NationStates

Conserative Morality wrote:There's no solid proof that Hitler ordered the Holocaust.

Reikoku wrote:Actually sort of surprised. Richard Spencer was never the cream of the moral crop (to put it mildly) but I never suspected that he was an abusive husband. Hope his ex-wife manages to get the emotional support and therapy she needs.

More jumping to conclusions. Awesome.

Forget 'evidence', who needs it? Hey, Trump set my house on fire - somebody arrest him! I said it so it must be true, right?

Ifreann wrote:

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:
Yeah, that's the problem. You can just up and decide he's guilty regardless of whether he is or not, and then go around telling people he is. Someone will just up and believe it without fact-checking first and then go off to tell other people the same, and so on, and so on, and so on. It's called 'spreading misinformation' and it's pretty fucking dangerous because all it takes is for one would-be "hero" to try and take "justice" into his own hands.

Spencer's been punched in the face before, I'm sure he can take another.

I was thinking of something far less grade school.

Maybe in comics.

Uh, no, it happens literally all the time in real life. I'll admit: usually it's when someone is accused of a sex crime or hate crime, but that doesn't mean they're the only ones. I've seen stories about how someone's entire life was destroyed - or even taken - just because of a false accusation. It very much fucking happens.

What a dick.

Napkiraly wrote:

Kowani wrote:And no one was surprised.

I’m actually more surprised that a Neo-Nazi got married. Or, more accurately, to anyone who wasn’t one of them. It’s not like it’s a double life of his that he’s hiding, it’s pretty open. Makes you wonder about the opinions of his wife.

And if she’s not a closet Neo-Nazi, than what the heck lady? You always hear “Don’t let political opinions influence a relationship!”, but you gotta draw a fuckin’ line.

IIRC she's a Dugin fan and translates Dugin's writing's into English.

The real crime here is that Dugin has fans.

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:More jumping to conclusions. Awesome.

Forget 'evidence', who needs it? Hey, Trump set my house on fire - somebody arrest him! I said it so it must be true, right?

If my opinion on an internet forum was enough to get heads of state arrested, the world would be a much different place.

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:

Ifreann wrote:Spencer's been punched in the face before, I'm sure he can take another.

I was thinking of something far less grade school.

Oh yeah. Someone's gonna hunt Richard Spencer down and murder him, not over the Nazi shit, but because he abused his wife. Totally.

Maybe in comics.

Uh, no, it happens literally all the time in real life. I'll admit: usually it's when someone is accused of a sex crime or hate crime, but that doesn't mean they're the only ones. I've seen stories about how someone's entire life was destroyed - or even taken - just because of a false accusation. It very much fucking happens.

Richard Spencer is already a Nazi who got punched in the face in the street. People cannot possibly think less of him.

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:

Conserative Morality wrote:There's no solid proof that Hitler ordered the Holocaust.

Have you proof to the contrary? I am sure the scholarly debate over functionalism vs. intentionalism would love to hear this new evidence you have that could clear this whole thing up!

Fact is, though few people have any doubt of Hitler's guilt regarding the Holocaust, and rightly so, it likely wouldn't stand up in a fair court of law. Hell, in the Nuremburg trials, about as far from fair as you can get, plenty of high-ranking Nazis managed to bullshit their way out of "beyond a reasonable doubt" and avoid the noose they so rightly deserved.

"Beyond a reasonable doubt" is a legal function to prevent innocents from being punished, not a moral precept.

Reikoku wrote:

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:More jumping to conclusions. Awesome.

Forget 'evidence', who needs it? Hey, Trump set my house on fire - somebody arrest him! I said it so it must be true, right?

If my opinion on an internet forum was enough to get heads of state arrested, the world would be a much different place.

It'd be a scarier place.

Ifreann wrote:

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:
I was thinking of something far less grade school.

Oh yeah. Someone's gonna hunt Richard Spencer down and murder him, not over the Nazi shit, but because he abused his wife. Totally.

