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MAGAThread XV: Because Another

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Confederate States of German America
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Postby Confederate States of German America » Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:45 pm

Also, for the record, Ann Coulter has been right on this issue and I don't think our Left of Center friends have actually looked up her tweets to understand where she has been coming at on this issue. She rightly pointed out that he had two years of total Republican dominance where Wall funding could've been secured, but instead we got a tax law in the Neoliberal vein and a criminal reform bill that they wouldn't even let Tom Cotton attach an Anti-Pedophile element to. Apparently this stung, because he quit following her some time before this all began.

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Postby Shrillland » Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:48 pm

Confederate States of German America wrote:Also, for the record, Ann Coulter has been right on this issue and I don't think our Left of Center friends have actually looked up her tweets to understand where she has been coming at on this issue. She rightly pointed out that he had two years of total Republican dominance where Wall funding could've been secured, but instead we got a tax law in the Neoliberal vein and a criminal reform bill that they wouldn't even let Tom Cotton attach an Anti-Pedophile element to. Apparently this stung, because he quit following her some time before this all began.


Not exactly. 51 Senators isn't dominance anymore, not now in our filibuster-everything Senate.
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Confederate States of German America
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Postby Confederate States of German America » Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:51 pm

Shrillland wrote:
Confederate States of German America wrote:Also, for the record, Ann Coulter has been right on this issue and I don't think our Left of Center friends have actually looked up her tweets to understand where she has been coming at on this issue. She rightly pointed out that he had two years of total Republican dominance where Wall funding could've been secured, but instead we got a tax law in the Neoliberal vein and a criminal reform bill that they wouldn't even let Tom Cotton attach an Anti-Pedophile element to. Apparently this stung, because he quit following her some time before this all began.


Not exactly. 51 Senators isn't dominance anymore, not now in our filibuster-everything Senate.


Was 52 until December of 2017 when Roy Moore lost the Alabama seat. That's a full year they could've got something done and it's likely several Democrats would have crossed the aisle as well, given the 2018 midterms were coming up and neither said Democrats nor Republicans wanted to be on record against something so near and dear to the GOP base. What I think happened? Jared and Ivanka. You would've thought Trump would've learned his lesson after Jared's plan in regards to Comey and Flynn completely backfired and they collectively engendered so much chaos by feuding with Bannon.
Last edited by Confederate States of German America on Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:52 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Seangoli
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Postby Seangoli » Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:08 pm

Shrillland wrote:
Confederate States of German America wrote:Also, for the record, Ann Coulter has been right on this issue and I don't think our Left of Center friends have actually looked up her tweets to understand where she has been coming at on this issue. She rightly pointed out that he had two years of total Republican dominance where Wall funding could've been secured, but instead we got a tax law in the Neoliberal vein and a criminal reform bill that they wouldn't even let Tom Cotton attach an Anti-Pedophile element to. Apparently this stung, because he quit following her some time before this all began.


Not exactly. 51 Senators isn't dominance anymore, not now in our filibuster-everything Senate.


Budget and appropriations bills have a hard limit of 50 hours of filibustering, pretty much because you don't want to fillibuster a budget. Further, you only need to get a super majority for cloture in such bills, and a simple majority to actually pass them.

The Democrats could have made life annoying for Republicans, but when you break it down they couldn't stop shit with a budget.

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Postby Thermodolia » Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:14 pm

Confederate States of German America wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:And I’m saying that the illegality of such actions means jack shit if enough people joined in. All 15,000 ATC might not make an impression but they are a drop in the hat if all transportation workers went on strike together. That includes airlines, trucking, shipping, all railroads, and transit systems.


I don't see how that could be brought about, or what that has to do with the Federal portion of that getting fired as a result of their action?

ACT strikes and transportation unions join in solidarity. That’s how it could be brought about. And for the later it really wouldn’t matter as part of the strikers conditions would most likely be restoration of jobs/repeal of said law/legal decision.

Plus firing ATC wouldn’t really do much except for inflame the strikers
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Postby Shrillland » Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:18 pm

Seangoli wrote:
Shrillland wrote:
Not exactly. 51 Senators isn't dominance anymore, not now in our filibuster-everything Senate.


Budget and appropriations bills have a hard limit of 50 hours of filibustering, pretty much because you don't want to fillibuster a budget. Further, you only need to get a super majority for cloture in such bills, and a simple majority to actually pass them.

The Democrats could have made life annoying for Republicans, but when you break it down they couldn't stop shit with a budget.


