50 Dead After New Zealand Terrorist Attack

[Ostroeuropa]

Get your own thread. Or a blog. You are way off topic.

I don't see how it's off topic to talk about the dynamic behind these shootings and the overall conflict between the Muslim community, the west, and how political policy is the root of it. Just because it isn't your preferred frame of reference for the topic doesn't mean it's not legitimate.

We have people discussing the views of the shooter and where they originate from here already. Perhaps you could explain how i've gone off it, i'm happy to abide by a line if you explain where it is.

[Borinsa]

This was going to happen sooner or later. You can't deny that the muslims didn't bring this upon themselves. There's no justifying what happened but do you think it would have happened if muslims were more proactive about making sure that they don't scare people of generous western host countries?

P.S. This is a mass shooting not a terrorist act

You're an idiot and as a New Zealander I am personally offended by your statement.

First of all New Zealand is not a western nation, we're southern and closer to Asia than to Europe.

and the fact is there have been other 4 terrorist incidents in modern New Zealand history and all of them have been perpetrated by Europeans (the 1982 Punk Rock bomb attack on the National Law Enforcement Computer, the Bombing of the Trades Hall in 1984 and the 1985 Sinking of the Rainbow Warrior by French spies)

There have been Muslims in Christchurch since the 1850s and Muslims are well integrated into society. With most New Zealand Muslims originating in India (Gujarati), Eastern Europe, Somalia, Lebanon, Malayasia and Iran the New Zealand Muslim community is very peaceful and pretty moderate in its views,

This latest attack further highlights that it is not Muslims that we need to be scared of, its the right wing white supremacist being triggered by internet extremism.
Christchurch has long had a racist white supremacist presence and so its likely that this Australian terrorist who attacked the Christchurch mosque had local support in the Christchurch area- especially as its not easy to get semi-automatic weapons in New Zealand without a licence.

SO keep your deluded rhetoric to yourself, there is no place for it here

New Zealand is a western nation culturally (or at least its been ever since the British took it from the Maori), it's not a geographic term.

Anyway yes, this was an act of terror. And yes the muslims of New Zealand are more moderate than those in Europe,
and of course all historical New Zelander attacks were comitted by whites, purely for demographic reasons.

All though I do not support islam or any other religion like it, I do in fact condemn this person who killed all these people.
This man clearly was attacking muslims for being mostly non-white rather than for their views, and that is despicable.

The only people who have the right to complain about immigration to New Zealand are the Maori.

[The Alma Mater]

This is a piece i was missing. So There Are gun laws in NZ, just this guy found a way around them?

I find it funny how the left celebrated New Zealand as the success of global gun control, and this happened

What are you talking about ? New Zealand has no global gun control. Assault rifles are freely available.

Though that may change now: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... rch-attack

[Borinsa]

This is a piece i was missing. So There Are gun laws in NZ, just this guy found a way around them?

I find it funny how the left celebrated New Zealand as the success of global gun control, and this happened

It doesn't matter if they are legal or not, people who want guns will get guns.

[The Alma Mater]

Get your own thread. Or a blog. You are way off topic.

I don't see how it's off topic to talk about the dynamic behind these shootings and the overall conflict between the Muslim community, the west, and how political policy is the root of it. Just because it isn't your preferred frame of reference for the topic doesn't mean it's not legitimate.

It is however a bit odd if the muslim community in Christchurch is perfectly integrated and contributing, and has been for almost 150 years.

[Aureumterra]

New Zealand is not a western nation

Yes it is

[Vassenor]

This is a piece i was missing. So There Are gun laws in NZ, just this guy found a way around them?

I find it funny how the left celebrated New Zealand as the success of global gun control, and this happened

I think you're confusing New Zealand with Australia.

[Saskovia]

I find it funny how the left celebrated New Zealand as the success of global gun control, and this happened

I think you're confusing New Zealand with Australia.

Which is like a kind of racist. I know you aren’t being racist, but when you confuse us two, it kinda feels like racism, ya know?!

[Ostroeuropa]

I don't see how it's off topic to talk about the dynamic behind these shootings and the overall conflict between the Muslim community, the west, and how political policy is the root of it. Just because it isn't your preferred frame of reference for the topic doesn't mean it's not legitimate.

It is however a bit odd if the muslim community in Christchurch is perfectly integrated and contributing, and has been for almost 150 years.

Yep. This is a part of a wider problem in the discussion. Muslims in the US for instance are usually more mainstream in their views than the fundamentalist christians. Bosnian Muslims are average for europe in terms of tolerance, coming out ahead of some uberchristian countries.

For this, however; New Zealand muslims and their political organizations wrote letters to 52 Muslim countries demanding a total boycott of New Zealand goods in response to a newspaper publishing images of the prophet Mohammed, requested government intervention, and forced the paper to back down.

There's been a lot of holocaust denial from their preachers to the point the far-right when in opposition demanded Labour denounce it, which they refused to do on the mewling basis that the exact incidents specified had occurred chronologically before their time in office.

And then there was the christchutch attack. That appears to be all I can find on the matter. I cannot find data on their views, but what is there isn't promising.

None of this justifies a terror attack. What it does suggest is that, perhaps due to their being only 1% of the population, New Zealand hasn't particularly paid much attention to them or their views. This doesn't support the shooters narrative either.

[Borinsa]

I think you're confusing New Zealand with Australia.

Which is like a kind of racist. I know you aren’t being racist, but when you confuse us two, it kinda feels like racism, ya know?!

