shari'i manner much like the arbitration made between Ali and Muawiya (May Allah be pleased with them), and yes indeed it is wrong for them to punish people for criticizing them.

As for their war in Yemen I do not want to get into that discussion, I have no issue what soever with their war, and it is endorsed by the Sharia it is against a Satanic force. But I will not discuss this any further as my stance on Iran related things on this forum tend to get me into trouble with moderation, and I don't want that.

Out of all the governments there are however I am glad knowing it is the Saudis who are running Mekkah and Medina.

That's what I'm saying the Saudis, particularly the royal family, tend to be money driven.

And could not Saudi Arabia not be any more satanic than Iran is? Are they both just as bad? Vying for influence in the region for their own interests and their mullahs? Resulting in thousands of deaths in nations like Yemen?

The Saudi government is the embodiment of the shataan. Go ahead, cuss me out, curse me to Jahanaam for that. I don't give a fuck. The Saudis have betrayed all decent Muslims. Tell me, why haven't they taken in any MUSLIM REFUGEES even though they have empty, air-conditioned, fully-stocked refugee camps in the middle of the desert just sitting there?

[Greater Cesnica]

Are you defending the Saudis bombing schoolchildren?

Nice strawman please don't go there, I support Yemen's sovereignty from Iranian backed proxies that openly praise the man gassing of children in Syria, and I support Yemen's right to self-defense, and the cooperation between Arab and Islamic countries against the Houthis who I do sincerely believe are servants of Satan.

You're a sheep. If anything Iran is the rightful representative of Islam, not Saudi Arabia. The Saudis are in bed with America and Israel, and they DO NOT CARE ABOUT ISLAM ONE BIT. Not at ALL. They want money. Aramco earns nearly a billion dollars a day from exporting oil. They are not Islamic at all.

[Jolthig]

Are you defending the Saudis bombing schoolchildren?

Nice strawman please don't go there, I support Yemen's sovereignty from Iranian backed proxies that openly praise the man gassing of children in Syria, and I support Yemen's right to self-defense, and the cooperation between Arab and Islamic countries against the Houthis who I do sincerely believe are servants of Satan.

Really, anyone who is too embellished in this world and fights for their own interests rather than for Allah is what makes someone a servant of Satan. That includes the Saudis and those who work for them. Not just Iranians and those who work for them too.

[Greater Cesnica]

Nice strawman please don't go there, I support Yemen's sovereignty from Iranian backed proxies that openly praise the man gassing of children in Syria, and I support Yemen's right to self-defense, and the cooperation between Arab and Islamic countries against the Houthis who I do sincerely believe are servants of Satan.

Really, anyone who is too embellished in this world and fights for their own interests rather than for Allah is what makes someone a servant of Satan. That includes the Saudis and those who work for them. Not just Iranians and those who work for them too.

A moderate Islamic democracy needs to be installed in Saudi Arabia. I would nominate the Hashemites to impose rule over the Holy Sites.

[Jolthig]

Really, anyone who is too embellished in this world and fights for their own interests rather than for Allah is what makes someone a servant of Satan. That includes the Saudis and those who work for them. Not just Iranians and those who work for them too.

A moderate Islamic democracy needs to be installed in Saudi Arabia. I would nominate the Hashemites to impose rule over the Holy Sites.

A true Islamic government can only happen when people understand the ettiques of Shariah, and that can only be truly established through the Institution of Ahmadiyya subservient to the Khalifa of the time. Inshallah

[Greater Cesnica]

A moderate Islamic democracy needs to be installed in Saudi Arabia. I would nominate the Hashemites to impose rule over the Holy Sites.

A true Islamic government can only happen when people understand the ettiques of Shariah, and that can only be truly established through the Institution of Ahmadiyya subservient to the Khalifa of the time. Inshallah

Think about this. How many Ahmadi Jihadists are there? None. How many acts of terrorism have been committed by Ahmadis? None. We are literally the most peaceful Muslims on the planet, yet we are persecuted for our perceived blasphemy and apostasy.

[Jolthig]

A true Islamic government can only happen when people understand the ettiques of Shariah, and that can only be truly established through the Institution of Ahmadiyya subservient to the Khalifa of the time. Inshallah

Think about this. How many Ahmadi Jihadists are there? None. How many acts of terrorism have been committed by Ahmadis? None. We are literally the most peaceful Muslims on the planet, yet we are persecuted for our perceived blasphemy and apostasy.

I agree.

May Allah save all Ahmadis from persecution. Ameen.

