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Leftist Militias: Should Liberals Be Pro-Second Amendment?

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Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:44 pm

Telconi wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
I thought so. Generally killing people is seen as "post Kool-aid" behaviour.


Not by reasonable people.


So killing police is reasonable?
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

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Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:46 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Telconi wrote:
I'm curious who thinks it isn't?


99% of the non-conservative and non-American human population.


I've literally never seen anyone who doesn't, so either you're full of crap, or I am a hell of a statistical anomoly.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:46 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Not by reasonable people.


So killing police is reasonable?


When they are oppressing people, yes.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:48 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
And gun ownership is worth killing for?


Every part of the bill of rights is.


Why?
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54796
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:49 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Every part of the bill of rights is.


Why?


Because I rather like all the various bits of it.
Hellenic Polytheist, Socialist

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Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:49 pm

Telconi wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
99% of the non-conservative and non-American human population.


I've literally never seen anyone who doesn't, so either you're full of crap, or I am a hell of a statistical anomoly.


Hold on, you're saying you've never seen anyone who doesn't think it's unreasonable to murder someone to be able to own guns?
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

User avatar
Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:50 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
Why?


Because I rather like all the various bits of it.


I rather like ice cream. Do I get to murder people for that?
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54796
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:50 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Because I rather like all the various bits of it.


I rather like ice cream. Do I get to murder people for that?


If someone breaks into your home and tries to take your ice cream I say go ahead.
Hellenic Polytheist, Socialist

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Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:50 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Telconi wrote:
I've literally never seen anyone who doesn't, so either you're full of crap, or I am a hell of a statistical anomoly.


Hold on, you're saying you've never seen anyone who doesn't think it's unreasonable to murder someone to be able to own guns?


No, I said I have never seen anyone who thinks it's unreasonable to kill over the issue of gun ownership.
Last edited by Telconi on Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:53 pm

Telconi wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
Hold on, you're saying you've never seen anyone who doesn't think it's unreasonable to murder someone to be able to own guns?


No, I said I have never seen anyone who thinks it's unreasonable to kill over the issue of gun ownership.


Well that explains alot. Also you are a statistical anomaly.
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

User avatar
Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:54 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
I rather like ice cream. Do I get to murder people for that?


If someone breaks into your home and tries to take your ice cream I say go ahead.


And if I'm in a country where ice creams are illegal, do I get to murder people until they're legalised?
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

User avatar
Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:55 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Telconi wrote:
No, I said I have never seen anyone who thinks it's unreasonable to kill over the issue of gun ownership.


Well that explains alot. Also you are a statistical anomaly.


And yet you cant rustle up a counter-example.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Licana
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16276
Founded: Jul 26, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Licana » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:55 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Telconi wrote:
No, I said I have never seen anyone who thinks it's unreasonable to kill over the issue of gun ownership.


Well that explains alot. Also you are a statistical anomaly.


Yeah, we'll just take your word for that.
>American education
[19:21] <Lubyak> I want to go and wank all over him.
Puzikas wrote:Gulf War One was like Slapstick: The War. Except, you know, up to 40,000 people died.

Vitaphone Racing wrote:Never in all my years have I seen someone actually quote the dictionary and still get the definition wrong.

Husseinarti wrote:
Vitaphone Racing wrote:Do lets. I really want to hear another explanation about dirty vaginas keeping women out of combat, despite the vagina being a self-cleaning organ.

So was the M-16.

Senestrum wrote:How are KEPs cowardly? Surely the "real man" would in fact be the one firing giant rods of nuclear waste at speeds best described as "hilarious".

User avatar
Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:57 pm

Telconi wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
Well that explains alot. Also you are a statistical anomaly.


And yet you cant rustle up a counter-example.


A counter example of someone who doesn't think it's reasonable to murder to own guns? Maybe pro gun control Americans and every country with stricter gun laws? That's, what 7.4 billion people?
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

User avatar
Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:58 pm

Licana wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
Well that explains alot. Also you are a statistical anomaly.


Yeah, we'll just take your word for that.


So you think everyone thinks it's reasonable to murder to own guns?
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

User avatar
Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54796
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:58 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
If someone breaks into your home and tries to take your ice cream I say go ahead.


And if I'm in a country where ice creams are illegal, do I get to murder people until they're legalised?


If you feel that's a worthy cause.
Hellenic Polytheist, Socialist

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Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:59 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Telconi wrote:
And yet you cant rustle up a counter-example.


