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LWDT 7: The Earth and Heavens Tremble.

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Which Book on Leftist Ideology is Your Preferred Book?

The Communist Manifesto (Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels)
23
18%
The Conquest of Bread (Peter Kropotkin)
24
19%
Das Kapital (Karl Marx)
21
16%
What is Property? (Pierre-Joseph Proudhon)
2
2%
Guerilla Warfare (Che Guevara)
8
6%
Mutual Aid (Peter Kropotkin)
2
2%
Profit Over People (Noam Chomsky)
4
3%
The Ego and Its Own (Max Stirner)
8
6%
Debt: The First 5,000 Years (David Graeber)
5
4%
Other (Please Explain)
32
25%
 
Total votes : 129

User avatar
Soviet Tankistan
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 436
Founded: Mar 27, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Soviet Tankistan » Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:57 pm

Democratic Communist Federation wrote:
Soviet Tankistan wrote:That's not true, no way you can have something without selling it! If I can't sell air freshener the world has basically ended and I have no rights nor possessions.


The objection of Marx was to capitalists owning the means of production, including, by extension, the workers. He never objected to individuals having personal possessions.

I believe in personal possessions, but setting up a sales operation to profit is bound to end up with violations.
Petrolheadia wrote:
Soviet Tankistan wrote:The whole point is for them to care about labor. It you don't fulfill standards as well as someone else, you are replaced.

Enabling them to keep not caring at some other workplace.

There's a point were most humans do care. There are jobs that somebody has to do that nobody wants to do. And slacking on some can end disastrously.
☭Welcome to Soviet Tankistan!☭
In Soviet Tankistan, everyone is considered a worker if they contribute. Fascists and terrorists are not welcome.


Humanity, Socialism, Order Political Compass: 8 left and 1 upwards.

User avatar
Democratic Communist Federation
Senator
 
Posts: 3829
Founded: Jul 14, 2017
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Democratic Communist Federation » Wed Jun 26, 2019 5:05 am

Soviet Tankistan wrote:I believe in personal possessions, but setting up a sales operation to profit is bound to end up with violations.


I have never sold any of my personal possessions. In any event, I don't see how that relates to what I wrote.

User avatar
Great Minarchistan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5953
Founded: Jan 08, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Great Minarchistan » Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:06 am

Democratic Communist Federation wrote:
Soviet Tankistan wrote:That's not true, no way you can have something without selling it! If I can't sell air freshener the world has basically ended and I have no rights nor possessions.


The objection of Marx was to capitalists owning the means of production, including, by extension, the workers. He never objected to individuals having personal possessions.

I wonder if owning housing is personal rather than private property even though it does add value to its owner
Awarded for Best Capitalist in 2018 NSG Awards ;')
##############################
Fmr. libertarian, irredeemable bank shill and somewhere inbetween classical liberalism and neoliberalism // Political Compass: +8.75 Economic, -2.25 Social (May 2019)

User avatar
Rostavykhan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1860
Founded: Sep 30, 2017
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Rostavykhan » Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:11 am

Great Minarchistan wrote:
Democratic Communist Federation wrote:
The objection of Marx was to capitalists owning the means of production, including, by extension, the workers. He never objected to individuals having personal possessions.

I wonder if owning housing is personal rather than private property even though it does add value to its owner


I'd personally consider housing personal, in the context that it's a person/family having their own house, instead of a landlord owning housing.

It's not like a guy living in his house in the country is the same as a guy owning a giant factory where people work and all.

I'm not Marx though.
Last edited by Rostavykhan on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
 

User avatar
Great Minarchistan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5953
Founded: Jan 08, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Great Minarchistan » Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:24 am

Rostavykhan wrote:
Great Minarchistan wrote:I wonder if owning housing is personal rather than private property even though it does add value to its owner


I'd personally consider housing personal, in the context that it's a person/family having their own house, instead of a landlord owning housing.

It's not like a guy living in his house in the country is the same as a guy owning a giant factory where people work and all.

I'm not Marx though.

Homeownership is a major provider of capital gains though, actually; be it by renting bedrooms to non-household members or by imputed income (ie. avoiding rental expenses, think of it as homeowners paying themselves a check) and even through valuation changes in land and structure over time. As per that, it's not too different from owning a family shop or a small sized business, both of which are part of the MoP.
Awarded for Best Capitalist in 2018 NSG Awards ;')
##############################
Fmr. libertarian, irredeemable bank shill and somewhere inbetween classical liberalism and neoliberalism // Political Compass: +8.75 Economic, -2.25 Social (May 2019)

User avatar
Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59498
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Liriena » Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:50 am

Last edited by Liriena on Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

User avatar
Torrocca
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 26912
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:24 pm

Communist now and forever.
I am Her Majesty, Torra I, of the House Anarkittismo, NS's self-anointed Anarcho-Monarchist Queen. Now known as God-Empress Torra.
"Fascism is not debated, it is destroyed." - [b]Buenaventura Durruti

"When the people are being hit with a stick, they are not happier if the stick is called “the stick of the people”. The State is an oppression that must be abolished."
I go by Torra and feminine pronouns! They/Them/Their are perfectly acceptable alternatives as well :3
Suggestions welcome!