[Greater Cesnica]

Think about this. How many Ahmadi Jihadists are there? None. How many acts of terrorism have been committed by Ahmadis? None. We are literally the most peaceful Muslims on the planet, yet we are persecuted for our perceived blasphemy and apostasy.

I agree.

May Allah save all Ahmadis from persecution. Ameen.

I would like to give some insight as to one of the main reasons I have returned to Ahmadiyyat. My Christian girlfriend (yes, I'm dating. Yes, dating is frowned upon in Islam, and is considered haraam by many. No, I do not have shame. I have known her for more than half of my lifespan) has been accepted by the Ahmadi community in the city where I live, which is in Ontario, Canada. She is not discriminated against by anyone, and she is not frowned upon by anyone within the Ahmadi community here. Nearly everyone approves of my intentions with her, and supports her and I. That was the final straw. Not only did they let someone who converted from Ahmadiyyat return, they accepted the person I love. This is why the Ahmadiyyat interpretation of Islam is superior to all others- it is modern, reformed, yet sticks to the divine roots of Islam without the extremist elements other schools of Islamic thought comprise of.

[Jolthig]

I agree.

May Allah save all Ahmadis from persecution. Ameen.

I would like to give some insight as to one of the main reasons I have returned to Ahmadiyyat. My Christian girlfriend (yes, I'm dating. Yes, dating is frowned upon in Islam, and is considered haraam by many. No, I do not have shame. I have known her for more than half of my lifespan) has been accepted by the Ahmadi community in the city where I live, which is in Ontario, Canada. She is not discriminated against by anyone, and she is not frowned upon by anyone within the Ahmadi community here. Nearly everyone approves of my intentions with her, and supports her and I. That was the final straw. Not only did they let someone who converted from Ahmadiyyat return, they accepted the person I love. This is why the Ahmadiyyat interpretation of Islam is superior to all others- it is modern, reformed, yet sticks to the divine roots of Islam without the extremist elements other schools of Islamic thought comprise of.

Well, it's not necessarily modern or reformed. Rather, we go back to the roots: That of the Sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad (saw). As with all religions, you'll have fundamentalists distort the main teachings and give extreme interpretations of them like the Wahhabists do. This is why the Promised Messiah (as) was sent to remove these misconceptions and restore the original teachings. I highly recommend you marry her one of these days.

I'm glad you found your way back though. One tip: Don't look to non-Ahmadi Muslims for interpretation of Islam, but rather, Ahmadis. This is a strict policy of myself that I follow.

[Greater Cesnica]

I would like to give some insight as to one of the main reasons I have returned to Ahmadiyyat. My Christian girlfriend (yes, I'm dating. Yes, dating is frowned upon in Islam, and is considered haraam by many. No, I do not have shame. I have known her for more than half of my lifespan) has been accepted by the Ahmadi community in the city where I live, which is in Ontario, Canada. She is not discriminated against by anyone, and she is not frowned upon by anyone within the Ahmadi community here. Nearly everyone approves of my intentions with her, and supports her and I. That was the final straw. Not only did they let someone who converted from Ahmadiyyat return, they accepted the person I love. This is why the Ahmadiyyat interpretation of Islam is superior to all others- it is modern, reformed, yet sticks to the divine roots of Islam without the extremist elements other schools of Islamic thought comprise of.

I highly recommend you marry her one of these days.

I'm glad you found your way back though. One tip: Don't look to non-Ahmadi Muslims for interpretation of Islam, but rather, Ahmadis. This is a strict policy of myself that I follow.

We are still young. Once we are established I will be prepared to do that. I am considering proposing within a year or so however.

[Jolthig]

I highly recommend you marry her one of these days.

I'm glad you found your way back though. One tip: Don't look to non-Ahmadi Muslims for interpretation of Islam, but rather, Ahmadis. This is a strict policy of myself that I follow.

We are still young. Once we are established I will be prepared to do that. I am considering proposing within a year or so however.

Okay, cool. Give my salaam to her.

[Greater Cesnica]

We are still young. Once we are established I will be prepared to do that. I am considering proposing within a year or so however.

Okay, cool. Give my salaam to her.

I'll remember to do so

[Jolthig]

Okay, cool. Give my salaam to her.

I'll remember to do so

Welcome back, brother!

Now I don't have to be alone on here in NSG anymore as being the only Ahmadi and defender of Ahmadiyya from its opponents though they are very small in number on NSG and it's only Al Mumtahanah that I really debate with on Ahmadiyya.

