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Federal Republics

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Federal Republics are the best form of governments

Yes
34
57%
Not really
22
37%
Not Sure
4
7%
 
Total votes : 60

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The Federated Soviets of North America
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Founded: Oct 31, 2018
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Postby The Federated Soviets of North America » Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:20 pm

Atheris wrote:Federal Republics are (imo) the best form of government, but a direct democracy is much more fair.

Help, my two favorite political systems are at odds with eachother

Become a council communist, we've got both
so does Switzerland, but whatever
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Rio Cana
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Postby Rio Cana » Sat Dec 15, 2018 6:00 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
United States of Natan wrote:I'm quite certain there's more than 15. You may be forgetting a few, such as Sudan and South Sudan.

Regardless, I do believe its the best type of government.

Well they forgot about Comoros, Iraq, Micronesia, Somalia, Sudan, and South Sudan.

And that’s not counting the federations that are monarchies. Which are Australia, Belgium, Canada, Malaysia, Saint Kitts and Nevis, and the UAE.

So in total there are 21 Federal Republics, 6 Federal Monarchies, and 27 Federations


The six nations you mentioned are not shining examples of Federal Republics. Somalia, Sudan and South Sudan are an example of nations gone amok. Iraq is a parliamentary democracy. Iraq being a parliamentary democracy means the Pres. has little power unlike in Federal Republics. Those inparliament choose the Pres. They also have a PM who is the one with the power. Comoros politics seems strange but they seem more to be a Federal Republic. Micronesia also seems a Federal Republic. But they are in is free association with the US even though independent. Government is dependent on US grants. There Pres. is elected by there congress. There supreme court has to be approved by the congress. There congress is the main power thus balance of power of the three branches does not exist.

Just interested in Presidential Federal Republics not monarchies.
Last edited by Rio Cana on Sat Dec 15, 2018 6:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Atheris
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Postby Atheris » Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:18 pm

Shofercia wrote:
Atheris wrote:Federal Republics are (imo) the best form of government, but a direct democracy is much more fair.

Help, my two favorite political systems are at odds with eachother


Switzerland has both. Check it out.

damn, Switzerland looks hella cool

too bad i'm a supporter of gun restrictions (not a total ban, don't get me wrong) though
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United States of Natan
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Postby United States of Natan » Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:20 pm

Menorica wrote:
Rio Cana wrote:Did some checking and it seems there are only 15 Federal Republics in the world. I though there were more. So why is this. Having a large population and large area has nothing to do with it since both Nepal and Austria are Federal Republics. Do you think having a Fed. Rep. has a form of government is better then most other political systems. I think it is a better system since it does give more local control to regions of a nation. So what do you think NS.

List of Federal Republics
1. Argentina
2. Austria
3. Bosnia
4. Brazil
5. Ethiopia
6. Germany
7. India
8. Mexico
9. Nepal
10. Nigeria
11. Pakistan
12. Russia
13. Switzerland
14. US
15. Venezuela


The United States of America is NOT a Federal Republic, It is a [CONSTITUTIONAL] Republic!

It's both, dude. a Federal Republic can be a constitutional republic. In fact, the U.S. is the oldest surviving Federation.
Last edited by United States of Natan on Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Atheris
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Postby Atheris » Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:27 pm

Menorica wrote:
Rio Cana wrote:Did some checking and it seems there are only 15 Federal Republics in the world. I though there were more. So why is this. Having a large population and large area has nothing to do with it since both Nepal and Austria are Federal Republics. Do you think having a Fed. Rep. has a form of government is better then most other political systems. I think it is a better system since it does give more local control to regions of a nation. So what do you think NS.

List of Federal Republics
1. Argentina
2. Austria
3. Bosnia
4. Brazil
5. Ethiopia
6. Germany
7. India
8. Mexico
9. Nepal
10. Nigeria
11. Pakistan
12. Russia
13. Switzerland
14. US
15. Venezuela


The United States of America is NOT a Federal Republic, It is a [CONSTITUTIONAL] Republic!


it is a federal republic though.

federalization = local power = federal republic
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United States of Natan
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Postby United States of Natan » Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:27 pm

Rio Cana wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Well they forgot about Comoros, Iraq, Micronesia, Somalia, Sudan, and South Sudan.

