How can you not be christian?

[Person012345]

Guys i know this forum is bound to be heated but we should at least try to be descreet even thought i was a bit of an ass in my post. we should try to understand him from his point of view

I understand his point of view, because I was raised in a similar perspective just as he's being raised. He's been taught the Truth, absolute and immutable. He has no reason to question this Truth because it was handed down to him by his father, stepmother and whatever authority figures in their church. Now that he's growing up and learning to express himself, he's attempting to hand down this Truth to the world around him as it was presented to him.

He's in for a shock, I'm afraid.

I am guessing you are religious and yes i know the world is quite harsh to people with different point of views :S if you are religious may i ask what religion ?

From his post I'd guess he was brought up religiously, but has since seen the light.

[Treznor]

Guys i know this forum is bound to be heated but we should at least try to be descreet even thought i was a bit of an ass in my post. we should try to understand him from his point of view

I understand his point of view, because I was raised in a similar perspective just as he's being raised. He's been taught the Truth, absolute and immutable. He has no reason to question this Truth because it was handed down to him by his father, stepmother and whatever authority figures in their church. Now that he's growing up and learning to express himself, he's attempting to hand down this Truth to the world around him as it was presented to him.

He's in for a shock, I'm afraid.

I am guessing you are religious and yes i know the world is quite harsh to people with different point of views :S if you are religious may i ask what religion ?

No, it's not about being harsh to people with different points of view. It's about children who are just learning to express themselves attempting to teach the world as they've been taught. The shock he's in for is that reality doesn't always match the point of view he's been taught to believe.

I was Evangelical Baptist. Through a long and occasionally tortured period of study and introspection, I got better. Now I'm atheist.

[Democraticus DCLXVI]

Bah, I abhor the sheer concept of religion. I believe we've gotten as far as we have because of natural selection and sheer human ingenuity; not because of some higher being that's helped us (or hasn't punished us yet).

World poverty? Blame the recessions on the economics stooges. Global warming? Chlorofluorocarbons and carbon dioxide emissions. Climate change? Global warming.

My two cents.

[Heavner]

This entire post is in the wrong place, the spelling and grammar are horrible, and this argument is ill-formed. I could go further, but do I really have to?

[Treznor]

This entire post is in the wrong place, the spelling and grammar are horrible, and this argument is ill-formed. I could go further, but do I really have to?

You're referring to the OP? Where else should it be posted besides General? This is, after all, where bad arguments go to die.

[Bavungria]

Person do you support your country's military? Do you think the Jews or any other holocaust survivors were offended by the soldiers who saved them ? i am sure they felt bad for there deaths but rejoiced and thank them for there good dead. So you would be offended that someone more "important" or "worth more than you " would die for you ? i would be thank full ! know that is just me. I see your point of view but i do not understand your total lack of value of your own life ?

About God being corrupt or unethical i can understand that. but there is two ways you can look at it. Either God is unethical but can give us many treasures if we worship him. most people go for the money and other treasures when it comes to life not really what is right. Or he is good and we where shaped in his image but when Satan tricked eave to eat the apple we turned into the evil/angelic people. I believe that people are basically the most evil and cruel creatures scientifically known to man. Do you agree ?

[Nuova Dalmazia]

Why do we have to be Christians? I have the utmost respect for this religion, as with others, but I'm not Christian nor Atheist; I call myself an Agnostic, meaning that I can't say that God exist, but neither can I prove He doesn't exist. I incline to recognize that there are some things that are beyond logic and human understanding, but I am unwilling to reconduct that to a dogmatic religion such as Christianity, Islam, Judaism or others. All those religions were used and manipulated in history by men without principles to do their bidding, and their 'gods' often said what they wanted them to say.
Besides, if all we can do is 'have faith in God', how can we prove that a religion is 'right', while others aren't? For me, everyone could be right, but I don't know. I sincerely don't know. That's why I am skeptycal, and I refuse to bow before any religion. I am asked to feel faith, but I can't feel any; in my opinion, if God exists, he is too far above our petty worries, or he simply doesn't care.
I also believe in freedom of thought; so, if God exists, he has to respect us and our choices; which comprehend also the choiches of faith and opinion.
Therefore, I can sincerely and strongly say that I can not be a Christian, and not because abhorrence of churches or dogmatism, but because I thought it over and over.