[Khataiy]

I did say they are far from perfect, they have issues they have imprisoned scholars and put them aside, they went to war with Iraq even though the invasion of Kuwait was wrong, it was wrong for the Saudis to call upon US forces to go to Saudi Arabia and fight Iraqi forces this was an issue that could have been resolved without arms in a Shari'i manner much like the arbitration made between Ali and Muawiya (May Allah be pleased with them), and yes indeed it is wrong for them to punish people for criticizing them.

As for their war in Yemen I do not want to get into that discussion, I have no issue what soever with their war, and it is endorsed by the Sharia it is against a Satanic force. But I will not discuss this any further as my stance on Iran related things on this forum tend to get me into trouble with moderation, and I don't want that.

Out of all the governments there are however I am glad knowing it is the Saudis who are running Mekkah and Medina.

That's what I'm saying the Saudis, particularly the royal family, tend to be money driven.

And could not Saudi Arabia not be any more satanic than Iran is? Are they both just as bad? Vying for influence in the region for their own interests and their mullahs? Resulting in thousands of deaths in nations like Yemen?

The Saudis were here before Iran's regime, Iran's regime was created after the revolution. Saudi Arabia has a natural right in a sense to have the position they do, they are center of the Arab world, they are the home of Islam. In Saudi Arabia you will see the people are good, the best scholars of our era come from there and the laws of God are applied. They have a satisfactory environment and in this era, that's something rare. They have made a lot of mistakes but in my view the good out weighs their bad to a degree, I think for example their feud with Qatar is being handled wrong, their proxy war in Libya is also wrong they are making Muslims fight each other. This isn't to say Qatar is in the right either as they have done many of these same things and have errors of their own.

It also isn't fair to put the Saudis and Iranians on the same level, as I do not consider their religion to be Islamic, I do not believe the Twelver sect of Shiism is Islamic, I consider it a separate religion and that its adherents are apostates. Where as the Saudis are from Ahlus Sunnah, and they support Ahlus Sunnah in Yemen whereas Iran backs proxies that follow their beliefs, so it is a battle between Haqq and Batil so naturally I would support the Saudi moves to counter-Iran, because it is my view that their victory is the end of Islam.

Next, I am not from the camp of the Khawarij where I make Takfeer against people I disagree with, I hold takfeer to be a sensitive issue you will not find me saying so and so is a Munafiq, so and so is a Murtad etc. Unless I have blatant evidence that I am willing to answer to Allah with on the day of judgement, and likewise I am not from the camp of the Murjiah that refuses to make Takfeer even on the most open of apostates, and neither am I from the camp of the Madkhalis even though I have emense respect for the Sheikh, but their points are valid regarding Saudi Arabia, there is no need for a revolt and there is no need for the hostility regarding them.

Prophet (SAAWS) said in the end times there will be men with hearts like devils, and in such a time you are to obey your commanders and leaders. In this same context it is not permissible in the Sharia of Allah to oppose a leader unless they openly commit acts of disbelief (apostasy) in which you have evidence from God to prove, I am sure you could label its leaders disbelievers but even then a revolt would not be beneficial, we must look at common good, no good would come from an open revolt in Saudi Arabia just because its leaders are mistaken and what would come from such violence would be something far worse, and those who would take up arms would regret it.

[Jolthig]

That's what I'm saying the Saudis, particularly the royal family, tend to be money driven.

And could not Saudi Arabia not be any more satanic than Iran is? Are they both just as bad? Vying for influence in the region for their own interests and their mullahs? Resulting in thousands of deaths in nations like Yemen?

The Saudis were here before Iran's regime, Iran's regime was created after the revolution. Saudi Arabia has a natural right in a sense to have the position they do, they are center of the Arab world, they are the home of Islam. In Saudi Arabia you will see the people are good, the best scholars of our era come from there and the laws of God are applied. They have a satisfactory environment and in this era, that's something rare. They have made a lot of mistakes but in my view the good out weighs their bad to a degree, I think for example their feud with Qatar is being handled wrong, their proxy war in Libya is also wrong they are making Muslims fight each other. This isn't to say Qatar is in the right either as they have done many of these same things and have errors of their own.

It also isn't fair to put the Saudis and Iranians on the same level, as I do not consider their religion to be Islamic, I do not believe the Twelver sect of Shiism is Islamic, I consider it a separate religion and that its adherents are apostates. Where as the Saudis are from Ahlus Sunnah, and they support Ahlus Sunnah in Yemen whereas Iran backs proxies that follow their beliefs, so it is a battle between Haqq and Batil so naturally I would support the Saudi moves to counter-Iran, because it is my view that their victory is the end of Islam.

