Right Wing Discussion Thread XV: A New Hoppe

[El-Amin Caliphate]

The Mujaheddin were backed by the United States to screw over the Soviets

We're they actually mujaahidoon tho?

You mean a Puppet Regime...You can dress a pig up in makeup (ie. call a Puppet Regime, a "less hostile, sovereign, native government), but a pig will always be a pig.

Puppet regimes don't openly announce that in a conflict between two allies, they'd side against their 'puppeteers'. Puppet regimes don't kick out our forces because negotiations about their status break down. Puppet regimes are more the CIA's shtick, not the US military.

How about instead of imperialism and the serious high possibility of war crimes (considering America it's probably already happened) we actually help them out?

Right now, the CIA isn't in charge of the situation, though it may be quietly exploiting it, and if we had any sense we'd disband them and the NSA because the institutional culture is so fucking corrupt.

Espionage is like a sausage. If you want to keep your taste for, it you don't ask how its done.

In your opinion, how do you believe we should gather intelligence on foreign nations? Do you believe that gathering vital information on foreign enemies is important in any nation worried about self defense? How do you propose we manage the domestic espionage conducted against the U.S.A by our "allies" and by our enemies?

Spying is Haraam and we shouldn't be doing that, at least not when we aren't at war with anyone. We should focus of developing our own country and helping out/working with others if they want it.

[The Man Who Shot Jiminy Cricket]

The Mujaheddin were backed by the United States to screw over the Soviets

We're they actually mujaahidoon tho?

Puppet regimes don't openly announce that in a conflict between two allies, they'd side against their 'puppeteers'. Puppet regimes don't kick out our forces because negotiations about their status break down. Puppet regimes are more the CIA's shtick, not the US military.

How about instead of imperialism and the serious high possibility of war crimes (considering America it's probably already happened) we actually help them out?

Espionage is like a sausage. If you want to keep your taste for, it you don't ask how its done.

In your opinion, how do you believe we should gather intelligence on foreign nations? Do you believe that gathering vital information on foreign enemies is important in any nation worried about self defense? How do you propose we manage the domestic espionage conducted against the U.S.A by our "allies" and by our enemies?

Spying is Haraam and we shouldn't be doing that, at least not when we aren't at war with anyone. We should focus of developing our own country and helping out/working with others if they want it.

Abu Bakr was an imperialist and, properly, all Islam should be represented by one empire, although obviously not a western style one

[Novus America]

The Mujaheddin were backed by the United States to screw over the Soviets

We're they actually mujaahidoon tho?

Puppet regimes don't openly announce that in a conflict between two allies, they'd side against their 'puppeteers'. Puppet regimes don't kick out our forces because negotiations about their status break down. Puppet regimes are more the CIA's shtick, not the US military.

How about instead of imperialism and the serious high possibility of war crimes (considering America it's probably already happened) we actually help them out?

Espionage is like a sausage. If you want to keep your taste for, it you don't ask how its done.

In your opinion, how do you believe we should gather intelligence on foreign nations? Do you believe that gathering vital information on foreign enemies is important in any nation worried about self defense? How do you propose we manage the domestic espionage conducted against the U.S.A by our "allies" and by our enemies?

Spying is Haraam and we shouldn't be doing that, at least not when we aren't at war with anyone. We should focus of developing our own country and helping out/working with others if they want it.

We are try to help Afghanistan out. We have no imperialist designs there whatsoever.

And as long as threats exist we need to gather information about them.

[The Man Who Shot Jiminy Cricket]

We're they actually mujaahidoon tho?

How about instead of imperialism and the serious high possibility of war crimes (considering America it's probably already happened) we actually help them out?

Spying is Haraam and we shouldn't be doing that, at least not when we aren't at war with anyone. We should focus of developing our own country and helping out/working with others if they want it.

We are try to help Afghanistan out. We have no imperialist designs there whatsoever.

And as long as threats exist we need to gather information about them.

The U.S. does not invade or occupy anyone out of altruism and never has.

[Conserative Morality]

How about instead of imperialism and the serious high possibility of war crimes (considering America it's probably already happened) we actually help them out?

Your responses are so predictable.

[Conserative Morality]

The U.S. does not invade or occupy anyone out of altruism and never has.

Doesn't mean we can't help. Also, we've invaded and occupied for good PR before. That's basically altruism, or as close to it as a nation-sized organization can get.

[The Man Who Shot Jiminy Cricket]

The U.S. does not invade or occupy anyone out of altruism and never has.

Doesn't mean we can't help. Also, we've invaded and occupied for good PR before. That's basically altruism, or as close to it as a nation-sized organization can get.