Capital - Karl Marx and Frederich Engels
Wage Labor and Capital - Karl Marx
The Conquest of Bread - Peter Kropotkin
Mutual Aid - Peter Kropotkin
Statism and Anarchy - Mikhail Bakunin

User avatar
Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59498
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Liriena » Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:27 pm


Whatever one may think of social media and big tech and bans and reddit in particular being extra stupid... it feels good.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

User avatar
Petrolheadia
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11347
Founded: May 02, 2015
New York Times Democracy

Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:28 pm


Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.
Capitalism, single-payer healthcare, pro-choice, LGBT rights, progressive personal taxation, low corporate tax, pro-business law, welfare for those in need.
Nazism, edgism, dogmatic statements, most of Abrahamic-derived morality (esp. as law), welfare for those not in need.
We are not Albania and I am not Albanian, FFS!
Male, gearhead, classic rock fan, gamer, agnostic.
Not sure if left-libertarian, ex-libertarian or without a damn clue.
Where you can talk about cars!
"They're always saying I'm a Capitalist pig. I suppose I am, but, ah...it ah...it's good for my drumming, I think." - Keith Moon,
If a Porsche owner treats it like a bicycle, he's a gentleman. And if he prays to it, he's simply a moron. - Jan Nowicki.

User avatar
Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59498
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Liriena » Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:31 pm

Petrolheadia wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
>r/The_Donald quarantined

It's like Christmas morning! Except in June.

Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.

It's a quarantine. They still get to post and comment. The only difference is that it won't make it to the front page (which is not a matter of "freedom of speech" unless you also think that my freedom of speech includes my right to trend on Twitter with my sub-zero follower count) and there's an "are you sure you want to see this hot garbage?" button you have to press.

Also, they got quarantined for advocating violence against cops. Let's see you defend that as "free speech".
Last edited by Liriena on Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

User avatar
Torrocca
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 26912
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:31 pm

Petrolheadia wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
>r/The_Donald quarantined

It's like Christmas morning! Except in June.

Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.


Not being allowed a specific platform isn't a restriction of free speech.
Communist now and forever.
I am Her Majesty, Torra I, of the House Anarkittismo, NS's self-anointed Anarcho-Monarchist Queen. Now known as God-Empress Torra.
"Fascism is not debated, it is destroyed." - [b]Buenaventura Durruti

"When the people are being hit with a stick, they are not happier if the stick is called “the stick of the people”. The State is an oppression that must be abolished."
I go by Torra and feminine pronouns! They/Them/Their are perfectly acceptable alternatives as well :3
Suggestions welcome!

Capital - Karl Marx and Frederich Engels
Wage Labor and Capital - Karl Marx
The Conquest of Bread - Peter Kropotkin
Mutual Aid - Peter Kropotkin
Statism and Anarchy - Mikhail Bakunin

User avatar
Uiiop
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5662
Founded: Jun 20, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Uiiop » Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:34 pm

Liriena wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.

It's a quarantine. They still get to post and comment. The only difference is that it won't make it to the front page (which is not a matter of "freedom of speech" unless you also think that my freedom of speech includes my right to trend on Twitter with my sub-zero follower count) and there's an "are you sure you want to see this hot garbage?" button you have to press.

Also, they got quarantined for advocating violence against cops. Let's see you defend that as "free speech".

"Trending" functions and the special treatment given by those functions might interfere with the "Marketplace of Ideas" /devil's advocate.

User avatar
Cekoviu
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16058
Founded: Oct 18, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cekoviu » Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:58 pm


The irony of The_Donald, who are constantly regurgitating Blue Lives Matter shit, getting quarantined for inciting violence against cops is just beautiful.
RWDT - REST IN POWER
Market socialist, David Hume fangirl, and massive Tuvaboo. Moderate SWERF & traditionalist SJW. Non-denominational Christian, influenced by Orthodoxy and certain Protestant currents.
/tʃɛ'koʊ.vi:.ju:/ (check-OH-vee-you)

User avatar
Torrocca
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 26912
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Wed Jun 26, 2019 1:01 pm

Cekoviu wrote:

The irony of The_Donald, who are constantly regurgitating Blue Lives Matter shit, getting quarantined for inciting violence against cops is just beautiful.