[Bavungria]

Guys i know this forum is bound to be heated but we should at least try to be descreet even thought i was a bit of an ass in my post. we should try to understand him from his point of view

I understand his point of view, because I was raised in a similar perspective just as he's being raised. He's been taught the Truth, absolute and immutable. He has no reason to question this Truth because it was handed down to him by his father, stepmother and whatever authority figures in their church. Now that he's growing up and learning to express himself, he's attempting to hand down this Truth to the world around him as it was presented to him.

He's in for a shock, I'm afraid.

I am guessing you are religious and yes i know the world is quite harsh to people with different point of views :S if you are religious may i ask what religion ?

From his post I'd guess he was brought up religiously, but has since seen the light.

i guess you could say that

[Bavungria]

Bah, I abhor the sheer concept of religion. I believe we've gotten as far as we have because of natural selection and sheer human ingenuity; not because of some higher being that's helped us (or hasn't punished us yet).

World poverty? Blame the recessions on the economics stooges. Global warming? Chlorofluorocarbons and carbon dioxide emissions. Climate change? Global warming.

My two cents.

all of those problems you mentioned are caused by humans

[Unchecked Expansion]

Bah, I abhor the sheer concept of religion. I believe we've gotten as far as we have because of natural selection and sheer human ingenuity; not because of some higher being that's helped us (or hasn't punished us yet).

World poverty? Blame the recessions on the economics stooges. Global warming? Chlorofluorocarbons and carbon dioxide emissions. Climate change? Global warming.

My two cents.

all of those problems you mentioned are caused by humans

Exactly. We cause our own problems, and we solve them ourselves (sometimes)

[Cabra West]

Wow, that OP made for the first good laugh of the day.
Thank you.

[Virtualila]

How can you not be christian?

Because I don't believe the "teachings" of the Bible, or really any holy book for that matter. I could go off on a long, convulted rant as to why I don't, but I'm not going to.

I believe in God, but my beliefs are not accepted by any organized religion under the sun. I don't believe that God really cares about how you worship him, or if you do at all (yes, I believe atheists CAN go to heaven without believing in God), and that acceptance into Heaven is based on your overall moral qualities and how you lived your life, and not on whether you believe in "the one true God" (once again, I could go off on a rant about how all religions are really worshipping the same God and getting huffy over the small stuff, but I won't). I don't think that sin is really black or white (and quite frankly I have A LOT to say about the Ten Commandments and how I call bullcrap that God actually said that, but once again I won't), nor can they be obsolved JUST by being Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddist... I strongly believe that any sin is repentable, but simply being a part of a certain religion doesn't cut it. You made your mess, so you get to clean it up.

[Bavungria]

Bah, I abhor the sheer concept of religion. I believe we've gotten as far as we have because of natural selection and sheer human ingenuity; not because of some higher being that's helped us (or hasn't punished us yet).

World poverty? Blame the recessions on the economics stooges. Global warming? Chlorofluorocarbons and carbon dioxide emissions. Climate change? Global warming.

My two cents.

all of those problems you mentioned are caused by humans

Exactly. We cause our own problems, and we solve them ourselves (sometimes)

lol ya sometimes most of the times we hide them

[Bavungria]

How can you not be christian?

Because I don't believe the "teachings" of the Bible, or really any holy book for that matter. I could go off on a long, convulted rant as to why I don't, but I'm not going to.