You'd be surprised. Some people are fucking nuts and make no sense.

Richard Spencer is already a Nazi who got punched in the face in the street. People cannot possibly think less of him.

I think you seriously underestimate how bizarre, petty, and fickle human beings can be.

Conserative Morality wrote:

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:

Have you proof to the contrary? I am sure the scholarly debate over functionalism vs. intentionalism would love to hear this new evidence you have that could clear this whole thing up!

Fact is, though few people have any doubt of Hitler's guilt regarding the Holocaust, and rightly so, it likely wouldn't stand up in a fair court of law. Hell, in the Nuremburg trials, about as far from fair as you can get, plenty of high-ranking Nazis managed to bullshit their way out of "beyond a reasonable doubt" and avoid the noose they so rightly deserved.

"Beyond a reasonable doubt" is a legal function to prevent innocents from being punished, not a moral precept.

The Nuremburg Trials were a mess. I highly doubt that, considering all the evidence of Nazi war crimes that were collected, that Hitler could go through a fair trial and win. His underlings, maybe, but not him or his inner circle. Honestly, considering the way he was near the end, he would have fucking owned up to it all and proudly proclaimed he did it in the name of Germany in order to be a martyr of some kind.

Fortunately he was a coward, so no need to worry about that.

Conserative Morality wrote:

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:

Have you proof to the contrary? I am sure the scholarly debate over functionalism vs. intentionalism would love to hear this new evidence you have that could clear this whole thing up!

Fact is, though few people have any doubt of Hitler's guilt regarding the Holocaust, and rightly so, it likely wouldn't stand up in a fair court of law. Hell, in the Nuremburg trials, about as far from fair as you can get, plenty of high-ranking Nazis managed to bullshit their way out of "beyond a reasonable doubt" and avoid the noose they so rightly deserved.

"Beyond a reasonable doubt" is a legal function to prevent innocents from being punished, not a moral precept.

You know I actually didn't know about the 'no written order' thing. That's pretty damn interesting.

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:The Nuremburg Trials were a mess.

They were a mess in no small part because of the application of ex post facto laws and an implicit presumption of guilt for the higher-ups. All necessary considering the circumstances to 'tighten the noose', so to speak dohohoho

I highly doubt that, considering all the evidence of Nazi war crimes that were collected, that Hitler could go through a fair trial and win. His underlings, maybe, but not him or his inner circle.

Many in his inner circle escaped the justice of the noose, m8. Hitler had a lot that would have sent him to the noose even in a fair trial, but regarding the Holocaust alone, in a truly fair, impartial trial, operating on the principle of innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt? All he'd need was a lawyer than wasn't completely incompetent.

Len Hyet wrote:You know I actually didn't know about the 'no written order' thing. That's pretty damn interesting.

Aye, it's a big debate whether Hitler et co knew that if it got traced directly back to them they'd be megascrewed, or if it just developed organically out of the massive totalitarian hate machine the Nazis ran and called a country.

This whole forum is just so ironic because not only is Richard Spencer innocent until proven guilty, the migrant grooming gangs in the UK go free because of their rape of young girls who have been found guilty.

https://metro.co.uk/2018/10/20/huddersf ... d-8059219/

We need to start seeing the bigger picture.

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:

Reikoku wrote:
If my opinion on an internet forum was enough to get heads of state arrested, the world would be a much different place.

It'd be a scarier place.

Ifreann wrote:Oh yeah. Someone's gonna hunt Richard Spencer down and murder him, not over the Nazi shit, but because he abused his wife. Totally.

You'd be surprised. Some people are fucking nuts and make no sense.

Richard Spencer is already a Nazi who got punched in the face in the street. People cannot possibly think less of him.

I think you seriously underestimate how bizarre, petty, and fickle human beings can be.

Nah.