"Do we love the police to own the libs, or do we support a Republican state senator who threatened to shoot the police to own the libs?"

Image
Communist now and forever.
I am Her Majesty, Torra I, of the House Anarkittismo, NS's self-anointed Anarcho-Monarchist Queen. Now known as God-Empress Torra.
"Fascism is not debated, it is destroyed." - [b]Buenaventura Durruti

"When the people are being hit with a stick, they are not happier if the stick is called “the stick of the people”. The State is an oppression that must be abolished."
I go by Torra and feminine pronouns! They/Them/Their are perfectly acceptable alternatives as well :3
Suggestions welcome!

Capital - Karl Marx and Frederich Engels
Wage Labor and Capital - Karl Marx
The Conquest of Bread - Peter Kropotkin
Mutual Aid - Peter Kropotkin
Statism and Anarchy - Mikhail Bakunin

User avatar
Rostavykhan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1860
Founded: Sep 30, 2017
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Rostavykhan » Wed Jun 26, 2019 1:04 pm

Torrocca wrote:
Cekoviu wrote:The irony of The_Donald, who are constantly regurgitating Blue Lives Matter shit, getting quarantined for inciting violence against cops is just beautiful.


"Do we love the police to own the libs, or do we support a Republican state senator who threatened to shoot the police to own the libs?"

Image


TBH r/The_Donald isn't known for being the smartest place.

Even /pol/ makes fun of them.

Then again, /pol/ makes fun of everything.
 

User avatar
Duvniask
Senator
 
Posts: 4282
Founded: Aug 30, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Duvniask » Wed Jun 26, 2019 1:06 pm

Petrolheadia wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
>r/The_Donald quarantined

It's like Christmas morning! Except in June.

Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.

Free speech warriors to the rescue as always.
Supporting anTIFA.

Economic Left/Right: -9.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.87
Danish | Political science student | Left communist
The old world is dying, and the new world struggles to be born: now is the time of monsters.

User avatar
The Galactic Liberal Democracy
Minister
 
Posts: 2514
Founded: Jun 13, 2018
New York Times Democracy

Postby The Galactic Liberal Democracy » Wed Jun 26, 2019 1:12 pm

Petrolheadia wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
>r/The_Donald quarantined

It's like Christmas morning! Except in June.

Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.

It's not free speech. Reddit has a right to slow or stop their users and calling for death can be illegal in some cases.
NOT STORMTROOPERS
Cossack Khanate wrote:This shall forever be known as World War Sh*t: Newark Aggression. Now if I see one more troop deployed, I will call on the force of all the Hindu gods to reverse time and wipe your race of the face of the planet. Cease.

The Black Party wrote:(TBP kamikaze's into all 99999999999 nukes before they hit our territory because we just have that many pilots ready to die for dah blak regime, we also counter-attack into your nation with our entire population of 45 million because this RP allows it.)

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:Galatic Liberal Democracy short-circuits all of NS with FACTS and LOGIC

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Proctopeo
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11674
Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Proctopeo » Wed Jun 26, 2019 4:12 pm


If that's the reason T_D gets quarantined, I can only imagine that many more will follow.

Still, surprised it took this long to happen.

Edit: Apparently this happened because MMFA threw a shitfit lmao, of course it's fucking MMFA
Last edited by Proctopeo on Wed Jun 26, 2019 4:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ec 4.38 soc -3.95
I don't like most tankies/red fascists
China Lied, People Died.
6500 Year-Old Soomer
RIP the LWDT and RWDT, may their legacy live on

User avatar
Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59498
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Liriena » Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:21 pm

Proctopeo wrote:

If that's the reason T_D gets quarantined, I can only imagine that many more will follow.

Still, surprised it took this long to happen.

Edit: Apparently this happened because MMFA threw a shitfit lmao, of course it's fucking MMFA

Yeah, MMFA pointed out the obvious: T_D had a consistent problem with violence and genocide advocacy. And because big tech only reacts to dubiously legal content in their platforms when actual journalists make a stink about it...

But I forgot that you have an irrational hatred of the entire journalistic profession and you only care about right-wing extremism when it gets deplatformed. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

User avatar
Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59498
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Liriena » Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:23 pm

The Galactic Liberal Democracy wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.

It's not free speech. Reddit has a right to slow or stop their users and calling for death can be illegal in some cases.

No, you see, T_D seriously talking about killing Muslims, immigrants, "degenerates" and cops is free speech. But when a leftist subreddit jokes about wedgies and milkshakes, that's horrifying advocacy for violence and it cannot stand.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

User avatar
The Xenopolis Confederation
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8227
Founded: Aug 11, 2017
Anarchy

Postby The Xenopolis Confederation » Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:40 pm

The Galactic Liberal Democracy wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.

