Malaysian jailed for 10 years for "insulting Islam"

[Baltenstein]

Erm...what?!

Seriously I don't even



You speak in mysterious ways. It's humiliating because...?

It means your people are dying and have no interest in reproducing

Right, just like responsibly managing your funds instead of throwing them out of the window for stuff you can't afford means that you have "no interest in living".

Cleary the 3rd World way of churning out more children than you could possibly feed, let alone offer the chance of a decent future, is the correct one.

[Bezkoshtovnya]

Erm...what?!

Seriously I don't even



You speak in mysterious ways. It's humiliating because...?

It means your people are dying and have no interest in reproducing

It actually means there is ample access to family planning, healthcare, and contraceptives as well as a mark of economic success as women are in the workforce and dont simply stay st home to be breeders. But, your explanation makes sense too somehow.

[Bienenhalde]

The ROC and the PRC have the same exact culture. One is the beacon of democracy/women rights, the other is a totalitarian dictatorship that uses its citizens as slaves.

The PRC is also a militantly atheist state where religious people are persecuted.

[Estanglia]

It shows more on your country that it's so petty that it throws people in jail for speech than on the speaker.

"T-that's just your opinion!" Utterly hilarious.

What's hilarious is all the arrogant stances you expect everyone to obey in the name of "freedom", your "freedom" only breeds failure.

Which area hasn't had a major war since WWII (excluding the Yugoslav wars)?

Which countries haven't had war since independence on their soil? And have been peaceful?

Which country has the highest GDP?

Hmm... could it be Europe, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and America?

No, It can't be.

'Arrogant stances' ?
People shouldn't be arrested for their opinion is 'arrogant' now?
What kind of mental gymnastics did that take?

Is that why nations which are more democratic and respect personal freedoms statistically have better economies, lifespans, and social order?

The UK, France and parts of the US are shitholes I cannot say the same for Malaysia, Saudi Arabia or Jordan etc.

Fucking hell, they aren't the best but they're certainly better than those countries.

1- Not what I said, but if your alternative to "punish so bad it creates pathological fear in the psyche of child" is "no punishment at all, just let do", then you need psychological help.
2- Nothing gives me the right to dictate how other countries act. I mean, I'd prefer it if we bombed the government of any country breaking human rights and put favorable regimes in charge, but that's neither here nor there.
3- Detroit is still better than the shitshow that is the Middle East under the so-called religion that is Islam tho. At least they don't decapitate people for speaking their mind or cut people's hands off for theft.

So in France when they behead the king to spread "frEedOm" it is cool and revolutionary but to behead a murder in a Muslim country it is "barbaric" and "uncivilized" you cannot even see your own double standards.

When was the last time France beheaded a king? Oh yeah, Louis XVI in 1793. Literally centuries ago. And that's all ignoring the fact that that isn't NGR's point.

The vast number of economic migrants trying to leave the West and enter Islamic countries really speaks for itself.

The west needs to import people instead of export people that speaks for itself.

Yeah. It shows that the place is so good few want to leave, and people are willing to abandon everything to come here.

The west doesn't need to import people, thèse people come out of their own Will.

There are no slaves in any western country. Unlike some others...

Western universities are dominated by foreigners and construction sites and labouerers are all natives or illegals from south America in the Gulf States it is the other way around the labourerers are all from India/Pakistan and the colleges are filled with natives.

Shows that people want to come here and not the Gulf States.

You'd rather the West "exported people"? Because that's what happened during the Age of Imperialism.

Also, newsflash, higher living standards lead to lower birthrates. That is true pretty much everywhere. Seeing how overpopulation is a problem for the world in general and for Muslim countries in particular, being a major reason why their socioeconomic prospects are so fucked-up and all, you should welcome lower birthrates rather than mock them.

Low birth rates while many like to say it is a sign of success it isn't, it's humiliating.

Not really. Stop pushing your ideas onto us.

[Baltenstein]

Erm...what?!

Seriously I don't even



You speak in riddles. It's humiliating because...?

From a religious point of view, it is because it means a constant decrease in the population of "The Ummat".

That point of view is quite similar to Fascist and Socialist regimes natalist ideal of having a steady stream of loyal soldiers for the cause.

It's also about as fucked-up.

[Estanglia]

Erm...what?!

Seriously I don't even



You speak in mysterious ways. It's humiliating because...?

It means your people are dying and have no interest in reproducing

Just like not going partying every day means you have no interest in fun.

