US Government Shutdown- It's Over!... For Now

[The South Falls]

I presume you mean one's self, rather than oneself, because I doubt that entering oneself is a crime.

No but it does make for interesting porn

No sir, Therm.

[Shofercia]

No but it does make for interesting porn

No sir, Therm.

It seems like an individual preference, (Therm's, not mine,) and America is the Land of Liberty when it comes to watching certain online platforms, although it gives me an idea: would it be considered torture to set up a massive TV in Tijuana, and broadcast the most disliked online clips, as determined by the fans, to the potential immigrants? I mean if things are so bad in their country that they left, they can tolerate a bit of Liberty, right?

[Western Vale Confederacy]

I presume you mean one's self, rather than oneself, because I doubt that entering oneself is a crime.

No but it does make for interesting porn

Bruh, what the hell?

[El-Amin Caliphate]

How long do you want the wall to be built? Because eminent domain can be fought in court and 90% of the landowners have said they will fight it for however long it takes.

I don't want the wall. I want a border fence, electrified, reinforced by the US military. But at the same time, I don't want a citizen initiative to fail over technicalities.

Why do you want it electrified?

And the wall will have gates at said ports of entry.

No need for a wall. As I've said, sensors, drones, and the fence already there, plus an increase in border patrol agents will solve the problem. We also need more people to process asylum cases.

^This so much. Instead of prosecuting illegal immigrants, get them citizenship instead. We punish them later if y'all want to.

Pretty sure death isn’t the penalty for illegally cross the border.

Pretty sure law enforcement is allowed to use force to prevent a crime.

Pretty sure probable cause exists.

Sheesh, man, just saying that without context means that a cop van just shoot someone for unarmed robbery.

"Human rights abuses, with my Human rights, abuses!"

Entering a country illegally is not a human right. Defending ones self, ones home and ones nation is.

A family jumping the border isn't dangerous. Also, people actually do have a right to entry according to certain articles in the Univeeisal Declaration of Human Rights.

[Shofercia]

I don't want the wall. I want a border fence, electrified, reinforced by the US military. But at the same time, I don't want a citizen initiative to fail over technicalities.

Why do you want it electrified?

To prevent people from climbing it. It could be slightly electrified, just to tase any potential climbers, no need to go all Jurassic Park on them.

[Thermodolia]

Why do you want it electrified?

To prevent people from climbing it. It could be slightly electrified, just to tase any potential climbers, no need to go all Jurassic Park on them.

But what about the illegal Dinos?

[Dogmeat]

To prevent people from climbing it. It could be slightly electrified, just to tase any potential climbers, no need to go all Jurassic Park on them.

But what about the illegal Dinos?

Literally millions of them cross the border every year.

Somehow I don't think a fence would stop them, though.

[Neutraligon]

Why do you want it electrified?

To prevent people from climbing it. It could be slightly electrified, just to tase any potential climbers, no need to go all Jurassic Park on them.

And how much money do you think doing that would cost? also...I am pretty sure there will be people very willing to try and use that electricity for themselves.

[Big Jim P]

I don't want the wall. I want a border fence, electrified, reinforced by the US military. But at the same time, I don't want a citizen initiative to fail over technicalities.

Why do you want it electrified?

No need for a wall. As I've said, sensors, drones, and the fence already there, plus an increase in border patrol agents will solve the problem. We also need more people to process asylum cases.

^This so much. Instead of prosecuting illegal immigrants, get them citizenship instead. We punish them later if y'all want to.

Pretty sure law enforcement is allowed to use force to prevent a crime.

Pretty sure probable cause exists.

Sheesh, man, just saying that without context means that a cop van just shoot someone for unarmed robbery.

Entering a country illegally is not a human right. Defending ones self, ones home and ones nation is.

A family jumping the border isn't dangerous. Also, people actually do have a right to entry according to certain articles in the Univeeisal Declaration of Human Rights.

The U.N. has no authority here. Coming to America is a privilege, not a right.

