Why do/don't you believe in a higher power? (Any HP)

[Geneviev]

That is God answering their prayer through you. God sends people to do his will.

Why does he gotta use humans to do his will? Isn't he omnipotent? Can't he just make it rain food whenever he wants to?

He could technically do that, and he did in the Bible. But God doesn't always intervene that directly. That's why it's important to do his will.

That is God answering their prayer through you. God sends people to do his will.

No it is not. Humans have free will remember? These are humans helping out fellow humans. Not god doing anything.

Humans are helping fellow humans because God told them to. They're pretty much missionaries.

[Free Arabian Nation]

Why does he gotta use humans to do his will? Isn't he omnipotent? Can't he just make it rain food whenever he wants to?

He could technically do that, and he did in the Bible. But God doesn't always intervene that directly. That's why it's important to do his will.

Because if they didn't, their prayers would not be answered and God would just let these people die. Gotcha

[Andsed]

Why does he gotta use humans to do his will? Isn't he omnipotent? Can't he just make it rain food whenever he wants to?

He could technically do that, and he did in the Bible. But God doesn't always intervene that directly. That's why it's important to do his will.

No it is not. Humans have free will remember? These are humans helping out fellow humans. Not god doing anything.

Humans are helping fellow humans because God told them to. They're pretty much missionaries.

Bullshit. No where on their site does it say that. It's only reference to religion is saying how they were inspired by Jesus.

[Geneviev]

He could technically do that, and he did in the Bible. But God doesn't always intervene that directly. That's why it's important to do his will.

Because if they didn't, their prayers would not be answered and God would just let these people die. Gotcha

Either God would intervene directly then, or he would accept free will.

[Salandriagado]

To be fair, that argument is quite exhausted. It always goes like this.

Atheist: “There is no evidence for god.”
Christian: “YES THERE IS!”
Atheist: “Okay, show me.”
Christian: “Uh... EVERYTHING OF COURSE!”
Atheist: “That makes no sense.”
Christian: “ EVERYTHINNNNGGGG”
Atheist: “Care to elaborate?”
Christian: “ WELL THE BIBLE SAYS...”
Atheist: "A book is not evidence."
Christian: "Well...you have no evidence HE DOESN'T EXIST! SO THEREFORE HE EXIST! Checkmate atheist."

At the end of the day, it all comes down to how you think we were created, no one can really answer that. So believing or not really doesn't matter.

We absolutely can answer that.

[Salandriagado]

Quick thing but created has implications I do not agree with. Also, when you mean we do you mean humans or the universe? Also are you saying we can never figure it out?

The universe. I look at it from a pragmatic stance. You can keep breaking the big bang, then the pre-big bang particles, etc. down until you get to a place where you don't know how things started. I fill that place in with a faith-based belief and do believe in a God. However, there is merit to what Athiests want to believe just as much merit there is to what I believe. To answer your last question, we may learn, we may not; I'll certainly know after death.

You certainly won't know: you won't have a brain to store the knowledge in.

[Free Arabian Nation]

Because if they didn't, their prayers would not be answered and God would just let these people die. Gotcha

Either God would intervene directly then, or he would accept free will.

So, it is free will then and not god directly helping these people and answering their prayers?

[Geneviev]

He could technically do that, and he did in the Bible. But God doesn't always intervene that directly. That's why it's important to do his will.


Humans are helping fellow humans because God told them to. They're pretty much missionaries.

Bullshit. No where on their site does it say that. It's only reference to religion is saying how they were inspired by Jesus.

Yes, exactly, God told them to do the work.

[Andsed]

Bullshit. No where on their site does it say that. It's only reference to religion is saying how they were inspired by Jesus.

Yes, exactly, God told them to do the work.

Uh no. They read the bible and were inspired by it. Being inspired by something and being told to do something are two different thing.

[Free Arabian Nation]

Bullshit. No where on their site does it say that. It's only reference to religion is saying how they were inspired by Jesus.

Yes, exactly, God told them to do the work.

He told them to, he didn't make them do it

A person can tell me to go walk across the street to a nice restaurant, but my choice to eat there is by my own free will. Even if that person is my father

[Geneviev]

Either God would intervene directly then, or he would accept free will.

