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Canada asks China's ambassador for clemency in death-row Cdn

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The Royal Kingdom of Quebec
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Canada asks China's ambassador for clemency in death-row Cdn

Postby The Royal Kingdom of Quebec » Tue Jan 15, 2019 7:09 pm

Source

Foreign Affairs Minister Chrystia Freeland has reached out to China's ambassador to ask for clemency in the case of Robert Lloyd Schellenberg, the Canadian who is facing the death penalty for allegedly smuggling 222 kilograms of methamphetamines.

"We have already spoken with China's ambassador to Canada and requested clemency," Freeland told reporters in Sainte-Hyacinthe, Que. today.

"Canada's position when it comes to the death penalty is consistent and of very long-standing," she added. "As Canadians know, we do not have the death penalty in Canada. We believe it is inhumane and inappropriate, and wherever the death penalty is considered with regard to a Canadian we speak out against it."

On Monday a Chinese court issued a death sentence against Schellenberg in what has become the latest escalation in the diplomatic rift between Canada and China.

The tensions emerged in early December when Canada arrested Meng Wanzhou, the chief financial officer of the Chinese technology giant Huawei on an extradition request issued by the United States.

The U.S. alleges Meng is guilty of violating international sanctions against Iran through a Huawei subsidiary called Skycom.

Shortly after Meng's arrest China arrested Canadians Michael Kovrig, a diplomat on leave who is working for an NGO in China and Michael Spavor, a business consultant who arranges trips to North Korea.


@PnPCBC
.@cafreeland says the gov't has spoken to China's Ambassador to Canada and requested clemency for Robert Schellenberg. She says Canada's current travel advisory urges people to use a 'high degree of caution' when travelling to China #cdnpoli

Asked if it was time for Canada to escalate the level of communication, to have Prime Minister Justin Trudeau reach out to Chinese President Xi Jinping, Freeland said there was plenty of talking going on between officials at present.

"We are in touch with the Chinese government at a number of levels," Freeland said.

'I've spoken to the Chinese ambassador twice myself, and he has many contacts here. We are also in touch with the Chinese government in China at a number of levels, and that continuing that dialogue is very important."

Harper's China clemency request

Global Affairs Canada confirmed to CBC News Tuesday that it provided consular assistance to one Canadian who was executed in 2015 for drug smuggling.

As first reported by Toronto Star, former Canadian Ambassador to China Guy Saint-Jacques said two Canadians of Chinese origin were tried and executed while he served as envoy to the country.

In an interview Tuesday with CBC News Network's Power & Politics, Saint-Jacques said Canada was only granted consular access to one Canadian because the other used a Chinese travel document to enter the country.

“Prime Minister Harper wrote a personal letter to Xi Jinping asking for clemency and they proceeded anyway the next day with the execution,” says Guy Saint-Jacques explaining how Canada has sought clemency in the past for Canadians facing the death penalty in China.

Saint-Jacques said both former prime minister Stephen Harper and former governor general David Johnston were personally involved in asking China for clemency in the two cases to no avail.

In fact, Saint-Jacques said that when Canada learned of the scheduled date of execution for the man who entered on his Canadian passport, Harper wrote a personal letter to Chinese President Xi Jinping asking for clemency.

China executed the man the next day.

Saint-Jacques said he doesn't think the Canadian government's request for leniency in the case of Schellenberg will change the attitude of the Chinese government.

Chinese politicians, not judges, may determine fate of Canadian sentenced to die

Freeland said she was proud that a "large and growing group" of Canada's allies are standing by Canada in the dispute, including Germany, France, the Netherlands, the EU, the U.S. the U.K. Australia, Estonia, Lithuania and Latvia.

Despite the tensions, Freeland was not ready to call time on the Canada/China relationship, saying that it is a "complicated and difficult moment" in the relationship between the two countries.

"It's also important to remember that Canada's relationship with China is very long-standing," Freeland said.

"It is a deep relationship which has many strands to it, and I think both Canada and China are committed to that relationship going forward. But it is true that this is a difficult moment, and our government will continue to advocate for the Canadians who are arbitrarily detained."


You gotta be kidding me. 222kg of meth to smuggle and you are asking the criminal, regardless of his nationality, to get away instead of 15 yrs (initial decision) or death sentence (second time around)? Ffs....
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Othelos
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Postby Othelos » Tue Jan 15, 2019 7:24 pm

I don't think they are arguing for him to "get away", but rather a sentence that doesn't involve the death penalty. The issue here is that the re-trial for the smuggling (which is called double-jeopardy and is a violation of constitutional rights in Canada and other nations that respect human rights) is clearly politically motivated and is a reaction to the arrest of Huawei's CFO.

