NATION

PASSWORD

US Imperial Military Dilemma

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

What do you do?

1. Carry out your orders, leave completely intact
40
54%
2. Refuse to carry out your orders and become a cripple
9
12%
3. Suicide by soldiers (aka go down fighting)
25
34%
 
Total votes : 74

User avatar
Wallenburg
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 22872
Founded: Jan 30, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Wallenburg » Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:36 pm

I would reveal to the special forces guarding Kennedy that, despite the propaganda put out by his dynasty, we had not truly won the war with Russia, and show them the undeniable evidence that it is America that has been invaded, that is on its last legs as an imperialist America crumbles under the weight of expeditionary forces from the rest of the Western world. Kennedy and his forefathers have not protected American liberty. No, when they suspended the elections in 2028, they were seizing control for themselves. They refused to be defeated by their ideological opponents. Following year after year of political purges, a devastating global recession brought about by American protectionism, and threats from an impoverished but ever more militaristic United States, the free world cut its ties with America and locked arms in defense of democracy. The invasion of Canada was the last straw, and since then Europe and a newly democratic China have struggled forward against the American Empire, liberating county after county, city after city. Kennedy's lies can be tolerated no more. The special forces, still struggling to believe what they have seen and heard, demand an explanation from Kennedy. He stammers, but knows not that the 100 unarmed prisoners have gathered and come forward. Now, under the harsh lights flooding the prison hallway, the guards can see their faces. They are the entire 2031 Senate, purged when Kennedy's dynasty assumed total legislative control. It is too much, and the guards turn their weapons from me to Kennedy. Terror flashes only briefly across Kennedy's eyes before he crumples to the ground. Dozens of bullets riddle him on his way to the floor. The guards join me and together we liberate the entire prison, cell by cell. Kennedy's lies are revealed to the people, and they rise up against their oppressive masters. A red, white, and blue flag rises over the Capitol building for the first time in over a decade. From Washington an emergency government broadcasts the fall of the Empire, and the return of the federal republic.
While she had no regrets about throwing the lever to douse her husband's mistress in molten gold, Blanche did feel a pang of conscience for the innocent bystanders whose proximity had caused them to suffer gilt by association.

King of Snark, Real Piece of Work, Metabolizer of Oxygen, Old Man from The East Pacific, by the Malevolence of Her Infinite Terribleness Catherine Gratwick the Sole and True Claimant to the Bears Armed Vacancy, Protector of the Realm

User avatar
Kannap
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 67469
Founded: May 07, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kannap » Sat Oct 13, 2018 5:55 pm

Where's the option for conscientious objection instead of getting drafted and then being imprisoned or put to death for treason while still in the United States?
Luna Amore wrote:Please remember to attend the ritualistic burning of Kannap for heresy
T H E M O U N T A I N S A R E C A L L I N G A N D I M U S T G O
G A Y S I N C E 1 9 9 7
.::The List of National Sports::.
27 years old, gay demisexual, they/them agnostic, North Carolinian. Pumpkin Spice everything.
TET's resident red panda
Red Panda Network
Jill Stein 2024

User avatar
Ethel mermania
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 129555
Founded: Aug 20, 2010
Father Knows Best State

Postby Ethel mermania » Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:58 pm

Kannap wrote:Where's the option for conscientious objection instead of getting drafted and then being imprisoned or put to death for treason while still in the United States?

Robo Kennedy took it away
https://www.hvst.com/posts/the-clash-of ... s-wl2TQBpY

The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion … but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.
--S. Huntington

The most fundamental problem of politics is not the control of wickedness but the limitation of righteousness. 

--H. Kissenger

User avatar
Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76676
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Conserative Morality » Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:09 pm

What if I don't want to go home. =^^^^^^)

Careful my edge is off the charts
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
Caesar and Imperator of RWDT
Got a blog up again. || An NS Writing Discussion

User avatar
Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76676
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Conserative Morality » Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:10 pm

Uxupox wrote:
The Holy Therns wrote:
He's twenty feet tall, his hands are gatling guns, his eyes are lasers and his mouth shoots tyranny.


his mouth shoots liberty.

