Inquisitions and jihads. Why do theists and tax payers respe

[Genivaria]

Take it from an antitheist that you need to get off your high horse and chill OP.

[Adad Civilization]

Christianity doesn't use inquisitions

Soon...

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Jihad:
https://sunnah.com/urn/1276900
https://sunnah.com/urn/409900
http://islamicsupremecouncil.org/unders ... ml?start=9
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AmcCrq6fIr0
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=klFib4nid7g
(https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2eR-ljgwTTA
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fD9VrPfk028
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=t0smqx_Cen4
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kVfftHFDXko
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0cK4PVGa6d8
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ypNCRK5SloM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nRajIIDcTJk
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yRP7m68ZDVY)
Watch the links inside the parentheses consecutively, they are parts 1 - 8.

^I think these only talk about Lesser Jihad, so you can ask me about Greater Jihad if you want to know.

I know what jihad is.

Ok then, what is it?

Caliphal infallibility isn't a thing afaik since Islam does not follow a type of theocratic power structure. The closest they have would probably be Ulema, Mullah, or Imams.

A Caliphate (Khalifah in Arabic) is the theocratic power structure of an Islamic nation, but you are correct in that they aren't infallible.

Doesn't exist.

False.

You've already proven yourself an unreliable proponent of Islam

How?

so I'm not sure why you'd think they'I'd care what you had to say about this.

Then don't say incorrect stuff. Jihad exist everywhere where a Muslim lives.

[Page]

Given that theists are to love the sinners and hate the sin, inquisitions and jihads seem to suggest that theists hate the sinners and love sin as they use murder to grow their religions, due to not having solid moral arguments and moral tenets to convert others with.

Hate the sin love the sinner is a bunch of crap anyway.

Back in the days of the Atlantic Slave Trade, slave owners used religion to justify their actions. But how does it sound if someone says "I love black people, but I hate their sinful nature of not knowing their place and thinking they are equals to the white man." Is that person a racist? No shit. And when a modern day gay hater says "I love you, but your lifestyle is sinful", that is a homophobe.

It's just an excuse for people to justify their bigotry. But there is no moral difference between bigotry inspired by religion and bigotry inspired by anyone else.

[Former Citizens of the Nimbus System]

Jihad:
https://sunnah.com/urn/1276900
https://sunnah.com/urn/409900
http://islamicsupremecouncil.org/unders ... ml?start=9
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AmcCrq6fIr0
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=klFib4nid7g
(https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2eR-ljgwTTA
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fD9VrPfk028
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=t0smqx_Cen4
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kVfftHFDXko
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0cK4PVGa6d8
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ypNCRK5SloM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nRajIIDcTJk
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yRP7m68ZDVY)
Watch the links inside the parentheses consecutively, they are parts 1 - 8.

^I think these only talk about Lesser Jihad, so you can ask me about Greater Jihad if you want to know.

I know what jihad is.

Why do you seem to respect and support murder?

Regards
DL

In actuality, I'm fairly sure you don't and, since I haven't seen anyone put an explanation here, I might as well fill the void!

Jihad, translated literally, means 'struggle', which obviously has a huge array of interpretations. It is divided into two types: lesser jihad and greater jihad. Greater jihad, considered by most to be the more important of the two, is focussed on self-perfection; it is a struggle against one's inner wrongs to make oneself a better person spiritually. Lesser jihad, on the other hand, is the struggle against outward, material wrongs. A part of the latter is, indeed, holy war, but that is governed by strict rules intended to ensure that such wars are righteous and necessary (whether war is this at all is another matter): that it may not simply be started to convert others to Islam and that one must not harm non-combatants its course are just two. Needless to say, I know of no Islamist terrorist group that properly engages in lesser jihad as it is perceived by the vast majority of Muslims. Moreover, lesser jihad is far more often concerned with other material wrongs: giving to charity, for instance, and engaging actively in one's community, are expressions of lesser jihad that most Muslims participate in on a regular basis.

Please bear in mind that I am an atheist myself and most of this is remembered from my three month-long Religious Studies topic on Islam from Year Eight (Grade Nine for Americans, if I correctly recall); if there are any inaccuracies in the above that somebody more knowledgeable is aware of, please do say so. Other than that, I hope that this helps!

[Xmara]

Op why do you come off acting so superior to everyone? You accuse religious people of being closed minded and bigoted, yet you’re strawmanning and making gross generalizations. I’m a Christian, and I don’t support genocide. The vast majority of both Christians and Muslims don’t support genocide.

I agree with Gen. You seriously need to chill.

[Joohan]

Not always, but their core values are, such as their homophobia and misogyny, which is why they had to resort to inquisitions and jihads to grow.

