Leftist Militias: Should Liberals Be Pro-Second Amendment?

[Bezkoshtovnya]

Both of these are simply not true. Guns don't cause violence themselves, and somehow getting rid of all of them isn't going to end or even reduce violence in any meaningful way. Plus, no. I think I would rather defend myself with a firearm then getting into a brawl with edged weapons.

I didn't state that with implications that guns cause violence. I'm not one of those "Guns kill people!" Idiots. I simply mean that a violent person can do more harm with a gun that he can anything else, with the exceptions of bombs and other such things.

But at the same time you say that someone meaning harm with a gun is a big threat, you also want law abiding citizens to make do with using knives for self defense instead of guns, and say they are just as effective.

[Thermodolia]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redneck_Revolt

As a pro-gun liberal, I was curious about whether there existed a counter to right-wing militias, and, sure enough, there are indeed a few groups. However, these groups are nowhere near as numerous as the 689 current active anti-government paramilitary groups (that curiously peaked during the Obama administration).

I studied the Redneck Revolt specifically, and they seemed, frankly, a little silly, though I appreciate that their mission is rather clear and concise. At the end of the day, though, they're one group, and a group with a frankly suspicious name.

After all, you know who else loves the color red? That's right. Communists and socialists. Yes, considering it's quite possible that the Redneck Revolt is a possibly Communist group, I have decided to ask myself, and therefore NSG, the question: should the left begin to arm itself in response to the increased presence of anti-government right wing militias, without espousing far-left ideals?

As a pro-gun liberal, I personally don't think it would be a... Terrible idea, just one that could easily get out of control, since private militias are a bad idea in general, especially when they're full of paranoid survivalists who are fond of self-fulfilling prophecies (I mean obviously the government is unreliable and oppressive: they panic and increase security when they're attacked by terrorists/"freedom fighters" like the Sovereign Citizen Movement and the fucking Bundinistas).

I have also noticed that quite a large number of liberals are anti-gun/Second Amendment. Granted, I realize that the evidence against the Second Amendment is there, however, I find it highly unlikely that the Second Amendment is ever going to be struck down... Enough that I refuse to compromise the rest of my political beliefs in favor of it.

At the same time, however... Is it a good idea to be pro-Second Amendment? Does the Second Amendment advocate a state-funded militia, or private militias? Should liberals bear arms, or is that counter-productive, both towards national and local safety and crime safety? Are leftist militias a concept that is too far-left?

Militias are a crap idea in general unless you're living in Somalia or Revolutionary France. The "left" is less afraid of government (and everything else) than the right so is less likely to form those types of militias. They're also more likely to believe in communal solutions to problems so are more likely to just want a better police force. Oh and they think gun violence is bad. All this means left-wing militias will always be a minority compared to right-wing militias.

You are thinking of liberals not actual leftists

[Chernoslavia]

Militias are a crap idea in general unless you're living in Somalia or Revolutionary France. The "left" is less afraid of government (and everything else) than the right so is less likely to form those types of militias. They're also more likely to believe in communal solutions to problems so are more likely to just want a better police force. Oh and they think gun violence is bad. All this means left-wing militias will always be a minority compared to right-wing militias.

You are thinking of liberals not actual leftists

Bah, liberals are just commies without ak47s.

[Ors Might]

You are thinking of liberals not actual leftists

Bah, liberals are just commies without ak47s.

Liberals are commies that weren’t cool enough to be tankies and went a bit too far with their salty sour grapes.

[Western Vale Confederacy]

Bah, liberals are just commies without ak47s.

Liberals are commies that weren’t cool enough to be tankies and went a bit too far with their salty sour grapes.

Classical liberalism crying in the distance as it is now associated with unhinged progressives and SJWs...

[Ors Might]

Liberals are commies that weren’t cool enough to be tankies and went a bit too far with their salty sour grapes.

Classical liberalism crying in the distance as it is now associated with unhinged progressives and SJWs...

It used to be one of the cool kids now it has to sit at the same table as the low budget theater dorks.

[Ardoki]

Civilians should not have access to guns. Only the police and military should be allowed firearms.

[Western Vale Confederacy]

Civilians should not have access to guns. Only the police and military should be allowed firearms.

Yeah, when hell freezes over.

[Frostnia]

Civilians should not have access to guns. Only the police and military should be allowed firearms.

This seems like a topic for a different thread, my friend

[Farnhamia]

Civilians should not have access to guns. Only the police and military should be allowed firearms.

This seems like a topic for a different thread, my friend

Quite right, and we do have one of those, over here: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=439114. Still, given the topic of the thread, it's difficult to forbid that sort of discussion here.

[Bezkoshtovnya]

Civilians should not have access to guns. Only the police and military should be allowed firearms.