[Infected Mushroom]

Lol

What an idiotic system of government

“I want to build a giant 5 billion dollar wall.

You will not.

Yes I will.

You will not.

(Government stops)”

Really? The government shuts off for 8 days? Lol

If someone told me in advance a few years back this is coming up in the government of the world’s Number One country I would have dismissed the possibility

But it happens for real, democracy continues to impress me

[Shofercia]

To prevent people from climbing it. It could be slightly electrified, just to tase any potential climbers, no need to go all Jurassic Park on them.

And how much money do you think doing that would cost? also...I am pretty sure there will be people very willing to try and use that electricity for themselves.

Not as much as you think: https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi- ... ity-solar/

On 14 days during March, Arizona utilities got a gift from California: free solar power. Well, actually better than free. California produced so much solar power on those days that it paid Arizona to take excess electricity its residents weren’t using to avoid overloading its own power lines. It happened on eight days in January and nine in February as well. All told, those transactions helped save Arizona electricity customers millions of dollars this year, though grid operators declined to say exactly how much. And California also has paid other states to take power.

The number of days that California dumped its unused solar electricity would have been even higher if the state hadn’t ordered some solar plants to reduce production — even as natural gas power plants, which contribute to greenhouse gas emissions, continued generating electricity. Solar and wind power production was curtailed a relatively small amount — about 3% in the first quarter of 2017 — but that’s more than double the same period last year. And the surge in solar power could push the number even higher in the future.

To prevent people from climbing it. It could be slightly electrified, just to tase any potential climbers, no need to go all Jurassic Park on them.

But what about the illegal Dinos?

Mark Zuckerberg will take care of it:

[Telconi]

I don't want the wall. I want a border fence, electrified, reinforced by the US military. But at the same time, I don't want a citizen initiative to fail over technicalities.

Why do you want it electrified?

No need for a wall. As I've said, sensors, drones, and the fence already there, plus an increase in border patrol agents will solve the problem. We also need more people to process asylum cases.

^This so much. Instead of prosecuting illegal immigrants, get them citizenship instead. We punish them later if y'all want to.

Pretty sure law enforcement is allowed to use force to prevent a crime.

Pretty sure probable cause exists.

Sheesh, man, just saying that without context means that a cop van just shoot someone for unarmed robbery.

Entering a country illegally is not a human right. Defending ones self, ones home and ones nation is.

A family jumping the border isn't dangerous. Also, people actually do have a right to entry according to certain articles in the Univeeisal Declaration of Human Rights.

The UDHR has the legal clout of used toilet tissue...

[Lamoni]

He’s not getting his stupid racist xenophobic wall. A democratic house will never vote for it

Funny how wanting a wall that proves a deterrent to ILLEGALS from entering stateside is considered racist and xenophobic. If those Mexican a**holes want to get US Citizenship they should go through all the proper channels like any other PROPER US Immigrant. They shouldn't be here in the first place, we use the term ILLEGAL Immigrant for a reason, and it's not because it's racist. It's because there are channels one needs to go through and these folks think that they should have all the American rights just for hopping over a line or having a kid or two pop out on the border. In an ideal world that would be nice and all, but this is reality. There is no need for actually Americans to shoulder the burden of taking in illegals.

The term "illegal immigrant" might not be racist, but you do not get to call Mexicans "a**sholes."

*** Unofficial warning for trolling ***

[Ifreann]

Pretty sure death isn’t the penalty for illegally cross the border.

Pretty sure law enforcement is allowed to use force to prevent a crime.

Within their jurisdiction. Mexico, I trust I do not need to tell you, as a Texan, is a different country from the United States.

---

Lol

What an idiotic system of government

“I want to build a giant 5 billion dollar wall.

You will not.

Yes I will.

You will not.

(Government stops)”

Really? The government shuts off for 8 days? Lol

If someone told me in advance a few years back this is coming up in the government of the world’s Number One country I would have dismissed the possibility

But it happens for real, democracy continues to impress me

America is not a very democratic country.