And that’s not counting the federations that are monarchies. Which are Australia, Belgium, Canada, Malaysia, Saint Kitts and Nevis, and the UAE.

So in total there are 21 Federal Republics, 6 Federal Monarchies, and 27 Federations


The six nations you mentioned are not shining examples of Federal Republics. Somalia, Sudan and South Sudan are an example of nations gone amok. Iraq is a parliamentary democracy. Iraq being a parliamentary democracy means the Pres. has little power unlike in Federal Republics. Those in parliament choose the Pres. They also have a PM who is the one with the power. Comoros politics seems strange but they seem more to be a Federal Republic. Micronesia also seems a Federal Republic. But they are in is free association with the US even though independent. Government is dependent on US grants. There Pres. is elected by there congress. There supreme court has to be approved by the congress. There congress is the main power thus balance of power of the three branches does not exist.

Just interested in Presidential Federal Republics not monarchies.

None of that conflicts with their status as federal republics. Somalia, Sudan, and South Sudan might be failed states, but it doesn't change their legal status as federal republics. Iraq is a federal parliamentary republic, which by no means undercuts the existence of their federal structure; they simply have less power vested in the head of state. It doesn't mean they aren't a federation. Micronesia is still legally an independent state, and even if it weren't, that wouldn't change its status as a federal entity. In fact, the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina, which is in a federal union with Republica Srpska (the country itself also being called simply "Bosnia and Herzegovina"), is itself a federation within a federation, consisting of 10 federal entities called cantons. (and yes, it is confusing, seeing as how both the federal entity and the country itself share a name, and because the two entities are NOT called "Bosnia" and "Herzegovina").

Federations are defined by the existence of one central government, along with two or more constituent states or jurisdictions which share sovereignty with the central government, often have their own constitutions, and cannot be abolished by either the central government nor a fellow constituent state, nor can its government be altered by them. For example, Connecticut is a federal entity, because it has its own territorial jurisdiction, constitution, and government, which cannot be altered in any way by the Federal government or fellow state governments. Scotland is a unitary (or devolved) entity, because its power derives from the central government and can be taken away by the central government.

In fact, a federation can even exist under a directorate, which is what Switzerland has.

The existence of a federation is NOT contingent on "who has the most power" within the federal government itself, as you seem to believe.
Last edited by United States of Natan on Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Thermodolia
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Postby Thermodolia » Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:47 pm

Rio Cana wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Well they forgot about Comoros, Iraq, Micronesia, Somalia, Sudan, and South Sudan.

And that’s not counting the federations that are monarchies. Which are Australia, Belgium, Canada, Malaysia, Saint Kitts and Nevis, and the UAE.

So in total there are 21 Federal Republics, 6 Federal Monarchies, and 27 Federations


The six nations you mentioned are not shining examples of Federal Republics. Somalia, Sudan and South Sudan are an example of nations gone amok. Iraq is a parliamentary democracy. Iraq being a parliamentary democracy means the Pres. has little power unlike in Federal Republics. Those inparliament choose the Pres. They also have a PM who is the one with the power. Comoros politics seems strange but they seem more to be a Federal Republic. Micronesia also seems a Federal Republic. But they are in is free association with the US even though independent. Government is dependent on US grants. There Pres. is elected by there congress. There supreme court has to be approved by the congress. There congress is the main power thus balance of power of the three branches does not exist.

Just interested in Presidential Federal Republics not monarchies.

If your just interested in Presidential Federal Republics then you need to remove:
Germany
Austria
Bosnia
Ethiopia
India
Nepal
Switzerland
Russia
Pakistan

From you list. Because Germany, Austria, Bosnia, Ethiopia, India, Nepal, and Pakistan are parliamentary republics not presidential republics. Russia is a Semi-Presidential republic. And Switzerland is a Directorial parliamentary republic.

None of these except for Russia, which has both an executive president and prime minister, have executive presidents. In many of these nations the president is elected by the parliament.
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Elybrit
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Postby Elybrit » Sun Dec 16, 2018 7:44 am

Using the United States as a case study, federalism is preferable to centralized government because ...

