Chicago Police Officer Convicted of Murder

[San Lumen]

I don't actually disagree about the middle ground.

My overall take on the matter would be than Van Dyke overreacted-but the reaction was based on justifiable context.

Manslaughter would have been appropriate, I think. /Notalawyer

What's the difference?

[Durzan]

I don't actually disagree about the middle ground.

My overall take on the matter would be than Van Dyke overreacted-but the reaction was based on justifiable context.

Manslaughter would have been appropriate, I think. /Notalawyer

Manslaughter (Killing the Person), Use of Excessive Force (Multiple Gunshot wounds), and a single charge of Battery (shooting while the guy was down) are the only charges that should've been brought up.

Under the circumstances, the only charges that should've even had a chance of going through would be Excessive Use of Force and possibly manslaughter. 2nd degree murder and battery for every single bullet fired is a gross injustice for the officer. Honestly, this man should've been given a light sentence at worst and been completely acquitted at best, given the circumstances described here. That being said, #NotALawyer.

[San Lumen]

Manslaughter would have been appropriate, I think. /Notalawyer

Manslaughter (Killing the Person), Use of Excessive Force (Multiple Gunshot wounds), and a single charge of Battery (shooting while the guy was down) are the only charges that should've been brought up.

Under the circumstances, the only charges that should've even had a chance of going through would be Excessive Use of Force and possibly manslaughter. 2nd degree murder and battery for every single bullet fired is a gross injustice for the officer. Honestly, this man should've been given a light sentence at worst and been completely acquitted at best, given the circumstances described here. That being said, #NotALawyer.

Why should he have been acquitted?

[Unstoppable Empire of Doom]

It is hardly rare that police are held accountable for their actions. It is often misconstrued as such.

Once, you get off of CNN, and start thinking for yourself and stop listening to the Anti-Police propaganda the left is pushing, you will find the opposite.

?

I think you misread my post. I am saying Police are typically held accountable when they commit serious crimes such as murder.

[Unstoppable Empire of Doom]

It is hardly rare that police are held accountable for their actions. It is often misconstrued as such.

It sure doesnt seem like they are.

Of course it doesn't. The news doesn't follow up with nearly as much coverage during and after the trials. Basically it looks like this on TV or in a newspaper -

COP MURDERS MAN (day 1)

Cop Being Investigated (day 3)

Cop put on unpaid suspension (2 weeks)

cop brought up on charges (2 months)

cop found guilty (2 years)

cop now on death row (3 years)

cop was executed today (12 years later....)

This takes time and in a 24 hour news cycle they often find something more entertaining to show. This is why I do not watch any mainstream news sources anymore.

[Napkiraly]

Good.

[Napkiraly]

His name was Lachlan and he didn't rush at the officer with the knife. there was no reason whatsoever to shoot him. and the officers name was Jason.

he had a knife......

He was also walking away and reports from other officers saying that they did not see the need to use force. There are also other non-lethal ways to detain a suspect.

[Dreshand]

he had a knife......

He was also walking away and reports from other officers saying that they did not see the need to use force. There are also other non-lethal ways to detain a suspect.

Like? You could of course just handcuff the man with a knife. Great solution if you have a death wish.
Maybe a taser or pepper spray? As someone said earlier he had none of them.
Walk away maybe? Or talk him down? Someone high on PCP, holding a knife with civilian lives potential in threat isn't really someone you should do either to

[Napkiraly]

Maybe a taser or pepper spray? As someone said earlier he had none of them.

This is what the first responding officers had requested and were waiting for. In the meantime they were observing him to make sure he didn't become a greater threat.

Walk away maybe? Or talk him down? Someone high on PCP, holding a knife with civilian lives potential in threat isn't really someone you should do either to

No civilians were in immediate danger. Hence why the first responding officers stated they did not believe lethal force was necessary.

Jason Van Dyke is a trigger happy pussy, what can I say.

[Dreshand]

Maybe a taser or pepper spray? As someone said earlier he had none of them.

This is what the first responding officers had requested and were waiting for. In the meantime they were observing him to make sure he didn't become a greater threat.

Walk away maybe? Or talk him down? Someone high on PCP, holding a knife with civilian lives potential in threat isn't really someone you should do either to

No civilians were in immediate danger. Hence why the first responding officers stated they did not believe lethal force was necessary.

Jason Van Dyke is a trigger happy pussy, what can I say.

That... actually makes sense, the guy was quite close though but for all the other points I have to say you seem in the right here

[Napkiraly]

This is what the first responding officers had requested and were waiting for. In the meantime they were observing him to make sure he didn't become a greater threat.
No civilians were in immediate danger. Hence why the first responding officers stated they did not believe lethal force was necessary.

Jason Van Dyke is a trigger happy pussy, what can I say.

That... actually makes sense, the guy was quite close though but for all the other points I have to say you seem in the right here

Him being close is his own fault. By his own admission he started moving towards McDonald who was still moving away from Van Dyke.

