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50 Dead After New Zealand Terrorist Attack

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Ostroeuropa
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 58536
Founded: Jun 14, 2006
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Ostroeuropa » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:30 am

Esternial wrote:
Tareldar wrote:On page 18 he mentions Breivik:
...I have only had brief contact with Knight Justiciar Breivik, receiving a blessing for my mission after contacting his brother knights.

Was this some kind of fucked up LARP session?


Yes and no. I think you can conclude he's leaning on satire and irony here. But I think you kind of need to view this kind of stuff in the light of the KKK and neo-nazi appropriation of pagan symbolism.

What fucked the KKK after the superman tapes was everyone laughing at how fucking LARPy the whole thing was. It seemed so uncool and so fucking nerdy and stuff.

You can't SERIOUSLY go around calling yourself "grand dragon" and have elaborate handshakes and a made up language and so on and not expect people to just laugh at you. Racism in general had this problem for a long while. (See "Springtime for Hitler" and the obvious campy pageantry of the Nazi parades. Nazi germany had such strict censorship in part because of how fragile the image of the regime was. You could easily rip the piss out of their choreographed dance numbers and make them look like losers and pretentious charlatans.).

Here's the thing.

It is an explicit tactic of the alt-right and its founders to adapt to that situation.

They can do so by relying in dissonance and the blur between irony and reality, a motte and bailey tactic. It is simultaneously ironic, and serious. It is ironic when attention is called to it, funny, hilarious, all a joke, right until you stop paying attention, and then it's serious again. Like breaking the 4th wall.

By recognizing the whole thing as stupid and larpy, they can get away with it. It becomes an in-joke, a nod and a wink.

It used to be if you laughed at dumb racist pretentiousness they'd get super butthurt about it and angry at you. Now they'll laugh along too, put their arm around your shoulder, and say "Yes, see? It's all a farce, all a big joke, that's the spirit, we're having fun together, aren't we?" which effectively removes humor as a weapon and disarms its effectiveness, especially as they have now inverted the use of humor as a weapon of resistance and critique.

Imagine a scene where you've got a defiant captive Muslim who tries to mock his captors and they get angry and beat him to death. They have a corpse, but not his compliance.

Now imagine they all burst out into laughter too and tell him that was very funny and he has a good sense of humor, but it changes nothing.

Not only does doing so rob the person of their defiant act and its impact and render their action impotent, but it also has the added effect of making the racist scarier, which is the point.

Making fun of dumb klan bullshit used to be a way to rob them of their power. Now doing so means you're laughing along with the klan and nobody else really finds it funny anymore, and suddenly YOU'RE the humorless one for not finding the notion of calling yourself a "Knight Justicar" hysterical and ridiculous, because ofcourse it is, its inherently ridiculous and what's wrong with you for not finding it funny? See, this is why your kind don't deserve to be here.

None of this is accidental. It is an explicit strategy you can learn about by reading Spencers stuff and some of the other guys involved. They're not morons. They're often well read people who understood the fall of previous racist regimes and have adapted to overcome the problems that brought them down.

Pepe's adoption is an example of this. By calling a cartoon frog a symbol of horrible racism, they make their opponents look like idiots. By behaving ironically and stupidly and being self-aware of it and forcing their opponents to treat it seriously, they have inverted the use of humor as a weapon.

Racists wanted to be taken seriously and laughing at them means they can't win, and can never win, because if they act ridiculous there's nothing in their power that can mean they aren't an object of ridicule and pity in the eyes of their victims and wider society. That changed. Now they want you to not take it seriously, and that's a much harder fight to win because it cedes a powerful tool to them.
Last edited by Ostroeuropa on Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:37 am, edited 3 times in total.
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

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Czechosia
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 15
Founded: Mar 15, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Czechosia » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:31 am

The Alma Mater wrote:
Czechosia wrote:Islamofascist Turks drank the blood of 2 million Armenians.

True, but the people in this mosque were not Turks, nor involved in said genocide.
Punishing Charles because Pete wronged you makes you a bad person.