- your vote carries more weight in a state or local election than a national election of 100 million voters
- your vote ISN'T rendered worthless because you don't live in a "Purple State"
- empirical evidence shows smaller nation-states have larger GDP's
- elected representatives are far less removed from where you live and what you experience in your daily life
- you're not subject to policy and practices from a representative thousands of miles removed from where you live
- if you don't like your state or local government, you can more easily move to an adjacent state or municipality
- if you don't like your national government, it's far more difficult to relocate, immigrate or flee a nation, than a region or province
- your state is different than other states or provinces, hence a solution from Washington that works in one state might not work in yours.
- a one size fits all Washington policy or practice that is a demonstrable failure, it doesn't impact all 50 states
- a state that institutes an innovative and beneficial policy or practice, it can be easily adopted by other states with similar characteristics
- competition among the different states of provinces increases due diligence and accountability among politicians
- corruption, while present in ALL levels of gov't, is more difficult to hide when it's local
- the alternatives to corrupt gov't are more palatable because it's easier to abandon a corrupt state than a corrupt nation

I apologize for the overlapping arguments, I was shooting from the hip.

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Elybrit
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Regarding Switzerland ...

Postby Elybrit » Sun Dec 16, 2018 7:54 am

Switzerland may be a federal republic, it may be managed better than other nation-states, but Switzerland is NOT cool.

Switzerland and the Swiss should pat themselves on the back and be thankful they don't live in a dysfunctional state, but they should also be thankful the United States and the United Kingdom affords them the privilege to live free and prosperous.

Switzerland was neutral during World War II when the Nazis were murdered millions of innocent people, including 6 million innocent Jews.

That's not cool, that's pragmatic.

Cool is pulling up your sleeves and hitting the beach at Omaha, Juno, Sword, Utah and Gold to liberate the hundreds of millions of souls from Nazi tyranny.

That's cool.

It was a federal constitutional republic that defeated a totalitarian dictatorship is 1945 and made Western Europe more free, peaceful, stable and prosperous than ever before.

That's cool.

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Ghost Land
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Postby Ghost Land » Sun Dec 16, 2018 8:03 am

Personally I have issues with the concept of a republic or representative "democracy" to begin with. I'd say the best form of government would be a constitutional benevolent dictatorship with frequent initiatives and referendums; federalism may come into play if the country is very large or spread out.
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sun Dec 16, 2018 8:11 am

Miss me with that shit, federal monarchy
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Crylante
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Postby Crylante » Sun Dec 16, 2018 8:15 am

I am a supporter of federalising the United Kingdom; similar to the existence of Scottish and Welsh parliaments I feel that autonomy should be given to regions of England, although what the exact borders of such regions would be I'm not sure of.
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Atheris
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Postby Atheris » Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:48 am

The Federated Soviets of North America wrote:
Atheris wrote:Federal Republics are (imo) the best form of government, but a direct democracy is much more fair.

Help, my two favorite political systems are at odds with eachother

Become a council communist, we've got both
so does Switzerland, but whatever

i'm sorry but as an anti-communist they wouldn't like me
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Western Vale Confederacy
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Postby Western Vale Confederacy » Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:55 am

Internationalist Bastard wrote:Miss me with that shit, federal monarchy
Alexa play Die Wacht am Rhein


Syndicalism > munurcheez

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Atheris
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Postby Atheris » Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:47 am

Western Vale Confederacy wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:Miss me with that shit, federal monarchy
Alexa play Die Wacht am Rhein


Syndicalism > munurcheez

Google Home play The Internationale

United States of America > Combined Syndicates of America

Hey Cortana, play Battlecry of Freedom
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The United Parliament
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Postby The United Parliament » Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:56 am

The USA is a Constitutional Federal Republic, which not only sounds awesome, but it also makes us "unique". 1 point to freedom.

Federalist Republics are by far the best forms of government, but I disagree with some of the statements here saying that local regions need to have more autonomy. With too much autonomy in your "states", you end up with an Articles of Confederacy where the central government gets no laws passed and generally plays second fiddle to the most autonomous states which have their own personal agendas and no means of working together. Generally, having a stronger central government is more appealing, and efficient; however, leaving some powers to the states makes it more equal.
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Greed and Death
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Postby Greed and Death » Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:38 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Menorica wrote:
The United States of America is NOT a Federal Republic, It is a [CONSTITUTIONAL] Republic!

Mate the US is a fucking federal republic.


It was with Trump dismissing the house of representatives and assigning military governors to rule directly it is more akin to a constitutional dictatorship now.
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Atheris
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Postby Atheris » Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:02 pm

Greed and Death wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Mate the US is a fucking federal republic.


