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Right Wing Discussion Thread XV: A New Hoppe

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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To what ethical philosophy do you subscribe?

Ethical Egoism
12
11%
Act Utilitarianism
7
6%
Rule Utilitarianism
7
6%
Kantian Ethics
6
5%
Virtue Ethics
19
17%
Nihilism/YOLO
18
16%
Radical Subjectivism
2
2%
Cultural Relativism
3
3%
Divine Command Theory
18
16%
Natural Law Theory
20
18%
 
Total votes : 112

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The Supreme Magnificent High Swaglord
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Posts: 6290
Founded: Jul 22, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby The Supreme Magnificent High Swaglord » Tue May 14, 2019 7:45 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not a Christian but tbh the Orthodox Church is the one true church and anyone who disagrees is a heretic and probably a l*beral too


Despite the fact that I do not (and can not, at least in good conscience) profess belief in the Christian faith, I nevertheless concur with the statement that the Eastern Orthodox Church/Orthodox Catholic Church has the most legitimate claim to being the "one true church", at least from my current knowledge of Church history.
< THE HIGH SWAGLORD | 8VALUES | POLITISCALES >
My NS stats are not indicative of my OOC views. NS stats are meant to be rather silly. My OOC political and ideological inspirations are as such:
The Republic, by Plato | Leviathan, by Thomas Hobbes | The Confucian civil service system of imperial China | The "Golden Liberty" elective
monarchy system of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth | The corporatist/technocratic philosophy of Henri de Saint-Simon | The communitarian
ideological framework of the Singaporean People's Action Party | "New Deal"-style societal regimentation | Kantian/Mohist/Stoic philosophy

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Nea Byzantia
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Posts: 5185
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 7:46 am

Novus America wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not a Christian but tbh the Orthodox Church is the one true church and anyone who disagrees is a heretic and probably a l*beral too


The Orthodox Churches, One Church. Pick one and only one...
Seriously though there is no single united Orthodox Church.
There are a bunch of fighting and politicking, actually completely independent and often quite different churches.
Some of which are in communion with some others and not with others.

There is One Church...it just has decentralized leadership.

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Diopolis
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Posts: 16797
Founded: May 15, 2012
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Diopolis » Tue May 14, 2019 7:46 am

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Diopolis wrote:Hey, yall imported the sexual revolution into your church well before Vatican II.

You mean we allow people to marry before getting ordained?

I mean you decided to allow divorce without an annulment.
Proudly anti-mask, moderately anti-vax.
Economic left -3.88, authoritarian 6.15
Thoughts
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Novus America
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Posts: 36275
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Novus America » Tue May 14, 2019 7:47 am

Evil Dictators Happyland wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not a Christian but tbh the Orthodox Church is the one true church and anyone who disagrees is a heretic and probably a l*beral too

Not a Christian but there really didn't need to be a power struggle between the Pope and the Emperor and Christianity would be much better off if it hadn't happened.


Well then the Eastern Emperor, still recognized as Emperor by the Roman Pope went on an insane iconoclastic rampage, and it all went downhill from there.

It was not needed per se, but inevitable when the Eastern Emperor decided to make his own religious rules.
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. Pragmatism is my ideology.

User avatar
Nea Byzantia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5185
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 7:47 am

Hakons wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:You mean we allow people to marry before getting ordained?


Referring to lax divorce rules, I believe

We don't allow divorce; we're not in favour of it; but sometimes shit happens, and so we allow it. We understand that rules have exceptions, sometimes; unlike the Catholics.

User avatar
Valrifell
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27319
Founded: Aug 18, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Valrifell » Tue May 14, 2019 7:48 am

Novus America wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not a Christian but tbh the Orthodox Church is the one true church and anyone who disagrees is a heretic and probably a l*beral too


The Orthodox Churches, One Church. Pick one and only one...
Seriously though there is no single united Orthodox Church.
There are a bunch of fighting and politicking, actually completely independent and often quite different churches.
Some of which are in communion with some others and not with others.


Technically the Catholic Church isn't a single uniform entity either. It's comprised of the Latin Church (headed by the Pope) and several other so-called Eastern Churches that went into communion with the Roman See. Some are quite different from the Latin Church and even allow priests to marry or be women.
Sint Musis socii Charites, Furia omnis abesto

User avatar
Nea Byzantia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5185
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 7:49 am

Valrifell wrote:
Novus America wrote:
The Orthodox Churches, One Church. Pick one and only one...
Seriously though there is no single united Orthodox Church.
There are a bunch of fighting and politicking, actually completely independent and often quite different churches.
Some of which are in communion with some others and not with others.