I think it is a safe bet to say that is never going to happen anywhere in the world. Either by criminal means or laws that allow citizens to have them, there are always going to be guns among civilians.

[Blazelander]

>impliying libshits are able to shot a gun

[The Chuck]

>impliying libshits are able to shot a gun

Woah there hotshot, no need to start dropping rude terminology around. We're all here to voice our opinions and there's more polite ways to go about it.

[Farnhamia]

>impliying libshits are able to shot a gun

*** Warned for trolling. ***

[Thermodolia]

Civilians should not have access to guns. Only the police and military should be allowed firearms.

The workers should be armed. Armed workers are harder to bully than unarmed workers

[Thermodolia]

>impliying libshits are able to shot a gun

Leftists aren’t liberals. And both of those groups can shoot weapons and have better grammar

[The Chuck]

Civilians should not have access to guns. Only the police and military should be allowed firearms.

The workers should be armed. Armed workers are harder to bully than unarmed workers

Unfortunately tell that to the workers at the Homestead strike...

[Ethereal Expanse]

I think what is really scary is you think ethnic cleansing may happen in the USA. I think we need less guns. If you can't stand on the strength of your ideas and convey those ideas to your peers then maybe the time for those ideas has not come or there is no will to pursue those ideas.

[Ors Might]

I think what is really scary is you think ethnic cleansing may happen in the USA. I think we need less guns. If you can't stand on the strength of your ideas and convey those ideas to your peers then maybe the time for those ideas has not come or there is no will to pursue those ideas.

Historically, most of the good in the world that came about in any era was backed by force. It’d be incredible if we could just rely on the value of our ideas but the fact of the matter is that if you want your ideals to prevail, you need some kind of strength to back it up. Whether that comes from a majority bloc or from the barrels of a metric fuck ton of guns makes little difference.

[Telconi]

I think what is really scary is you think ethnic cleansing may happen in the USA. I think we need less guns. If you can't stand on the strength of your ideas and convey those ideas to your peers then maybe the time for those ideas has not come or there is no will to pursue those ideas.

We would have had a really rough time conveying the idea that Jews were people to the Nazis...

[Infected Mushroom]

Upon further reflection, I'm really really torn on this.

On the one hand, I want the left wing to be able to field a large militia/standing army to counter the existing militias of the right. If we turned to statelessness today the right wing could easily defeat the left in the field of battle and that's not necessarily a balanced nor desirable good status quo. As of now, the political culture of the left strongly discourages the maintenance of heavily armed militias even where liberals DO live in places where guns are legal. Meanwhile, the right can mobilise thousands-millions of troops as soon as the state collapses. Its not balanced and this bothers me.

However, if guns were made legal many many individuals would face some serious temptations. If guns became legal and widely available, I might face some temptations to use them. And so too, I would imagine, many liberals. I'm not sure this is a good idea. It could be dangerous for society.

I'm tempted to use my firearms all the time. Usually by my friend Ben, when he wants to go to the range. Other times, by my friend Chris, who wants me to take him with me the next time I go to the range. All the other times are when I'm the one that initiates the plan to go to the range.

Every time I DO use them involves the destruction of a lot of paper targets, followed by a good meal, and shopping for targets/shooting supplies/etc.

Then you have pretty good self control

I am personally glad I didn’t have access to firearms in the past; I would not trust myself with them

[Frievolk]

I'm tempted to use my firearms all the time. Usually by my friend Ben, when he wants to go to the range. Other times, by my friend Chris, who wants me to take him with me the next time I go to the range. All the other times are when I'm the one that initiates the plan to go to the range.

Every time I DO use them involves the destruction of a lot of paper targets, followed by a good meal, and shopping for targets/shooting supplies/etc.

Then you have pretty good self control

I am personally glad I didn’t have access to firearms in the past; I would not trust myself with them

Then don't buy guns. It's not our fault you can't use anything responsibly.

[Paddy O Fernature]

Then you have pretty good self control

I am personally glad I didn’t have access to firearms in the past; I would not trust myself with them

Then don't buy guns. It's not our fault you can't use anything responsibly.

^ Ding!

[Grinning Dragon]

Then don't buy guns. It's not our fault you can't use anything responsibly.

^ Ding!

Then again, it is people like this who decide that they themselves could not be trusted so therefore others cannot be trusted and laws must be passed.
As to the OP, I think everyone should be pro 2nd Amendment, after all the right to keep and bear arms and the ability to join or form a militia is just one of the many positives of individual freedom.

[Paddy O Fernature]

^ Ding!

Then again, it is people like this who decide that they themselves could not be trusted so therefore others cannot be trusted and laws must be passed.

Projectionists at their finest. People need to stop blaming others and take a little bit of self responsibility for their stupid mistakes.