Adding to this, there's a reason.
We have a high quality of life that many kids would potentially bring down (both from having to spend money on them and also having to shift work to fit the child), and we don't want to take that risk.

[New Sukberia]

The ROC and the PRC have the same exact culture. One is the beacon of democracy/women rights, the other is a totalitarian dictatorship that uses its citizens as slaves.

The PRC is also a militantly atheist state where religious people are persecuted.

Very sad. But they kinda have to do That! After all
our Atheist Bible justifiyes those crimes right?

[Handecanistan]

You'd rather the West "exported people"? Because that's what happened during the Age of Imperialism.

Also, newsflash, higher living standards lead to lower birthrates. That is true pretty much everywhere. Seeing how overpopulation is a problem for the world in general and for Muslim countries in particular, being a major reason why their socioeconomic prospects are so fucked-up and all, you should welcome lower birthrates rather than mock them.

Low birth rates while many like to say it is a sign of success it isn't, it's humiliating.

Low birth rates for the West is about 2 babies per couple, meaning every couple have 2 kids, who then couple with others and have 2 kids per couple, this means the population is stable,with the same amout of people dying and being born, in a world where overpopulation can screw a species completely, this phenomenon is exactly what humans need. Otherwise we'd have to rely on authoritarian tactics like "one child policies" to prevent famine and death as a result of lack of resources.

[North German Realm]

From a religious point of view, it is because it means a constant decrease in the population of "The Ummat".

That point of view is quite similar to Fascist and Socialist regimes natalist ideal of having a steady stream of loyal soldiers for the cause.

It's also about as fucked-up.

... Yes. That's the point. Religions like Islam would die in five generations if they didn't breed this extensively. More people leave the religion than they convert every day.

[Genivaria]

It means your people are dying and have no interest in reproducing

Because they work.

Honestly the claim that birth rates going down is linked to women working is factually false, if anything it's the financial burden of child-rearing which keeps alot of young people from having kids.

About a quarter of the respondents who had children or planned to said they had fewer or expected to have fewer than they wanted. The largest shares said they delayed or stopped having children because of concerns about having enough time or money.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/05/upsh ... s-why.html
I could go into a long rant about minimum wage, job security, and trade schools but that would be very off topic.

[Kingdom of Mantenga]

If the law is," It is illegal to insult Islam in Malaysia then that's the penalty if it's not then the man should be released but keep an eye on him incase he plans something.

[Gormwood]

That point of view is quite similar to Fascist and Socialist regimes natalist ideal of having a steady stream of loyal soldiers for the cause.

It's also about as fucked-up.

... Yes. That's the point. Religions like Islam would die in five generations if they didn't breed this extensively. More people leave the religion than they convert every day.

Are you calling Muslims fruit flies?

[Genivaria]

I said it deserves to be replaced, which it does.
It's not my fault that you can't read and wanted to invent a position for me.

You're literally advocating for génocide here

....No....no I am not.
I don't think you know what that word means,

[New Sukberia]

You're literally advocating for génocide here

....No....no I am not.
I don't think you know what that word means,

(sarcasm Mah boi)

[Estanglia]

If the law is," It is illegal to insult Islam in Malaysia then that's the penalty if it's not then the man should be released but keep an eye on him incase he plans something.

'It's the law' is a shit argument.

And what is he planning? Calling your God dumb? It shows more on you that you seem to think he's a threat than on him.

[Genivaria]

....No....no I am not.
I don't think you know what that word means,

(sarcasm Mah boi)

Ah. In future a common method of showing sarcasm is putting "/s" at the end of the statement since tone cannot be heard through text.

[New Sukberia]

(sarcasm Mah boi)

Ah. In future a common method of showing sarcasm is putting "/s" at the end of the statement since tone cannot be heard through text.

I thought it was ridiculous enough. Thanks for the tip

[Handecanistan]

... Yes. That's the point. Religions like Islam would die in five generations if they didn't breed this extensively. More people leave the religion than they convert every day.

Are you calling Muslims fruit flies?

It's a well known fact that religions target and spread their beliefs onto children in as that is the state that is easiest to manipulate, as they have learnt that "adults know best" and don't have enough experience to question things or think critically. If a religion didn't bolster their numbers by reproducing more then they'd end up shrinking.

It's a sad fact that even religions have recognised that it is extremely difficult to convert an adult to their religion and started targeting kids instead (especially Catholics lol). Not that it isn't impossible to convert an adult, even atheist sometimes convert to other religions. Though I don't see why they'd convert to a religion that would imprison them for asking questions or making a criticism.

