Right Wing Discussion Thread XV: A New Hoppe

[Kowani]

Sure, but the better question is why. Probably because if you mistreat and marginalize a group they are more likely to be drawn to such an ideology.

Except for the fact said Jews tended to be well of socio-economically.

Economically yes, socially no.

[Novus America]

Sure, but the better question is why. Probably because if you mistreat and marginalize a group they are more likely to be drawn to such an ideology.

Except for the fact said Jews tended to be well of socio-economically.

Not in the Russian Empire.
Also you can be economically okay and still mistreated and marginalized.

[Joohan]

I like how working for a market research firm has turned one of my friends against universal enfranchisement.

The best argument for democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter.

You're a liberatarian. Yours is an ideology which idealizes the selfishness of the individual and excuses their faults as being non of the collective's concern.

I don't know what you gain from this quote.

[Duhon]

"Lenin was a Jew, therefore the Protocols are real!"

That Jews are over-represented among Revolutionary Leftist groups is well known; I don't see how that in of itself is controversial.

I'm not disputing that; I'm disputing -- no, way beyond that -- that it is specifically the Jewishness of Lenin et al that drove them to revolutionary thought and practice.

[Diopolis]

Except for the fact said Jews tended to be well of socio-economically.

Not in the Russian Empire.
Also you can be economically okay and still mistreated and marginalized.

Wealthy middleman minorities elsewhere don't seem to be leading revolutionary movements. I mean, Indians in Apartheid SA, Chinese in Malaysia, and Igbos in Nigeria, just to name a few examples, seem interested in maintaining the status quo.
And, to the point, most of the Russian revolutionaries were not Peasant ben Farmerstein. They came from wealthy, educated, urban jews.

[Totally Not OEP]

Not in the Russian Empire.
Also you can be economically okay and still mistreated and marginalized.

Wealthy middleman minorities elsewhere don't seem to be leading revolutionary movements. I mean, Indians in Apartheid SA, Chinese in Malaysia, and Igbos in Nigeria, just to name a few examples, seem interested in maintaining the status quo.
And, to the point, most of the Russian revolutionaries were not Peasant ben Farmerstein. They came from wealthy, educated, urban jews.

This, exactly.

[Duhon]

Not in the Russian Empire.
Also you can be economically okay and still mistreated and marginalized.

Wealthy middleman minorities elsewhere don't seem to be leading revolutionary movements. I mean, Indians in Apartheid SA, Chinese in Malaysia, and Igbos in Nigeria, just to name a few examples, seem interested in maintaining the status quo.
And, to the point, most of the Russian revolutionaries were not Peasant ben Farmerstein. They came from wealthy, educated, urban jews.

So it is the Jewishness, got it.

(Do I add the handwringing, crooked smiles, and presumably not a little bit of hissing to complete the picture?)

[Kowani]

Not in the Russian Empire.
Also you can be economically okay and still mistreated and marginalized.

Wealthy middleman minorities elsewhere don't seem to be leading revolutionary movements. I mean, Indians in Apartheid SA, Chinese in Malaysia, and Igbos in Nigeria, just to name a few examples, seem interested in maintaining the status quo.
And, to the point, most of the Russian revolutionaries were not Peasant ben Farmerstein. They came from wealthy, educated, urban jews.

None of the minorities you mentioned went under anything close to the treatment of Russian Jews.

[Hanafuridake]

Emperor Go-Toba is one of my favorite monarchs, in spite of his mistreatment of Fujiwara Teika and unjust persecution of Honen and the Pure Land school.

Hito mo oshi
Hito mo urameshi
Ajiki-naku
Yo wo omou yue ni.
Mono omou mi wa.

How I regret my fallen friends
How I despise my foes!
And, tired of life, I only seek
To reach my long day's close,
And gain at last repose.

[Joohan]

Except for the fact said Jews tended to be well of socio-economically.

Not in the Russian Empire.
Also you can be economically okay and still mistreated and marginalized.

No. Not in the slightest. If there is one constant throughout history, having superior wealth pretty much damn near decides were your status is in society. So what if your neighbors hate you cause you're Guadeloupean - you employ those peons, live in a gated community, and take vacations down by the coast.

I can't think of a single society where in material wealth was not the greatest decider of social standing, exempting states were in the government attempted genocide for ideological reasons.

[Jack Thomas Lang]

None of the minorities you mentioned went under anything close to the treatment of Russian Jews.

Neither Trotsky, Lenin and other Jewish Bolsheviks actually suffered from pogroms and overt oppression. They faced state-sanction repression because of their political activities, not Jewishness.

[Kowani]

Not in the Russian Empire.
Also you can be economically okay and still mistreated and marginalized.

No. Not in the slightest. If there is one constant throughout history, having superior wealth pretty much damn near decides were your status is in society. So what if your neighbors hate you cause you're Guadeloupean - you employ those peons, live in a gated community, and take vacations down by the coast.

I can't think of a single society where in material wealth was not the greatest decider of social standing, exempting states were in the government attempted genocide for ideological reasons.

So, how did medieval Jews fare in Europe?

[Duhon]

None of the minorities you mentioned went under anything close to the treatment of Russian Jews.

Neither Trotsky, Lenin and other Jewish Bolsheviks actually suffered from pogroms and overt oppression. They faced state-sanction repression because of their political activities, not Jewishness.