A hypercharismatic telepathical knight
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
Caesar and Imperator of RWDT
Got a blog up again. || An NS Writing Discussion

User avatar
Ithreland
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 142
Founded: Jul 11, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Ithreland » Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:16 pm

Realistically, I'd probably freeze up and get #2'd.
If I recall tropes in the moment, I'll go for #3. #2 is rife with potential Obi-Wan-ing and if I'm gonna die, I'm not going out as Haymitch.
The government is elected from pools of experts in whichever fields are necessary, with polarizing issues having a minimum quotient for political balance (like abortion rights would be decided by a mix of pro-choice/pro-life expert advocates, for example).

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(") This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination
♂♀Copy and Paste this in your sig if you know there are 2 genders and didn't fail biology♂♀
-_qCopy and paste this in your sig if your Capitalist-_q
A 15.83 civilization, according to this index.
My 8values score.

User avatar
Rio Cana
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10825
Founded: Dec 21, 2005
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Rio Cana » Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:46 pm

The following two possible solutions.
1. When you see that things have become very immoral then object due to religious values. But that could get you into trouble if they could care less about religion.

2. When they are not looking head for China.
Last edited by Rio Cana on Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
National Information
Empire of Rio Cana has been refounded.
We went from Empire to Peoples Republic to two divided Republics one called Marina to back to an Empire. And now a Republic under a military General. Our Popular Music
Our National Love SongOur Military Forces
Formerly appointed twice Minister of Defense and once Minister of Foreign Affairs for South America Region.

User avatar
Loben
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1996
Founded: Sep 27, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Loben » Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:47 pm

Orders are orders, not my call who makes em.

User avatar
Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 39286
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:02 pm

Loben wrote:Orders are orders, not my call who makes em.


prisoners: “wait! No! Don’t!”

You (with a blank look): “just following orders”

(*opens fire)

User avatar
Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 39286
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:17 pm

Renolia wrote:This seems like an overly long hypothetical when all it essentially is, is just a question of "Would you obey orders even if it meant the killing of 100 unarmed prisoners, and refusal to do so would result in your arms and legs being broken?"


What a nice simple summary

=)

User avatar
Loben
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1996
Founded: Sep 27, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Loben » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:19 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Loben wrote:Orders are orders, not my call who makes em.


prisoners: “wait! No! Don’t!”

You (with a blank look): “just following orders”

(*opens fire)


yep.

User avatar
Herador
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8902
Founded: Mar 08, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Herador » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:21 pm

Loben wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
prisoners: “wait! No! Don’t!”

You (with a blank look): “just following orders”

(*opens fire)


yep.

I think someone tried that after World War 2. Can't recall how it went right now, probably well though.
Vaguely a pessimist, certainly an absurdist, unironically an antinatalist.

User avatar
Kowani
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44957
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:28 pm

Wallenburg wrote:I would reveal to the special forces guarding Kennedy that, despite the propaganda put out by his dynasty, we had not truly won the war with Russia, and show them the undeniable evidence that it is America that has been invaded, that is on its last legs as an imperialist America crumbles under the weight of expeditionary forces from the rest of the Western world. Kennedy and his forefathers have not protected American liberty. No, when they suspended the elections in 2028, they were seizing control for themselves. They refused to be defeated by their ideological opponents. Following year after year of political purges, a devastating global recession brought about by American protectionism, and threats from an impoverished but ever more militaristic United States, the free world cut its ties with America and locked arms in defense of democracy. The invasion of Canada was the last straw, and since then Europe and a newly democratic China have struggled forward against the American Empire, liberating county after county, city after city. Kennedy's lies can be tolerated no more. The special forces, still struggling to believe what they have seen and heard, demand an explanation from Kennedy. He stammers, but knows not that the 100 unarmed prisoners have gathered and come forward. Now, under the harsh lights flooding the prison hallway, the guards can see their faces. They are the entire 2031 Senate, purged when Kennedy's dynasty assumed total legislative control. It is too much, and the guards turn their weapons from me to Kennedy. Terror flashes only briefly across Kennedy's eyes before he crumples to the ground. Dozens of bullets riddle him on his way to the floor. The guards join me and together we liberate the entire prison, cell by cell. Kennedy's lies are revealed to the people, and they rise up against their oppressive masters. A red, white, and blue flag rises over the Capitol building for the first time in over a decade. From Washington an emergency government broadcasts the fall of the Empire, and the return of the federal republic.

Emphasis mine.
Ya know, that's the least believable part of your scenario.
American History and Historiography; Political and Labour History, Urbanism, Political Parties, Congressional Procedure, Elections.