Ah, no. Not when the U.S. owns the PR. Every American death in Iraq was held up by the media aw so brave and tragic. The 700,000 Iraqis killed, by contrast, had very little coverage

[Novus America]

We are try to help Afghanistan out. We have no imperialist designs there whatsoever.

And as long as threats exist we need to gather information about them.

The U.S. does not invade or occupy anyone out of altruism and never has.

Of course it is not purely altruism. But altruism does play a part on our policies.
Perhaps too much.

We went into Afghanistan because it was used to attack us on 9–11.
It has nothing we want. Why would we want Afghanistan?

[Conserative Morality]

Doesn't mean we can't help. Also, we've invaded and occupied for good PR before. That's basically altruism, or as close to it as a nation-sized organization can get.

Ah, no. Not when the U.S. owns the PR. Every American death in Iraq was held up by the media aw so brave and tragic. The 700,000 Iraqis killed, by contrast, had very little coverage

I see someone wasn't actually paying attention to the news at the time.

Also "American owns PR" lol

[Novus America]

Doesn't mean we can't help. Also, we've invaded and occupied for good PR before. That's basically altruism, or as close to it as a nation-sized organization can get.

Ah, no. Not when the U.S. owns the PR. Every American death in Iraq was held up by the media aw so brave and tragic. The 700,000 Iraqis killed, by contrast, had very little coverage

That is not entirely true, and the focus is because people have become jaded about Iraqis killing each other.

And obviously we do not own the PR. The media is very critical of us.

[The Man Who Shot Jiminy Cricket]

Ah, no. Not when the U.S. owns the PR. Every American death in Iraq was held up by the media aw so brave and tragic. The 700,000 Iraqis killed, by contrast, had very little coverage

I see someone wasn't actually paying attention to the news at the time.

Also "American owns PR" lol

America is more than a government. It is a collection of various interests and businesses. The controlling ones have considerable influence on state policy.

[Fahran]

Ah, no. Not when the U.S. owns the PR. Every American death in Iraq was held up by the media aw so brave and tragic. The 700,000 Iraqis killed, by contrast, had very little coverage

Publishing fatalities in graphic and transparent ways is a feature of media that emerged during the Vietnam War era and it effectively hamstrung our ability to engage in a long-term or even a serious military conflict without massive public outcry. You picked an unpopular example of a conflict that occurred due to poor intelligence and a refusal to comply to treaty obligations. The US has embarked on military adventures to cultivate good will in the past - including in Somalia, Yugoslavia, and the Caribbean. Of course, good will was never generated because involvement in war almost never accomplishes that goal.

[Conserative Morality]

That is not entirely true, and the focus because people have become jaded about Iraqis killing each other.

And obviously we do not own the PR. The media is very critical of us.

As it should be, of course. All things become lax under unwatchful eyes.

[Germanic Templars]

Ah, no. Not when the U.S. owns the PR. Every American death in Iraq was held up by the media aw so brave and tragic. The 700,000 Iraqis killed, by contrast, had very little coverage

That is not entirely true, and the focus because people have become jaded about Iraqis killing each other.

Or the Middle East and Africa in general. Just to throw on for good measures.

[The Man Who Shot Jiminy Cricket]

Ah, no. Not when the U.S. owns the PR. Every American death in Iraq was held up by the media aw so brave and tragic. The 700,000 Iraqis killed, by contrast, had very little coverage

Publishing fatalities in graphic and transparent ways is a feature of media that emerged during the Vietnam War era and it effectively hamstrung our ability to engage in a long-term or even a serious military conflict without massive public outcry. You picked an unpopular example of a conflict that occurred due to poor intelligence and a refusal to comply to treaty obligations. The US has embarked on military adventures to cultivate good will in the past - including in Somalia, Yugoslavia, and the Caribbean. Of course, good will was never generated because involvement in war almost never accomplishes that goal.

It was incredibly popular and bipartisan at the outset. Once people got bored with it, it ceased to be popular. That intellugence was fabricated added to disgruntlement, although not outrage

[El-Amin Caliphate]

The US has embarked on military adventures to cultivate good will in the past - including in Somalia

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/ ... ar-crimes/
https://www.thedailybeast.com/strong-ev ... in-somalia
http://hornofafrica.ssrc.org/de_Waal3/

Yugoslavia

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bo ... Yugoslavia:

"The bombing killed between 489 and 528 civilians, and destroyed bridges, industrial plants, public buildings, private businesses"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilia ... lied_Force

[Novus America]

The US has embarked on military adventures to cultivate good will in the past - including in Somalia

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/ ... ar-crimes/
https://www.thedailybeast.com/strong-ev ... in-somalia
http://hornofafrica.ssrc.org/de_Waal3/

Yugoslavia

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bo ... Yugoslavia:

"The bombing killed between 489 and 528 civilians, and destroyed bridges, industrial plants, public buildings, private businesses"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilia ... lied_Force

Entering with good intentions does not mean no casualties will occur, and the occurrence of casualties does not mean intentions are bad.