It's not free speech. Reddit has a right to slow or stop their users and calling for death can be illegal in some cases.

Still, I reckon social media platforms ought to uphold a certain amount of free speech on their platform.
Pro: Liberty, Liberalism, Capitalism, Secularism, Equal opportunity, Direct Democracy, Windows Chauvinism, Progressive Rock, LGBT+ Rights, Live and let live tbh.
Against: Authoritarianism, Traditionalism, Non-Market-Socialism, Laissez-Faire Capitalism, Autocracy, (A)Theocracy, Macs, "The ends justify the means," Collectivism in all its forms.
Economic: 0.5
Social: -8
I'm a 19 year old Australian who tries to think about things but fails, as we all do. I'll regret this in 2 years tops.

I think I have gender dysphoria so I'd prefer you use she/her pronouns on me. If not, he/him'll do.

User avatar
Cekoviu
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16058
Founded: Oct 18, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cekoviu » Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:52 pm

The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:
The Galactic Liberal Democracy wrote:It's not free speech. Reddit has a right to slow or stop their users and calling for death can be illegal in some cases.

Still, I reckon social media platforms ought to uphold a certain amount of free speech on their platform.

And quarantining T_D is fully within the bounds of that certain amount. FFS, it's not like they banned the subreddit.
RWDT - REST IN POWER
Market socialist, David Hume fangirl, and massive Tuvaboo. Moderate SWERF & traditionalist SJW. Non-denominational Christian, influenced by Orthodoxy and certain Protestant currents.
/tʃɛ'koʊ.vi:.ju:/ (check-OH-vee-you)

User avatar
The Xenopolis Confederation
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8227
Founded: Aug 11, 2017
Anarchy

Postby The Xenopolis Confederation » Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:56 pm

Cekoviu wrote:
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Still, I reckon social media platforms ought to uphold a certain amount of free speech on their platform.

And quarantining T_D is fully within the bounds of that certain amount. FFS, it's not like they banned the subreddit.

I know, I'm just saying. Also, I don't really know what quarantining in the context of Reddit.
Pro: Liberty, Liberalism, Capitalism, Secularism, Equal opportunity, Direct Democracy, Windows Chauvinism, Progressive Rock, LGBT+ Rights, Live and let live tbh.
Against: Authoritarianism, Traditionalism, Non-Market-Socialism, Laissez-Faire Capitalism, Autocracy, (A)Theocracy, Macs, "The ends justify the means," Collectivism in all its forms.
Economic: 0.5
Social: -8
I'm a 19 year old Australian who tries to think about things but fails, as we all do. I'll regret this in 2 years tops.

I think I have gender dysphoria so I'd prefer you use she/her pronouns on me. If not, he/him'll do.

User avatar
Washington Resistance Army
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44413
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:58 pm

The Galactic Liberal Democracy wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:Nothing more beautiful than restricting freedom of speech.

It's not free speech. Reddit has a right to slow or stop their users and calling for death can be illegal in some cases.


It'd be great if they were consistent with it at least. Of course that would piss off all the lefties when their subs started getting banned or quarantined for the same things and will never happen.

Cekoviu wrote:
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Still, I reckon social media platforms ought to uphold a certain amount of free speech on their platform.

And quarantining T_D is fully within the bounds of that certain amount. FFS, it's not like they banned the subreddit.


Give it some time and it will be irregardless of whether they break any rules or not. DebateFascism got quarantined and despite being very civil and having very strong moderation that clamped down hard on anything that broke the rules still got banned eventually. It's all about politics, not actual rules enforcement.
Hellenistic pagan, firearms dealer/manufacturer, agrarian, loves old cinema. Cops are terrorists.
Blessed and fortunate is he who knowing the sacred rites of the Gods leads a pure life.
Australian gun control didn't work. A rebuttal to the "well regulated militia" argument.

User avatar
Dumb Ideologies
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42958
Founded: Sep 30, 2007
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Dumb Ideologies » Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:03 pm

My impression was that this particular subreddit had been given considerable leniency compared to others for quite some time.

Being linked to a notable figure ain't an eternal free pass.
Tʜᴇ Sᴛʀᴀssᴇʀɪsᴛ Sᴜɴᴅᴀᴇ Cʟᴜʙ ᴏғ Dᴜᴍʙ Iᴅᴇᴏʟᴏɢɪᴇs
¸„¤*˜*¤„¸„¤*˜*¤„¸ Use Culture War Snake Oil on all your stubborn political stains - if it doesn't work just add more! ¸„¤*˜*¤„¸„¤*˜*¤„¸
The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane ~ Marcus Aurelius
♆ P ᴀ x D I ᴀ ʙ ᴏ ʟ ɪ ᴄ ᴀ ♆

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