LWDT 7: The Earth and Heavens Tremble.

[Liriena]

r/frenworld advocated for white supremacism, including Holocaust denialism and genocide apologia

r/CTH, as per the post Proct hand-picked, made fun of neo-nazis getting egged and milkshaked, and joked about shoving neo-nazis into lockers and giving them wedgies

If you honestly think that these two are equally terrible, then your moral and political compasses are broken.

CTH has very regularly shilled for very real violence. If frenworld deserves to be banned then CTH, and tbh probably LSC too, sure as shit deserve the same treatment.

Here's the thing though: CTH has cleaned up its act ever since admins made it clear that they were on thin ice. The only serious violence you might see CTH shill for today is in their jokes about killing slave owners which... meh?

[Great Minarchistan]

And this, ultimately, is why the left will win. We actually stick to our fucking principles.

When did fighting against pragmatism win again? I'll let that sink for a while :^)

[Torrocca]

I leave for half an hour and now there's a tide of "libertarians" shilling out for Fascism and the babytalking Neo-Nazis of r/frenworld. Wewee.

[Liriena]

You know your "economic theory" is a more of a religious cult to "The Market" than anyhing else when you start to unironically argue for selling children.

>worships the state
>"ur a cult"

I think that is you famalam.

>"worships the state"
>my long term ideal is literally a stateless society

I know that right-wing libertarianism tends to have some serious issues when it comes to actual political philosophy but... lmao

[Liriena]

I leave for half an hour and now there's a tide of "libertarians" shilling out for Fascism and the babytalking Neo-Nazis of r/frenworld. Wewee.

Very interesting that it was something related to frenworld that caught Proctopeo's eye. One wonders where he originally got it from.

[The Liberated Territories]

>worships the state
>"ur a cult"

I think that is you famalam.

>"worships the state"
>my long term ideal is literally a stateless society

I know that right-wing libertarianism tends to have some serious issues when it comes to actual political philosophy but... lmao

So is mine, but I usually don't advocate for a statist solution to anything.

[Torrocca]

>worships the state
>"ur a cult"

I think that is you famalam.

>"worships the state"
>my long term ideal is literally a stateless society

I know that right-wing libertarianism tends to have some serious issues when it comes to actual political philosophy but... lmao

Ackshtually, Liri, since ur a gormless c o m m i e, u obviously worship Stalin xD commie DESTROYED with FACTS and LOGIC

[Liriena]

And this, ultimately, is why the left will win. We actually stick to our fucking principles.

When did fighting against pragmatism win again? I'll let that sink for a while :^)

In my experience, "pragmatism" is often just idealism with a lack of scruples and a serious case of the Dunning-Krugers.

[Torrocca]

I leave for half an hour and now there's a tide of "libertarians" shilling out for Fascism and the babytalking Neo-Nazis of r/frenworld. Wewee.

Very interesting that it was something related to frenworld that caught Proctopeo's eye. One wonders where he originally got it from.

>"Here's my IRREFUTABLE PROOF that r/CTH is bad!!1!"
>Links to a post mocking literal, as in actual, bonafide Neo-Nazis
>Later downplays how Neo-Nazi they actually were

Hmm.

[Liriena]

>"worships the state"
>my long term ideal is literally a stateless society

I know that right-wing libertarianism tends to have some serious issues when it comes to actual political philosophy but... lmao

So is mine, but I usually don't advocate for a statist solution to anything.

Private property and currency are both statist constructs enforced by the state :^)

[Liriena]

Very interesting that it was something related to frenworld that caught Proctopeo's eye. One wonders where he originally got it from.

>"Here's my IRREFUTABLE PROOF that r/CTH is bad!!1!"
>Links to a post mocking literal, as in actual, bonafide Neo-Nazis
>Later downplays how Neo-Nazi they actually were

Hmm.

And, again, his examples of CTH advocating for violence were the silliest examples imaginable. He might as well have pointed to the CTH users who joke about fucking the spouses of cops and soldiers.

[The Liberated Territories]

So is mine, but I usually don't advocate for a statist solution to anything.

Private property and currency are both statist constructs enforced by the state :^)

The first does not need to be defended by the state. In the American west during the 1800s it often wasn't.

The latter is absolutely false, as private currencies (such as bitcoin) do exist, and private gold backed currencies have been in use in the past.