[New Sukberia]

Are you calling Muslims fruit flies?

It's a well known fact that religions target and spread their beliefs onto children in as that is the state that is easiest to manipulate, as they have learnt that "adults know best" and don't have enough experience to question things or think critically. If a religion didn't bolster their numbers by reproducing more then they'd end up shrinking.

It's a sad fact that even religions have recognised that it is extremely difficult to convert an adult to their religion and started targeting kids instead (especially Catholics lol). Not that it isn't impossible to convert an adult, even atheist sometimes convert to other religions. Though I don't see why they'd convert to a religion that would imprison them for asking questions or making a criticism.

"started targetting kids instead ( especially Catholics lol)"

My lungs Hurt now

[Bezkoshtovnya]

If the law is," It is illegal to insult Islam in Malaysia then that's the penalty if it's not then the man should be released but keep an eye on him incase he plans something.

Yeah, I mean what if he plans to say even MORE slightly critical or mean words regarding Islam? How would the nation even be able to bear such a tragedy?

[Gormwood]

Are you calling Muslims fruit flies?

It's a well known fact that religions target and spread their beliefs onto children in as that is the state that is easiest to manipulate, as they have learnt that "adults know best" and don't have enough experience to question things or think critically. If a religion didn't bolster their numbers by reproducing more then they'd end up shrinking.

It's a sad fact that even religions have recognised that it is extremely difficult to convert an adult to their religion and started targeting kids instead (especially Catholics lol). Not that it isn't impossible to convert an adult, even atheist sometimes convert to other religions. Though I don't see why they'd convert to a religion that would imprison them for asking questions or making a criticism.

If children could remain indoctrinated like Reaper bait there wouldn't really be any defection now would there?

[New Bremerton]

A government that enforces thought crime legislation needs to be replaced.

We already did that last year. My hopes have been dashed since then. The old government (Barisan Nasional) was ruled by a coalition of exceedingly corrupt fascist Malay-Muslim supremacists and a number of smaller, non-Malay, non-Muslim, race-based parties whose members sold out their own people in favor of taxpayers' loot and opulence. The new government (Pakatan Harapan) pays some lip service to human rights, democracy and fighting corruption, but the racist, antisemitic PM (Mahathir Mohamad) who once presided over the old regime continues to pander to Muslim extremists and roll back whatever progress has been made. While it is much easier to criticize the government, race, royalty and religion (the three R's, specifically the sanctity of Malay supremacy and the Malay language, the Malay rulers and Islam) remain largely off-limits. The transition to democracy hasn't really helped.

Just to clarify for everyone else, the Malaysian government used a civil law to prosecute the non-Muslim guy in Sarawak. Sharia only technically applies to the Muslim majority. But the intent is crystal clear. As Darussalam has said multiple times, this is a show of force by Muslim fundamentalists to remind non-Muslims of their inferior dhimmitude in Malaysian society and that we should just deal with it, much like how the Jews were treated in 19th century Ottoman Palestine prior to the formation of the now proud and upright Jewish, democratic State of Israel to the consternation of envious Muslims. This is a de facto imposition of sharia on all non-Muslim Malaysians.

To answer El Amin's question, we still don't know exactly what the guy said that was purportedly so offensive. I don't know if we'll ever know, and the effect of this is to chill any honest, level-headed discussion of Islam.

[Baltenstein]

It's a sad fact that even religions have recognised that it is extremely difficult to convert an adult to their religion and started targeting kids instead (especially Catholics lol). Not that it isn't impossible to convert an adult, even atheist sometimes convert to other religions. Though I don't see why they'd convert to a religion that would imprison them for asking questions or making a criticism.

That's quite easily explained actually. It is a known fact that many recently-converted people (not only those of Islam but of all religions really) will opt for the most intolerant, conservative and authoritarian interpretation of their new-found faith. Very often, the crucial factor that drove them into picking up a new faith in the first place was a general sense of disorientation, of being adrift, of not knowing where they belong etc. A clear and strict set of rules that tells them precisely what to think and what to do is exactly what those people were looking for in the first place.

[Aureumterra]

Sharia law is shit. Indonesia should be the model Islamic nation

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Sharia law is s*it. Indonesia should be the model Islamic nation

They have partial Shari'ah too. Fortunately one of their provinces (?) has full Shari'ah iirc. Imo southeast Asian Muslim-majority countries are the best models we as an Ummah have, but they still need work.