[United States of Natan]

Trump hasn't even spent the money congress already gave him for border security over the past two years (over 90% of it is unspent). Why the hell should we give him MORE money for a wall that experts have concluded won't work (most undocumented immigrants become undocumented by overstaying their visas), is completely immoral and racist, and too expensive?

Honestly, he screwed up here. He could've gotten a descent border security deal while the GOP controlled the house. But because he won't accept anything less than his 5 billion in wall money, he has to wait until Dems take back Congress, and he's absolutely nuts if he thinks that Pelosi's gonna give him his wall. The longer the shutdown lasts, the more it hurts him. And I hope he remembers that he's got an election in less than 2 years. Does he think voters will just forget that he shut down the government for completely foolish, ideological reasons, while his party controlled both chambers of congress, when Dems offered sufficient alternatives? Especially when the shutdown looks like it's not ending any time soon?

[San Lumen]

Trump hasn't even spent the money congress already gave him for border security over the past two years (over 90% of it is unspent). Why the hell should we give him MORE money for a wall that experts have concluded won't work (most undocumented immigrants become undocumented by overstaying their visas), is completely immoral and racist, and too expensive?

Honestly, he screwed up here. He could've gotten a descent border security deal while the GOP controlled the house. But because he won't accept anything less than his 5 billion in wall money, he has to wait until Dems take back Congress, and he's absolutely nuts if he thinks that Pelosi's gonna give him his wall. The longer the shutdown lasts, the more it hurts him. And I hope he remembers that he's got an election in less than 2 years. Does he think voters will just forget that he shut down the government for completely foolish, ideological reasons, while his party controlled both chambers of congress, when Dems offered sufficient alternatives? Especially when the shutdown looks like it's not ending any time soon?

People have short memories sadly

[Godular]

Trump hasn't even spent the money congress already gave him for border security over the past two years (over 90% of it is unspent). Why the hell should we give him MORE money for a wall that experts have concluded won't work (most undocumented immigrants become undocumented by overstaying their visas), is completely immoral and racist, and too expensive?

Honestly, he screwed up here. He could've gotten a descent border security deal while the GOP controlled the house. But because he won't accept anything less than his 5 billion in wall money, he has to wait until Dems take back Congress, and he's absolutely nuts if he thinks that Pelosi's gonna give him his wall. The longer the shutdown lasts, the more it hurts him. And I hope he remembers that he's got an election in less than 2 years. Does he think voters will just forget that he shut down the government for completely foolish, ideological reasons, while his party controlled both chambers of congress, when Dems offered sufficient alternatives? Especially when the shutdown looks like it's not ending any time soon?

People have short memories sadly

Highly selective memories also.

[The Alma Mater]

Trump hasn't even spent the money congress already gave him for border security over the past two years (over 90% of it is unspent). Why the hell should we give him MORE money for a wall that experts have concluded won't work (most undocumented immigrants become undocumented by overstaying their visas), is completely immoral and racist, and too expensive?

Honestly, he screwed up here. He could've gotten a descent border security deal while the GOP controlled the house. But because he won't accept anything less than his 5 billion in wall money, he has to wait until Dems take back Congress, and he's absolutely nuts if he thinks that Pelosi's gonna give him his wall. The longer the shutdown lasts, the more it hurts him. And I hope he remembers that he's got an election in less than 2 years. Does he think voters will just forget that he shut down the government for completely foolish, ideological reasons, while his party controlled both chambers of congress, when Dems offered sufficient alternatives? Especially when the shutdown looks like it's not ending any time soon?

Where do you get the silly idea that Republicans will remember that or that way ?

They will remember the brave Trump standing up against the evil traitors. Reality does not matter.

[Myrensis]

Trump hasn't even spent the money congress already gave him for border security over the past two years (over 90% of it is unspent). Why the hell should we give him MORE money for a wall that experts have concluded won't work (most undocumented immigrants become undocumented by overstaying their visas), is completely immoral and racist, and too expensive?