Australian and Kiwi are nationalities not ethnicities and both of them are basically mostly just Anglo-Saxon settlers anyway.
The Australian constitution even says that New Zealand is part of their country (even though it isn't)

[Sneudal]

This is a piece i was missing. So There Are gun laws in NZ, just this guy found a way around them?

I find it funny how the left celebrated New Zealand as the success of global gun control, and this happened

Let's not go around and pretend like it would matter even a bit.

[Cetacea]

Christchurch has long had a racist white supremacist presence and so its likely that this Australian terrorist who attacked the Christchurch mosque had local support in the Christchurch area- especially as its not easy to get semi-automatic weapons in New Zealand without a licence.

This is a piece i was missing. So There Are gun laws in NZ, just this guy found a way around them?
Have there been other cases of violent racism before in that area? Something to give the indication of the white supremacist presence you speak of?

New Zealand Gun Control involve Gun Licence and Police Vetting, but arent that strict really
Use of a Gun in New Zealand requires a Gun licence which are issued at the discretion of the police (following vetting for 'good character' and mental health). Guns can only lawfully be possessed, carried and used for hunting, pest control, farming and sports. They may not lawfully be carried for self defense.

No magazine can have more than 7 rounds (and 10 round magazines must be modified)
Pistols, semi-automatic rifles and shotguns require a special licence category and further vetting
Restricted Weapons include machine guns, selective-fire assault rifles, grenades and rocket launchers.

As to Christchurch being the NZ Home of White Supremacist:
Article from 2011, back when the main focus was against too many Asians immigrating http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/498799 ... premacists
or a couple more violent incidents https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Re ... aland_gang)

[Borinsa]

I think you're confusing New Zealand with Australia.

Which is like a kind of racist. I know you aren’t being racist, but when you confuse us two, it kinda feels like racism, ya know?!

Wait...
Only 1% of New Zealand of muslim but you're saying MOST of your country feels unsafe right now?
Are you afraid of some sort of retaliation of some sort?

[The Alma Mater]

I find it funny how the left celebrated New Zealand as the success of global gun control, and this happened

Let's not go around and pretend like it would matter even a bit.

It does matter a bit that he is lying. New Zealand is practically a posterchild of how the NRA believes things should be; with very lax laws and practically no registration.

[Borinsa]

This is a piece i was missing. So There Are gun laws in NZ, just this guy found a way around them?
Have there been other cases of violent racism before in that area? Something to give the indication of the white supremacist presence you speak of?

New Zealand Gun Control involve Gun Licence and Police Vetting, but arent that strict really
Use of a Gun in New Zealand requires a Gun licence which are issued at the discretion of the police (following vetting for 'good character' and mental health). Guns can only lawfully be possessed, carried and used for hunting, pest control, farming and sports. They may not lawfully be used for self defense.

No magazine can have more than 7 rounds (and 10 round magazines must be modified)
Pistols, semi-automatic rifles and shotguns require a special licence category and further vetting
Restricted Weapons include machine guns, selective-fire assault rifles, grenades and rocket launchers.

As to Christchurch being the NZ Home of White Supremacist:
Article from 2011, back when the main focus was against too many Asians immigrating http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/498799 ... premacists
or a couple more violent incidents https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Re ... aland_gang)

Third world slum?
I thought asians were supposed to be better than whites.
Is the smart asian stereotype just an American thing?

[Western Vale Confederacy]

I shouldn’t be laughing at the latest memes...

[Torrocca]

I shouldn’t be laughing at the latest memes...

What the fuck.

[Shamhnan Insir]

I shouldn’t be laughing at the latest memes...

Probably not. The "meme" is a lazy fucking mechanism which has become commonplace in regard to just about every situation humans can find themselves in. Those responsible for this incident are relying upon exactly this mechanism to do their work for them.
They have planned this and taken careful aim where they needed to hit to create the highest impact. It's there to cause division. You may laugh at it, but to another audience it's abhorrent and there we help the division propagate.
We're in danger of letting these bastards win, the societal challenge triggers they've pulled are the correct ones to further the spat that's been brewing for a while in our ignorance.

[Valrifell]

I shouldn’t be laughing at the latest memes...

What the fuck.

No, like, seriously, what the actual fuck.

[The Huskar Social Union]

I shouldn’t be laughing at the latest memes...

Yeah thats a pretty poor taste thing to do.


Im more shocked there are memes about this less than a day after it happened. Shouldnt be too surprised though i guess knowing the internet.

[Borinsa]

What the fuck.

No, like, seriously, what the actual fuck.

I knew a meme would come around eventually but this is literally too soon. You're supposed to wait at least five years.

[Bun Queen]

I shouldn’t be laughing at the latest memes...

Don't feel bad not all memes are bad like for example light hearted memes. You can laugh at those however, do avoid laughing at dark humor memes like

Hitler, 9/11, White Power, and other memes that use human suffering for laughs.

[Loben]

What the fuck.

No, like, seriously, what the actual fuck.

what is it "international be a debby downer day"?

[Borinsa]

I shouldn’t be laughing at the latest memes...

Don't feel bad not all memes are bad like for example light hearted memes. You can laugh at those however, do avoid laughing at dark humor memes like

Hitler, 9/11, White Power, and other memes that use human suffering for laughs.

I say dark memes are okay if it's been long enough.
Hitler was a narcisist and the last thing he would want is someone poking fun at him, so in a way memes of him are sort of like part of his soul's punishment in a way.

[Borinsa]

No, like, seriously, what the actual fuck.

what is it "international be a debby downer day"?

Yes, currently an Australian man is in the lead.