Servant of The Democracy since 1896.


Historian, of sorts.

Effortposts can be found here!

User avatar
Kowani
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44957
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:34 pm

Loben wrote:Orders are orders, not my call who makes em.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuremberg_trials
American History and Historiography; Political and Labour History, Urbanism, Political Parties, Congressional Procedure, Elections.

Servant of The Democracy since 1896.


Historian, of sorts.

Effortposts can be found here!

User avatar
Loben
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1996
Founded: Sep 27, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Loben » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:35 pm

Herador wrote:
Loben wrote:
yep.

I think someone tried that after World War 2. Can't recall how it went right now, probably well though.


they lost.

User avatar
Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 39286
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:41 pm

Valrifell wrote:Shoot Kennedy


If it was a movie, this is how it might go down.

You: "I... I can't..." (lowers machine gun slightly)

Kennedy walks up to you and puts a hand on your shoulder. "Now now Valrifell, you can do it. Kill them. Just do that and start a new life."

You: ...

Kennedy smiles: It would be the wise thing to do my friend.

You: You... you're not my friend.

You suddenly turn around, the tip of the machine-gun knocks Kennedy back slightly. You open fire as Kennedy is killed by a hail of bullets.

The Special Forces troops open fire on you; one of these soldiers is played by Boyd Holbrook.

You scream out as you are shot over and over (Sonny Corleone style)... then you fall down dead next to Kennedy.

User avatar
Wallenburg
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 22872
Founded: Jan 30, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Wallenburg » Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:28 pm

Kowani wrote:
Wallenburg wrote:I would reveal to the special forces guarding Kennedy that, despite the propaganda put out by his dynasty, we had not truly won the war with Russia, and show them the undeniable evidence that it is America that has been invaded, that is on its last legs as an imperialist America crumbles under the weight of expeditionary forces from the rest of the Western world. Kennedy and his forefathers have not protected American liberty. No, when they suspended the elections in 2028, they were seizing control for themselves. They refused to be defeated by their ideological opponents. Following year after year of political purges, a devastating global recession brought about by American protectionism, and threats from an impoverished but ever more militaristic United States, the free world cut its ties with America and locked arms in defense of democracy. The invasion of Canada was the last straw, and since then Europe and a newly democratic China have struggled forward against the American Empire, liberating county after county, city after city. Kennedy's lies can be tolerated no more. The special forces, still struggling to believe what they have seen and heard, demand an explanation from Kennedy. He stammers, but knows not that the 100 unarmed prisoners have gathered and come forward. Now, under the harsh lights flooding the prison hallway, the guards can see their faces. They are the entire 2031 Senate, purged when Kennedy's dynasty assumed total legislative control. It is too much, and the guards turn their weapons from me to Kennedy. Terror flashes only briefly across Kennedy's eyes before he crumples to the ground. Dozens of bullets riddle him on his way to the floor. The guards join me and together we liberate the entire prison, cell by cell. Kennedy's lies are revealed to the people, and they rise up against their oppressive masters. A red, white, and blue flag rises over the Capitol building for the first time in over a decade. From Washington an emergency government broadcasts the fall of the Empire, and the return of the federal republic.

Emphasis mine.
Ya know, that's the least believable part of your scenario.

I think the least believable part is that the Kennedy's assume control of the government and go on a fascist worldwide killing spree, and nobody back home bats an eye.
While she had no regrets about throwing the lever to douse her husband's mistress in molten gold, Blanche did feel a pang of conscience for the innocent bystanders whose proximity had caused them to suffer gilt by association.

King of Snark, Real Piece of Work, Metabolizer of Oxygen, Old Man from The East Pacific, by the Malevolence of Her Infinite Terribleness Catherine Gratwick the Sole and True Claimant to the Bears Armed Vacancy, Protector of the Realm

User avatar
Collatis
Minister
 
Posts: 2702
Founded: Aug 10, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Collatis » Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:36 pm

I think it’s in my child’s best interest to be raised by the POTUS.

