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Why do/don't you believe in a higher power? (Any HP)

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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The Grims
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Founded: Antiquity
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby The Grims » Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:58 pm

The Caleshan Valkyrie wrote:
Elenir wrote:Then you are a gnostic lmao, you actively deny the existance of god


Your assessment is flawed. Would you like me to link you to the relevant chart?

Here it is anyway:

Image


You’ll note that in my previous statements I’ve specifically stated that without evidence to back up your claim, I’ve no reason to treat your god as anything more than an imaginary friend that you’re just a little too invested in. I could just as easily presume that the universe was sneezed into existence by the Great Green Arkleseizure, and that would have every bit the same amount of material support as the idea of this god thingie.

Does this mean that I deny the fact that it cannot fully be DISproven? Nope.


That chart is slightly flawed. Agnosticism is a statement about the possibility of knowledge. An agnost believes it is not possible to know for certain if a God or gods exist, while a gnostic believes such knowing is possible. This distinction changes the gnostic theist quadrant: a gnostic theist believes god exists and also thinks it is possible to know this for certain - but does not need to claim to actually know it themselves.
Last edited by The Grims on Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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South Odreria
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Ex-Nation

Postby South Odreria » Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:09 pm

I believe in God because of some experiences I have had, that are not relevant to anyone except me.

Also, what he said.^ I believe in God, and I think it is possible to know 100%, but I do not.
Last edited by South Odreria on Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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The Caleshan Valkyrie
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Postby The Caleshan Valkyrie » Thu Jan 10, 2019 5:46 am

The Grims wrote:
The Caleshan Valkyrie wrote:
Your assessment is flawed. Would you like me to link you to the relevant chart?

Here it is anyway:

Image


You’ll note that in my previous statements I’ve specifically stated that without evidence to back up your claim, I’ve no reason to treat your god as anything more than an imaginary friend that you’re just a little too invested in. I could just as easily presume that the universe was sneezed into existence by the Great Green Arkleseizure, and that would have every bit the same amount of material support as the idea of this god thingie.

Does this mean that I deny the fact that it cannot fully be DISproven? Nope.


That chart is slightly flawed. Agnosticism is a statement about the possibility of knowledge. An agnost believes it is not possible to know for certain if a God or gods exist, while a gnostic believes such knowing is possible. This distinction changes the gnostic theist quadrant: a gnostic theist believes god exists and also thinks it is possible to know this for certain - but does not need to claim to actually know it themselves.


Righto, my point stands tho.
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Sneudal
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Founded: Jan 09, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Sneudal » Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:43 am

The Caleshan Valkyrie wrote:
Sneudal wrote:As an Agnostic person i don't confirm or deny the existance of a God, nor do i follow a specific religion for that matter. Only two ways to find out for sure: either he/she/it proves it, or we'll meet him/her/it on the day we die (or we don't, in which case it never mattered anyways).


I used to be like you, calling myself agnostic. Then I discovered that agnostic and atheist are not mutually exclusive.

As an agnostic atheist I admit that it is impossible to prove that a god doesn’t exist, but in the absence of any evidence supporting the position that a god DOES exist it is necessary to default to the negation of that position.

It’d be pretty silly to do otherwise. Would one look both ways before crossing the street, see that there are no cars, then still avoid crossing because maybe there’s some undetectable god-car trundling stealthily along at the worst possible moment?


Oh i just don't bother with the millions of names people come up with for every little change in view these days, i suppose i'm too old for that.

I do agree with your view though, but still try not to be a total dickhead in life just in case there is a God at the end.

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The Blaatschapen
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Anarchy

Postby The Blaatschapen » Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:46 am

Sneudal wrote:
The Caleshan Valkyrie wrote:
I used to be like you, calling myself agnostic. Then I discovered that agnostic and atheist are not mutually exclusive.

As an agnostic atheist I admit that it is impossible to prove that a god doesn’t exist, but in the absence of any evidence supporting the position that a god DOES exist it is necessary to default to the negation of that position.

It’d be pretty silly to do otherwise. Would one look both ways before crossing the street, see that there are no cars, then still avoid crossing because maybe there’s some undetectable god-car trundling stealthily along at the worst possible moment?


Oh i just don't bother with the millions of names people come up with for every little change in view these days, i suppose i'm too old for that.

I do agree with your view though, but still try not to be a total dickhead in life just in case there is a God at the end.


I try not to be a total dickhead in life because it is the right thing to do.

Also, being a total dickhead all the time is a lot of effort. I'm lazy.
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:51 am

The blAAtschApen wrote:
Sneudal wrote:
Oh i just don't bother with the millions of names people come up with for every little change in view these days, i suppose i'm too old for that.