Well, that would be the creme de la creme. Now for the decidedly less creamy.

[Joohan]

No. Not in the slightest. If there is one constant throughout history, having superior wealth pretty much damn near decides were your status is in society. So what if your neighbors hate you cause you're Guadeloupean - you employ those peons, live in a gated community, and take vacations down by the coast.

I can't think of a single society where in material wealth was not the greatest decider of social standing, exempting states were in the government attempted genocide for ideological reasons.

So, how did medieval Jews fare in Europe?

The vast majority of them did terribly - with very little property or political rights they were both poor and marginalized. However, those jews who could obtain profitable job positions ( like court bankers ) did wonderfully for themselves while under the protection of the state.

[Diopolis]

Wealthy middleman minorities elsewhere don't seem to be leading revolutionary movements. I mean, Indians in Apartheid SA, Chinese in Malaysia, and Igbos in Nigeria, just to name a few examples, seem interested in maintaining the status quo.
And, to the point, most of the Russian revolutionaries were not Peasant ben Farmerstein. They came from wealthy, educated, urban jews.

None of the minorities you mentioned went under anything close to the treatment of Russian Jews.

Nonwhites under apartheid were treated so well, I forgot how the government singled them out to offer free ice cream...
Perhaps as another example, Armenians in the ottoman empire did organize to demand a higher level of autonomy, but not to launch an ideological revolt.

[Duhon]

Not in the Russian Empire.
Also you can be economically okay and still mistreated and marginalized.

No. Not in the slightest. If there is one constant throughout history, having superior wealth pretty much damn near decides were your status is in society. So what if your neighbors hate you cause you're Guadeloupean - you employ those peons, live in a gated community, and take vacations down by the coast.

I can't think of a single society where in material wealth was not the greatest decider of social standing, exempting states were in the government attempted genocide for ideological reasons.

By this metric no rich guy ever was a social pariah, or indeed can be molded into one, countless examples to the contrary.

[Joohan]

No. Not in the slightest. If there is one constant throughout history, having superior wealth pretty much damn near decides were your status is in society. So what if your neighbors hate you cause you're Guadeloupean - you employ those peons, live in a gated community, and take vacations down by the coast.

I can't think of a single society where in material wealth was not the greatest decider of social standing, exempting states were in the government attempted genocide for ideological reasons.

By this metric no rich guy ever was a social pariah, or indeed can be molded into one, countless examples to the contrary.

Because of their own personal actions and eccentricities, sure - but by ethnicity or religion? Pretty damn unlikely.

[Kowani]

None of the minorities you mentioned went under anything close to the treatment of Russian Jews.

Nonwhites under apartheid were treated so well, I forgot how the government singled them out to offer free ice cream...

I did not say they were treated well, but they certainly didn’t suffer the same way the Russian Jews did.

Perhaps as another example, Armenians in the ottoman empire did organize to demand a higher level of autonomy, but not to launch an ideological revolt.

What is the Armenian Genocide?

So, how did medieval Jews fare in Europe?

The vast majority of them did terribly - with very little property or political rights they were both poor and marginalized. However, those jews who could obtain profitable job positions ( like court bankers ) did wonderfully for themselves while under the protection of the state.

I refer to you the People’s Crusade.

[Communist Zombie Horde]

I got an ad on YouTube about why god is a he by prageru. Thank you Dennis.

[Diopolis]

Nonwhites under apartheid were treated so well, I forgot how the government singled them out to offer free ice cream...

I did not say they were treated well, but they certainly didn’t suffer the same way the Russian Jews did.

Perhaps as another example, Armenians in the ottoman empire did organize to demand a higher level of autonomy, but not to launch an ideological revolt.

What is the Armenian Genocide?

Not an example of Armenians launching an ideological revolt.

[Kowani]

I did not say they were treated well, but they certainly didn’t suffer the same way the Russian Jews did.

What is the Armenian Genocide?

Not an example of Armenians launching an ideological revolt.

Perhaps because they were devastated by the genocide?

[Hanafuridake]

I got an ad on YouTube about why god is a he by prageru. Thank you Dennis.

The fact that they see Dinesh D'Souza as an expert says all you needs to know about them.

[Diopolis]

Not an example of Armenians launching an ideological revolt.

Perhaps because they were devastated by the genocide?

Perhaps. Or perhaps because they never intended to in the first place.

[Joohan]

Nonwhites under apartheid were treated so well, I forgot how the government singled them out to offer free ice cream...

I did not say they were treated well, but they certainly didn’t suffer the same way the Russian Jews did.

Perhaps as another example, Armenians in the ottoman empire did organize to demand a higher level of autonomy, but not to launch an ideological revolt.

What is the Armenian Genocide?

The vast majority of them did terribly - with very little property or political rights they were both poor and marginalized. However, those jews who could obtain profitable job positions ( like court bankers ) did wonderfully for themselves while under the protection of the state.

I refer to you the People’s Crusade.

And my point is yet proven. Those jews with wealth and ties to business were able to save themselves from the violence, while their poorer counterparts were killed.

[Communist Zombie Horde]

I got an ad on YouTube about why god is a he by prageru. Thank you Dennis.

The fact that they see Dinesh D'Souza as an expert says all you needs to know about them.

Actually the video is by Dennis prayer and it is about the logical reasoning behind the choice of he as the pronoun.