Yes, but I mean that cloture is used for every single bill that comes down the pipe is what I should've said.
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Postby Seangoli » Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:40 pm

Shrillland wrote:
Seangoli wrote:
Budget and appropriations bills have a hard limit of 50 hours of filibustering, pretty much because you don't want to fillibuster a budget. Further, you only need to get a super majority for cloture in such bills, and a simple majority to actually pass them.

The Democrats could have made life annoying for Republicans, but when you break it down they couldn't stop shit with a budget.


Yes, but I mean that cloture is used for every single bill that comes down the pipe is what I should've said.


The Republicans couldneasily have gone the route of reconcilliation, making fillibusters impossible and 20 hours of debate, and only requiring a simple majority to pass.

Frankly, the major reason why they didn't is because I doubt they could get the 50 votes needed (with Pence being 51), and McConnell wasnt going to risk it. Particularly after the fiasco with repealing Obamacare, and if I recall trying to push it through reconcilliation and still failing.

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Postby Farnhamia » Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:51 pm

Seangoli wrote:
Shrillland wrote:
Yes, but I mean that cloture is used for every single bill that comes down the pipe is what I should've said.


The Republicans couldneasily have gone the route of reconcilliation, making fillibusters impossible and 20 hours of debate, and only requiring a simple majority to pass.

Frankly, the major reason why they didn't is because I doubt they could get the 50 votes needed (with Pence being 51), and McConnell wasnt going to risk it. Particularly after the fiasco with repealing Obamacare, and if I recall trying to push it through reconcilliation and still failing.

Yeah, but the guy who spoiled that triumph is dead and Susan Collins will believe anything McConnell tells her as long as he keeps a straight face saying it.
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Postby Confederate States of German America » Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:45 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Confederate States of German America wrote:
I don't see how that could be brought about, or what that has to do with the Federal portion of that getting fired as a result of their action?

ACT strikes and transportation unions join in solidarity. That’s how it could be brought about. And for the later it really wouldn’t matter as part of the strikers conditions would most likely be restoration of jobs/repeal of said law/legal decision.

Plus firing ATC wouldn’t really do much except for inflame the strikers


The last time this was tried in the 1940s and resulted in Taft Hartley and Truman, a pretty firm New Dealer, having to crackdown on Unions even if disagreed with the legislation. I just don't see the Federal Government, especially in the current environment given the private sector doesn't have as many grievances and especially with alternatives like Uber gaining ground. I'm all for a push back on Corporation power via unionization and strikes, but the validity of FDR's and later Reagan's stance on public (federal) workers is extremely valid and just in my estimation. We've seen enough chaos on that front here and elsewhere, so I don't think think the Feds would budge on this especially as we are seeing now and have seen in the past there ability to weather such events.

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Postby Confederate States of German America » Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:55 pm

Seangoli wrote:
Shrillland wrote:
Yes, but I mean that cloture is used for every single bill that comes down the pipe is what I should've said.


The Republicans couldneasily have gone the route of reconcilliation, making fillibusters impossible and 20 hours of debate, and only requiring a simple majority to pass.

Frankly, the major reason why they didn't is because I doubt they could get the 50 votes needed (with Pence being 51), and McConnell wasnt going to risk it. Particularly after the fiasco with repealing Obamacare, and if I recall trying to push it through reconcilliation and still failing.


Obamacare had the safety of public opinion eroding against it, even among the Republicans. The Wall was, at least then, very favored by Republican rank and file, meaning any negative vote on it would've been dangerous given 2018 being just around the corner. Beyond the threat of primaries to sitting Republicans and the very real appeal of voting for something that would appeal to Trumpists for the same, this also would've put quite a few Democrats on notice, given they'd were in Deep Red States this would appeal to. Collins, Flake and McCain could've bounced, but that would've left Republicans with 49 and they could've easily picked up, say, Manchin for 50.

I maintain it was just Jared and Ivanka. They've been the moderates pushing for things like the DACA reforms he starts talking about and then is forced to back off when the base explodes. This also explains this whole ordeal in my estimation, as he simply cannot hope to win 2020 if he doesn't have the base rallied up.

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Postby The Rich Port » Fri Jan 18, 2019 11:01 pm

Confederate States of German America wrote:Also, for the record, Ann Coulter has been right on this issue and I don't think our Left of Center friends have actually looked up her tweets to understand where she has been coming at on this issue. She rightly pointed out that he had two years of total Republican dominance where Wall funding could've been secured, but instead we got a tax law in the Neoliberal vein and a criminal reform bill that they wouldn't even let Tom Cotton attach an Anti-Pedophile element to. Apparently this stung, because he quit following her some time before this all began.


