What do you mean? I won't be convinced otherwise...
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by Erythrean Thebes » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:21 am
by Petrolheadia » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:23 am
Erythrean Thebes wrote:The Grims wrote:
Why would the crimes of your ancestors justify torturing you?
Here's what I think personally: if you're not like these evil 'ancestors' of yours, then you're a member of the new class of the redeemed which Christ created. God doesn't punish you. Whereas, if you really are like them, you're guilty of the same sins...
The historical answer is that when the books of the Bible were being written, it was widely believed that children inherited the personality traits of their parents automatically.
(If you're asking, 'why does God inflict suffering on people in the Bible?', I think you'll find that each instance of God inflicting a punishment on people is rather elaborately explained...)
by The Grims » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:25 am
Erythrean Thebes wrote:The Grims wrote:
Why would the crimes of your ancestors justify torturing you?
Here's what I think personally: if you're not like these evil 'ancestors' of yours, then you're a member of the new class of the redeemed which Christ created. God doesn't punish you. Whereas, if you really are like them, you're guilty of the same sins...
The historical answer is that when the books of the Bible were being written, it was widely believed that children inherited the personality traits of their parents automatically.
(If you're asking, 'why does God inflict suffering on people in the Bible?', I think you'll find that each instance of God inflicting a punishment on people is rather elaborately explained...)
by Erythrean Thebes » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:26 am
Petrolheadia wrote:Why can't we have both a good material and immaterial life?
by Erythrean Thebes » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:27 am
The Grims wrote:Erythrean Thebes wrote:Here's what I think personally: if you're not like these evil 'ancestors' of yours, then you're a member of the new class of the redeemed which Christ created. God doesn't punish you. Whereas, if you really are like them, you're guilty of the same sins...
The historical answer is that when the books of the Bible were being written, it was widely believed that children inherited the personality traits of their parents automatically.
(If you're asking, 'why does God inflict suffering on people in the Bible?', I think you'll find that each instance of God inflicting a punishment on people is rather elaborately explained...)
The question was "why does god give children cancer if he is allloving and omnipotent".
The answer given was "because their ancestors suck and therefor they deserve it".
I am hoping I am not understanding this correctly.
by Erythrean Thebes » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:28 am
Petrolheadia wrote:Erythrean Thebes wrote:Here's what I think personally: if you're not like these evil 'ancestors' of yours, then you're a member of the new class of the redeemed which Christ created. God doesn't punish you. Whereas, if you really are like them, you're guilty of the same sins...
The historical answer is that when the books of the Bible were being written, it was widely believed that children inherited the personality traits of their parents automatically.
(If you're asking, 'why does God inflict suffering on people in the Bible?', I think you'll find that each instance of God inflicting a punishment on people is rather elaborately explained...)
If God thinks that redemption is good, why do we even have free will?
As far as I can see, he's either:
1. Stupid,
2. Malicious,
3. Not there.
by Genivaria » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:29 am
by Ifreann » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:30 am
Erythrean Thebes wrote:God only 'controls' himself; he is 'omnipotent' in the sense that, in his capacity as a discrete entity, he can appear anywhere.
by Genivaria » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:34 am
Erythrean Thebes wrote:The Grims wrote:
The question was "why does god give children cancer if he is allloving and omnipotent".
The answer given was "because their ancestors suck and therefor they deserve it".
I am hoping I am not understanding this correctly.
Why do you think God gives children cancer?
by Frievolk » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:36 am
♔ The Frievolker Empire || Frievolker Kaiserreik ♔
♔ The Realm in the Sun || De Reik in de Sonne ♔
♔ Led by Kaiser Johann, Part of the Erstwelt ♔
Never forget that the Muslims literally made up a new meaningless name for him when they forgot the name of Adam's Firstborn.
by Ters Althria » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:36 am
by Neutraligon » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:37 am
by Neutraligon » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:37 am
Ters Althria wrote:I ask this; If there is a chair who created it, and if you sought its maker would you find it in the woodgrain, the nails perhaps, or even the glue that sturdy its construction; where within this creation would you find its creator?
If you do not expect to find the maker of such a chair within the confines of its creation. why would you expect to find our creator within the bounds of his creation?
by Ters Althria » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:39 am
Neutraligon wrote:Prove there is a creation.
by Neutraligon » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:41 am
by Erythrean Thebes » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:43 am
Ifreann wrote:Erythrean Thebes wrote:God only 'controls' himself; he is 'omnipotent' in the sense that, in his capacity as a discrete entity, he can appear anywhere.
Whose idea was it to call God omnipotent because he can go anywhere?
If I tried to sell people an omnipotent car they'd be pretty mad to learn that what I meant was "off-roader".
by Togeria » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:44 am
by Erythrean Thebes » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:47 am
by Genivaria » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:48 am
Ters Althria wrote:I ask this: If there is a chair who created it, and if you sought its maker would you find it in the woodgrain, the nails perhaps, or even the glue that sturdy its construction; where within this creation would you find its creator?
If you do not expect to find the maker of such a chair within the confines of its creation. why would you expect to find our creator within the bounds of his creation?
by Ters Althria » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:49 am
Neutraligon wrote:I am sorry you failed to understand that a universe and a chair are two separate things. So once again, provide evidence that the universe was created. Oh and Maybe answer this question...how do we tell the difference between something that forms naturally and something that is created?
Genivaria wrote:Sounds like a flaw on the maker's part, they should know to put a logo or something on it.
Otherwise I can only conclude they don't care if people know who made it.
by Korasta » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:52 am
by Frievolk » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:52 am
Erythrean Thebes wrote:Frievolk wrote:You're the one making the claim in the first place though
I'm sorry, it's not supposed to be a claim in such a way. I don't want to try and convince you of it against your opposition. I'm interested in the debate as an exercise to explore how the Christian religion can accommodate different forms of criticism and skepticism. I believe the Christian view of mankind is an ideology, suitable for those who identify with its precepts.
♔ The Frievolker Empire || Frievolker Kaiserreik ♔
♔ The Realm in the Sun || De Reik in de Sonne ♔
♔ Led by Kaiser Johann, Part of the Erstwelt ♔
Never forget that the Muslims literally made up a new meaningless name for him when they forgot the name of Adam's Firstborn.
by Genivaria » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:53 am
Ters Althria wrote:Neutraligon wrote:I am sorry you failed to understand that a universe and a chair are two separate things. So once again, provide evidence that the universe was created. Oh and Maybe answer this question...how do we tell the difference between something that forms naturally and something that is created?
Are you saying a creator cannot form naturally?
I assure you I was born no different from you and yet I am very capable of creating many objects from wood.
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