New Jersey to Teach LGBT History in Schools

[Karu Nadu]

Just replying to the thread

With a source that, as was pointed out, doesn't actually have anything to do with the argument that you made.

So, the whole thing about the problem with children of a same-sex couple. At one point, I believe Hari Kondabolu had a joke of some kind about his mother's opposition (and eventual change of mind) towards it.

[Aellex]

Not Good, per se, but potentially beneficial if implemented properly, otherwise it may inadvertently do more harm than benefit.

And how does acknowledging the historic contributions of LGBTQIA and disabled persons do harm exactly?

It's a rather sad and an admission of how little they have done that you're forced to put them in their own little category tbh.

[Karu Nadu]

And how does acknowledging the historic contributions of LGBTQIA and disabled persons do harm exactly?

It's a rather sad and an admission of how little they have done that you're forced to put them in their own little category tbh.

People of the LGBTQ+ community have done lots, to tell the truth.

[Aellex]

It's a rather sad and an admission of how little they have done that you're forced to put them in their own little category tbh.

People of the LGBTQ+ community have done lots, to tell the truth.

Have they? And did they even recognize themselves in that label you're trying to force on them?
Plenty of Romans plowed other men's asses but they'd still rage at being associated with "effetes" and "boys who prostitute their virtue".
I find the whole thing a little dumb personally but well.

[Slarvainian]

People of the LGBTQ+ community have done lots, to tell the truth.

Have they? And did they even recognize themselves in that label you're trying to force on them?
Plenty of Romans plowed other men's asses but they'd still rage at being associated with "effetes" and "boys who prostitute their virtue".
I find the whole thing a little dumb personally but well.

I think it's sort of silly any identity group be able to voice a collective opinion on their labels. Really it should be left to self-identification but we sadly can't discuss ideals when talking about LGBTQ issues or even public policy in general. Let's be practical here, homosexuality is probably still a generation away from being completely normalized (20 years) while trans and non-binary individuals are probably two generations away. Until then you sort of have to do this pandering to those that aren't aware of the similarity of others to themselves.

On that note of practicality, we don't need the Romans opinion in order to say there were gay people in their society. It's more colloquial than anything.

[Ifreann]

People of the LGBTQ+ community have done lots, to tell the truth.

Have they? And did they even recognize themselves in that label you're trying to force on them?
Plenty of Romans plowed other men's asses but they'd still rage at being associated with "effetes" and "boys who prostitute their virtue".
I find the whole thing a little dumb personally but well.

Congrats on stumbling onto a key things people should be taught. That out current understandings of gender and sexuality have not been shared by all peoples in all periods of of history.

[The South Falls]

People of the LGBTQ+ community have done lots, to tell the truth.

Have they? And did they even recognize themselves in that label you're trying to force on them?
Plenty of Romans plowed other men's asses but they'd still rage at being associated with "effetes" and "boys who prostitute their virtue".
I find the whole thing a little dumb personally but well.

Teaching the history of those who are important is paramount, otherwise history is useless.

[Aellex]

Have they? And did they even recognize themselves in that label you're trying to force on them?
Plenty of Romans plowed other men's asses but they'd still rage at being associated with "effetes" and "boys who prostitute their virtue".
I find the whole thing a little dumb personally but well.

Teaching the history of those who are important is paramount, otherwise history is useless.

It really isn't tho. Again, that Sulla liked to get sodomised by a trap should be nothing more than a funny trivia when talking about the proscriptions and the last days of the Republic, not the subject of the whole lesson.

[Karu Nadu]

Teaching the history of those who are important is paramount, otherwise history is useless.

It really isn't tho. Again, that Sulla liked to get sodomised by a trap should be nothing more than a funny trivia when talking about the proscriptions and the last days of the Republic, not the subject of the whole lesson.

I don't think they're giving lessons on these peoples' sex lives, to be honest...

[Internationalist Bastard]

Teaching the history of those who are important is paramount, otherwise history is useless.

It really isn't tho. Again, that Sulla liked to get sodomised by a trap should be nothing more than a funny trivia when talking about the proscriptions and the last days of the Republic, not the subject of the whole lesson.

Which is probably what it’ll be in class

[Vassenor]

It really isn't tho. Again, that Sulla liked to get sodomised by a trap should be nothing more than a funny trivia when talking about the proscriptions and the last days of the Republic, not the subject of the whole lesson.

I don't think they're giving lessons on these peoples' sex lives, to be honest...

Yes, but it's easy to use extreme examples like that to try and discredit teaching kids about a current example of marginalisation.

Then again it'd probably also result in kids realising why terms like "trap" are problematic as well.

[Aellex]

It really isn't tho. Again, that Sulla liked to get sodomised by a trap should be nothing more than a funny trivia when talking about the proscriptions and the last days of the Republic, not the subject of the whole lesson.

I don't think they're giving lessons on these peoples' sex lives, to be honest...