Next, I am not from the camp of the Khawarij where I make Takfeer against people I disagree with, I hold takfeer to be a sensitive issue you will not find me saying so and so is a Munafiq, so and so is a Murtad etc. Unless I have blatant evidence that I am willing to answer to Allah with on the day of judgement, and likewise I am not from the camp of the Murjiah that refuses to make Takfeer even on the most open of apostates, and neither am I from the camp of the Madkhalis even though I have emense respect for the Sheikh, but their points are valid regarding Saudi Arabia, there is no need for a revolt and there is no need for the hostility regarding them.

Prophet (SAAWS) said in the end times there will be men with hearts like devils, and in such a time you are to obey your commanders and leaders. In this same context it is not permissible in the Sharia of Allah to oppose a leader unless they openly commit acts of disbelief (apostasy) in which you have evidence from God to prove, I am sure you could label its leaders disbelievers but even then a revolt would not be beneficial, we must look at common good, no good would come from an open revolt in Saudi Arabia just because its leaders are mistaken and what would come from such violence would be something far worse, and those who would take up arms would regret it.

I agree that Shi'ite Islam has a lot of doctrines I disagree with completely. They definitely do have fabricated hadith regarding the Holy Sahaba, Abu Bakr, Umar, and Uthman (rm), but so as long as one recites the kalima, they are Muslim. Even if they have beliefs that may be at odds with the Sunnah. I'm not anymore of a fan of Iran either. I hate their government because they have enforced a wrong interpretation of Islam on its people and they force people to fast which is against the basic fundamentals of fasting in the first place. But there are righteous Shi'ites out there who are nothing like the mullahs of the Iranian government which is why being Shi'ite by itself isn't grounds for takfir.

Saudi Arabia does have nice education, yes, but it can also be misleading imo as what happens with the rise of terrorist groups among the Ummah. And yea, it's true Saudi Arabia has wonderful people among the commonfolk. I've read that Arabs generally are very nice people. Theres actually an Arab man from Jordan who occasionally visits our masjid. Wonderful man. The arabs fascinate me greatly.

And yeah, that is the issue, Saudi Arabia helps to instigate wars too, making muslims fight one another when it's forbidden by the Quran and Sunnah. It's not that it's a mistake, but it's deliberately done on purpose by some of the greedy members of the Saudi royal family clan. Why? Because money is more important than Allah. Which is a disgrace.

That's why I say the Saudi government isn't any better than Iran's. But I really dislike the whole "holy war against Iran" thing. Because I could say the perspective of Ahmadiyya that all of you are in the wrong, but that's a topic for another day.

[Khataiy]

The Saudis were here before Iran's regime, Iran's regime was created after the revolution. Saudi Arabia has a natural right in a sense to have the position they do, they are center of the Arab world, they are the home of Islam. In Saudi Arabia you will see the people are good, the best scholars of our era come from there and the laws of God are applied. They have a satisfactory environment and in this era, that's something rare. They have made a lot of mistakes but in my view the good out weighs their bad to a degree, I think for example their feud with Qatar is being handled wrong, their proxy war in Libya is also wrong they are making Muslims fight each other. This isn't to say Qatar is in the right either as they have done many of these same things and have errors of their own.

It also isn't fair to put the Saudis and Iranians on the same level, as I do not consider their religion to be Islamic, I do not believe the Twelver sect of Shiism is Islamic, I consider it a separate religion and that its adherents are apostates. Where as the Saudis are from Ahlus Sunnah, and they support Ahlus Sunnah in Yemen whereas Iran backs proxies that follow their beliefs, so it is a battle between Haqq and Batil so naturally I would support the Saudi moves to counter-Iran, because it is my view that their victory is the end of Islam.

Next, I am not from the camp of the Khawarij where I make Takfeer against people I disagree with, I hold takfeer to be a sensitive issue you will not find me saying so and so is a Munafiq, so and so is a Murtad etc. Unless I have blatant evidence that I am willing to answer to Allah with on the day of judgement, and likewise I am not from the camp of the Murjiah that refuses to make Takfeer even on the most open of apostates, and neither am I from the camp of the Madkhalis even though I have emense respect for the Sheikh, but their points are valid regarding Saudi Arabia, there is no need for a revolt and there is no need for the hostility regarding them.