Yeah, we're not going to care that Ann Coulter was right for literally once. Sue us.
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Postby Confederate States of German America » Fri Jan 18, 2019 11:04 pm

The Rich Port wrote:
Confederate States of German America wrote:Also, for the record, Ann Coulter has been right on this issue and I don't think our Left of Center friends have actually looked up her tweets to understand where she has been coming at on this issue. She rightly pointed out that he had two years of total Republican dominance where Wall funding could've been secured, but instead we got a tax law in the Neoliberal vein and a criminal reform bill that they wouldn't even let Tom Cotton attach an Anti-Pedophile element to. Apparently this stung, because he quit following her some time before this all began.


Yeah, we're not going to care that Ann Coulter was right for literally once. Sue us.


For the record, she's also repeatedly said she expects him to cave. I'm putting my money no later than March, because that's when food stamp money will run out.

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Postby Thermodolia » Sat Jan 19, 2019 12:09 am

Confederate States of German America wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
Yeah, we're not going to care that Ann Coulter was right for literally once. Sue us.


For the record, she's also repeatedly said she expects him to cave. I'm putting my money no later than March, because that's when food stamp money will run out.

He might be caving tomorrow. Apparently he’s going to offer the democrats a deal
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Postby Thermodolia » Sat Jan 19, 2019 12:14 am

Confederate States of German America wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:ACT strikes and transportation unions join in solidarity. That’s how it could be brought about. And for the later it really wouldn’t matter as part of the strikers conditions would most likely be restoration of jobs/repeal of said law/legal decision.

Plus firing ATC wouldn’t really do much except for inflame the strikers


The last time this was tried in the 1940s and resulted in Taft Hartley and Truman, a pretty firm New Dealer, having to crackdown on Unions even if disagreed with the legislation. I just don't see the Federal Government, especially in the current environment given the private sector doesn't have as many grievances and especially with alternatives like Uber gaining ground. I'm all for a push back on Corporation power via unionization and strikes, but the validity of FDR's and later Reagan's stance on public (federal) workers is extremely valid and just in my estimation. We've seen enough chaos on that front here and elsewhere, so I don't think think the Feds would budge on this especially as we are seeing now and have seen in the past there ability to weather such events.

Not for what I’m talking about. Nothing would be moving. The Railroads are 100% union controlled. If the Railroad workers unions all went on a general strike with other transportation unions we wouldn’t be weathering anything.

If airport and railroad workers, both of which are highly unionized, went on strike together supporting the ATC strike the economy would collapse almost instantly. Truckers alone could not and would not be able to handle everything.
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Postby Thuzbekistan » Sat Jan 19, 2019 3:35 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Confederate States of German America wrote:
The last time this was tried in the 1940s and resulted in Taft Hartley and Truman, a pretty firm New Dealer, having to crackdown on Unions even if disagreed with the legislation. I just don't see the Federal Government, especially in the current environment given the private sector doesn't have as many grievances and especially with alternatives like Uber gaining ground. I'm all for a push back on Corporation power via unionization and strikes, but the validity of FDR's and later Reagan's stance on public (federal) workers is extremely valid and just in my estimation. We've seen enough chaos on that front here and elsewhere, so I don't think think the Feds would budge on this especially as we are seeing now and have seen in the past there ability to weather such events.

Not for what I’m talking about. Nothing would be moving. The Railroads are 100% union controlled. If the Railroad workers unions all went on a general strike with other transportation unions we wouldn’t be weathering anything.

If airport and railroad workers, both of which are highly unionized, went on strike together supporting the ATC strike the economy would collapse almost instantly. Truckers alone could not and would not be able to handle everything.

I'd rather not have our entire economy held hostage by unions that think a guy sweeping the floor at GM should be paid 80 bucks an hour...
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Postby Telconi » Sat Jan 19, 2019 3:56 am

Thuzbekistan wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Not for what I’m talking about. Nothing would be moving. The Railroads are 100% union controlled. If the Railroad workers unions all went on a general strike with other transportation unions we wouldn’t be weathering anything.

If airport and railroad workers, both of which are highly unionized, went on strike together supporting the ATC strike the economy would collapse almost instantly. Truckers alone could not and would not be able to handle everything.

I'd rather not have our entire economy held hostage by unions that think a guy sweeping the floor at GM should be paid 80 bucks an hour...


Well si ce your imaginary meme union doesn't actually exist, no worries.
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Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Sat Jan 19, 2019 4:19 am

Thuzbekistan wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Not for what I’m talking about. Nothing would be moving. The Railroads are 100% union controlled. If the Railroad workers unions all went on a general strike with other transportation unions we wouldn’t be weathering anything.