Social Democrat | Humanist | Progressive | Internationalist | New Dealer

PRO: social democracy, internationalism, progressivism, democracy,
republicanism, human rights, democratic socialism, Keynesianism,
EU, NATO, two-state solution, Democratic Party, Bernie Sanders
CON: conservatism, authoritarianism, totalitarianism, neoliberalism,
death penalty, Marxism-Leninism, laissez faire, reaction, fascism,
antisemitism, isolationism, Republican Party, Donald Trump


User avatar
Dynastic Systems of Salir
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 54
Founded: Sep 27, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Dynastic Systems of Salir » Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:41 pm

I want to say I’d rather go down by suicide by soldier.
But I know if I’m in that situation in real life I’m gonna surprise myself and kill the prisoners in record time because I wanted to live.
FT puppet of Nantoraka

All my images were made by me.
Yes, that means I use Spore Creatures for my dudes. Fight me.

User avatar
Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 39286
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:47 pm

Wallenburg wrote:
Kowani wrote:Emphasis mine.
Ya know, that's the least believable part of your scenario.

I think the least believable part is that the Kennedy's assume control of the government and go on a fascist worldwide killing spree, and nobody back home bats an eye.


Wow

Lots of people are going to do poorly on reading comp in those standardized tests...

Look back at the op. There is no mention of the kennedies running the government, just that a Kennedy runs that secret police unit.

There’s no mention of a Kennedy coup. You’re assuming a lot.

User avatar
Wallenburg
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 22872
Founded: Jan 30, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Wallenburg » Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:58 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Wallenburg wrote:I think the least believable part is that the Kennedy's assume control of the government and go on a fascist worldwide killing spree, and nobody back home bats an eye.


Wow

Lots of people are going to do poorly on reading comp in those standardized tests...

Look back at the op. There is no mention of the kennedies running the government, just that a Kennedy runs that secret police unit.

There’s no mention of a Kennedy coup. You’re assuming a lot.

I must have skimmed over that part. I don't bother taking threads like these too seriously.
While she had no regrets about throwing the lever to douse her husband's mistress in molten gold, Blanche did feel a pang of conscience for the innocent bystanders whose proximity had caused them to suffer gilt by association.

King of Snark, Real Piece of Work, Metabolizer of Oxygen, Old Man from The East Pacific, by the Malevolence of Her Infinite Terribleness Catherine Gratwick the Sole and True Claimant to the Bears Armed Vacancy, Protector of the Realm

User avatar
Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 39286
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sat Oct 13, 2018 10:09 pm

Wallenburg wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
Wow

Lots of people are going to do poorly on reading comp in those standardized tests...

Look back at the op. There is no mention of the kennedies running the government, just that a Kennedy runs that secret police unit.

There’s no mention of a Kennedy coup. You’re assuming a lot.

I must have skimmed over that part. I don't bother taking threads like these too seriously.


I see...

User avatar
Heloin
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 26091
Founded: Mar 30, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Heloin » Sat Oct 13, 2018 11:43 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Loben wrote:Orders are orders, not my call who makes em.


prisoners: “wait! No! Don’t!”

You (with a blank look): “just following orders”

(*opens fire)

Ve vere only obeying orders.

User avatar
NeuPolska
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9184
Founded: Jun 09, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby NeuPolska » Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:06 am

Why would I be unlucky to be drafted into the Imperial American army

That sounds like a pretty good gig can I be an officer please

Please, call me POLSKA
U.S. Army Enlisted
Kar-Esseria wrote:Who is that and are they female because if not then they can go make love to their hand.
Impaled Nazarene wrote:Go home Polska wins NS.
United Mongol Hordes wrote:Polska isn't exactly the nicest guy in the world
Impaled Nazarene wrote:Hurd you miss the point more than Polska misses Poland.
Rhodesialund wrote:when you have Charlie ten feet away or something operating operationally.
Nirvash Type TheEND wrote:Gayla is living in 1985 but these guys are already in 1916

User avatar
Dahon
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5892
Founded: Nov 11, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Dahon » Sun Oct 14, 2018 4:07 am

Join the prisoners and die alongside them. When the world is this absurd, why cling on to it?
Authoritarianism kills all. Never forget that.

-5.5/-7.44

al-Ibramiyah (inactive; under research)
Moscareinas (inactive)
Trumpisslavia (inactive)
Dahon the Alternative (inactive; under research)
Our Heavenly Dwarf (Forum 7)

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Arcturus Novus, Bethesda Scamville, Cyptopir, Emotional Support Crocodile, Floofybit, Hidrandia, Katinea, Plan Neonie, Republics of the Solar Union, Singaporen Empire

Advertisement

Remove ads