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Why do/don't you believe in a higher power? (Any HP)

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Free Arabian Nation
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Postby Free Arabian Nation » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:25 am

Holy Tedalonia wrote:I find the universe or the world far to much in our favor. And with that fortune in mind, makes me believe in god. Sure we may be lucky, but you can only be lucky so many times.

Lol no, if anything this universe hates us.

I mean, if this universe was truly biased towards humans, our Earth would grow pizza and beer on trees and hookers would be everywhere.

Jokes aside, this universe is most definitely NOT in our favor. Especially considering the fact that 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of our universe will kill us without things like Clothing, Spacesuits, Spaceships, Weapons, Air Conditioning, Food, Medicine. Hell, Humanity would have gone extinct/wouldn't be the top species if it wasn't for the magical invention of "Controlled Fire"

It's less of a finely tuned haven for Humans and more of a flower in a sidewalk crack.
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Alvecia
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Postby Alvecia » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:28 am

Free Arabian Nation wrote:
Holy Tedalonia wrote:I find the universe or the world far to much in our favor. And with that fortune in mind, makes me believe in god. Sure we may be lucky, but you can only be lucky so many times.

Lol no, if anything this universe hates us.

I mean, if this universe was truly biased towards humans, our Earth would grow pizza and beer on trees and hookers would be everywhere.

Jokes aside, this universe is most definitely NOT in our favor. Especially considering the fact that 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of our universe will kill us without things like Clothing, Spacesuits, Spaceships, Weapons, Air Conditioning, Food, Medicine. Hell, Humanity would have gone extinct/wouldn't be the top species if it wasn't for the magical invention of "Controlled Fire"

It's less of a finely tuned haven for Humans and more of a flower in a sidewalk crack.

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Albydia
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Postby Albydia » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:28 am

There has to be a God because I refuse to believe that I am here out of sheer dumb luck. It takes more faith to say that you are product of dumb luck that was created by nothing out of nothing, like everything around you, than it does to admit that there is a God who has always been there and deliberately designed you and everything around you.
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Australian rePublic
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Postby Australian rePublic » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:28 am

Greater Germany wrote:
Reikoku wrote:Nature or the universe seems to me to be the only thing which can justifiably be called God, since everything originates inside of it, and everything forms a co-dependent relationship with other natural objects.

This kinda fits for me.

I don't really believe in the classic Abrahamic "guy with a beard and robe that looks like a human and makes petty-seeming decisions" sort of god. But the universe, and the unknown within it, that we try to learn more about and draw our origins from, feel like a god of the natural which gives us inspiration and motivation.
Something something the first gulp from the glass of natural sciences will turn you into an atheist, but at the bottom of the glass God is waiting for you, etc.

I'm not sure if any Abrahamic believer actually believes that. Correct me if I'm wrong (and there's a good chance that I am), but I think that depictions of God as a human being are meant to be relatable, rather than accurate
Last edited by Australian rePublic on Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Free Arabian Nation
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Postby Free Arabian Nation » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:29 am

Albydia wrote:There has to be a God because I refuse to believe that I am here out of sheer dumb luck. It takes more faith to say that you are product of dumb luck that was created by nothing out of nothing, like everything around you, than it does to admit that there is a God who has always been there and deliberately designed you and everything around you.

Alright then

Who created the god?

If God has always existed, then something can come out of nothing, meaning belief in a lucky creation is not unjustified

If God was created by something much more powerful than him, then who created that god? It will just be a infinite loop of "God 1 created man, God 2 created god 1, god 2 has always existed coming from nothing", etc
Last edited by Free Arabian Nation on Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Alvecia
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Postby Alvecia » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:30 am

Albydia wrote:There has to be a God because I refuse to believe that I am here out of sheer dumb luck. It takes more faith to say that you are product of dumb luck that was created by nothing out of nothing, like everything around you, than it does to admit that there is a God who has always been there and deliberately designed you and everything around you.

I mean, no, not really. Unless you worship Lady Luck or something like that.

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The Grims
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Postby The Grims » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:30 am

Holy Tedalonia wrote:I find the universe or the world far to much in our favor. And with that fortune in mind, makes me believe in god. Sure we may be lucky, but you can only be lucky so many times.


You mean how a puddle notices how perfectly he fits the hole ?

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Albydia
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Postby Albydia » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:30 am

Free Arabian Nation wrote:
Albydia wrote:There has to be a God because I refuse to believe that I am here out of sheer dumb luck. It takes more faith to say that you are product of dumb luck that was created by nothing out of nothing, like everything around you, than it does to admit that there is a God who has always been there and deliberately designed you and everything around you.