It was with Trump dismissing the house of representatives and assigning military governors to rule directly it is more akin to a constitutional dictatorship now.

lmfao what
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Northwest Slobovia
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Anarchy

Postby Northwest Slobovia » Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:20 pm

Page wrote:Federalism is better than a central government controlling everything. I think most states and regions of federal republicans don't have nearly enough autonomy.

Yup. But are federal republics the best ever™? For a starters, best at what? Federalism represents a political compromise, an attempt to balance, for example, the benefits of consistent nationwide policy against local control and/or lack of consensus on what good policy is. So, there's always questions about what should be done by the states/provinces vs. the central government. Maybe they're just the best form of government at stumbling along. :P
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Northwest Slobovia
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Anarchy

Postby Northwest Slobovia » Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:21 pm

Atheris wrote:
Greed and Death wrote:
It was with Trump dismissing the house of representatives and assigning military governors to rule directly it is more akin to a constitutional dictatorship now.

lmfao what

Apparently G&D is taking advantage of federalism, indulging in substances now legal/decriminalized in some states. :P
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Greed and Death
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Postby Greed and Death » Sun Dec 16, 2018 4:10 pm

Atheris wrote:
Greed and Death wrote:
It was with Trump dismissing the house of representatives and assigning military governors to rule directly it is more akin to a constitutional dictatorship now.

lmfao what


Here is General Mattis explaining the new system.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoV0ZnnQ7l4
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Thermodolia
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Postby Thermodolia » Sun Dec 16, 2018 4:14 pm

Greed and Death wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Mate the US is a fucking federal republic.


It was with Trump dismissing the house of representatives and assigning military governors to rule directly it is more akin to a constitutional dictatorship now.

Remember that the mods told you to stop making up bullshit?
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Greed and Death
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Postby Greed and Death » Sun Dec 16, 2018 4:19 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Greed and Death wrote:
It was with Trump dismissing the house of representatives and assigning military governors to rule directly it is more akin to a constitutional dictatorship now.

Remember that the mods told you to stop making up bullshit?

Its a starwars joke. Things are not yet bad enough people would think Democracy is over.
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The National Salvation Front for Russia
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Postby The National Salvation Front for Russia » Sun Dec 16, 2018 5:14 pm

The United Parliament wrote:The USA is a Constitutional Federal Republic, which not only sounds awesome, but it also makes us "unique". 1 point to freedom.

Federalist Republics are by far the best forms of government, but I disagree with some of the statements here saying that local regions need to have more autonomy. With too much autonomy in your "states", you end up with an Articles of Confederacy where the central government gets no laws passed and generally plays second fiddle to the most autonomous states which have their own personal agendas and no means of working together. Generally, having a stronger central government is more appealing, and efficient; however, leaving some powers to the states makes it more equal.

Australia is right on your tail.

We're just a Constitutional Federal Monarchy, but the moment the Republican movement boots out the Queen, we'll be a Constitutional Federal Republic too.
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Shofercia
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Shofercia » Sun Dec 16, 2018 5:49 pm

Atheris wrote:
Shofercia wrote:
Switzerland has both. Check it out.

damn, Switzerland looks hella cool

too bad i'm a supporter of gun restrictions (not a total ban, don't get me wrong) though


Switzerland also has decent mental healthcare, so they don't have mass shootings that aren't "politically inspired" by local idiots: https://www.businessinsider.com/switzer ... ths-2018-2

Switzerland has a stunningly high rate of gun ownership — here's why it doesn't have mass shootings...

Switzerland hasn't had a mass shooting since 2001, when a man stormed the local parliament in Zug, killing 14 people and then himself. The country has about 2 million privately owned guns in a nation of 8.3 million people. In 2016, the country had 47 attempted homicides with firearms. The country's overall murder rate is near zero...

Unlike the US, Switzerland has mandatory military service for men. All men between the ages of 18 and 34 deemed "fit for service" are given a pistol or a rifle and trained. After they've finished their service, the men can typically buy and keep their service weapons, but they have to get a permit for them. In recent years, the Swiss government has voted to reduce the size of the country's armed forces.


Lots of guns + high quality training + decent mental healthcare program = no apolitical mass shootings, and maybe one political mass shooting in a decade; it also prevents numerous murders and rapes.
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