Honestly, he screwed up here. He could've gotten a descent border security deal while the GOP controlled the house. But because he won't accept anything less than his 5 billion in wall money, he has to wait until Dems take back Congress, and he's absolutely nuts if he thinks that Pelosi's gonna give him his wall. The longer the shutdown lasts, the more it hurts him. And I hope he remembers that he's got an election in less than 2 years. Does he think voters will just forget that he shut down the government for completely foolish, ideological reasons, while his party controlled both chambers of congress, when Dems offered sufficient alternatives? Especially when the shutdown looks like it's not ending any time soon?

You're never going to get anywhere trying to interpret Trumps behavior through the lens of "Somebody with an actual plan" or "Somebody with an actual ideology they care about"

Trump doesn't give two shits about the wall, it's just something that gets him a lot of clapping and cheering at rallies, hence why he never bothered with a serious push for it during the two years he had a friendly House. The stupidity of staging a shutdown battle for it now, after he's lost the House and still needs Democratic support in the Senate, stems from the fact that those were never considerations that entered his mind, the sum total of all thought, motivation, and planning that went into this was, "The conservative pundits on TV said I wouldn't be the prettiest girl at the ball unless I get the wall now!".

Compounded by the fact that Trump has no actual idea how 'negotiation' works. For pretty much his entire life his 'Master Negotiator' skills have consisted of using his money and pet thug lawyers to browbeat and steamroll people into doing whatever he wanted. He has no clue how to react or what to do when he has to negotiate with someone who is 100% willing and able to tell him to go screw himself.

Hence the longrunning pattern of his Presidency, where he Tweets about all these amazing deals he's willing to make with the Democrats...then locks himself in a room with Republicans and screams at them to get him what he wants or else he'll turn the red-hats loose on them.

[Manokan Republic]

Trump hasn't even spent the money congress already gave him for border security over the past two years (over 90% of it is unspent). Why the hell should we give him MORE money for a wall that experts have concluded won't work (most undocumented immigrants become undocumented by overstaying their visas), is completely immoral and racist, and too expensive?

Honestly, he screwed up here. He could've gotten a descent border security deal while the GOP controlled the house. But because he won't accept anything less than his 5 billion in wall money, he has to wait until Dems take back Congress, and he's absolutely nuts if he thinks that Pelosi's gonna give him his wall. The longer the shutdown lasts, the more it hurts him. And I hope he remembers that he's got an election in less than 2 years. Does he think voters will just forget that he shut down the government for completely foolish, ideological reasons, while his party controlled both chambers of congress, when Dems offered sufficient alternatives? Especially when the shutdown looks like it's not ending any time soon?

How is a wall immoral or racist? Like it doesn't even make sense. There's no specific explanation for this.

Furthermore, almost no-one cares about illegal immigrants that overstay their visas, as they are in the system and only illegal by technicality. I'm more worried about illegal border crossings, such as by cartels and other traffickers, or those who will go on to be exploited by big businesses, and not legal immigrants that due to a technicality of overstaying their visas. Ted Cruz, a leading Republican figure, proposed a bill to streamline legal immigration, for example doubling the number of judges from 375 to 750 judges, and shortening the time it takes to become an American citizen. Most Republicans and people in favor of a wall in general are not against legal immigrants, but against illegal border crossings specifically, which is where the problem lies. Unless legal immigrants come here and by becoming illegal automatically are trafficking drugs or working for less than 2 dollars an hour under the table (bad for native workers by devaluing their wages and bad for the illegal immigrants themselves who are mistreated), then no-one will care.