[Torrocca]

>"Here's my IRREFUTABLE PROOF that r/CTH is bad!!1!"
>Links to a post mocking literal, as in actual, bonafide Neo-Nazis
>Later downplays how Neo-Nazi they actually were

Hmm.

And, again, his examples of CTH advocating for violence were the silliest examples imaginable. He might as well have pointed to the CTH users who joke about fucking the spouses of cops and soldiers.

B-But Liri, a fraction of a percent of the users commenting on that post mocking r/frenworld called for using milkshakes as violence, so that clearly means the entire community at large needs to be treated like a bunch of amoral, violent devils!!1! If you disagree then you're triggered!!1!

[Great Minarchistan]

I leave for half an hour and now there's a tide of "libertarians" shilling out for Fascism and the babytalking Neo-Nazis of r/frenworld. Wewee.

It's simply a thought experiment but I digress, you're surely busier bashing rocks around instead of constructing a reasonable argument

[Torrocca]

Private property and currency are both statist constructs enforced by the state :^)

The first does not need to be defended by the state. In the American west during the 1800s it often wasn't.

The latter is absolutely false, as private currencies (such as bitcoin) do exist, and private gold backed currencies have been in use in the past.

I'm certain you'll be perfectly wealthy enough to amass a suitable private army to successfully fight against the McPolice of the McCorporation that comes along to seize your private property in your ideal world.

[Liriena]

And, again, his examples of CTH advocating for violence were the silliest examples imaginable. He might as well have pointed to the CTH users who joke about fucking the spouses of cops and soldiers.

B-But Liri, a fraction of a percent of the users commenting on that post mocking r/frenworld called for using milkshakes as violence, so that clearly means the entire community at large needs to be treated like a bunch of amoral, violent devils!!1! If you disagree then you're triggered!!1!

I'm not triggered! You're triggered! Now let me continue to scream about how joking about throwing milkshakes at neo-nazis is literally terrorism.

[Torrocca]

B-But Liri, a fraction of a percent of the users commenting on that post mocking r/frenworld called for using milkshakes as violence, so that clearly means the entire community at large needs to be treated like a bunch of amoral, violent devils!!1! If you disagree then you're triggered!!1!

I'm not triggered! You're triggered! Now let me continue to scream about how joking about throwing milkshakes at neo-nazis is literally terrorism.

>TFW using innocuous babytalk to advocate for the genocide of non-whites gets crickets and downplaying from our residential right-wing "libertarian"
>TFW some milky bois gets several pages of faux moral outrage because leftists did it

SMH my head.

[Liriena]

Private property and currency are both statist constructs enforced by the state :^)

The first does not need to be defended by the state. In the American west during the 1800s it often wasn't.

The latter is absolutely false, as private currencies (such as bitcoin) do exist, and private gold backed currencies have been in use in the past.

By bitcoin you mean the massively wasteful, unsafe and unstable online currency that massively blew up the prices of PC components?

Not quite the ringing endorsement of ancap bullshit I was expecting but okay.

Also, we don't live in the 1800s anymore, and I'd like to see lower and middle class Americans try to defend their private property rights without a state against the full power of corporate America.

[Torrocca]

The first does not need to be defended by the state. In the American west during the 1800s it often wasn't.

The latter is absolutely false, as private currencies (such as bitcoin) do exist, and private gold backed currencies have been in use in the past.

By bitcoin you mean the massively wasteful, unsafe and unstable online currency that massively blew up the prices of PC components?

Not quite the ringing endorsement of ancap bullshit I was expecting but okay.

Don't forget that Bitcoin's founder(?) voluntarily disappeared off the face of the Earth with all the wealth and information and shit he amassed from what was basically a scheme rather than a real currency.

Also, we don't live in the 1800s anymore, and I'd like to see lower and middle class Americans try to defend their private property rights without a state against the full power of corporate America.

But getting stomped by the McMilitary might of McCorporation and having your property seized is okay, because it's not statism!

[Great Minarchistan]

By bitcoin you mean the massively wasteful, unsafe and unstable online currency that massively blew up the prices of PC components?

Not quite the ringing endorsement of ancap bullshit I was expecting but okay.

bitcoin didn't do it alone for the record, besides you forgot to bash the insanely high transaction fees ;^)

[Great Minarchistan]

Don't forget that Bitcoin's founder(?) voluntarily disappeared off the face of the Earth with all the wealth and information and shit he amassed from what was basically a scheme rather than a real currency.