Prophet (SAAWS) said in the end times there will be men with hearts like devils, and in such a time you are to obey your commanders and leaders. In this same context it is not permissible in the Sharia of Allah to oppose a leader unless they openly commit acts of disbelief (apostasy) in which you have evidence from God to prove, I am sure you could label its leaders disbelievers but even then a revolt would not be beneficial, we must look at common good, no good would come from an open revolt in Saudi Arabia just because its leaders are mistaken and what would come from such violence would be something far worse, and those who would take up arms would regret it.

I agree that Shi'ite Islam has a lot of doctrines I disagree with completely. They definitely do have fabricated hadith regarding the Holy Sahaba, Abu Bakr, Umar, and Uthman (rm), but so as long as one recites the kalima, they are Muslim. Even if they have beliefs that may be at odds with the Sunnah. I'm not anymore of a fan of Iran either. I hate their government because they have enforced a wrong interpretation of Islam on its people and they force people to fast which is against the basic fundamentals of fasting in the first place. But there are righteous Shi'ites out there who are nothing like the mullahs of the Iranian government which is why being Shi'ite by itself isn't grounds for takfir.

Saudi Arabia does have nice education, yes, but it can also be misleading imo as what happens with the rise of terrorist groups among the Ummah. And yea, it's true Saudi Arabia has wonderful people among the commonfolk. I've read that Arabs generally are very nice people. Theres actually an Arab man from Jordan who occasionally visits our masjid. Wonderful man. The arabs fascinate me greatly.

And yeah, that is the issue, Saudi Arabia helps to instigate wars too, making muslims fight one another when it's forbidden by the Quran and Sunnah. It's not that it's a mistake, but it's deliberately done on purpose by some of the greedy members of the Saudi royal family clan. Why? Because money is more important than Allah. Which is a disgrace.

That's why I say the Saudi government isn't any better than Iran's. But I really dislike the whole "holy war against Iran" thing. Because I could say the perspective of Ahmadiyya that all of you are in the wrong, but that's a topic for another day.

Saying the Kalima makes you a Muslim if you believe in what you are saying, but you know who else said the Kalima? The Sahaba (RA) and according to Shia beliefs, Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthman, Khalid Ibn Walid, Muawiya, and Aisha are disbelievers they make open takfeer against the Sahaba, if I were to make Takfeer against a regular Muslim how would we respond? The Prophet (SAAWS) said that if you make Takfeer against a fellow Muslim you your self are the disbeliever, so therefore by saying that the Sahaba are disbelievers anyone who makes this claim by the Hadith of the Prophet is a disbeliever, the Prophet (SAAWS) also said refusal to make Takfeer on a disbeliever is an act of disbelief, therefore when someone says Umar Ibn Khattab is a disbeliever that person themselves are disbelievers, and if we were to sit here and say he [The person calling Umar a disbeliever] isn't, we ourselves would be disbelievers too, Umar Ibn Khattab is not only a Sahabi but he was our brother in Islam.

[Greater Cesnica]

To those who blindly oppose Ahmadi Muslims, you should be proud of what you've done. Tomorrow the Jalsa Salana Canada (spiritual gathering of the Ahmadi community) will continue to be held at the International Center. I will be attending tomorrow. They have eliminated all vehicle drop-off zones, there will be armed security and police with rifles and shotguns, and there will be ram-proof barriers and bomb-sniffing dogs. These measures weren't implemented last year. This is because of threats from hard-line extremist groups and individuals in Canada. This is what you have done to my ethnic creed, you have persecuted and threatened them to the point that men and women are forced to protect us and potentially use deadly force against a would-be attacker. Your adherence to original Islamic principles is outstanding.

[Jolthig]

I agree that Shi'ite Islam has a lot of doctrines I disagree with completely. They definitely do have fabricated hadith regarding the Holy Sahaba, Abu Bakr, Umar, and Uthman (rm), but so as long as one recites the kalima, they are Muslim. Even if they have beliefs that may be at odds with the Sunnah. I'm not anymore of a fan of Iran either. I hate their government because they have enforced a wrong interpretation of Islam on its people and they force people to fast which is against the basic fundamentals of fasting in the first place. But there are righteous Shi'ites out there who are nothing like the mullahs of the Iranian government which is why being Shi'ite by itself isn't grounds for takfir.

Saudi Arabia does have nice education, yes, but it can also be misleading imo as what happens with the rise of terrorist groups among the Ummah. And yea, it's true Saudi Arabia has wonderful people among the commonfolk. I've read that Arabs generally are very nice people. Theres actually an Arab man from Jordan who occasionally visits our masjid. Wonderful man. The arabs fascinate me greatly.

