NationStates

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:48 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Grenartia wrote:No religious group (or even religion as a whole) can honestly claim a monopoly on the term 'marriage'.

Yes they can. Marriage is a religious concept. Fight me.

>> Greater than 500 AUC
>> still practicing Confarraetio marriage

Sine maru only, optimate!

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:49 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:Where does the concept of Marriage come from? The idea of one man, one woman. Where is that idea derived from, if not from religion?

Roman law.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:49 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Hammer Britannia wrote:Yeah, but your religion didn't start it.

So fight me

Who is this man?

~~Full-Time Summer poster and acolyte of Washington Resistance Armyism~~

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:49 am**

Grenartia wrote:
Novus America wrote:I would prefer the government only use the term civil union

Honest question: Why?

No religious group (or even religion as a whole) can honestly claim a monopoly on the term 'marriage'.

To stop (well remove from government) the silly arguments over it.
I prefer it uses the term civil union for ALL cases, including men marrying women.

Yeah sure we can have semantic debates all day about what is the real meaning of marriage, whether or not is started as primarily secular or religious (of course it started long before the freedom of religion and separation of church and state) yada yada.

Because that debate cannot be resolved and is mere semantics, that debate should be separated from the government. Both religious and non religious private groups could call it marriage too.
One could get a humanist society or Wiccan coven or whatever to call it marriage too.
Whatever floats your boat.
I do not care.

Really just to stop the government from having to deal with it.
But the government calling it marriage does not bother me that much really.
On my list of political priorities what to call it is about as far down as you can go.

Like I said I have seen no ill effects from the legalization of gay marriage.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:50 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
As one of those people, I absolutely do not want my family choosing potential partners for me.

Prove it.

Where does the concept of Marriage come from? The idea of one man, one woman. Where is that idea derived from, if not from religion?

The desire to trace one's and others' ancestry.

Please, in the future, come up with a less easily debunked, less tawdry argument.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:50 am**

Hammer Britannia wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:Who is this man?

~~Full-Time Summer poster and acolyte of Washington Resistance Armyism~~

Paganism isn't a proper Religion, though.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:51 am**

Grenartia wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:Where does the concept of Marriage come from? The idea of one man, one woman. Where is that idea derived from, if not from religion?

The need to trace ancestry.

Please, in the future, come up with a less easily debunked, less tawdry argument.

It hasn't been debunked.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:51 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Hammer Britannia wrote:Yeah, but your religion didn't start it.

So fight me

Paganism isn't a Religion.

It's a broad category of religion yes.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:51 am**

Transjlwanja wrote:
Kowani wrote:Step 1. Can it hurt me? Yes/no.
Step 2. Can it be logically used to justify harming me? Yes/no.
Step 3. Can it harm my support networks? Yes/no.
Step 4. Does it tangibly improve the material circumstances of the lives of the citizenry? Yes/no.

Why should I care about "the material circumstances of the lives of the citizenry" if your worldview is true?

A rising tide lifts all boats. Well, that and not having an angry citizenry on the brink of revolution is always good.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:51 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
The need to trace ancestry.

Please, in the future, come up with a less easily debunked, less tawdry argument.

It hasn't been debunked.

But it has been. I gave you an answer to your question that didn't involve religion.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:52 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Hammer Britannia wrote:~~Full-Time Summer poster and acolyte of Washington Resistance Armyism~~

Paganism isn't a proper Religion, though.

>> when you encounter a proper No True Scotsman argument

Ach!

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:52 am**

Genivaria wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:Paganism isn't a Religion.

It's a broad category of religion yes.

Yeah, but its not an Organized Religion...no hierarchy, no Holy Book; its just a hedonistic, free-for-all, sh*tshow.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:53 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
As one of those people, I absolutely do not want my family choosing potential partners for me.

Prove it.

Where does the concept of Marriage come from? The idea of one man, one woman. Where is that idea derived from, if not from religion?

This is the very definition of an Argument from Ignorance.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:53 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
The need to trace ancestry.

Please, in the future, come up with a less easily debunked, less tawdry argument.