I believe in God, but my beliefs are not accepted by any organized religion under the sun. I don't believe that God really cares about how you worship him, or if you do at all (yes, I believe atheists CAN go to heaven without believing in God), and that acceptance into Heaven is based on your overall moral qualities and how you lived your life, and not on whether you believe in "the one true God" (once again, I could go off on a rant about how all religions are really worshipping the same God and getting huffy over the small stuff, but I won't). I don't think that sin is really black or white (and quite frankly I have A LOT to say about the Ten Commandments and how I call bullcrap that God actually said that, but once again I won't), nor can they be obsolved JUST by being Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddist... I strongly believe that any sin is repentable, but simply being a part of a certain religion doesn't cut it. You made your mess, so you get to clean it up.

nice i am liking your beliefs ( not being sarcastic)

[Vojvodina-Nihon]

How can you not be christian?

Because I don't believe the "teachings" of the Bible, or really any holy book for that matter. I could go off on a long, convulted rant as to why I don't, but I'm not going to.

*snip long, convoluted rant*

[Virtualila]

How can you not be christian?

Because I don't believe the "teachings" of the Bible, or really any holy book for that matter. I could go off on a long, convulted rant as to why I don't, but I'm not going to.

*snip long, convoluted rant*

If you think that's a rant, you should have seen the blasting I gave out yesterday to a friend of mine IRL. THAT was a rant.

[Meridiani Planum]

My question is how can you not be christian.

Very easily. Simply by being convinced that reality is something other than what is described by christian dogma. You might as well ask how a hindu could not be a christian.

People who are athiest, I believe say there is no god as an excuse for them to get away wiht something they know is a sin.

I'm sure you do believe this. It's not true of me, however. I have high standards of ethics. I don't seek to "get away" with anything. I believe that any attempt to "cheat" at life is really cheating oneself out of a life one can have genuine respect for.

Also people say why doesnt god just show himself and my answer to that is Faith.

If God wants to play hide and seek, then he should expect some people to be honest unbelievers.

I've had sex with every Playboy Playmate of the past ten years. Don't believe me? You gotta have faith...

Are you convinced yet?

Also Athiest who dont belive in god explain to me about ghosts then? Dont say thier not real either because my dad and stepmother have both seen demons, and if you want to know about it i would be more than happy to explain

Ghosts and demons are misinterpretations of personal experiences. There ya go!

[Cameroi]

i know i shouldn't let this raise my blood pressure, but what really gets under my skin is when "christians" and "athiests" just assume nothing but one or the other could possibly exist, like they were the only two people in the room. like HELLO in there.

ever consider the possibility of there being a god who's getting damd tired of that whinge?

[Bavungria]

Cameroi you do have a good point. thanks for raising it to add to this intellectual, hopefully peaceful discussion.

[Bavungria]

Guys i know this forum is bound to be heated but we should at least try to be descreet even thought i was a bit of an ass in my post. we should try to understand him from his point of view

I understand his point of view, because I was raised in a similar perspective just as he's being raised. He's been taught the Truth, absolute and immutable. He has no reason to question this Truth because it was handed down to him by his father, stepmother and whatever authority figures in their church. Now that he's growing up and learning to express himself, he's attempting to hand down this Truth to the world around him as it was presented to him.

He's in for a shock, I'm afraid.

I am guessing you are religious and yes i know the world is quite harsh to people with different point of views :S if you are religious may i ask what religion ?

No, it's not about being harsh to people with different points of view. It's about children who are just learning to express themselves attempting to teach the world as they've been taught. The shock he's in for is that reality doesn't always match the point of view he's been taught to believe.

I was Evangelical Baptist. Through a long and occasionally tortured period of study and introspection, I got better. Now I'm atheist.

interesting

[Democraticus DCLXVI]

Bah, I abhor the sheer concept of religion. I believe we've gotten as far as we have because of natural selection and sheer human ingenuity; not because of some higher being that's helped us (or hasn't punished us yet).

World poverty? Blame the recessions on the economics stooges. Global warming? Chlorofluorocarbons and carbon dioxide emissions. Climate change? Global warming.