Hitler was a Muslim.

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United States of Devonta
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6184
Founded: Sep 20, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby United States of Devonta » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:31 am

Laura Southern has deleted her video named "The Great Replacement" in wake of the shooting.

The killers manifesto was titled "The Great Replacement".

EDIT: And yes i'm aware, it is a common trope, w/ in a certain crowd of people. Its the same as the White Genocide theory, just rebranded.
Last edited by United States of Devonta on Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34994
Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:33 am

Czechosia wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:True, but the people in this mosque were not Turks, nor involved in said genocide.
Punishing Charles because Pete wronged you makes you a bad person.

Hitler was a Muslim.

In all my years of nsg i have never heard such a stupid statement

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Nantoraka
Diplomat
 
Posts: 748
Founded: Oct 19, 2017
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Nantoraka » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:33 am

Czechosia wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:True, but the people in this mosque were not Turks, nor involved in said genocide.
Punishing Charles because Pete wronged you makes you a bad person.

Hitler was a Muslim.

You sure he wasn't Jewish?

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-Ocelot-
Minister
 
Posts: 2260
Founded: Jun 14, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby -Ocelot- » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:33 am

Tareldar wrote:
-Ocelot- wrote:
Sorry I forgot I'm not allowed to speak bad about fascism on NSG.


Interestingly this guy claims he is an "eco-fascist", which isn't one I'd heard of before.


Many white supremacists are environmentalists.

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Andsed
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13443
Founded: Aug 24, 2017
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Andsed » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:34 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
Czechosia wrote:Hitler was a Muslim.

In all my years of nsg i have never heard such a stupid statement

Don’t respond to him. I doubt he is here in good faith.
I do be tired


LOVEWHOYOUARE~

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Czechosia
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Founded: Mar 15, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Czechosia » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:34 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
Czechosia wrote:Hitler was a Muslim.

In all my years of nsg i have never heard such a stupid statement

Don't like the truth do you?

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Caracasus
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Posts: 7918
Founded: Apr 23, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Caracasus » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:36 am

-Ocelot- wrote:
Tareldar wrote:
Interestingly this guy claims he is an "eco-fascist", which isn't one I'd heard of before.


Many white supremacists are environmentalists.


Eh... there's a faction of the movement that uses environmentalism as an excuse for committing some horrific act of genocide or another, but I'd not call them environmentalists any more than I'd call the ones that cling to discredited scientific racism biologists. It's just another excuse really.
As an editor I seam to spend an awful lot of thyme going threw issues and checking that they're no oblivious errars. Its a tough job but someone's got too do it!



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Czechosia
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Founded: Mar 15, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Czechosia » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:36 am

Nantoraka wrote:
Czechosia wrote:Hitler was a Muslim.

You sure he wasn't Jewish?

Jews are a racial group.

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Esternial
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 54394
Founded: May 09, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Esternial » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:36 am

Czechosia wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:In all my years of nsg i have never heard such a stupid statement

Don't like the truth do you?

Also yogurt is authoritarian.

Pinapples are oppressive.

WATERMELONS WILL TAINT YOUR SOUL RED

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Tareldar
Attaché
 
Posts: 91
Founded: Dec 28, 2017
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tareldar » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:36 am

-Ocelot- wrote:
Tareldar wrote:
Interestingly this guy claims he is an "eco-fascist", which isn't one I'd heard of before.


Many white supremacists are environmentalists.

Why? Some "return to nature" sort of thing?

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34994
Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:36 am

-Ocelot- wrote:
Tareldar wrote:
Interestingly this guy claims he is an "eco-fascist", which isn't one I'd heard of before.


Many white supremacists are environmentalists.


First of all no

Second of all environmentalists have nothing to with idpol

Third of all what does this have to do with the thread

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LiberNovusAmericae
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6942
Founded: Mar 10, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:37 am

Czechosia wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:True, but the people in this mosque were not Turks, nor involved in said genocide.
Punishing Charles because Pete wronged you makes you a bad person.