I do agree with your view though, but still try not to be a total dickhead in life just in case there is a God at the end.


I try not to be a total dickhead in life because it is the right thing to do.

Also, being a total dickhead all the time is a lot of effort. I'm lazy.

It's far better to be a casual dickhead. Being a total dickhead dulls the effect after a while. Casual dickheadery keeps people guessing.
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

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Jolthig
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Postby Jolthig » Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:57 am

As a member of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, I believe in Allah because of my own private experiences in my prayers, how Allah sent the Quran to Muhammad (saw), and just by analyzing the life of Muhammad (saw) as well as that of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) of Qadian, India.

The example of the Khalifa of my community is also proof to me that God is real just by analyzing his conduct and how he speaks.

The God I believe in helps those who help themselves and gives true dreams and revelations to those who are close with him. That's the summary of my beliefs anyway. :p
Last edited by Jolthig on Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Blaatschapen
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Anarchy

Postby The Blaatschapen » Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:59 am

The New California Republic wrote:
The blAAtschApen wrote:
I try not to be a total dickhead in life because it is the right thing to do.

Also, being a total dickhead all the time is a lot of effort. I'm lazy.

It's far better to be a casual dickhead. Being a total dickhead dulls the effect after a while. Casual dickheadery keeps people guessing.


Exactly. Be like Pope Francis, not like Piers Morgan.
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Caori
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Founded: Jan 03, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Caori » Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:00 am

I don't believe in god because I just never had the need to believe in it in the first place.

Usually the believing on a god is created when someone is in need of it. Or that's how I see it.

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Cekoviu
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Postby Cekoviu » Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:21 am

DACOROMANIA wrote:I know surely that God exist and I believe in Him. I experienced something about His existence by Eastern Orthodox Christianity. I seen also that some people who practice Occultism cannot support exactly the Holy senses of Eastern Orthodox Christianity, rather than any other types of Christianity (or even Mozaism/Judaism).

How could you experience something about the existence of God that He may exist ?
That is a big question, because you have things to do, especially an ascetic practice for a considerable number of days or months and you have to release your pride outside.
And as a Christian you have to pray unstoppable (even in your heart).
"Sola fides" don't apply to Eastern Christianity where you have to prove yourself as Christian by actions.
"God the Creator, if you exist I want to know you and teach me".
It's a very hard practice where you may feel yourself like a "Buddha" by doing that. However, if you are still a bad sinner in your heart, in mind and in facts during that practice then you done nothing.
But... if you are a greedy sinner atheist who believes himself to be the sunshine of mankind... then you'll never get to know the God.

What if I'm a self-hating atheist?
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Sneudal
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Ex-Nation

Postby Sneudal » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:53 am

The blAAtschApen wrote:
Sneudal wrote:
Oh i just don't bother with the millions of names people come up with for every little change in view these days, i suppose i'm too old for that.

I do agree with your view though, but still try not to be a total dickhead in life just in case there is a God at the end.


I try not to be a total dickhead in life because it is the right thing to do.

Also, being a total dickhead all the time is a lot of effort. I'm lazy.


That what is considered right and wrong mostly come from religion, you do realize that right?

Being a dickhead is indeed a lot of effort, though so is being nice all the time i guess. Better be kind to those who need or earned it, and be a dickhead when someone deserved it.

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The Blaatschapen
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Anarchy

Postby The Blaatschapen » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:54 am

Sneudal wrote:
The blAAtschApen wrote:
I try not to be a total dickhead in life because it is the right thing to do.

Also, being a total dickhead all the time is a lot of effort. I'm lazy.


That what is considered right and wrong mostly come from religion, you do realize that right?


Nope, philosophy :)
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:58 am

The blAAtschApen wrote:
Sneudal wrote:
That what is considered right and wrong mostly come from religion, you do realize that right?


Nope, philosophy :)

Correct.
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

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Central Termina
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Ex-Nation

Postby Central Termina » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:01 am

The blAAtschApen wrote:
Sneudal wrote:
That what is considered right and wrong mostly come from religion, you do realize that right?


Nope, philosophy :)


Yup. :clap:

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Cekoviu
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Postby Cekoviu » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:44 am

Sneudal wrote:
The blAAtschApen wrote:
I try not to be a total dickhead in life because it is the right thing to do.

Also, being a total dickhead all the time is a lot of effort. I'm lazy.


That what is considered right and wrong mostly come from religion, you do realize that right?

Being a dickhead is indeed a lot of effort, though so is being nice all the time i guess. Better be kind to those who need or earned it, and be a dickhead when someone deserved it.