Technically the Catholic Church isn't a single uniform entity either. It's comprised of the Latin Church (headed by the Pope) and several other so-called Eastern Churches that went into communion with the Roman See. Some are quite different from the Latin Church and even allow priests to marry or be women.

They Uniates allow Priestesses??

User avatar
Valrifell
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27319
Founded: Aug 18, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Valrifell » Tue May 14, 2019 7:49 am

Novus America wrote:
Evil Dictators Happyland wrote:Not a Christian but there really didn't need to be a power struggle between the Pope and the Emperor and Christianity would be much better off if it hadn't happened.


Well then the Eastern Emperor, still recognized as Emperor by the Roman Pope went on an insane iconoclastic rampage, and it all went downhill from there.

It was not needed per se, but inevitable when the Eastern Emperor decided to make his own religious rules.


It's not like the Holy Roman Emperors didn't try to do that anyway.
Sint Musis socii Charites, Furia omnis abesto

User avatar
Novus America
Post Czar
 
Posts: 36275
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Novus America » Tue May 14, 2019 7:50 am

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Novus America wrote:
The Orthodox Churches, One Church. Pick one and only one...
Seriously though there is no single united Orthodox Church.
There are a bunch of fighting and politicking, actually completely independent and often quite different churches.
Some of which are in communion with some others and not with others.

There is One Church...it just has decentralized leadership.


Except it exists in name only, kind of. That is like saying there is one world government that just has decentralized leadership.

Even with decentralized leadership you still need some common leader or or governing body.
Again several of the Orthodox Churches (plural) do not even recognize each other.
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. Pragmatism is my ideology.

User avatar
Nea Byzantia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5185
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 7:51 am

Novus America wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:There is One Church...it just has decentralized leadership.


Except it exists in name only, kind of. That is like saying there is one world government that just has decentralized leadership.

Even with decentralized leadership you still need some common leader or or governing body.
Again several of the Orthodox Churches (plural) do not even recognize each other.

We meet Synodically (ie. Church Councils) to decide on matters.

User avatar
Valrifell
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27319
Founded: Aug 18, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Valrifell » Tue May 14, 2019 7:52 am

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Valrifell wrote:
Technically the Catholic Church isn't a single uniform entity either. It's comprised of the Latin Church (headed by the Pope) and several other so-called Eastern Churches that went into communion with the Roman See. Some are quite different from the Latin Church and even allow priests to marry or be women.

They Uniates allow Priestesses??


No wait I think I'm wrong, they let married men become priests tho.
Sint Musis socii Charites, Furia omnis abesto

User avatar
Novus America
Post Czar
 
Posts: 36275
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Novus America » Tue May 14, 2019 7:52 am

Valrifell wrote:
Novus America wrote:
Well then the Eastern Emperor, still recognized as Emperor by the Roman Pope went on an insane iconoclastic rampage, and it all went downhill from there.

It was not needed per se, but inevitable when the Eastern Emperor decided to make his own religious rules.


It's not like the Holy Roman Emperors didn't try to do that anyway.


They did, but that does not change the underlying point. No conflict would require clear and respected boundaries.
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. Pragmatism is my ideology.

User avatar
Hakons
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5619
Founded: Jul 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Hakons » Tue May 14, 2019 7:53 am

The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:
Hakons wrote:
>Searches French phrase because historical French phrases are fun

>Realizes it's from Voltaire

>When he was talking about wanting to destroy the Church

*resets sign to zero days since Voltaire was proven to be a mistake*

Did Voltaire actively want to destroy the church?


Yes, he was essentially an NSG militant atheist, just in the 1700s.

Writing to Frederick II:
"Your Majesty will do the human race an eternal service by extirpating this infamous superstition, I do not say among the rabble, who are not worthy of being enlightened and who are apt for every yoke; I say among honest people, among men who think, among those who wish to think. ... My one regret in dying is that I cannot aid you in this noble enterprise, the finest and most respectable which the human mind can point out."

Along with being anti-catholic, you can add general anti-theism and antisemitism.

"For example, in Voltaire's A Philosophical Dictionary, he wrote of Jews: "In short, we find in them only an ignorant and barbarous people, who have long united the most sordid avarice with the most detestable superstition and the most invincible hatred for every people by whom they are tolerated and enriched." "
“All elements of the national life must be made to drink in the Life which proceedeth from Him: legislation, political institutions, education, marriage and family life, capital and labour.” —Pope Leo XIII

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Novus America
Post Czar
 
Posts: 36275
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Novus America » Tue May 14, 2019 7:54 am

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Novus America wrote:
Except it exists in name only, kind of. That is like saying there is one world government that just has decentralized leadership.

