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US Considers Reparations For Slavery

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Should descendants of African American slaves get reparations?

Yes
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No
280
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Total votes : 349

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Enjuku
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US Considers Reparations For Slavery

Postby Enjuku » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:06 pm

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/21/us/p ... olicy.html

More and more US Democratic Presidential candidates are supporting some form of financial reparations for descendants of African American slaves:

Even among the 2020 Democrats who stopped short of endorsing reparations, several have laid out robust policies aimed at closing the gap in wealth between black and white families. Scholars estimate that black families in America today earn just $57.30 for every $100 in income earned by white families, according to the Census Bureau’s Current Population Survey. For every $100 in white family wealth, black families hold just $5.04.


It's a difficult topic imo. Black families were originally planned to get paybacks in land and money (if you've ever heard the expression "40 acres and a mule") but never got it. Instead they had to start from nothing, regardless of the racial discrimination they faced from the abolition of slavery in the 1860s to the Civil Rights era in the 1960s. Some even ended up working back on the plantations they were freed from at a very minor wage, and by the time Reconstruction ended, they were living in practical slavery for many more generations. Meanwhile, white families who profited from slavery kept their profits and see that benefit today. This down the line leads to the massive wealth inequality between African Americans and everyone else in the US.

There's also the argument that the mass incarceration of African Americans, stealing mothers and fathers and children from Black families, is the "new slavery". Lost generations of potential wealth, all due to government-sanctioned racism. When you contextualize the value of all the lost wages, or the financial cost of the pain and suffering, it becomes an EXTREMELY expensive endeavor. But is it worth it?

What are some of your thoughts? Does the US government have an obligation to provide financial pay-back to make up for all the lost wealth from hundreds of years of racism and unpaid labor?
Last edited by Enjuku on Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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LiberNovusAmericae
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Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:15 pm

I'm against this, as I don't have any slave owner ancestors. I see no reason as to why I should pay for it.

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Aureumterra
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Postby Aureumterra » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:18 pm

The vast majority of Americans do not have ancestors that owned slaves. Even at the time of slavery, it was only the rich who could afford it, so forcing everyone to pay reparations is a pretty stupid move
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Greed and Death
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Postby Greed and Death » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:20 pm

The 40 acres and a mule comes from special field orders 15 by General Sherman. The measures were war time measure and meant to be temporary. It was a means by which freed slaves could feed themselves immediately rather than hamper the war effort by forcing the Union army to provide food.
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The South Falls
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Postby The South Falls » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:24 pm

Yea, that's not going to work. All kinds of problems related to genealogy, and racial categorization.
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LiberNovusAmericae
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Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:25 pm

Aureumterra wrote:The vast majority of Americans do not have ancestors that owned slaves. Even at the time of slavery, it was only the rich who could afford it, so forcing everyone to pay reparations is a pretty stupid move

I agree, and many of the poorer people in the south couldn't vote, due to property requirements. Their descendants are hardly responsible for this.

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Postby Ifreann » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:30 pm

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:I'm against this, as I don't have any slave owner ancestors. I see no reason as to why I should pay for it.

The US government was rather involved in slavery. Would you agree that it should pay reparations?
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Postby Conserative Morality » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:31 pm

Descendants should not get reparations - too much time has passed. Measures should be enacted with an eye towards racial equality.
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LiberNovusAmericae
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Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:34 pm

Ifreann wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:I'm against this, as I don't have any slave owner ancestors. I see no reason as to why I should pay for it.

The US government was rather involved in slavery. Would you agree that it should pay reparations?

No, because it takes its money from citizens like me, so in actuality it is the people getting penalized, despite us not being responsible for this. The people who actually owe reparations are long dead.
Last edited by LiberNovusAmericae on Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Iberia01
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Postby Iberia01 » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:37 pm

This is just the latest of the countless expamples of the Democrat Party's race baiting tactics

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Greed and Death
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Postby Greed and Death » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:38 pm

Ifreann wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:I'm against this, as I don't have any slave owner ancestors. I see no reason as to why I should pay for it.

The US government was rather involved in slavery. Would you agree that it should pay reparations?

any former slave should be compensated.
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US-SSR
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Postby US-SSR » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:38 pm

It is a documented fact that the current prosperity and power of the US is largely based on taking land from Native Americans and putting African slaves to work on it. The profits from this thievery extended from the cotton fields of the Mississippi basin to the textile mills and manufacturies of New England. No one who has benefited from the strength of the US economy can claim to have no connection to slavery; we are all implicated.

That being said I prefer Ta-Nehisi Coates's solution:

    - All African-Americans are automatically registered to vote upon turning 18. No paperwork needed.
    - The votes of all African-Americans count for 5/3 of a vote.

I favor this partly because no amount of money could begin to repay the descendants of those who had their land, labor and liberty stolen from them in order to "make America great."
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Postby Ors Might » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:47 pm

Not a big fan of reparations. Seems more appropriate to work towards improving the lives of the still living.
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Vetalia
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Postby Vetalia » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:47 pm

Handouts aren't going to solve the problem of wealth disparity, the only thing that will work is true investment in black communities. That investment is only possible with more of President Trump's economic and criminal justice reform policies to alleviate black unemployment and disparity in job opportunities, liberalization of drug laws regarding marijuana, a focus on encouraging black entrepreneurship, and a focus on eliminating crime via stiff, non-negotiable sentencing for violent criminals and opiod dealers. The resources freed from legalizing marijuana alone would be a godsend for saving areas like NE Ohio.
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Ors Might
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Postby Ors Might » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:49 pm

US-SSR wrote:It is a documented fact that the current prosperity and power of the US is largely based on taking land from Native Americans and putting African slaves to work on it. The profits from this thievery extended from the cotton fields of the Mississippi basin to the textile mills and manufacturies of New England. No one who has benefited from the strength of the US economy can claim to have no connection to slavery; we are all implicated.