Dickheadedness and by association non-dickheadedness are pre-religious. For example:
"Two, look what I've got!" *holds up Two's horse's meat*
"Wow, you're a real dickhead."
Last edited by Cekoviu on Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sneudal
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Ex-Nation

Postby Sneudal » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:13 am

The blAAtschApen wrote:
Sneudal wrote:
That what is considered right and wrong mostly come from religion, you do realize that right?


Nope, philosophy :)


That surely played a role as well.

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:14 am

Sneudal wrote:
The blAAtschApen wrote:
Nope, philosophy :)


That surely played a role as well.

Mostly philosophy.
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the complete victory over Caesar's Legion, and the pacification and annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.
Current President of The NCR: Aaron Kimball.
Current NCR Ambassador to The World Assembly: Colonel James Hsu, NCR Army (Ret.)
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Frievolk
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Postby Frievolk » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:15 am

Sneudal wrote:
The blAAtschApen wrote:
Nope, philosophy :)


That surely played a role as well.

It really was mostly philosophy tho.
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Southerniva
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Postby Southerniva » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:28 am

I grew up in a family of Roman Catholics who were pretty much open-minded on religion and science. I had a aunt who was what I would describe as a "liberal Catholic" since she always went to mass every Sunday, while being supportive of homosexuality and gay marriage. My deceased grandma was the same as well, but the only difference was she once said to me "I just cannot understand how people cannot believe in a God or deity.".

As for my mother she pretty much is your basic person who believes there is a higher deity, but at the same time doesn't really think deeply of it on a daily basis. Not to mention the fact she has been into science since she was little.

As for me on the thread's question of "Why do you/don't you believe in God?".

I do believe there has to be a higher power in the universe, even though there is not evidence or actual proof of such. And since I am very open-minded I honestly do think it is entirely possible there could be more than a single god. So in a way I am pretty much understanding of polytheism.

The reason I believe there has to be a higher power in the universe is simply because it gives myself a better answer to how the laws of physics work, how the universe was created, gravity, math, science, etc.

In a way I kind of would go further to even believe that it be very likely we could be living within a simulation that is run by God/Yahweh/Allah(and so on...).

But bear in mind I do not believe anything from the Bible or Quran, or any religious works in general as literal. That in my opinion is something I feel is illogical to do since if there is a God surely I think he would want us to decide on what is right and wrong or what is correct or incorrect ourselves rather than just using a book that is quote "Man's interpretation of God". It would honestly make the idea of free will meaningless to me personally if I read everything from the Bible as literal. After all I am a free-thinking individual.

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:31 am

Southerniva wrote:In a way I kind of would go further to even believe that it be very likely we could be living within a simulation that is run by God/Yahweh/Allah(and so on...)..

Image
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

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Current President of The NCR: Aaron Kimball.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:51 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Southerniva wrote:In a way I kind of would go further to even believe that it be very likely we could be living within a simulation that is run by God/Yahweh/Allah(and so on...)..

Image

If the Matrix is a metaphor for the closet, and we're all living in the Matrix, does that mean that everyone is gay? And that out gay people are double gay? Is everyone trans, and trans people double trans? Does that mean they've looped back to cis?
Last edited by Ifreann on Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:51 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Southerniva wrote:In a way I kind of would go further to even believe that it be very likely we could be living within a simulation that is run by God/Yahweh/Allah(and so on...)..

Image

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Hystaria
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Postby Hystaria » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:54 am

this is just turning into babble
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:54 am

Ifreann wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:(Image)

If the Matrix is a metaphor for the closet, and we're all living in the Matrix, does that mean that everyone is gay? And that out gay people are double gay? Is everyone trans, and trans people double trans? Does that mean they've looped back to cis?

The problem is made even more convoluted when people who have escaped the Matrix/closet go back into the Matrix/closet for brief periods...
Last edited by The New California Republic on Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the complete victory over Caesar's Legion, and the pacification and annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.
Current President of The NCR: Aaron Kimball.
Current NCR Ambassador to The World Assembly: Colonel James Hsu, NCR Army (Ret.)
.

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:09 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Ifreann wrote:If the Matrix is a metaphor for the closet, and we're all living in the Matrix, does that mean that everyone is gay? And that out gay people are double gay? Is everyone trans, and trans people double trans? Does that mean they've looped back to cis?

The problem is made even more convoluted when people who have escaped the Matrix/closet go back into the Matrix/closet for brief periods...

But they're only going back in the closet to get more people out of the closet, until they find the One who can dismantle the closet forever!
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