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Cetacea
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Postby Cetacea » Tue Jan 15, 2019 7:38 pm

china has executed foreign nationals for drug smuggling in the past and there is nothing that makes this case different

222kg of meth isnt minor and its dealers deserve no clemency nor sympathy

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Othelos
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Postby Othelos » Tue Jan 15, 2019 7:43 pm

Cetacea wrote:china has executed foreign nationals for drug smuggling in the past and there is nothing that makes this case different

I disagree.

- It took 2.5 years for his case to originally move through courts and bureaucracy and be sentenced to 15 years in prison.
- Huawei's CFO was arrested in Canada.
- In one day, the defendant was retried and convicted to death.

This is a political tool that China is using to pressure Canada.

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LiberNovusAmericae
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Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Tue Jan 15, 2019 7:47 pm

Othelos wrote:
Cetacea wrote:china has executed foreign nationals for drug smuggling in the past and there is nothing that makes this case different

I disagree.

- It took 2.5 years for his case to originally move through courts and bureaucracy and be sentenced to 15 years in prison.
- Huawei's CFO was arrested in Canada.
- In one day, the defendant was retried and convicted to death.

This is a political tool that China is using to pressure Canada.

Agreed, and China isn't known for having an independent judicial system either, so that is something that China would do.

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Ethel mermania
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Postby Ethel mermania » Tue Jan 15, 2019 7:49 pm

if canada agrees to sell china 1,000,000 barrels of oil a day for say 10 years at 50 dollars a barrel, i am sure some sort of accommodation can be worked out
Last edited by Ethel mermania on Tue Jan 15, 2019 7:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Costa Fierro
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Postby Costa Fierro » Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:21 pm

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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:21 pm

I believe the Chinese term for this is:

"公报私仇" (Gōngbàosīchóu)

Its an age old Chinese expression that denotes "avenging a personal wrong in the name of public interest/official regular business."

Basically they're saying, "well you didn't let our person go... so now TAKE THIS!"

And when you get upset they go:

"Well it's nothing personal. We're just following formalities."

And they maintain a perfectly civilised, straight, polite face and facade as they point you to the rules and then they say "sorry, there's nothing we can do about it."
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
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Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:34 pm

No nation should ever have a death penalty. The state outside of war should not have the power to end another humans life.

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Ethel mermania
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Postby Ethel mermania » Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:41 pm

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:No nation should ever have a death penalty. The state outside of war should not have the power to end another humans life.


thats lovely, but china disagrees.
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger

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Othelos
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Postby Othelos » Tue Jan 15, 2019 10:47 pm


I agree with her. We have to stand together and defend our societies.

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Arlenton
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Postby Arlenton » Tue Jan 15, 2019 10:55 pm

If a foreign person committed a crime in China that is considered punishable by the death penalty in China, then foreign nations have no right to talk.

In this case though, it seems there may be more at play.

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Arlenton
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Postby Arlenton » Tue Jan 15, 2019 10:56 pm

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:No nation should ever have a death penalty. The state outside of war should not have the power to end another humans life.

No. If they knowingly commit a crime that is punishable by the death penalty, they deserve it.

Not saying this particular guy does, since I'm hearing that some other funky stuff is going on.
Last edited by Arlenton on Tue Jan 15, 2019 10:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Western Vale Confederacy
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Postby Western Vale Confederacy » Tue Jan 15, 2019 11:16 pm

As much as I disagree with outright executing drug dealers, this crime was seemingly committed on Chinese land, and thus Canada has no right in interfering with the application of Chinese law on a crime committed on Chinese territory, as slightly excessive of a punishment as it might be.

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Risottia
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Postby Risottia » Tue Jan 15, 2019 11:36 pm

Western Vale Confederacy wrote:As much as I disagree with outright executing drug dealers, this crime was seemingly committed on Chinese land, and thus Canada has no right in interfering with the application of Chinese law on a crime committed on Chinese territory, as slightly excessive of a punishment as it might be.

Canada has no right, that's why they're asking, not ordering.
.

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Page
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Postby Page » Tue Jan 15, 2019 11:37 pm

Western Vale Confederacy wrote:As much as I disagree with outright executing drug dealers, this crime was seemingly committed on Chinese land, and thus Canada has no right in interfering with the application of Chinese law on a crime committed on Chinese territory, as slightly excessive of a punishment as it might be.


A fair point, except for the fact that this guy was re-sentenced from 15 years to death in a single day during a time of diplomatic tensions in which Canada and China each do little things to spite each other.
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Costa Fierro
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Postby Costa Fierro » Wed Jan 16, 2019 12:09 am

Arlenton wrote:In this case though, it seems there may be more at play.


There is. Canada arrested and then released Huawei's CFO on bail on the behest of the United States and now China is acting in response to that.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

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Ethel mermania
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Postby Ethel mermania » Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:57 am

A little more background on the topic.

The BBC article bas links to others around the case of schellenberg

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-46874922
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger


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