NationStates

Trotskylvania wrote:

Kowani wrote:Who the fuck defends Pol Pot or Idi Amin?

Oh buddy do I have a surprise for you

Oh thank God you're back.

Torrocca wrote:I also have more, including a recent release last year from the World Bank citing that half the world's population lives on less than $5.50 a day.

There's also this much more in-depth article which affirms the statistic of 80% of people living on less than $10 a day.

Torra, both of your sources explicitly say that even though there’s a lot left to go and that the decrease has slowed down, that poverty is still decreasing, which is what I’ve been saying this whole time.

Kowani wrote:

Torrocca wrote:I also have more, including a recent release last year from the World Bank citing that half the world's population lives on less than $5.50 a day.

There's also this much more in-depth article which affirms the statistic of 80% of people living on less than $10 a day.

Torra, both of your sources explicitly say that even though there’s a lot left to go and that the decrease has slowed down, that poverty is still decreasing, which is what I’ve been saying this whole time.

... I mean, that's fair enough. It's still an overall incredibly shitty situation, though.

Torrocca wrote:

Kowani wrote:Torra, both of your sources explicitly say that even though there’s a lot left to go and that the decrease has slowed down, that poverty is still decreasing, which is what I’ve been saying this whole time.

... I mean, that's fair enough. It's still an overall incredibly shitty situation, though.

I would argue that if you take into account how absolutely terrible much of our history has been, it is not “overall shitty”, but it is definitely terrible.

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Northern Davincia wrote:Things are objectively getting better and the only one not to notice is you.
And for every instance where my actions bring no harm to others, society can politely screw off. Individual rights are paramount. Those who make their own wealth have demonstrated the merit and intelligence to do so.

A lot of communists have in the past feared economic growth and development, as well as societal welfare programs, would cause their revolution not to occur.

Their ideology is literally predicated on society being as shitty as possible so that people will be desparate enough to adopt their ideas.

No, it's because life as a worker is never good no matter how much you're getting paid, because your life is not your own. You're a factor of a system of production, and the nature of that system is to get as much work out of you in as little time as possible, and pay you as little as it can.

Anyone who thinks that social welfare programs or economic growth makes life hunky dory has a hole in their head. As Marx himself put it, "It is as if, among slaves who have at last got behind the secret of slavery and broken out in rebellion, a slave still in thrall to obsolete notions were to inscribe on the program of the rebellion: Slavery must be abolished because the feeding of slaves in the system of slavery cannot exceed a certain low maximum!"

Trotskylvania wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:A lot of communists have in the past feared economic growth and development, as well as societal welfare programs, would cause their revolution not to occur.

Their ideology is literally predicated on society being as shitty as possible so that people will be desparate enough to adopt their ideas.

No, it's because life as a worker is never good no matter how much you're getting paid, because your life is not your own. You're a factor of a system of production, and the nature of that system is to get as much work out of you in as little time as possible, and pay you as little as it can.

Anyone who thinks that social welfare programs or economic growth makes life hunky dory has a hole in their head. As Marx himself put it, "It is as if, among slaves who have at last got behind the secret of slavery and broken out in rebellion, a slave still in thrall to obsolete notions were to inscribe on the program of the rebellion: Slavery must be abolished because the feeding of slaves in the system of slavery cannot exceed a certain low maximum!"

Marxism is a dead end-circut-logic ideology from which there cannot be any escape or freedom within it. Its a prison for the mind.

United Muscovite Nations wrote:

Trotskylvania wrote:Oh buddy do I have a surprise for you

Oh thank God you're back.

I have returned from my pilgrimage. What news on the home front?

Trotskylvania wrote:

United Muscovite Nations wrote:Oh thank God you're back.

I have returned from my pilgrimage. What news on the home front?

Anti-Bolshevism is on the rise. And so is tankism and blatant Stalin apologism.

Nakena wrote:

Trotskylvania wrote:No, it's because life as a worker is never good no matter how much you're getting paid, because your life is not your own. You're a factor of a system of production, and the nature of that system is to get as much work out of you in as little time as possible, and pay you as little as it can.

Anyone who thinks that social welfare programs or economic growth makes life hunky dory has a hole in their head. As Marx himself put it, "It is as if, among slaves who have at last got behind the secret of slavery and broken out in rebellion, a slave still in thrall to obsolete notions were to inscribe on the program of the rebellion: Slavery must be abolished because the feeding of slaves in the system of slavery cannot exceed a certain low maximum!"

Marxism is a dead end-circut-logic ideology from which there cannot be any escape or freedom within it. Its a prison for the mind.

I see we're already skipping to the end where the idealist thinks that ideology moves the wheel of history, and they can think their way out of material problems.

Nakena wrote:

Trotskylvania wrote:I have returned from my pilgrimage. What news on the home front?

Anti-Bolshevism is on the rise. And so is tankism and blatant Stalin apologism.

To be fair, apologia for everybody is on the rise.

Trotskylvania wrote:

Nakena wrote:
Marxism is a dead end-circut-logic ideology from which there cannot be any escape or freedom within it. Its a prison for the mind.

I see we're already skipping to the end where the idealist thinks that ideology moves the wheel of history, and they can think their way out of material problems.

Yeah we're skipping right to the point where all that ideological bullshit is piled up, and then lit on a freaking bonfire. :^)

Nakena wrote:

Trotskylvania wrote:I have returned from my pilgrimage. What news on the home front?

Anti-Bolshevism is on the rise. And so is tankism and blatant Stalin apologism.

Tankies must be barred from government.