And yet that's the only reason you want to talk of them.

[Aellex]

Yes, but it's easy to use extreme examples like that to try and discredit teaching kids about a current example of marginalisation.

Stop trying to insert your politics everywhere. History is supposed to be about history, period.

Then again it'd probably also result in kids realising why terms like "trap" are problematic as well.

Trap is rather polite albeit familiar word, their contemporaries would have been way cruder and direct than I've been. :^)

[Karu Nadu]

I don't think they're giving lessons on these peoples' sex lives, to be honest...

And yet that's the only reason you want to talk of them.

When did I ever say that was the only reason I wanted to talk about them?

[Internationalist Bastard]

I don't think they're giving lessons on these peoples' sex lives, to be honest...

And yet that's the only reason you want to talk of them.

We’ll more specifically it’s to create an idea that lgbt people has always been around and important to both help lgbt students feel better about themselves while also teaching people it’s a natural part of life

[Christian Confederation]

Just replying to the thread

This thread is on the decision of New Jersey to implement recognition of the historical contributions of LGBTQIA and disabled persons within their history curriculum. You have argued that children raised by same-sex couples would suffer from developmental issues. You have linked to articles discussing divorce and family breakup, which has nothing to do with your earlier claim.

My argument was children need a father and a mother to grow up without mental and emotional problems, than I remembered an ancient conservative proverb.
"Never dabate with a libral they will not lessin to even the most fact based argument, there one goal is to disagree with you and win even if they are wrong"- Ben Shapiro

[Aellex]

When did I ever say that was the only reason I wanted to talk about them?

That's literally what this whole thing is about. Slap some big "that guy was gay" sticker on some historical figure and talk about him for no other reason than that, as if it defined both his personality and accomplishments.

[Vassenor]

This thread is on the decision of New Jersey to implement recognition of the historical contributions of LGBTQIA and disabled persons within their history curriculum. You have argued that children raised by same-sex couples would suffer from developmental issues. You have linked to articles discussing divorce and family breakup, which has nothing to do with your earlier claim.

My argument was children need a father and a mother to grow up without mental and emotional problems, than I remembered an ancient conservative proverb.
"Never dabate with a libral they will not lessin to even the most fact based argument, there one goal is to disagree with you and win even if they are wrong"- Ben Shapiro

Maybe you should actually provide facts then rather than just hiding behind badly misspelled rhetoric.

[Christian Confederation]

My argument was children need a father and a mother to grow up without mental and emotional problems, than I remembered an ancient conservative proverb.
"Never dabate with a libral they will not lessin to even the most fact based argument, there one goal is to disagree with you and win even if they are wrong"- Ben Shapiro

Maybe you should actually provide facts then rather than just hiding behind badly misspelled rhetoric.

This is why I don't dabate People online

[Alvecia]

That kinda implies sex and relationships can't be casual

Because THEY CANT BE CASUAL!! It’s not like getting a burrito!

Yes they can.

[Karu Nadu]

When did I ever say that was the only reason I wanted to talk about them?

That's literally what this whole thing is about. Slap some big "that guy was gay" sticker on some historical figure and talk about him for no other reason than that, as if it defined both his personality and accomplishments.

What about the bias against LGBT+ people in the past, and the struggle to legalize gay marriage and civil unions? Do you think those aren't important things to teach?

[Vassenor]

Maybe you should actually provide facts then rather than just hiding behind badly misspelled rhetoric.

This is why I don't dabate People online

Because we actually expect you to back up what you say with facts rather than just blindly accepting that you are right?

[Aellex]

That's literally what this whole thing is about. Slap some big "that guy was gay" sticker on some historical figure and talk about him for no other reason than that, as if it defined both his personality and accomplishments.

What about the bias against LGBT+ people in the past, and the struggle to legalize gay marriage and civil unions? Do you think those aren't important things to teach?

I do not, no. There are plenty better and more interesting things to focus about.

[Neutraligon]

What about the bias against LGBT+ people in the past, and the struggle to legalize gay marriage and civil unions? Do you think those aren't important things to teach?

I do not, no. There are plenty better and more interesting things to focus about.

We learn about the civil rights movement in the 60s, why shouldn't we also learn about the civil rights movement for LGBT people?

[Pasong Tirad]

This thread is on the decision of New Jersey to implement recognition of the historical contributions of LGBTQIA and disabled persons within their history curriculum. You have argued that children raised by same-sex couples would suffer from developmental issues. You have linked to articles discussing divorce and family breakup, which has nothing to do with your earlier claim.

My argument was children need a father and a mother to grow up without mental and emotional problems, than I remembered an ancient conservative proverb.
"Never dabate with a libral they will not lessin to even the most fact based argument, there one goal is to disagree with you and win even if they are wrong"- Ben Shapiro

Imagine thinking quoting Ben Shapiro is a good argument.