Alright then

Who created the god?

He's always been there. That's why we say that God is eternal.
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Valentine Z
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Postby Valentine Z » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:32 am

Free Arabian Nation wrote:
Albydia wrote:There has to be a God because I refuse to believe that I am here out of sheer dumb luck. It takes more faith to say that you are product of dumb luck that was created by nothing out of nothing, like everything around you, than it does to admit that there is a God who has always been there and deliberately designed you and everything around you.

Alright then

Who created the god?


That's also something I can't wrap my head around. There has to be a beginning to all of this, even from a scientific viewpoint. Even for Buddhism, it's lacking because... where's the start?

What's there before the Big Bang, and all of that. I really want to believe that there's something that created this universe.
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Free Arabian Nation
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Postby Free Arabian Nation » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:32 am

Albydia wrote:
Free Arabian Nation wrote:Alright then

Who created the god?

He's always been there. That's why we say that God is eternal.

So, he came from nothing because he's always been there.

Nothing intelligently created him, as he always existed, meaning that something as intelligent as a man being created by something not intelligent is not an invalid thought.
Last edited by Free Arabian Nation on Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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An Alan Smithee Nation
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Postby An Alan Smithee Nation » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:35 am

Free Arabian Nation wrote:
Albydia wrote:There has to be a God because I refuse to believe that I am here out of sheer dumb luck. It takes more faith to say that you are product of dumb luck that was created by nothing out of nothing, like everything around you, than it does to admit that there is a God who has always been there and deliberately designed you and everything around you.

Alright then

Who created the god?


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Australian rePublic
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Postby Australian rePublic » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:36 am

Free Arabian Nation wrote:
Albydia wrote:There has to be a God because I refuse to believe that I am here out of sheer dumb luck. It takes more faith to say that you are product of dumb luck that was created by nothing out of nothing, like everything around you, than it does to admit that there is a God who has always been there and deliberately designed you and everything around you.

Alright then

Who created the god?

No one. That's a logical fallacy. In order for creation to exist, time has to exist. There has to be a time before you existed (and, unless you're immortal) there has to be a time after you exist. God exists outside of time. To God, before, now and after all exist simultaneously. In order for God to have been created, there has to be a before He existed. Since before, now and after are simultaneous to God, there is no before, therefore, there is no "time" when God didn't exist. God has always existed. God always was, God always is, and God always will be. God is eternal. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that that's the meaning of "I am who I am"
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Sapientia Et Bellum
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Postby Sapientia Et Bellum » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:37 am

I can easily replace god with what came before the big bang and what came before the answer to that and science cant answer it just as religion cant answer what created god as we know it... its beyond our capability of knowing.... nothing is truly falsifiable
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Albydia
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Postby Albydia » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:37 am

Australian rePublic wrote:
Free Arabian Nation wrote:Alright then

Who created the god?

No one. That's a logical fallacy. In order for creation to exist, time has to exist. There has to be a time before you existed (and, unless you're immortal) there has to be a time after you exist. God exists outside of time. To God, before, now and after all exist simultaneously. In order for God to have been created, there has to be a before He existed. Since before, now and after are simultaneous to God, there is no before, therefore, there is no "time" when God didn't exist. God has always existed. God always was, God always is, and God always will be. God is eternal. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that that's the meaning of "I am who I am"

:clap: Thank you Orthobro, very cool. That's basically what I was trying to say, and you said it much better than I could.
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Australian rePublic
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Postby Australian rePublic » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:38 am

Valentine Z wrote:
Free Arabian Nation wrote:Alright then

Who created the god?


That's also something I can't wrap my head around. There has to be a beginning to all of this, even from a scientific viewpoint. Even for Buddhism, it's lacking because... where's the start?

What's there before the Big Bang, and all of that. I really want to believe that there's something that created this universe.

You mention the Big Bang. What's created the singularity which existed before the big bang?
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Postby Australian rePublic » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:40 am

Albydia wrote:
Australian rePublic wrote:No one. That's a logical fallacy. In order for creation to exist, time has to exist. There has to be a time before you existed (and, unless you're immortal) there has to be a time after you exist. God exists outside of time. To God, before, now and after all exist simultaneously. In order for God to have been created, there has to be a before He existed. Since before, now and after are simultaneous to God, there is no before, therefore, there is no "time" when God didn't exist. God has always existed. God always was, God always is, and God always will be. God is eternal. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that that's the meaning of "I am who I am"

:clap: Thank you Orthobro, very cool. That's basically what I was trying to say, and you said it much better than I could.