It hasn't been debunked.

Okay. Of the four forms of Roman marriage practiced, only one was religious, and it was the least common form.

Try again pls.

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Genivaria wrote:It's a broad category of religion yes.

Yeah, but its not an Organized Religion...no hierarchy, no Holy Book; its just a hedonistic, free-for-all, sh*tshow.

Sweet Jesus, is this a joke?

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:54 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Genivaria wrote:It's a broad category of religion yes.

Yeah, but its not an Organized Religion...no hierarchy, no Holy Book; its just a hedonistic, free-for-all, sh*tshow.

You should probably do at least a modicum of research about something before you post about it.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:55 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Genivaria wrote:It's a broad category of religion yes.

Yeah, but its not an Organized Religion...no hierarchy, no Holy Book; its just a hedonistic, free-for-all, sh*tshow.

The Greeks are the Free-For-All shitshow? Buddy, do I need to remind you of the 30 years war?

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:55 am**

Conserative Morality wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:Paganism isn't a proper Religion, though.

>> when you encounter a proper No True Scotsman argument

Ach!

>>>when you're surrounded on all sides by rabid Liberals...

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:56 am**

Grenartia wrote:
Novus America wrote:
Admittedly that is a problem, that should be watched out for and we can take steps to address.
But having the family help find partners for those we are unable to do one their own and want the help is not a bad thing.

Obviously such a system should not be forced on anyone who does not want it.
But why prevent someone who wants the system from utilizing it?
It could help a lot of people, especially those not so socially outgoing.

As one of those people, I absolutely do not want my family choosing potential partners for me.

Nea Byzantia wrote:Yes they can. Marriage is a religious concept. Fight me.

Prove it.

Fair enough. Which is why it should be available as an option but not required,
You do not want it. But apparently many people here do.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:56 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Hammer Britannia wrote:Yeah, but your religion didn't start it.

So fight me

Paganism isn't a Religion.

Yeah, it's a category of religions. Some of which do maintain hierarchies within their own religious organizations.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:56 am**

Conserative Morality wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:It hasn't been debunked.

Okay. Of the four forms of Roman marriage practiced, only one was religious, and it was the least common form.

Is it surprising that the religious form of Roman marriage, the one that was indistinguishable from condemning a woman to slavery under the headship of her husband, was the least popular one? Some are apparently surprised.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:56 am**

Hammer Britannia wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:Yeah, but its not an Organized Religion...no hierarchy, no Holy Book; its just a hedonistic, free-for-all, sh*tshow.

The Greeks are the Free-For-All shitshow? Buddy, do I need to remind you of the 30 years war?

I'm not Catholic or Protestant...I could care less about what sh*t they did.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:57 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Hammer Britannia wrote:The Greeks are the Free-For-All shitshow? Buddy, do I need to remind you of the 30 years war?

I'm not Catholic or Protestant...I could care less about what sh*t they did.

Yet you repeat with zeal their agitation propaganda.

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:57 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:>> when you encounter a proper No True Scotsman argument

Ach!

>>>when you're surrounded on all sides by rabid Liberals...

>> implying Caesar wasn't a liberal
>> implying he wasn't a pro-immigrant imperialist who championed the lower classes against the excesses of the aristocracy and archaic traditions
>> implying though he conquered Gaul, Nicomedes didn't conquer Caesar

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:58 am**

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Hammer Britannia wrote:The Greeks are the Free-For-All shitshow? Buddy, do I need to remind you of the 30 years war?

I'm not Catholic or Protestant...I could care less about what sh*t they did.

Yeah, you were too busy being Cucked by Ottomans or being Russia (Which did get involved in the 30 years war, for the record)

Posted: **Tue May 07, 2019 10:59 am**

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:Is it surprising that the religious form of Roman marriage, the one that was indistinguishable from condemning a woman to slavery under the headship of her husband, was the least popular one? Some are apparently surprised.

tbqf there was another form of marriage that was even more explicit about trading women like property and that was secular, though also very unpopular by the Late Republic.

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