And yeah, that is the issue, Saudi Arabia helps to instigate wars too, making muslims fight one another when it's forbidden by the Quran and Sunnah. It's not that it's a mistake, but it's deliberately done on purpose by some of the greedy members of the Saudi royal family clan. Why? Because money is more important than Allah. Which is a disgrace.

That's why I say the Saudi government isn't any better than Iran's. But I really dislike the whole "holy war against Iran" thing. Because I could say the perspective of Ahmadiyya that all of you are in the wrong, but that's a topic for another day.

Saying the Kalima makes you a Muslim if you believe in what you are saying, but you know who else said the Kalima? The Sahaba (RA) and according to Shia beliefs, Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthman, Khalid Ibn Walid, Muawiya, and Aisha are disbelievers they make open takfeer against the Sahaba, if I were to make Takfeer against a regular Muslim how would we respond? The Prophet (SAAWS) said that if you make Takfeer against a fellow Muslim you your self are the disbeliever, so therefore by saying that the Sahaba are disbelievers anyone who makes this claim by the Hadith of the Prophet is a disbeliever, the Prophet (SAAWS) also said refusal to make Takfeer on a disbeliever is an act of disbelief, therefore when someone says Umar Ibn Khattab is a disbeliever that person themselves are disbelievers, and if we were to sit here and say he [The person calling Umar a disbeliever] isn't, we ourselves would be disbelievers too, Umar Ibn Khattab is not only a Sahabi but he was our brother in Islam.

I do agree with you 100% that Hadhrat Umar (ra) is our brother in Islam though not all Shiites go that extreme. Some simply just reject their Khalifat without takfiring them.

To those who blindly oppose Ahmadi Muslims, you should be proud of what you've done. Tomorrow the Jalsa Salana Canada (spiritual gathering of the Ahmadi community) will continue to be held at the International Center. I will be attending tomorrow. They have eliminated all vehicle drop-off zones, there will be armed security and police with rifles and shotguns, and there will be ram-proof barriers and bomb-sniffing dogs. These measures weren't implemented last year. This is because of threats from hard-line extremist groups and individuals in Canada. This is what you have done to my ethnic creed, you have persecuted and threatened them to the point that men and women are forced to protect us and potentially use deadly force against a would-be attacker. You outstanding adherence to original Islamic principles is outstanding.

May Allah protect the Canadian Jalsa from evil, and frustrate the plans of those who try to hurt Ahmadis. Ameen.

[Samudera Darussalam]

To those who blindly oppose Ahmadi Muslims, you should be proud of what you've done. Tomorrow the Jalsa Salana Canada (spiritual gathering of the Ahmadi community) will continue to be held at the International Center. I will be attending tomorrow. They have eliminated all vehicle drop-off zones, there will be armed security and police with rifles and shotguns, and there will be ram-proof barriers and bomb-sniffing dogs. These measures weren't implemented last year. This is because of threats from hard-line extremist groups and individuals in Canada. This is what you have done to my ethnic creed, you have persecuted and threatened them to the point that men and women are forced to protect us and potentially use deadly force against a would-be attacker. You outstanding adherence to original Islamic principles is outstanding.

May Allah protect you and those other people. Be careful, tho.

[Jolthig]

To those who blindly oppose Ahmadi Muslims, you should be proud of what you've done. Tomorrow the Jalsa Salana Canada (spiritual gathering of the Ahmadi community) will continue to be held at the International Center. I will be attending tomorrow. They have eliminated all vehicle drop-off zones, there will be armed security and police with rifles and shotguns, and there will be ram-proof barriers and bomb-sniffing dogs. These measures weren't implemented last year. This is because of threats from hard-line extremist groups and individuals in Canada. This is what you have done to my ethnic creed, you have persecuted and threatened them to the point that men and women are forced to protect us and potentially use deadly force against a would-be attacker. You outstanding adherence to original Islamic principles is outstanding.

May Allah protect you and those other people. Be careful, tho.

(Not a Canadian Ahmadi)

For sure.

Nobody will stop us from embracing our faith. Anyone who tries to harm us, Allah will harm them.

[Greater Cesnica]

Are pious Muslims permitted by faith to lawfully carry a pistol on his/her person for self-defense or the defense of others?

[Jolthig]

Are pious Muslims permitted by faith to lawfully carry a pistol on his/her person for self-defense or the defense of others?

I'm sure they can though it would be best to ask an Imam for a better answer.