(emphasis mine) And this is how you typically separate well opinionated comments from text filler against a concept one does not know properly about

[Torrocca]

By bitcoin you mean the massively wasteful, unsafe and unstable online currency that massively blew up the prices of PC components?

Not quite the ringing endorsement of ancap bullshit I was expecting but okay.

Don't forget that Bitcoin's founder(?) voluntarily disappeared off the face of the Earth with all the wealth and information and shit he amassed from what was basically a scheme rather than a real currency.

Also, we don't live in the 1800s anymore, and I'd like to see lower and middle class Americans try to defend their private property rights without a state against the full power of corporate America.

But getting stomped by the McMilitary might of McCorporation and having your property seized is okay, because it's not statism!

As it turns out, I was a fair bit wrong with the story. I will note, however, there have been suggestions that he did fake his death and make off with the money (around $150,000,000, in this case).

[The Liberated Territories]

The first does not need to be defended by the state. In the American west during the 1800s it often wasn't.

The latter is absolutely false, as private currencies (such as bitcoin) do exist, and private gold backed currencies have been in use in the past.

By bitcoin you mean the massively wasteful, unsafe and unstable online currency that massively blew up the prices of PC components?

Not quite the ringing endorsement of ancap bullshit I was expecting but okay.

Also, we don't live in the 1800s anymore, and I'd like to see lower and middle class Americans try to defend their private property rights without a state against the full power of corporate America.

Tthe (US) government's magic fiat money has decreased 99% in value since the establishment of the central bank a hundred years ago, while bitcoin's value has increased by 20,000% since inception. Something to chew on.

"It's the current year" the comment. I didn't know you were Canadian liri. Also you think the corporations are taking private property away the most? Lmao, look up eminent domain. The government is a shitty protector of private property.

[Grenartia]

I find it incredibly hard to believe a man who defended the idea of being able to buy ownership of children for sexual purposes didn't do so himself.

Care to point out where Rothbard favored selling children for sexual purposes?

He asserted that parents have the right to put a child out for adoption or sell the rights to the child in a voluntary contract in what Rothbard suggests will be a "flourishing free market in children". He believes that selling children as consumer goods in accord with market forces—while "superficially monstrous"—will benefit "everyone" involved in the market: "the natural parents, the children, and the foster parents purchasing".[113][114]

In Rothbard's view of parenthood, "the parent should not have a legal obligation to feed, clothe, or educate his children, since such obligations would entail positive acts coerced upon the parent and depriving the parent of his rights".[113] Thus, Rothbard stated that parents should have the legal right to let any infant die by starvation and should be free to engage in other forms of child neglect. However, according to Rothbard, "the purely free society will have a flourishing free market in children". In a fully libertarian society, he wrote, "the existence of a free baby market will bring such 'neglect' down to a minimum".[113]

Economist Gene Callahan of Cardiff University, formerly a scholar at the Rothbard-affiliated Mises Institute, observes that Rothbard allows "the logical elegance of his legal theory" to "trump any arguments based on the moral reprehensibility of a parent idly watching her six-month-old child slowly starve to death in its crib".[115]

So, we have him openly saying that child abuse and selling children are both totally ok.

"BUT GREN" I hear you say, "None of that really is him advocating for child sex slavery."

To which, I will respond by pointing out that in that same chapter of Ethics of Liberty (Chapter 14), he says the following:

It has, indeed, been estimated that from one-quarter to one-half of "juvenile delinquents" currently incarcerated by the state did not commit acts that would be considered crimes if committed by adults (i.e., aggression against person and property).19 The "crimes" of these children were in exercising their freedom in ways disliked by the minions of the state: truancy "incorrigibility," running away. Between the sexes, it is particularly girl children who are jailed in this way for "immoral" rather than truly criminal actions. The percentage of girls jailed for immorality ("waywardness," sexual relations) rather than for genuine crimes ranges from 50 to over 80 percent.20

Which all but explicitly states that children should be able to have sex with anyone (and implicitly that anyone should be able to have sex with children).

So, there we have it. According to Rothbard, people should be able to buy and sell children, and people should be able to have sex with children.

[Great Minarchistan]

Tthe (US) government's magic fiat money has decreased 99% in value since the establishment of the central bank a hundred years ago, while bitcoin's value has increased by 20,000% since inception. Something to chew on.

okay now this is extremely retarded though, not only was the 99% (achrkctually around 93%) devaluation realized over a century long timespan as well as btc's value was driven by speculative use