As far as the effectiveness of a border wall, it depends specifically on the type, but they generally tend to work well. In El Paso, illegal immigrant crossing dropped 89%, or from 122,261 immigrant to 12,251. "In fact, the number of deportable illegal immigrants located by the US Border Patrol plummeted by more than 89 percent over the five-year period during which the controversial new fence was built, according to Homeland Security data I reviewed. When the project first started in 2006, illegal crossings totaled 122,261, but by 2010, when the 131-mile fence was completed from one end of El Paso out into the New Mexico desert, immigrant crossings shrank to just 12,251." In Yuma Arizona, the border wall has virtually eliminated crossings, and with cameras on the border, they know exactly how many have crossed. "“We essentially apprehend 92 percent of all entries through the Yuma sector,” said Porvaznik, as he steered a white and green Chevy Tahoe through the sand. “That is 126 miles of border, which includes 12 miles of these sand dunes. On a scale of 1 to 10 we are a 9.” Today, Yuma has triple the manpower and apprehends just 15 illegal immigrants a day, a 96 percent reduction. Instead of 2,700 vehicle penetrations, this year’s total is just 27." A virtual border wall, essentially just cameras and sensory equipment, known as project 28, stopped 30% of illegal crossings, with the majority of cases being that the border police arrived only a few minutes late, which obviously could have been stopped with an actual wall. Israel, illegal immigration dropped 99% along the Egyptian border. Even left-wing sources basically admit it will work, even if they still don't like it. As for tunneling under, there's only been about 180 serious attempts, and of these a handful were successful for a short while. Underground tunneling detectors that use sonar, prevalent on many military bases, can also be used on any wall, as a part of the sensory equipment, making this even less likely. As for cost, 20 billion dollars out of a 4 trillion dollar annual budget is literally like a half a percent, for one year, for a wall that will last for like 50+ years. So, as for the idea that it's too expensive, that's hardly even an argument, and the government shut down has already been more expensive. If this was about money, than the democrats would have already caved.

48% of violent crime is committed by organized criminal organizations, such as gangs and cartels, and a large amount of it is facilitated or caused by their actions, such as from the proliferation of drugs or guns. As for drug causing crime, approximately 46.7% of violent criminals classify as drug dependent, and 48.9% of those committing homicide, despite chronic illicit drug users making up 9.4% of the population. Drugs obviously mess with your brain, and other than the massive death tolls, they can cause a person to become violent. Smuggling guns, people, money, and all kinds of contraband can also increase crime rates, and as most trafficking is from overland routes and not by sea or air (roughly 98%), largely bypassing legal POE's and checkpoints, then we know that, a wall would should most of this down. While it's true that it's theoretically possible to bypass a wall through various means, it will be rare, which will stop the majority of it, and by extent, the crime it brings along with it.

[San Lumen]

Yeah because those government workers don’t have rent or mortgages to pay or kids to feed right?

Everyone happy with government shutdowns should forgo there pay for the duration of the shutdown.

I also don't like welfare, should I let my kids starve? People can find temp work for a month, stop playing dumb. People ought to see how little the federal government actually effects their life.

So easy for you to say when your not a government worker. You obviously understand little about government

And what about the coast guard and secret service who have to work without pay? The heck with them?

[Land of the Trolls]

I also don't like welfare, should I let my kids starve? People can find temp work for a month, stop playing dumb. People ought to see how little the federal government actually effects their life.

So easy for you to say when your not a government worker. You obviously understand little about government

And what about the coast guard and secret service who have to work without pay? The heck with them?

Let them eat cake!

[Valrifell]

I also don't like welfare, should I let my kids starve? People can find temp work for a month, stop playing dumb. People ought to see how little the federal government actually effects their life.

So easy for you to say when your not a government worker. You obviously understand little about government

And what about the coast guard and secret service who have to work without pay? The heck with them?

Don't forget that Trump has blown through the annual secret service budget before, meaning they've already had to work without pay, iirc.

[Esternial]

Speaking as a Belgian, a good government shutdown can work wonders at time :)

Like doing one of those toxic cleanses.

not to vote for the hive-minds on the left.

It's fascinating to see this used (potentially) unironically.

[The British American Colonies]

Hold up, did trump not take the blame for the shutdown?