NationStates

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Crysuko wrote:So no, you don't. Only to state what you consider to be obvious. It's not the fault of the socialists those people are a hamper full of wet blankets, hell they only ran because their guy didn't get the ratings they wanted, it's just a flat out temper tantrum to the detriment of the country.

Yes, yes. It's never the fault of socialists that they have to deal with basic economic realities.

The national syndicalists showing their real colors.

Torrocca wrote:

Crysuko wrote:That other people suddenly require a change of underwear at the mere mention? Not our problem.

It's definitely hilarious that the Peronists are the ones receiving the blame for a bunch of Capitalist investors acting like screaming manbabies because their guy didn't get enough votes from the Argentinian public. Kinda like blaming an abuse victim after they get the shit beaten out of them by their abuser because they did something to make their abuser angry.

Do you only speak in the text equivalent of counter signal memes

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Crysuko wrote:And replace it with something that suits the people rather than profit. But yes tell me how numbers on a bank account are more important.

And how are you (or him) going to replace it? What's your plan for completely restructuring an entire economy from the ground up?

There's a wealth of literature on the subject, see thread poll for a few examples

Crysuko wrote:

Nakena wrote:
Social Democracy might become an viable alternative in murican politics.

Anarcho-Communism or whatever is rather unlikely however. AOC and Bernie are smart enough to avoid cringe choices that fuckup the economy.

It looks to me that the US would sooner collapse than embrace SocDem

Nah, the Bernie train's been driving full-speed ahead recently. 2020's looking way more hopeful than it was before.

Hanafuridake wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:Yes, yes. It's never the fault of socialists that they have to deal with basic economic realities.

The national syndicalists showing their real colors.

At least I want to keep the market system lol

Torrocca wrote:

Nakena wrote:
Social Democracy might become an viable alternative in murican politics.

Anarcho-Communism or whatever is rather unlikely however. AOC and Bernie are smart enough to avoid cringe choices that fuckup the economy.

Thank goodness I wasn't screaming about "ANARCHO-COMMUNISM NOW" in that post, then, amirite?

Not in that one to be fair. No. But in others?

No comment.

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Hanafuridake wrote:
The national syndicalists showing their real colors.

At least I want to keep the market system lol

As the philosopher Jagger said, "you can't always get what you want"

Crysuko wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:And how are you (or him) going to replace it? What's your plan for completely restructuring an entire economy from the ground up?

There's a wealth of literature on the subject, see thread poll for a few examples

Literature is not the same as a concrete plan, particularly when modern economic realities have changed. And I doubt any of those pieces of literature address the specific economic realities of Argentina.

Effectively, neither of you have any plan.

Proctopeo wrote:Not only is the Argentine Peso collapsing, so is the Argentine economy.
Second-largest economic crash in any country since 1950, with the S&P Merval Index dropping a heart-stopping 48% in a day.
And it's not even the general election yet. Miiiiight want to rethink the Peronists on this one, Argentina, lest you default a third time in twenty years.

Ah yes, Macri's excuse: it's everybody else's fault. Nevermind that we were, in fact, far better off under the Kirchners. And curse y'all for making me say that aloud.

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Crysuko wrote:There's a wealth of literature on the subject, see thread poll for a few examples

Literature is not the same as a concrete plan, particularly when modern economic realities have changed. And I doubt any of those pieces of literature address the specific economic realities of Argentina.

Effectively, neither of you have any plan.

There is, which is contained within those theories. One has likely been constructed from theory and literature and will be enacted if given the opportunity. Do I have to spoonfeed you every single detail lest you hang yourself on a loophole

Hanafuridake wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:Yes, yes. It's never the fault of socialists that they have to deal with basic economic realities.

The national syndicalists showing their real colors.

>TFW you ostensibly claim to want a syndicalist economy for the benefit of the nation above all others but clandestinely have absolutely no issues whatsoever with keeping the overwhelming majority of people crushed under the boot of status-quo capitalism if it means keeping the overwhelming majority of people from improving their lives in a way different from your ostensible beliefs

Gotta love the sheer amount of inconsistency in the dogma of Fascism-Lite.

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Proctopeo wrote:Not only is the Argentine Peso collapsing, so is the Argentine economy.
Second-largest economic crash in any country since 1950, with the S&P Merval Index dropping a heart-stopping 48% in a day.
And it's not even the general election yet. Miiiiight want to rethink the Peronists on this one, Argentina, lest you default a third time in twenty years.

It's fascinating to see that the mere idea of electing a socialist is enough to tank an economy.

Fernandez is not a socialist. He's a succdem at most. You know the difference.

Liriena wrote:

Proctopeo wrote:Not only is the Argentine Peso collapsing, so is the Argentine economy.
Second-largest economic crash in any country since 1950, with the S&P Merval Index dropping a heart-stopping 48% in a day.
And it's not even the general election yet. Miiiiight want to rethink the Peronists on this one, Argentina, lest you default a third time in twenty years.

Ah yes, Macri's excuse: it's everybody else's fault.

Well, given that he's been keeping the Argentine economy from going tits-up for four years, I don't think it's his fault.

Nevermind that we were, in fact, far better off under the Kirchners. And curse y'all for making me say that aloud.

That sounds like utter bullshit, so you'll have to explain.

Nakena wrote:

Torrocca wrote:
Thank goodness I wasn't screaming about "ANARCHO-COMMUNISM NOW" in that post, then, amirite?

Not in that one to be fair. No. But in others?

No comment.

I do understand realism, y'know, as much of an idealist as I am. I've no issue accepting run-of-the-mill Socialism in a democratic polity, as much as that's not my ideal end-goal.