If airport and railroad workers, both of which are highly unionized, went on strike together supporting the ATC strike the economy would collapse almost instantly. Truckers alone could not and would not be able to handle everything.

I'd rather not have our entire economy held hostage by unions that think a guy sweeping the floor at GM should be paid 80 bucks an hour...


And most Americans would rather the government be turned back on instead of being held hostage by an idiot who wants a wall.
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Postby Tarsonis » Sat Jan 19, 2019 6:38 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
Thuzbekistan wrote:I'd rather not have our entire economy held hostage by unions that think a guy sweeping the floor at GM should be paid 80 bucks an hour...


And most Americans would rather the government be turned back on instead of being held hostage by an idiot who wants a wall.


I dunno, I haven’t noticed a difference really
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Postby Thermodolia » Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:05 am

Thuzbekistan wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Not for what I’m talking about. Nothing would be moving. The Railroads are 100% union controlled. If the Railroad workers unions all went on a general strike with other transportation unions we wouldn’t be weathering anything.

If airport and railroad workers, both of which are highly unionized, went on strike together supporting the ATC strike the economy would collapse almost instantly. Truckers alone could not and would not be able to handle everything.

I'd rather not have our entire economy held hostage by unions that think a guy sweeping the floor at GM should be paid 80 bucks an hour...

Don’t worry that doesn’t exist. That’s just anti-union propaganda
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Postby Thermodolia » Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:06 am

Tarsonis wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
And most Americans would rather the government be turned back on instead of being held hostage by an idiot who wants a wall.


I dunno, I haven’t noticed a difference really

I have. Attempting to fly out of ATL has gotten fucking worse
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Postby Ifreann » Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:12 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Tarsonis wrote:
I dunno, I haven’t noticed a difference really

I have. Attempting to fly out of ATL has gotten fucking worse

Big shout out to ATL, where TSA didn't notice the LOADED GUN a passenger brought through security and onto a flight.
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Postby Salandriagado » Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:28 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Tarsonis wrote:
I dunno, I haven’t noticed a difference really

I have. Attempting to fly out of ATL has gotten fucking worse


Wait, worse‽ I thought ATL was already the result of an experiment to determine how shit you can make flying out of an airport.
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Postby Thermodolia » Sat Jan 19, 2019 8:09 am

Salandriagado wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:I have. Attempting to fly out of ATL has gotten fucking worse


Wait, worse‽ I thought ATL was already the result of an experiment to determine how shit you can make flying out of an airport.

The security lines where 2 hours longer than normal
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Jerzylvania » Sat Jan 19, 2019 8:19 am

The Rich Port wrote:
Confederate States of German America wrote:Also, for the record, Ann Coulter has been right on this issue and I don't think our Left of Center friends have actually looked up her tweets to understand where she has been coming at on this issue. She rightly pointed out that he had two years of total Republican dominance where Wall funding could've been secured, but instead we got a tax law in the Neoliberal vein and a criminal reform bill that they wouldn't even let Tom Cotton attach an Anti-Pedophile element to. Apparently this stung, because he quit following her some time before this all began.


Yeah, we're not going to care that Ann Coulter was right for literally once. Sue us.


Twice. She and Bill Maher are good friends.
Living with low vision since 2005. Expect edits, construction delays and weird deletions.
Reading political tea leaves since Eisenhower was POTUS, so expect crankiness, disgust and dismay ...but unlike Trump, I never hold a grudge. XD
Below: Check today's "new" official Jerzylvania anthem choices! Vote for your choice via TG! Cancer is like carbon. All life on this planet is comprised of it. Same with cancer. Ubiquitous.
Helsinki - Helsinki - Helsinki ...Make America Grovel Again! ~ Donald Trump is Burning

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Jerzylvania
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7222
Founded: Aug 10, 2016
Father Knows Best State

Postby Jerzylvania » Sat Jan 19, 2019 8:19 am

Salandriagado wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:I have. Attempting to fly out of ATL has gotten fucking worse


Wait, worse‽ I thought ATL was already the result of an experiment to determine how shit you can make flying out of an airport.


:rofl:
Living with low vision since 2005. Expect edits, construction delays and weird deletions.
Reading political tea leaves since Eisenhower was POTUS, so expect crankiness, disgust and dismay ...but unlike Trump, I never hold a grudge. XD
Below: Check today's "new" official Jerzylvania anthem choices! Vote for your choice via TG! Cancer is like carbon. All life on this planet is comprised of it. Same with cancer. Ubiquitous.
Helsinki - Helsinki - Helsinki ...Make America Grovel Again! ~ Donald Trump is Burning

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