[Free African Union]

After Russia withdrew, Afghanistan was in total anarchy until.the Taliban restored order. If the Taliban is exterminated and the U.S. leaves, the country will probably degenerate into anarchy or civil war

The US is no even doing much fighting there anymore. The Afghanistan government, despite its flaws can survive and with the Taliban gone be able endure and be about as good as you can expect for that part of the world.

Except the Taliban isn't gone and is in fact wrestling more and more control out of the hands of the Afghan government.

[Novus America]

The US is no even doing much fighting there anymore. The Afghanistan government, despite its flaws can survive and with the Taliban gone be able endure and be about as good as you can expect for that part of the world.

Except the Taliban isn't gone and is in fact wrestling more and more control out of the hands of the Afghan government.

Well sure the Taliban is not gone. I was responding to a poster who claimed if the Taliban was gone there would be a civil war.

The Taliban is unfortunately still around, which is why we unfortunately cannot completely just pack up and leave yet.

But the government is not at any immediate risk of collapse either.

[Confederate States of German America]

Anyone who thinks irregular military forces are not credible threats has a very poor grasp of military history.

Going back to this, where did the anti-Soviet irregular forces of the Baltic States, Poland and Ukraine go after the end of the 1940's? Why did they not pose a potent enough threat to the Soviet machinery that they were on the cusp of success?

They remained an extremely effective fighting and lasted in some capacity into the 1960s; Soviet sources and Western intelligence suggests that those in the Baltics alone inflicted some 20,000 casualties on the Red Army over the late 1940s, which is equal to possibly five divisions given the RKKA average per division in 1944-1945. In the Baltics and Ukraine alone, not including Poland or Romania, there was probably as many Anti-Soviet partisans as there had been partisans against the Germans in 1942-1943.

[Confederate States of German America]

Fascist Virginia: a band of raiders broken and reformed into a totalistic militarist state under the dictatorship of one known as Oil Exporting Peoples. The aesthetic is a mixture of Confederate, Kaiserreich, and Roman. It despises weakness and enforces total discipline, with summary execution for those who are found guilty of breaching the rules. The number of conscripts who survive training are relatively low. It's currently at war with Maryland and its proxy state West Virginia, which Fascist Virginia wants to become a part of Virginia again.

Would've preferred Tennessee or North Carolina, but the fact I'm engaged in warfare with CM in Maryland is fitting.

[Confederate States of German America]

I doubt many mommas know what Jews are.

You know how when you don't get a girl's number at a party and your fellow dude-bros tell you that "there's plenty of fish in the sea?" Well, we're the mermaids. And Judaism is the rock against which a hundred ships will crash.

I'm bad at jokes. And humility.

Tbh, this one fell flat. I've also only just met my first Jew and he was a dude, so I have yet to see evidence of this.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/ ... ar-crimes/
https://www.thedailybeast.com/strong-ev ... in-somalia
http://hornofafrica.ssrc.org/de_Waal3/

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bo ... Yugoslavia:

"The bombing killed between 489 and 528 civilians, and destroyed bridges, industrial plants, public buildings, private businesses"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilia ... lied_Force

Entering with good intentions does not mean no casualties will occur, and the occurrence of casualties does not mean intentions are bad.

The time span between my post and this is 2 mins, no where near enough time to read those links. Please read them, especially the the link by De Waal.

[Confederate States of German America]

So, you certainly agree, that the US lost the Vietnam War, among other wars.

We did lose, by why you lost matters to.
The military did not lose the war, Congress lost it.

For which quite a few people should've been shot for, given the treason inherent to it. By the time our boys left the VC were dead as an effective force while continued American logistical aid and air support had shown during the 1972 Easter Offensives that the ARVN could meet and defeat the NVA. Then traitors in the Media and Congress, overwhelmingly Leftist, stabbed our efforts in the back.

[Novus America]

Entering with good intentions does not mean no casualties will occur, and the occurrence of casualties does not mean intentions are bad.

The time span between my post and this is 2 mins, no where near enough time to read those links. Please read them, especially the the link by De Waal.

It does not matter. Bad things possibly being done during a war does not mean the original intentions were bad.