Hitler was a Muslim.

I don't think he was a Muslim but he did have sympathy towards it, as well as some other religions.
Last edited by LiberNovusAmericae on Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
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Posts: 34994
Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:38 am

Andsed wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:In all my years of nsg i have never heard such a stupid statement

Don’t respond to him. I doubt he is here in good faith.


I know that it was just kinda bewildering to see such blatent bullshit

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The Alma Mater
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Ex-Nation

Postby The Alma Mater » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:38 am

Tareldar wrote:
-Ocelot- wrote:
Many white supremacists are environmentalists.

Why? Some "return to nature" sort of thing?

Very viking-y. Respect for the power of the Bear. Believing it is ones duty to protect. And so on.
It makes sense.
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable sexual disease.
It made you unsuitable for a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.
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Pim Fortuyn
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 62
Founded: Feb 14, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Pim Fortuyn » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:40 am

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:
Czechosia wrote:Hitler was a Muslim.

I don't think he was a Muslim but he did have sympathy towards it.

He also had sympathy towards veganism. Makes you think... :eyebrow:
~Flirting with concepts.

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Andsed
Postmaster-General
 
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Founded: Aug 24, 2017
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Andsed » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:40 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
Andsed wrote:Don’t respond to him. I doubt he is here in good faith.


I know that it was just kinda bewildering to see such blatent bullshit

That is fair I do have the urge to just rip into his post because they are just so hilariously ridiculous.
I do be tired


LOVEWHOYOUARE~

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Czechosia
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Founded: Mar 15, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Czechosia » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:40 am

Hitler wanted Europe to Islamic that's why he killed Jews ,Christian and Atheists.

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Tareldar
Attaché
 
Posts: 91
Founded: Dec 28, 2017
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tareldar » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:40 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
-Ocelot- wrote:
Many white supremacists are environmentalists.


First of all no

Second of all environmentalists have nothing to with idpol

Third of all what does this have to do with the thread


This guy cites environmentalism quite a bit in his manifesto:

Green nationalism is the only true nationalism

There is no Conservatism without nature, there is no nationalism without
environmentalism, the natural environment of our lands shaped us just as
we shaped it. We were born from our lands and our own culture was
molded by these same lands .The protection and preservation of these
lands is of the same importance as the protection and preservation of our
own ideals and beliefs.

For too long we have allowed the left to co-opt the environmentalist
movement to serve their own needs. The left has controlled all discussion
regarding environmental preservation whilst simultaneously presiding
over the continued destruction of the natural environment itself through
mass immigration and uncontrolled urbanization, whilst offering no true
solution to either issue.

There is no Green future with never ending population growth, the ideal
green world cannot exist in a World of 100 billion 50 billion or even 10
billion people. Continued immigration into Europe is environmental
warfare and ultimately destructive to nature itself.

The Europe of the future is not one of concrete and steel,smog and wires
but a place of forests, lakes, mountains and meadows. Not a place where
english is the defacto language but a place where every European
language, belief and tradition is valued. Each nation and each ethnicity
was melded by their own environment and if they are to be protected so
must their own environments.

THERE IS NO TRADITIONALISM WITHOUT
ENVIRONMENTALISM

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Salus Maior
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27813
Founded: Jun 16, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Salus Maior » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:42 am

The Alma Mater wrote:
Tareldar wrote:He claims a group of "reborn Knights Templars" gave him their blessing, page 10 of the manifesto

Very Breivik.


I'm guessing the "reborn Knights Templar" isn't a real thing. Just some kind of fearmongering reference to make people think that there's some kind of huge organization behind what they do. Like, KKK's "invisible empire".
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist, Disillusioned Millennial.