Even with decentralized leadership you still need some common leader or or governing body.
Again several of the Orthodox Churches (plural) do not even recognize each other.

We meet Synodically (ie. Church Councils) to decide on matters.


Where only some show up, and the decisions are not binding and often not enforced at all.
The world leaders meet at the UN too.
Last edited by Novus America on Tue May 14, 2019 7:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. Pragmatism is my ideology.

User avatar
Diopolis
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16797
Founded: May 15, 2012
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Diopolis » Tue May 14, 2019 7:54 am

Valrifell wrote:
Novus America wrote:
The Orthodox Churches, One Church. Pick one and only one...
Seriously though there is no single united Orthodox Church.
There are a bunch of fighting and politicking, actually completely independent and often quite different churches.
Some of which are in communion with some others and not with others.


Technically the Catholic Church isn't a single uniform entity either. It's comprised of the Latin Church (headed by the Pope) and several other so-called Eastern Churches that went into communion with the Roman See. Some are quite different from the Latin Church and even allow priests to marry or be women.

The Roman Catholic church is comprised of 23 constituent churches, the largest of which is the Latin church at 1.3 billion, followed by the Ukrainian Greek-Catholic church at 5 million and then a handful of oriental churches in the low millions. All share a common theology and moral views, including acknowledging the pope as head of the church, and a common apostolic succession- including a male-only priesthood. Interestingly, while many Catholic churches allow married men to be ordained to the priesthood, even widowed men may not be consecrated bishops.
You may be thinking of the various schismatic groups referring to themselves as the old Catholic church, which do have female "priests". They also have a vampire hunting bishop, and anyways in Europe they're more like a subcategory of Anglicanism than a Catholic church.
Proudly anti-mask, moderately anti-vax.
Economic left -3.88, authoritarian 6.15
Thoughts
Abortion is not healthcare.

User avatar
Nea Byzantia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5185
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 7:56 am

Valrifell wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:They Uniates allow Priestesses??


No wait I think I'm wrong, they let married men become priests tho.

Its probably like it is in the Orthodox Church...You can get married before you get ordained (I believe its as a SubDeacon), but if your wife dies after you become a priest, you can't remarry.

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Diopolis
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16797
Founded: May 15, 2012
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Diopolis » Tue May 14, 2019 8:02 am

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Valrifell wrote:
No wait I think I'm wrong, they let married men become priests tho.

Its probably like it is in the Orthodox Church...You can get married before you get ordained (I believe its as a SubDeacon), but if your wife dies after you become a priest, you can't remarry.

My friend on the path to priesthood in the Ruthenian Catholic church(Byzantine Catholic church USA) gave the following rules:
You have to get married before the subdiaconate. If you're widowed after taking orders, you cannot remarry even if you're not at the subdiaconate, unless you have children. In practice, men on the path to priesthood can postpone subdiaconal ordination as necessary.
No remarriage after diaconate. We're a bit stricter than the Orthodox about that. For that matter, it's stricter than the Latin church, which does allow permanent deacons to remarry if they have children under a certain age, at the discretion of the bishop.
Widowed priests cannot become bishops. Neither can married priests, but you already knew that.
Men in major orders must abstain from sex for 24 hours before participating in the divine liturgy. Wives have the power to veto ecclesiastical advancement.
Proudly anti-mask, moderately anti-vax.
Economic left -3.88, authoritarian 6.15
Thoughts
Abortion is not healthcare.

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Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76677
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Conserative Morality » Tue May 14, 2019 8:05 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not a Christian but tbh the Orthodox Church is the one true church and anyone who disagrees is a heretic and probably a l*beral too

Orthodoxy is lame. Come back when you have a winner on your hands.

Wait a minute...

Orthodoxy is lame...

Orthodoxy islame

Orthodoxy Islam

Image
Last edited by Conserative Morality on Tue May 14, 2019 8:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
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Hakons
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Posts: 5619
Founded: Jul 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Hakons » Tue May 14, 2019 8:05 am

Diopolis wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:>> tfw I know the context of the quote and it's basically the same comeback Nobunaga himself used against Shingen, the equivalent of mocking a point of the opposition with a diametrically opposed shitpost

Yes, I am sure that's why Catholics are more liberal than the Protestants here in the States. They are upholding an even older form of the religion. =^)

Did you miss Vatican II?

Vatican II was not Catholic. It was an attempt to import the heresies of the french revolution into the church.