Liriena wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:It's fascinating to see that the mere idea of electing a socialist is enough to tank an economy.

Fernandez is not a socialist. He's a succdem at most. You know the difference.

In the minds of reactionaries, anything left of Reagan or Blair is a Stalin worshipper with a full size Lenin love pillow

Crysuko wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:Literature is not the same as a concrete plan, particularly when modern economic realities have changed. And I doubt any of those pieces of literature address the specific economic realities of Argentina.

Effectively, neither of you have any plan.

There is, which is contained within those theories. One has likely been constructed from theory and literature and will be enacted if given the opportunity. Do I have to spoonfeed you every single detail lest you hang yourself on a loophole

There's a difference between theory and actually putting that theory into practice.

Proctopeo wrote:

Liriena wrote:Ah yes, Macri's excuse: it's everybody else's fault.

Well, given that he's been keeping the Argentine economy from going tits-up for four years, I don't think it's his fault.

Except that's not true. At all. He hasn't prevented a crisis. His austerity and failure to deliver on his promises of foreign investment helped precipitate the crisis.

Nevermind that we were, in fact, far better off under the Kirchners. And curse y'all for making me say that aloud.

That sounds like utter bullshit, so you'll have to explain.

While some statistics are debatable, our currency was not nearly as devalued, our industry wasn't doing nearly as badly, small businesses were in better shape, and unemployment and poverty and homelessness were all lower.

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Crysuko wrote:There is, which is contained within those theories. One has likely been constructed from theory and literature and will be enacted if given the opportunity. Do I have to spoonfeed you every single detail lest you hang yourself on a loophole

There's a difference between theory and actually putting that theory into practice.

WHICH IS WHY I SPECIFIED THE CONSTRUCTION AND IMPLEMENTATION OF SUCH A THING. READ ALL THE WAY THROUGH BEFORE REPLYING

Crysuko wrote:

Torrocca wrote:
Imagine blaming the Socialists because of the fact that a bunch of Capitalists investors ran away from a country's stock market because their guy didn't win votes.

It's definitely the fault of the socialists that these people are snivelling cowards, no doubt.

Clairvoyance is not cowardice. Socialists are permanently incapable of organizing an economy efficiently, therefore it is wise for investors to pull out before the socialist wins. There is no profit for them to make otherwise.

Liriena wrote:

Proctopeo wrote:Well, given that he's been keeping the Argentine economy from going tits-up for four years, I don't think it's his fault.

Except that's not true. At all. He hasn't prevented a crisis. His austerity and failure to deliver on his promises of foreign investment helped precipitate the crisis.

[x] doubt

That sounds like utter bullshit, so you'll have to explain.

While some statistics are debatable, our currency was not nearly as devalued, our industry wasn't doing nearly as badly, small businesses were in better shape, and unemployment and poverty and homelessness were all lower.

Show me these statistics.

Torrocca wrote:

Nakena wrote:
Not in that one to be fair. No. But in others?

No comment.

I do understand realism, y'know, as much of an idealist as I am. I've no issue accepting run-of-the-mill Socialism in a democratic polity, as much as that's not my ideal end-goal.

Then we're gucci

Crysuko wrote:

Liriena wrote:Fernandez is not a socialist. He's a succdem at most. You know the difference.

In the minds of reactionaries, anything left of Reagan or Blair is a Stalin worshipper with a full size Lenin love pillow

Nah. I am reading currently some books about the eastern bloc nations (GDR specifically) and their economic and political system in practice. They were much, much more ideology driven than I thought, also had a lot of true believers, and their systems were remarkably designed in ways to ensure that those people did rise through ranks. Tbqh this makes anti-bolshevism much more legit and reinforces my view on it.

Theres alot of a difference between social democracy and bolshevism in ideology and practice.

Northern Davincia wrote:

Crysuko wrote:It's definitely the fault of the socialists that these people are snivelling cowards, no doubt.

Clairvoyance is not cowardice. Socialists are permanently incapable of organizing an economy efficiently, therefore it is wise for investors to pull out before the socialist wins. There is no profit for them to make otherwise.

It's not clairvoyance to run away like a screaming manbaby from an economic model that prevents you from extracting a profit off the labor of other people. It's certainly cowardice, however, when said running-away like a screaming manbaby directly hurts those people trying to better their society's conditions.

Also imagine thinking Capitalism is remotely efficient with the sheer amount of excess and waste it produces lmao

Northern Davincia wrote:

Crysuko wrote:It's definitely the fault of the socialists that these people are snivelling cowards, no doubt.

Clairvoyance is not cowardice. Socialists are permanently incapable of organizing an economy efficiently, therefore it is wise for investors to pull out before the socialist wins. There is no profit for them to make otherwise.

Take said profit and insert rectally, socialism is about making a better world for the proletariat, not more money for the 1%.

Crysuko wrote:

Nova Cyberia wrote:There's a difference between theory and actually putting that theory into practice.

WHICH IS WHY I SPECIFIED THE CONSTRUCTION AND IMPLEMENTATION OF SUCH A THING. READ ALL THE WAY THROUGH BEFORE REPLYING

So, again, you have no plan.

Nova Cyberia wrote:

Crysuko wrote:WHICH IS WHY I SPECIFIED THE CONSTRUCTION AND IMPLEMENTATION OF SUCH A THING. READ ALL THE WAY THROUGH BEFORE REPLYING

So, again, you have no plan.

I'm done replying to you. You're not reading my posts, and are clearly just trying to be a thorn in my side