Regards
DL

Most of what you have a problem with in Christianity comes from incorrect assumptions based on the Old Testament. The jews were an angry bunch, but a good chunk of the Old Testament is not considered by Chirstianity to be canon, perse.

All the old testament is canon - but we operate under the new testament.

It confuses most people but - the new testament fulfills the old. The lessons remain the same, but the applications are different.

[Ethereal Expanse]

First there is no such thing as infallible human. I am a catholic but I think we are big enough to admit in the past we have got it wrong. Most of the money is gathered through donations from common people and much of that money goes back into supporting the public. If we would just get it through our heads that it is not our job to punish sinners maybe things like this would not happen.

We support these systems because of the good that they have done and continue to do. Do we make mistakes absolutely yes we do. Do we get it wrong yes we do but to codemn the whole system for the actions a few is short-sighted. Churches gather money and goods for the poor and people involved in natural disasters. Churches bring a sense of community and hold up ideals which we all strive to achieve.

[Ethereal Expanse]

Secondly tax dollars are not collected to support churches at least in the USA. Churches are tax exempt which is not really the same thing. There are certain programs such AA which have nothing really to do with religion which can receive state, municipal, or federal funding. Churches also support adoption, battered women shelters, and food pantries. In general they tend to do more good than harm. Does that relieve us from the mistakes we have made in the past, no it does not.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Caliphal infallibility isn't a thing afaik since Islam does not follow a type of theocratic power structure. The closest they have would probably be Ulema, Mullah, or Imams.
Even then, it's nowhere to the degree of the strict hierarchy of the catholic church and all the diocese and bishops and archbishops and the like.

Seems the OP already has their mind made up about theism and is putting face for a faux-debate to seem tolerant.

I am not at all tolerant of evil and proudly admit it.

Both Christianity and Islam, slave holding ideologies, have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

And you don't know neither Islamic nor Christian history in full.

Please dont misrepresent and twist my words because that's exactly what you're doing with the strawman in your first sentence.

You still have not demonstrated who exactly is funding inquisitions and jihads as I asked you in my post.

The last sentence I can agree with.

If you agree with my last, where do you think that cash goes if not to help fund Islam's endeavors, which include jihad?

Which type of jihad are you talking about?

I know what jihad is.

Why do you seem to respect and support murder?

Regards
DL

In actuality, I'm fairly sure you don't and, since I haven't seen anyone put an explanation here, I might as well fill the void!

Jihad, translated literally, means 'struggle', which obviously has a huge array of interpretations. It is divided into two types: lesser jihad and greater jihad. Greater jihad, considered by most to be the more important of the two, is focussed on self-perfection; it is a struggle against one's inner wrongs to make oneself a better person spiritually. Lesser jihad, on the other hand, is the struggle against outward, material wrongs. A part of the latter is, indeed, holy war, but that is governed by strict rules intended to ensure that such wars are righteous and necessary (whether war is this at all is another matter): that it may not simply be started to convert others to Islam and that one must not harm non-combatants its course are just two. Needless to say, I know of no Islamist terrorist group that properly engages in lesser jihad as it is perceived by the vast majority of Muslims. Moreover, lesser jihad is far more often concerned with other material wrongs: giving to charity, for instance, and engaging actively in one's community, are expressions of lesser jihad that most Muslims participate in on a regular basis.

Please bear in mind that I am an atheist myself and most of this is remembered from my three month-long Religious Studies topic on Islam from Year Eight (Grade Nine for Americans, if I correctly recall); if there are any inaccuracies in the above that somebody more knowledgeable is aware of, please do say so. Other than that, I hope that this helps!

You are correct

And the stuff Ethereal Expanse said is some of the same stuff masaajid do.

[Saiwania]

I find that the Inquisitions were justified given the time and place. Spain was rooting out a Muslim and Jewish fifth column to solidify their Catholic state after reconquest of their land after many centuries of occupation by north Africans and the other people they brought with them. Spain was right to force them all back out. It was undoing a mistake of history. Spain shouldn't have fallen to invaders to begin with.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

I find that the Inquisitions were justified given the time and place. Spain was rooting out a Muslim and Jewish fifth column to solidify their Catholic state after reconquest of their land after many centuries of occupation by north Africans and the other people they brought with them. Spain was right to force them all back out. It was undoing a mistake of history. Spain shouldn't have fallen to invaders to begin with.

Considering we ruled Al-Andalus for ~700 years, they would've been the 5th column. And aren't you against persecuting ethnic groups?

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Considering we ruled Al-Andalus for ~700 years, they would've been the 5th column.

And they ruled out for the centuries before that.

[The New California Republic]

Spain was rooting out a Muslim and Jewish fifth column to solidify their Catholic state after reconquest of their land after many centuries of occupation by north Africans and the other people they brought with them. Spain was right to force them all back out. It was undoing a mistake of history. Spain shouldn't have fallen to invaders to begin with.