:hug:
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Albydia
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Postby Albydia » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:41 am

Australian rePublic wrote:
Valentine Z wrote:
That's also something I can't wrap my head around. There has to be a beginning to all of this, even from a scientific viewpoint. Even for Buddhism, it's lacking because... where's the start?

What's there before the Big Bang, and all of that. I really want to believe that there's something that created this universe.

You mention the Big Bang. What's created the singularity which existed before the big bang?

Most atheistic creation stories point to something that's always existed. It's almost as if it's a fact that something in this universe has always existed and will always exist. What sounds more reasonable, that that something is a clump of matter or that that something is the Almighty Creator, the Great I AM.
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Valentine Z
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Postby Valentine Z » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:41 am

Australian rePublic wrote:
Valentine Z wrote:
That's also something I can't wrap my head around. There has to be a beginning to all of this, even from a scientific viewpoint. Even for Buddhism, it's lacking because... where's the start?

What's there before the Big Bang, and all of that. I really want to believe that there's something that created this universe.

You mention the Big Bang. What's created the singularity which existed before the big bang?


Yep! And what existed before then, and stuff.
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Toaslandia
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Postby Toaslandia » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:43 am

I'm a Catholic, and even though I don't go to church that often I firmly believe that God exists. But I also believe other religions gods exist (so I guess I'm a heretic :) ) . I believe that God exists mainly because I don't think a bunch of people would just go "You know what would be funny? If we made up some random guy and said he was the Son of God."
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Olthar
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Postby Olthar » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:44 am

In the entire course of human history, but especially now when everyone has a camera in their pocket, there has never been any credible evidence of a God. Furthermore, the very notion of a God is simply illogical and irrational. We know enough about science and the universe that we can safely say that God either violates natural law (and is, therefore, impossible) or God does nothing relevant that affects us (and is, therefore, not worth worshipping). I prefer the first option as a do-nothing God who simply watches us for their own amusement is a terrible thought.
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Postby The New California Republic » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:45 am

Albydia wrote:
Australian rePublic wrote:You mention the Big Bang. What's created the singularity which existed before the big bang?

Most atheistic creation stories...

Atheists don't have "creation" stories, as that implies a creator.
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An Alan Smithee Nation
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Postby An Alan Smithee Nation » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:45 am

Australian rePublic wrote:
Valentine Z wrote:
That's also something I can't wrap my head around. There has to be a beginning to all of this, even from a scientific viewpoint. Even for Buddhism, it's lacking because... where's the start?

What's there before the Big Bang, and all of that. I really want to believe that there's something that created this universe.

You mention the Big Bang. What's created the singularity which existed before the big bang?


Time didn't exist before the singularity.
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:47 am

Olthar wrote:In the entire course of human history, but especially now when everyone has a camera in their pocket, there has never been any credible evidence of a God. Furthermore, the very notion of a God is simply illogical and irrational. We know enough about science and the universe that we can safely say that God either violates natural law (and is, therefore, impossible) or God does nothing relevant that affects us (and is, therefore, not worth worshipping). I prefer the first option as a do-nothing God who simply watches us for their own amusement is a terrible thought.

The silence of God is deafening isn't it? He was awfully chatty thousands of years ago, but now seems to have gone very quiet for an extended period... :roll:
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

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White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
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Randsidia
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Postby Randsidia » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:48 am

Albydia wrote:There has to be a God because I refuse to believe that I am here out of sheer dumb luck. It takes more faith to say that you are product of dumb luck that was created by nothing out of nothing, like everything around you, than it does to admit that there is a God who has always been there and deliberately designed you and everything around you.


Nobody atheist (at least not me) is arguing that we were created out of nothing.

Indeed, we weren't created at all. We evolved from more primitive species over the span of millions of years.

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Abarri
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Postby Abarri » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:49 am

I believe in God because I think there must be some being that is much more intelligent than humans (even more intelligent than any extraterrestrials who might exist somewhere in the vast universe). Said being should be able to explain everything in this universe/dimension/whatever, since no human can do that. It's sad to think if humans were to be the most intelligent or complex beings ever.

I used to be atheist (I was in 7th grade), but I "shifted back" to Christianity, even if I do not belong to any church or denomination. Currently my (non)religious side borders towards atheism, deism, Protestantism, and agnosticism; deism seems to dominate. If believing in God is illogical, then I'm happy to accept such belief as part of the irrational side of my personality.
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