A counter example of someone who doesn't think it's reasonable to murder to own guns? Maybe pro gun control Americans and every country with stricter gun laws? That's, what 7.4 billion people?


The best thing about counter-examples is they need to counter the stated position...

Gun grabbers are perfectly fine with killing over the issue of gun ownership.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:01 pm

Telconi wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
A counter example of someone who doesn't think it's reasonable to murder to own guns? Maybe pro gun control Americans and every country with stricter gun laws? That's, what 7.4 billion people?


The best thing about counter-examples is they need to counter the stated position...

Gun grabbers are perfectly fine with killing over the issue of gun ownership.


So forgetting about your weird second line, you admit there are plenty of counter examples then?
We need to take this one step at a time.
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

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LiberNovusAmericae
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6942
Founded: Mar 10, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:02 pm

Telconi wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
A counter example of someone who doesn't think it's reasonable to murder to own guns? Maybe pro gun control Americans and every country with stricter gun laws? That's, what 7.4 billion people?


The best thing about counter-examples is they need to counter the stated position...

Gun grabbers are perfectly fine with killing over the issue of gun ownership.

This ^^ More authoritarian types would raid houses to seize any gun they could find, or have SWAT teams do it.

User avatar
Tobleste
Minister
 
Posts: 2713
Founded: Dec 27, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tobleste » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:02 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Tobleste wrote:
And if I'm in a country where ice creams are illegal, do I get to murder people until they're legalised?


If you feel that's a worthy cause.


So it's reasonable to kill for whatever I think is important?

Do you see why the rest of us think you (the anti gun control lobby) are ridiculous?
Social Democrat
Political Compass:
Economic Left/Right: -4.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.26

User avatar
Len Hyet
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10798
Founded: Jun 25, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Len Hyet » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:03 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
If you feel that's a worthy cause.


So it's reasonable to kill for whatever I think is important?

Do you see why the rest of us think you (the anti gun control lobby) are ridiculous?

So your argument is there is nothing worth killing or dying for?
=][= Founder, 1st NSG Irregulars. Our Militia is Well Regulated and Well Lubricated!
On a formerly defunct now re-declared one-man campaign to elevate the discourse of you heathens.
American 2L. No I will not answer your legal question.

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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54796
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:04 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
If you feel that's a worthy cause.


So it's reasonable to kill for whatever I think is important?


Yes, it's been that way for literally all of human history.
Hellenic Polytheist, Socialist

User avatar
Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:05 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Telconi wrote:
The best thing about counter-examples is they need to counter the stated position...

Gun grabbers are perfectly fine with killing over the issue of gun ownership.


So forgetting about your weird second line, you admit there are plenty of counter examples then?
We need to take this one step at a time.


You keep insisting these counter-examples exist, and yet you provide as a "counter-example" people who have literally written tweets about nuking American cities over the issue of gun ownership...

Hey, in case you didn't k ow this yet. Nuclear warheads kill...
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
LiberNovusAmericae
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6942
Founded: Mar 10, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:05 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
If you feel that's a worthy cause.


So it's reasonable to kill for whatever I think is important?

Do you see why the rest of us think you (the anti gun control lobby) are ridiculous?

Most of us aren't seriously for terrorism in that manor, but I guarantee that over-regulating guns will create a violent black market. That's something that gun control advocates ignore.

User avatar
Licana
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16276
Founded: Jul 26, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Licana » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:06 pm

Tobleste wrote:
Licana wrote:
Yeah, we'll just take your word for that.


So you think everyone thinks it's reasonable to murder to own guns?


"So you're saying X?" is about the laziest way to strawman, step up your game.
>American education
[19:21] <Lubyak> I want to go and wank all over him.
Puzikas wrote:Gulf War One was like Slapstick: The War. Except, you know, up to 40,000 people died.

Vitaphone Racing wrote:Never in all my years have I seen someone actually quote the dictionary and still get the definition wrong.

Husseinarti wrote:
Vitaphone Racing wrote:Do lets. I really want to hear another explanation about dirty vaginas keeping women out of combat, despite the vagina being a self-cleaning organ.

So was the M-16.

Senestrum wrote:How are KEPs cowardly? Surely the "real man" would in fact be the one firing giant rods of nuclear waste at speeds best described as "hilarious".

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