It could be argued that Moorish culture was far superior to the Visigothic culture in Iberia that they displaced.

[Awesome Dudes and Dudettes]

OP is making me laugh
Straw-manning, acting superior, coming in close-minded, you really need to think before posting.

[Saiwania]

It could be argued that Moorish culture was far superior to the Visigothic culture in Iberia that they displaced.

You're going to side with barbarians from the east that embraced the use of sexual slavery, over Iberian natives whose ancestors experienced Roman civilization?

[Ithreland]

Given that theists are to love the sinners and hate the sin, inquisitions and jihads seem to suggest that theists hate the sinners and love sin as they use murder to grow their religions, due to not having solid moral arguments and moral tenets to convert others with.

Hate the sin love the sinner is a bunch of crap anyway.

Back in the days of the Atlantic Slave Trade, slave owners used religion to justify their actions. But how does it sound if someone says "I love black people, but I hate their sinful nature of not knowing their place and thinking they are equals to the white man." Is that person a racist? No shit. And when a modern day gay hater says "I love you, but your lifestyle is sinful", that is a homophobe.

It's just an excuse for people to justify their bigotry. But there is no moral difference between bigotry inspired by religion and bigotry inspired by anyone else.

My best friend is gay. I am a Christian. I support him as a person but not his actions. Some people don't drink, but are friends with people who do--not saying alcohol's a sin, but using it as an example that people can civilly disagree on even the arguably most important things.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

It could be argued that Moorish culture was far superior to the Visigothic culture in Iberia that they displaced.

You're going to side with barbarians from the east that embraced the use of sexual slavery

Which 'barbarians are you talking about? At least 3 Muslims states ruled Al-Andalus.

over Iberian natives whose ancestors experienced Roman civilization?

Living in Rome doesn't make someone good.

[The New California Republic]

It could be argued that Moorish culture was far superior to the Visigothic culture in Iberia that they displaced.

You're going to side with barbarians from the east that embraced the use of sexual slavery, over Iberian natives whose ancestors experienced Roman civilization?

Yup.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

You're going to side with barbarians from the east that embraced the use of sexual slavery, over Iberian natives whose ancestors experienced Roman civilization?

Yup.

Same here.

[Pope Joan]

Jihad is a grassroots movement which has been callously co opted by powerful Sunni state (the Sauds) and Israel (for whom it is a convenient tool against Iran and Hezbollah)

As such, it now has very little to do with real religion

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Jihad is a grassroots movement which has been callously co opted by powerful Sunni state (the Sauds) and Israel (for whom it is a convenient tool against Iran and Hezbollah)

As such, it now has very little to do with real religion

False

[GnosticChristian]

Take it from an antitheist that you need to get off your high horse and chill OP.

Take it from me that if you are not actively fighting the vile religions that are harming society as we speak, that your morals need improving.

Both Christianity and Islam, slave holding ideologies, have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

https://topdocumentaryfilms.com/theft-values/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxoxPapPxXk

Humanity centered religions, good? Yes. Esoteric ecumenist Gnostic Christianity being the best of these.

Supernaturally based religions, evil? Yes. Islam and Christianity being the worst of these.

Regards
DL

[GnosticChristian]

Given that theists are to love the sinners and hate the sin, inquisitions and jihads seem to suggest that theists hate the sinners and love sin as they use murder to grow their religions, due to not having solid moral arguments and moral tenets to convert others with.

Hate the sin love the sinner is a bunch of crap anyway.

Back in the days of the Atlantic Slave Trade, slave owners used religion to justify their actions. But how does it sound if someone says "I love black people, but I hate their sinful nature of not knowing their place and thinking they are equals to the white man." Is that person a racist? No shit. And when a modern day gay hater says "I love you, but your lifestyle is sinful", that is a homophobe.

It's just an excuse for people to justify their bigotry. But there is no moral difference between bigotry inspired by religion and bigotry inspired by anyone else.

U C 20/20 on this.

Pass that on to all theists and be prepared to be hated just like the ancient Christians hated us when we spoke the truth of their religious views and they sent their inquisitors to exterminate us.

Regards
DL

[GnosticChristian]

Op why do you come off acting so superior to everyone? You accuse religious people of being closed minded and bigoted, yet you’re strawmanning and making gross generalizations. I’m a Christian, and I don’t support genocide. The vast majority of both Christians and Muslims don’t support genocide.

I agree with Gen. You seriously need to chill.

Yahweh/Jesus is a genocidal son murdering God. If you see him as something else, let's start looking at the morals Christianity has, starting with their homophobia and misogyny.

Watch this clip and see what moral men have to say first, then come and tell me what kind of God would torture and murder a baby, all because of his anger at the father.

https://vimeo.com/7038401

Regards
DL