My two cents.

all of those problems you mentioned are caused by humans

Exactly, these problems are not caused by any supernatural powers, but by humans themselves. So if you want to blame someone, don't go blaming Zeus or Buddha or Jehovah or something, blame people.

i know i shouldn't let this raise my blood pressure, but what really gets under my skin is when "christians" and "athiests" just assume nothing but one or the other could possibly exist, like they were the only two people in the room. like HELLO in there.

ever consider the possibility of there being a god who's getting damd tired of that whinge?

Of course I've considered that possibility. If there was a supreme being who created the universe or something, I'd like to think that it stopped at creating the universe and simply remained passive from there, leaving its creations to fend for themselves, which is still basically the same as what I'm putting forth.

If there was ever a compromise between believing in a god and believing in humanity, the above would be it.

[Namabia]

My question is how can you not be christian. People who are athiest, I believe say there is no god as an excuse for them to get away wiht something they know is a sin. Also people say why doesnt god just show himself and my answer to that is Faith. What use what it be if god just showed himself to everyone and then everyone just switched to christian, God wants people who have faith and are loyal not people who see him and then suddenly believe. Also Athiest who dont belive in god explain to me about ghosts then? Dont say thier not real either because my dad and stepmother have both seen demons, and if you want to know about it i would be more than happy to explain.

Also people who belive Obama is the Anti-Christ, I can see this to some point because in the bible it says that the Anti-Christ will try to make peace wiht everyone and be a nice handsome smooth talker whihc obama is so yes i can see obama being the anti-christ. But i wouldnt freak out about it because if your saved then you will go to heaven. just like 2012 why freak out when you will be going to a better place thats why i think the people who freak out about it are the ones who are worried because they no about the sins they have committed.


Also all of these different religons like catholics, prodestants and judism and all the others i think are in my opinion are not needed because all you have to do is belive in god and the virgin marry and that jesus gave his sins for us, also god didnt make religon, humans made religon in thier own way that they seen fit. For example reilgon is formed like a club and then one day a member form that club doesnt like the ideas of it so then they go and make thier own club meaning religon. But really all you have to do is belive in virgin marry, jesus sacrifice and belive in god as your heavenly father and you will go to heaven.

Im not a perfect christian, no one is infact ive had my doubts but after talking wiht my Step Mom and my Dad and thinking about the miracles that have happened to me i do belive there is a god and thats called faith. So please anyone is welcome to comment but do not argue or make stupid comments or make fun of anyones religon. This is meant to be a discussion not a argument about which religon is better or calling someone stupid because of thier beliefs.

Listen you yourself have destroyed this arguement.

1. God issued something called 'Free Will'
2. Free Will enables people to believe in whatever they want. Does God love everyone still? Yes no matter what. Does God want those people back with him? Yes, but he can't force them.
3. Obama being the Anti-Christ? Hay no. He is prepared to lead the world in peace yes. But the Bible did not just say there would be the Anti-Christ. There is his prophet or forrunner.
4. Only through the Lord Jesus Christ can your sins be forgiven. No priest can do that. Neither can Mary.
5. Christiainity is a Faith. Not a religion. Religion was invented by control freaks who want all the power.
6. The only way to Heaven is through the Lord Jesus Christ.

[Cabra West]

[

Listen you yourself have destroyed this arguement.

1. God issued something called 'Free Will'
2. Free Will enables people to believe in whatever they want. Does God love everyone still? Yes no matter what. Does God want those people back with him? Yes, but he can't force them.

Not omnipotent after all, then?

[Namabia]

[

Listen you yourself have destroyed this arguement.

1. God issued something called 'Free Will'
2. Free Will enables people to believe in whatever they want. Does God love everyone still? Yes no matter what. Does God want those people back with him? Yes, but he can't force them.

Not omnipotent after all, then?

I never was to begin with.

[Yvellun]

I don't understand why people seem to have to rationalise everything. Why ruin something as spectacular and beautiful and spontaneous as the universe, as life, by insisting that it must have been created by an all powerful deity?

I also object to the classification of belief. Why put a label on something that is unique? Sounds like a bad case of organisation to me.