Kustonia wrote:This whole forum is just so ironic because not only is Richard Spencer innocent until proven guilty, the migrant grooming gangs in the UK go free because of their rape of young girls who have been found guilty.

https://metro.co.uk/2018/10/20/huddersf ... d-8059219/

We need to start seeing the bigger picture.

Talk about a completely irrelevant whataboutism.

Make a thread for that if you wanna talk about it so much.

Kustonia wrote:This whole forum is just so ironic because not only is Richard Spencer innocent until proven guilty, the migrant grooming gangs in the UK go free because of their rape of young girls who have been found guilty.

https://metro.co.uk/2018/10/20/huddersf ... d-8059219/

We need to start seeing the bigger picture.

The guilty people went free?

Fartsniffage wrote:

Kustonia wrote:This whole forum is just so ironic because not only is Richard Spencer innocent until proven guilty, the migrant grooming gangs in the UK go free because of their rape of young girls who have been found guilty.

https://metro.co.uk/2018/10/20/huddersf ... d-8059219/

We need to start seeing the bigger picture.

The guilty people went free?

He's talking out of his ass. The article literally says nothing of the sort.

Torrocca wrote:

Fartsniffage wrote:
The guilty people went free?

He's talking out of his ass. The article literally says nothing of the sort.

I know. It's been a pretty big story in the UK.

Fartsniffage wrote:

Torrocca wrote:
He's talking out of his ass. The article literally says nothing of the sort.

I know. It's been a pretty big story in the UK.

Shit, I forgot you're British for a second there.

Conserative Morality wrote:

Len Hyet wrote:You know I actually didn't know about the 'no written order' thing. That's pretty damn interesting.

Aye, it's a big debate whether Hitler et co knew that if it got traced directly back to them they'd be megascrewed, or if it just developed organically out of the massive totalitarian hate machine the Nazis ran and called a country.

Huh. If I had to guess, both. The Nazis had this weird combination of excellent record keeping on certain things, and absolute garbage record keeping on other things.

Fartsniffage wrote:

Kustonia wrote:This whole forum is just so ironic because not only is Richard Spencer innocent until proven guilty, the migrant grooming gangs in the UK go free because of their rape of young girls who have been found guilty.

https://metro.co.uk/2018/10/20/huddersf ... d-8059219/

We need to start seeing the bigger picture.

The guilty people went free?

Yes, and they were deported afterward. They're just going to come back and continue what they were doing. I'm not stupid.

Len Hyet wrote:

Conserative Morality wrote:Aye, it's a big debate whether Hitler et co knew that if it got traced directly back to them they'd be megascrewed, or if it just developed organically out of the massive totalitarian hate machine the Nazis ran and called a country.

Huh. If I had to guess, both. The Nazis had this weird combination of excellent record keeping on certain things, and absolute garbage record keeping on other things.

Hitler really liked having his orders be an oral-only type of deal.

Kustonia wrote:

Fartsniffage wrote:
The guilty people went free?

Yes, and they were deported afterward. They're just going to come back and continue what they were doing. I'm not stupid.

Give proof. Of all of that.

Kustonia wrote:

Fartsniffage wrote:
The guilty people went free?

Yes, and they were deported afterward. They're just going to come back and continue what they were doing. I'm not stupid.

They were found guilty 5 days ago. You're saying they served their multiyear sentences and got deported that quickly?

Fartsniffage wrote:

Kustonia wrote:
Yes, and they were deported afterward. They're just going to come back and continue what they were doing. I'm not stupid.

They were found guilty 5 days ago. You're saying they served their multiyear sentences and got deported that quickly?

They smuggled a timey-wimey device into prison, duh.

Torrocca wrote:

Kustonia wrote:
Yes, and they were deported afterward. They're just going to come back and continue what they were doing. I'm not stupid.

Give proof. Of all of that.

Migrants Deported to Pakistan

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... o-pakistan

Migration and Crime Statistics Amongst Migrants

https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/7470 ... ants-crime