Nakena wrote:

Trotskylvania wrote:I see we're already skipping to the end where the idealist thinks that ideology moves the wheel of history, and they can think their way out of material problems.

Yeah we're skipping right to the point where all that ideological bullshit is piled up, and then lit on a freaking bonfire. :^)

You keep using that word. It does not mean what you think it means.

Trotskylvania wrote:

Nakena wrote:
Yeah we're skipping right to the point where all that ideological bullshit is piled up, and then lit on a freaking bonfire. :^)

You keep using that word. It does not mean what you think it means.

You know exactly what I mean though.

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:

Nakena wrote:
Anti-Bolshevism is on the rise. And so is tankism and blatant Stalin apologism.

Tankies must be barred from government.

Aren’t you all about freedom of speech and the free marketplace of ideas?

Kowani wrote:

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Tankies must be barred from government.

Aren’t you all about freedom of speech and the free marketplace of ideas?

I don't know. Am I?

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:

Kowani wrote:Aren’t you all about freedom of speech and the free marketplace of ideas?

I don't know. Am I?

If I knew, I wouldn’t be asking.

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:

Kowani wrote:Aren’t you all about freedom of speech and the free marketplace of ideas?

I don't know. Am I?

“Supports: Liberty, Capitalism, Libertarianism, Low Taxes, Free Speech, Civic Nationalism, Representative Republics, Secularism, Atheism, Gun Rights”

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:I don't know. Am I?

“Supports: Liberty, Capitalism, Libertarianism, Low Taxes, Free Speech, Civic Nationalism, Representative Republics, Secularism, Atheism, Gun Rights”

God, do I feel stupid right now...

Trotskylvania wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:A lot of communists have in the past feared economic growth and development, as well as societal welfare programs, would cause their revolution not to occur.

Their ideology is literally predicated on society being as shitty as possible so that people will be desparate enough to adopt their ideas.

No, it's because life as a worker is never good no matter how much you're getting paid, because your life is not your own. You're a factor of a system of production, and the nature of that system is to get as much work out of you in as little time as possible, and pay you as little as it can.

Anyone who thinks that social welfare programs or economic growth makes life hunky dory has a hole in their head. As Marx himself put it, "It is as if, among slaves who have at last got behind the secret of slavery and broken out in rebellion, a slave still in thrall to obsolete notions were to inscribe on the program of the rebellion: Slavery must be abolished because the feeding of slaves in the system of slavery cannot exceed a certain low maximum!"

Or perhaps we simply aren't slaves and don't need your shitty ideology to help us. I'm a worker and I have a fairly good life, as do many others. You're completely disconnected from the reality of the situation. We aren't all 19th century Russian peasants.

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Trotskylvania wrote:No, it's because life as a worker is never good no matter how much you're getting paid, because your life is not your own. You're a factor of a system of production, and the nature of that system is to get as much work out of you in as little time as possible, and pay you as little as it can.

Anyone who thinks that social welfare programs or economic growth makes life hunky dory has a hole in their head. As Marx himself put it, "It is as if, among slaves who have at last got behind the secret of slavery and broken out in rebellion, a slave still in thrall to obsolete notions were to inscribe on the program of the rebellion: Slavery must be abolished because the feeding of slaves in the system of slavery cannot exceed a certain low maximum!"

Or perhaps we simply aren't slaves and don't need your shitty ideology to help us. I'm a worker and I have a fairly good life, as do many others. You're completely disconnected from the reality of the situation. We aren't all 19th century Russian peasants.

Some of us are 20th century Russian kulaks in disguise.

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Trotskylvania wrote:No, it's because life as a worker is never good no matter how much you're getting paid, because your life is not your own. You're a factor of a system of production, and the nature of that system is to get as much work out of you in as little time as possible, and pay you as little as it can.

Anyone who thinks that social welfare programs or economic growth makes life hunky dory has a hole in their head. As Marx himself put it, "It is as if, among slaves who have at last got behind the secret of slavery and broken out in rebellion, a slave still in thrall to obsolete notions were to inscribe on the program of the rebellion: Slavery must be abolished because the feeding of slaves in the system of slavery cannot exceed a certain low maximum!"

Or perhaps we simply aren't slaves and don't need your shitty ideology to help us. I'm a worker and I have a fairly good life, as do many others. You're completely disconnected from the reality of the situation. We aren't all 19th century Russian peasants.

If life were really that good, my coworkers would not be constantly joking about injuring themselves so they could time away from work.

When your normal working class job inspires suicidal ideation, that's a sign that things are not alright.

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:Some of us are 20th century Russian kulaks in disguise.

If you're not a landowner, what good are you?

Trotskylvania wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:Or perhaps we simply aren't slaves and don't need your shitty ideology to help us. I'm a worker and I have a fairly good life, as do many others. You're completely disconnected from the reality of the situation. We aren't all 19th century Russian peasants.

If life were really that good, my coworkers would not be constantly joking about injuring themselves so they could time away from work.

When your normal working class job inspires suicidal ideation, that's a sign that things are not alright.

Have you considered that your anecdotes are not representative of everyone's experiences? I mean, honestly, maybe your job just sucks. You have my sympathies, but quit acting acting like no one else can have a good life.

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:

Nakena wrote:
Anti-Bolshevism is on the rise. And so is tankism and blatant Stalin apologism.

Tankies must be barred from government.

That would suggest that there's a serious risk of tankies becoming members of the government.

Which isn't the case. Stalin sympathizers are much more common in Russia than Western Europe, and the Soviet Union hasn't revived yet.