That being said I prefer Ta-Nehisi Coates's solution:

    - All African-Americans are automatically registered to vote upon turning 18. No paperwork needed.
    - The votes of all African-Americans count for 5/3 of a vote.

I favor this partly because no amount of money could begin to repay the descendants of those who had their land, labor and liberty stolen from them in order to "make America great."

So privileges for racial groups? And doesn’t your statement mean that wealthy blacks are also implicated in slavery?
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Postby Gun Manufacturers » Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:58 pm

My family didn't come over to the US until AFTER slavery was abolished, so I don't see how I owe reparations. Another issue I see is, how do we prove who was a descendant of a slave? Also, how much damage do we plan to do to our economy in this VERY futile and disconnected attempt to right hundreds of years of wrongs?

I have an alternative solution that will do much the same thing, without the economic damage. Since the US Government was responsible for allowing slavery, anyone that can prove that they are the descendant of a slave is allowed to give sitting politicians a good, swift kick in the shin.
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Postby The Ferenghi » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:11 pm

Well
One The U.S. Didn't bring slavery to North America or Africa it was a practice in both places before we were a nation
Two While we didn't start it we did end it.
Three Just how much in reparations is owed by Africans that sold Africans as slaves (Something that is still ongoing)
Four Does this give white people that are descended from people that were enslaved by the moors the right to reparations ?
Five if you have slaveowner blood are you prorated (First slaveowner in America was black)
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Postby Otira » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:14 pm

Ifreann wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:I'm against this, as I don't have any slave owner ancestors. I see no reason as to why I should pay for it.

The US government was rather involved in slavery.

It was also rather involved in ending it.

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US-SSR
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Postby US-SSR » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:17 pm

Ors Might wrote:
US-SSR wrote:It is a documented fact that the current prosperity and power of the US is largely based on taking land from Native Americans and putting African slaves to work on it. The profits from this thievery extended from the cotton fields of the Mississippi basin to the textile mills and manufacturies of New England. No one who has benefited from the strength of the US economy can claim to have no connection to slavery; we are all implicated.

That being said I prefer Ta-Nehisi Coates's solution:

    - All African-Americans are automatically registered to vote upon turning 18. No paperwork needed.
    - The votes of all African-Americans count for 5/3 of a vote.

I favor this partly because no amount of money could begin to repay the descendants of those who had their land, labor and liberty stolen from them in order to "make America great."

So privileges for racial groups? And doesn’t your statement mean that wealthy blacks are also implicated in slavery?


Yes, privileges for racial groups. Why not? And let's ask "wealthy blacks," who are every bit as likely as any black people to be the victims of institutional racism and random and organized hatred, how they feel the US system has benefited them before we draw any conclusions, shall we?
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Postby Farnhamia » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:18 pm

The Ferenghi wrote:Well
One The U.S. Didn't bring slavery to North America or Africa it was a practice in both places before we were a nation
Two While we didn't start it we did end it.
Three Just how much in reparations is owed by Africans that sold Africans as slaves (Something that is still ongoing)
Four Does this give white people that are descended from people that were enslaved by the moors the right to reparations ?
Five if you have slaveowner blood are you prorated (First slaveowner in America was black)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Johnson_(colonist)

Anthony Johnson wasn't the first slave owner in what is now the US. He arrived in Virginia in 1621, the first slaves in 1619.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_i ... al_America

And, may I say, the title is very misleading. The US government is not considering reparations, some candidates have raised the idea.
Last edited by Farnhamia on Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:21 pm

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:
Ifreann wrote:The US government was rather involved in slavery. Would you agree that it should pay reparations?

No, because it takes its money from citizens like me, so in actuality it is the people getting penalized, despite us not being responsible for this. The people who actually owe reparations are long dead.

Suppose the reparations didn't increase the tax burden on you. The government sells assets off or garnishes Congressional wages or something. Would you support the US government paying reparations for its part in slavery then?

You said that you shouldn't have to pay reparations, because your ancestors didn't own slaves. So I assume that you think that people whose ancestors did own slaves do owe reparations. I mean, otherwise why mention your ancestors at all? Well, the US government is essentially the same "person" it was for the entire period that slavery was practised within its jurisdiction. If someone descended from slave owners owes reparations then surely the US government does.
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Postby Upper Pacifica » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:23 pm

Enjuku wrote:https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/21/us/politics/2020-democrats-race-policy.html

I'm supporting Marianne Williamson for POTUS, and I'm glad she's mentioned in this article

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Ors Might
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Postby Ors Might » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:25 pm

US-SSR wrote:
Ors Might wrote:So privileges for racial groups? And doesn’t your statement mean that wealthy blacks are also implicated in slavery?


Yes, privileges for racial groups. Why not? And let's ask "wealthy blacks," who are every bit as likely as any black people to be the victims of institutional racism and random and organized hatred, how they feel the US system has benefited them before we draw any conclusions, shall we?

Because privileging people because of their race is immoral.

You said that anyone that benefits from the US having a strong economy is implicated in slavery. That’s a very wide net you chose to cast.
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Postby Salus Maior » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:29 pm

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:31 pm

Ors Might wrote:
US-SSR wrote:
Yes, privileges for racial groups. Why not? And let's ask "wealthy blacks," who are every bit as likely as any black people to be the victims of institutional racism and random and organized hatred, how they feel the US system has benefited them before we draw any conclusions, shall we?

Because privileging people because of their race is immoral.

You said that anyone that benefits from the US having a strong economy is implicated in slavery. That’s a very wide net you chose to cast.

How do you undo the effects of enslaving a race of people without privileging that people?
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