"In any case we clearly see....That some opportune remedy must be found quickly for the misery and wretchedness pressing so unjustly on the majority of the working class...it has come to pass that working men have been surrendered, isolated and helpless, to the hardheartedness of employers and the greed of unchecked competition." -Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

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-Ocelot-
Minister
 
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Founded: Jun 14, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby -Ocelot- » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:43 am

Tareldar wrote:
-Ocelot- wrote:
Many white supremacists are environmentalists.

Why? Some "return to nature" sort of thing?


Stems from Nazi Germany's ideology. Nature makes you strong, blood and soil, paganism, strong over weak... all that bullshit.

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Caracasus
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7918
Founded: Apr 23, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Caracasus » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:45 am

Tareldar wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
First of all no

Second of all environmentalists have nothing to with idpol

Third of all what does this have to do with the thread


This guy cites environmentalism quite a bit in his manifesto:

Green nationalism is the only true nationalism

There is no Conservatism without nature, there is no nationalism without
environmentalism, the natural environment of our lands shaped us just as
we shaped it. We were born from our lands and our own culture was
molded by these same lands .The protection and preservation of these
lands is of the same importance as the protection and preservation of our
own ideals and beliefs.

For too long we have allowed the left to co-opt the environmentalist
movement to serve their own needs. The left has controlled all discussion
regarding environmental preservation whilst simultaneously presiding
over the continued destruction of the natural environment itself through
mass immigration and uncontrolled urbanization, whilst offering no true
solution to either issue.

There is no Green future with never ending population growth, the ideal
green world cannot exist in a World of 100 billion 50 billion or even 10
billion people. Continued immigration into Europe is environmental
warfare and ultimately destructive to nature itself.

The Europe of the future is not one of concrete and steel,smog and wires
but a place of forests, lakes, mountains and meadows. Not a place where
english is the defacto language but a place where every European
language, belief and tradition is valued. Each nation and each ethnicity
was melded by their own environment and if they are to be protected so
must their own environments.

THERE IS NO TRADITIONALISM WITHOUT
ENVIRONMENTALISM


So yes then. Co-opting environmentalism as an excuse to murder people. Fairly typical of the far right to be honest.
As an editor I seam to spend an awful lot of thyme going threw issues and checking that they're no oblivious errars. Its a tough job but someone's got too do it!



Issues editor, not a moderator.

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34994
Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:46 am

Tareldar wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
First of all no

Second of all environmentalists have nothing to with idpol

Third of all what does this have to do with the thread


This guy cites environmentalism quite a bit in his manifesto:

Green nationalism is the only true nationalism

There is no Conservatism without nature, there is no nationalism without
environmentalism, the natural environment of our lands shaped us just as
we shaped it. We were born from our lands and our own culture was
molded by these same lands .The protection and preservation of these
lands is of the same importance as the protection and preservation of our
own ideals and beliefs.

For too long we have allowed the left to co-opt the environmentalist
movement to serve their own needs. The left has controlled all discussion
regarding environmental preservation whilst simultaneously presiding
over the continued destruction of the natural environment itself through
mass immigration and uncontrolled urbanization, whilst offering no true
solution to either issue.

There is no Green future with never ending population growth, the ideal
green world cannot exist in a World of 100 billion 50 billion or even 10
billion people. Continued immigration into Europe is environmental
warfare and ultimately destructive to nature itself.

The Europe of the future is not one of concrete and steel,smog and wires
but a place of forests, lakes, mountains and meadows. Not a place where
english is the defacto language but a place where every European
language, belief and tradition is valued. Each nation and each ethnicity
was melded by their own environment and if they are to be protected so
must their own environments.

THERE IS NO TRADITIONALISM WITHOUT
ENVIRONMENTALISM


The guy is still an idiot beacuse you can make the environnent better without killing people

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Mombombu
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Posts: 68
Founded: Mar 20, 2014
Father Knows Best State

Postby Mombombu » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:46 am

Czechosia wrote:
The Alma Mater wrote:True, but the people in this mosque were not Turks, nor involved in said genocide.
Punishing Charles because Pete wronged you makes you a bad person.

Hitler was a Muslim.


So can we report people for being obvious trolls?

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