So, it is free will then and not god directly helping these people and answering their prayers?

It's God telling someone else to do something to answer the prayer, and if that person doesn't do it then God might or might not intervene directly.

Yes, exactly, God told them to do the work.

Uh no. They read the bible and were inspired by it. Being inspired by something and being told to do something are two different thing.

Being divinely inspired is being told to do something by God.

[Andsed]

So, it is free will then and not god directly helping these people and answering their prayers?

It's God telling someone else to do something to answer the prayer, and if that person doesn't do it then God might or might not intervene directly.

Uh no. They read the bible and were inspired by it. Being inspired by something and being told to do something are two different thing.

Being divinely inspired is being told to do something by God.

No it is reading a book and getting inspired to do something good by it. God had nothing to do with this.

[Neutraligon]

Bullshit. No where on their site does it say that. It's only reference to religion is saying how they were inspired by Jesus.

Yes, exactly, God told them to do the work.

If humans get blamed for using their free will to do things god does not like then humans also get credit for doing things god does like, and none of it is god taking action. So no, god is not fulfilling any prayers, that would be humans fulfilling someone's prayer but because we are limited being unable to fulfill all prayers. God seems rather...impotent.

[Free Arabian Nation]

Being divinely inspired is being told to do something by God.

I can tell- "Inspire" my, hypothetical, son to build a house for my needy friend. Was that house built by me? No, it wasn't. It was my son's actions and my friend should be thanking the son and not my up-my-own-ass arrogant self.

I would also like to point out the fallacy that only prayers made to Yahweh are answered. No, there are plenty of stories from Muslims, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, Pagans, and many others praying to their respective god(s) and also getting what they want.

[Salandriagado]

To be fair, that argument is quite exhausted. It always goes like this.

Atheist: “There is no evidence for god.”
Christian: “YES THERE IS!”
Atheist: “Okay, show me.”
Christian: “Uh... EVERYTHING OF COURSE!”
Atheist: “That makes no sense.”
Christian: “ EVERYTHINNNNGGGG”
Atheist: “Care to elaborate?”
Christian: “ WELL THE BIBLE SAYS...”
Atheist: "A book is not evidence."
Christian: "Well...you have no evidence HE DOESN'T EXIST! SO THEREFORE HE EXIST! Checkmate atheist."

“Everything” would more or less refer to the created order of the universe.

If the universe has a "created order", then we can conclude something about the preferences of the creator:

1. This creator is fucking obsessed with Hydrogen and Helium. Seriously, 97.9% of the mass of the universe.
2. This creator is also a massive fan of empty space.
3. Third on the list of favourites comes "barren lifeless rock".
4. If we restrict to living things, then this creator really, really likes microbes, earthworms, krill, fungi, and trees. Humans don't even begin to make it onto into that list.

[Neutraligon]

“Everything” would more or less refer to the created order of the universe.

If the universe has a "created order", then we can conclude something about the preferences of the creator:

1. This creator is fucking obsessed with Hydrogen and Helium. Seriously, 97.9% of the mass of the universe.
2. This creator is also a massive fan of empty space.
3. Third on the list of favourites comes "barren lifeless rock".
4. If we restrict to living things, then this creator really, really likes microbes, earthworms, krill, fungi, and trees. Humans don't even begin to make it onto into that list.

Don't forget beetles.

[Geneviev]

Yes, exactly, God told them to do the work.

He told them to, he didn't make them do it

A person can tell me to go walk across the street to a nice restaurant, but my choice to eat there is by my own free will. Even if that person is my father

That's true.

It's God telling someone else to do something to answer the prayer, and if that person doesn't do it then God might or might not intervene directly.


Being divinely inspired is being told to do something by God.

No it is reading a book and getting inspired to do something good by it. God had nothing to do with this.

World Vision themselves call it divine inspiration.

Yes, exactly, God told them to do the work.

If humans get blamed for using their free will to do things god does not like then humans also get credit for doing things god does like, and none of it is god taking action. So no, god is not fulfilling any prayers, that would be humans fulfilling someone's prayer but because we are limited being unable to fulfill all prayers. God seems rather...impotent.