V2 is Catholic, lol. I disagree with some of the reforms, but it is Catholic. CM can say what he wants, but he is not Catholic, and attributing V2 to liberalism is just plainly wrong. Modernization, yes, but the Church stands utterly opposed to liberalism. By merely professing our faith in one true Church, we are opposed to liberalism.

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Evil Dictators Happyland wrote:Not a Christian but there really didn't need to be a power struggle between the Pope and the Emperor and Christianity would be much better off if it hadn't happened.


You're not wrong. Though all the schismatic nonsense is proof of the superiority of ye olde polytheistic traditions :p

Also nobody ever answered my question on if we have a new OP picked yet : (


I know you're joking, but paganism dies out everywhere it's faced with monotheism.

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Hakons wrote:
Referring to lax divorce rules, I believe

We don't allow divorce; we're not in favour of it; but sometimes shit happens, and so we allow it. We understand that rules have exceptions, sometimes; unlike the Catholics.


"We don't allow divorce... but... we allow it." That's an atrocious sentence, theologically and literary. The Truth of God has no exceptions. We can surrender to the culture of the times, or stick to the Word of God.

Valrifell wrote:
Novus America wrote:
The Orthodox Churches, One Church. Pick one and only one...
Seriously though there is no single united Orthodox Church.
There are a bunch of fighting and politicking, actually completely independent and often quite different churches.
Some of which are in communion with some others and not with others.


Technically the Catholic Church isn't a single uniform entity either. It's comprised of the Latin Church (headed by the Pope) and several other so-called Eastern Churches that went into communion with the Roman See. Some are quite different from the Latin Church and even allow priests to marry or be women.


Uh... no. Not at all. The Church is entirely united in communion with Rome. There are Eastern Catholics Rites, but they are still entirely Catholic. There are non-Latin Rites precisely because our Church is Catholic, general, and not strictly Latin/Western. Priests are not allowed to be married under any Rite, though Eastern Catholics can be married before they are ordained, so can Anglican convert priests. Under no circumstances can a woman be a priest. Pope Francis said this a few days ago, to the discouragement of quite a few modernists.
“All elements of the national life must be made to drink in the Life which proceedeth from Him: legislation, political institutions, education, marriage and family life, capital and labour.” —Pope Leo XIII

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Washington Resistance Army
Post Czar
 
Posts: 45354
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue May 14, 2019 8:07 am

Hakons wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
You're not wrong. Though all the schismatic nonsense is proof of the superiority of ye olde polytheistic traditions :p

Also nobody ever answered my question on if we have a new OP picked yet : (


I know you're joking, but paganism dies out everywhere it's faced with monotheism.


We're growing quite steadily in the western world while Christianity is increasingly dying off. Round 2 electric boogaloo friendo.

also India laughs at your claim, smh
Third Positionist, Agrarian, Anti-Racist, Authoritarian

User avatar
Washington Resistance Army
Post Czar
 
Posts: 45354
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue May 14, 2019 8:08 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not a Christian but tbh the Orthodox Church is the one true church and anyone who disagrees is a heretic and probably a l*beral too

Orthodoxy is lame. Come back when you have a winner on your hands.


Fact: the Orthodox have the best hats out of any Christians and thus are objectively the coolest
Third Positionist, Agrarian, Anti-Racist, Authoritarian

User avatar
Nea Byzantia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5185
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 8:08 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not a Christian but tbh the Orthodox Church is the one true church and anyone who disagrees is a heretic and probably a l*beral too

Orthodoxy is lame. Come back when you have a winner on your hands.

Image

User avatar
Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76677
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Conserative Morality » Tue May 14, 2019 8:09 am

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:Orthodoxy is lame. Come back when you have a winner on your hands.

Image

>> when you claim to be the heir to the Roman Empire and its glorious culture
>> but your art is literally worse than the Franks somehow

smh
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
Caesar and Imperator of RWDT
Got a blog up again. || An NS Writing Discussion

User avatar
Loben The 2nd
Senator
 
Posts: 4410
Founded: Apr 29, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Loben The 2nd » Tue May 14, 2019 8:09 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not a Christian but tbh the Orthodox Church is the one true church and anyone who disagrees is a heretic and probably a l*beral too

Orthodoxy is lame. Come back when you have a winner on your hands.

Wait a minute...

Orthodoxy is lame...

Orthodoxy islame

Orthodoxy Islam

Image


Hmmmmm.
no quarter.
Satisfaction guaranteed.

User avatar
Nea Byzantia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5185
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 8:10 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:Orthodoxy is lame. Come back when you have a winner on your hands.


Fact: the Orthodox have the best hats out of any Christians and thus are objectively the coolest

Image


Amen

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