God is fulfilling prayers through people. That's how he usually fulfills prayers. And humans who do what God commands will be rewarded in heaven, so they do get credit for what they're doing. But it still comes from God.

[Salandriagado]

If the universe has a "created order", then we can conclude something about the preferences of the creator:

1. This creator is fucking obsessed with Hydrogen and Helium. Seriously, 97.9% of the mass of the universe.
2. This creator is also a massive fan of empty space.
3. Third on the list of favourites comes "barren lifeless rock".
4. If we restrict to living things, then this creator really, really likes microbes, earthworms, krill, fungi, and trees. Humans don't even begin to make it onto into that list.

Don't forget beetles.

Beetles are objectively really cool, though, so having them near the top of the list is understandable.

[Neutraligon]

He told them to, he didn't make them do it

A person can tell me to go walk across the street to a nice restaurant, but my choice to eat there is by my own free will. Even if that person is my father

That's true.

No it is reading a book and getting inspired to do something good by it. God had nothing to do with this.

World Vision themselves call it divine inspiration.

If humans get blamed for using their free will to do things god does not like then humans also get credit for doing things god does like, and none of it is god taking action. So no, god is not fulfilling any prayers, that would be humans fulfilling someone's prayer but because we are limited being unable to fulfill all prayers. God seems rather...impotent.

God is fulfilling prayers through people. That's how he usually fulfills prayers. And humans who do what God commands will be rewarded in heaven, so they do get credit for what they're doing. But it still comes from God.

If humans doing something like that is god fulfilling prayer, then humans not doing things (and god also not doing anything directly) is god not fulfilling prayers. You don't get to give god credit for the good while excusing him from the bad.

[Geneviev]

That's true.


World Vision themselves call it divine inspiration.


God is fulfilling prayers through people. That's how he usually fulfills prayers. And humans who do what God commands will be rewarded in heaven, so they do get credit for what they're doing. But it still comes from God.

If humans doing something like that is god fulfilling prayer, then humans not doing things (and god also not doing anything directly) is god not fulfilling prayers. You don't get to give god credit for the good while excusing him from the bad.

When people don't do what God wants, it's not God's fault. He can't do anything to force them without interfering with their free will.

[Free Arabian Nation]

If humans doing something like that is god fulfilling prayer, then humans not doing things (and god also not doing anything directly) is god not fulfilling prayers. You don't get to give god credit for the good while excusing him from the bad.

When people don't do what God wants, it's not God's fault. He can't do anything to force them without interfering with their free will.

So he's not answering prayers, he's just gambling that some person will listen to him and do his will?

[Neutraligon]

If humans doing something like that is god fulfilling prayer, then humans not doing things (and god also not doing anything directly) is god not fulfilling prayers. You don't get to give god credit for the good while excusing him from the bad.

When people don't do what God wants, it's not God's fault. He can't do anything to force them without interfering with their free will.

Then by the same logic he is not answering people's prayers, since he also cannot force anyone to do anything. So once again that is not god answering prayers, that is humans answering prayers.

[Geneviev]

When people don't do what God wants, it's not God's fault. He can't do anything to force them without interfering with their free will.

So he's not answering prayers, he's just gambling that some person will listen to him and do his will?

Close enough. He's doing what is going to answer the prayer, and that's why the Bible says Christians must obey God.

When people don't do what God wants, it's not God's fault. He can't do anything to force them without interfering with their free will.

Then by the same logic he is not answering people's prayers, since he also cannot force anyone to do anything. So once again that is not god answering prayers, that is humans answering prayers.

God is instructing humans to answer prayers. They wouldn't know what to do otherwise.

[Free Arabian Nation]

So he's not answering prayers, he's just gambling that some person will listen to him and do his will?

Close enough. He's doing what is going to answer the prayer, and that's why the Bible says Christians must obey God.

And if the Christian doesn't obey? Like if he's sick or something? And by the time god finds a replacement, it's far too late for the prayer to be answered?

[Geneviev]

Close enough. He's doing what is going to answer the prayer, and that's why the Bible says Christians must obey God.

And if the Christian doesn't obey? Like if he's sick or something? And by the time god finds a replacement, it's far too late for the prayer to be answered?

God will find someone else or intervene directly if he has to. Sometimes he doesn't.

And the Christian should always obey.