[Dreshand]

That... actually makes sense, the guy was quite close though but for all the other points I have to say you seem in the right here

Him being close is his own fault. By his own admission he started moving towards McDonald who was still moving away from Van Dyke.

Alright then, you've convinced me.
This is a monumental moment for the internet

[San Lumen]

That... actually makes sense, the guy was quite close though but for all the other points I have to say you seem in the right here

Him being close is his own fault. By his own admission he started moving towards McDonald who was still moving away from Van Dyke.

You agree with the verdict then?

[Napkiraly]

Him being close is his own fault. By his own admission he started moving towards McDonald who was still moving away from Van Dyke.

You agree with the verdict then?

I've already stated such. I also think me calling Van Dyke a trigger happy pussy further clarifies matters.

[Bombadil]

The problem is the way in which the law is applied when it comes to police officers, I think it's the issue with 'stand your ground', that is the test is not whether a reasonable person would think there's a threat, nor can you assess after the fact whether it was a threat or not. The test is whether the police thought there was a threat at the time and, really, that mostly depends on what the police says. If they say they felt under threat that is about all the evidence required.

It's not even he said/she said, it's just 'he said' and because there's no real way to prove the state of mind of someone in that moment then the only evidence is 'what he said he felt'.

[Ausinia]

do you honesty believe police officers can do no wrong? It was perfectly acceptable to shoot him sixteen times even after he was on the ground? Are you freaking serious?

He could have stood back and stabbed if not shot enough. The officer didn’t know whether or not the criminal was on hard drugs/major painkillers.

And understandably, the officer was scared and reasonably overreacted a little.

I personally don’t believe that, for any circumstance, taking ones life, no matter how bad or messed up it was, should not be considered ‘overreacted a little’

[Petrasylvania]

His name was Lachlan and he didn't rush at the officer with the knife. there was no reason whatsoever to shoot him. and the officers name was Jason.

he had a knife......

Clearly the dash cam was lying on behalf of Black Lives Matter.

[Nui-ta]

He should have been given a taser. Any cop who gets to have a gun also needs a taser, because not every situation can be solved with a gun.

This is regrettable on all counts. McDonald didn't need to die, and Van Dyke didn't need to go through this.

[Isilanka]

He should have been given a taser. Any cop who gets to have a gun also needs a taser, because not every situation can be solved with a gun.

This is regrettable on all counts. McDonald didn't need to die, and Van Dyke didn't need to go through this.

TBF tasers aren't ideal either. They can kill if badly used. Besides there's always the risk that, because they're non-lethal weapons (in theory) police officers start using them too liberally.

[Ifreann]

Seems like justice was served, to me. He was absolutely wrong to shoot the kid sixteen fucking times.

I'll ask the same question-the man with a knife who you just shot seems to be getting up. He is close enough that, he can charge and stab you. You don't have a taser. You're a police officer, you can't retreat. What do you do?

Police officers can retreat, you know. They do not have any legal duty to protect people or enforce the law.

---

I'll ask the same question-the man with a knife who you just shot seems to be getting up. He is close enough that, he can charge and stab you. You don't have a taser. You're a police officer, you can't retreat. What do you do?

I get your point. I really do. But there is a middle ground between completely unloading and doing nothing. Unlike many others who will respond to this thread, I don't have an anticop bias. He did wrong and deserved to be punished. I will completely agree that charging an individual count of assault for each round was preposterous. That doesn't mean he wasn't criminally culpable, however.

What's preposterous about it?

[Genivaria]

Seems like justice was served, to me. He was absolutely wrong to shoot the kid sixteen fucking times.

I'll ask the same question-the man with a knife who you just shot seems to be getting up. He is close enough that, he can charge and stab you. You don't have a taser. You're a police officer, you can't retreat. What do you do?

So we're doing made up scenarios now?

the man with a knife who you just shot seems to be getting up

The man who was doing nothing and was shot for seemingly no reason?

You're a police officer, you can't retreat

Yes you can.

[Kowani]

I'll ask the same question-the man with a knife who you just shot seems to be getting up. He is close enough that, he can charge and stab you. You don't have a taser. You're a police officer, you can't retreat. What do you do?

So we're doing made up scenarios now?

the man with a knife who you just shot seems to be getting up

The man who was doing nothing and was shot for seemingly no reason?

You're a police officer, you can't retreat

Yes you can.

Not by law, there’s a “stand your ground” law where this happens that makes it illegal for police officers to retreat unless, y’know, superior firepower.

[Uxupox]

he had a knife......

Clearly the dash cam was lying on behalf of Black Lives Matter.

what does blm have to do with this case?

[Ifreann]

So we're doing made up scenarios now?

The man who was doing nothing and was shot for seemingly no reason?

Yes you can.

Not by law, there’s a “stand your ground” law where this happens that makes it illegal for police officers to retreat unless, y’know, superior firepower.

Haha, what? That's ridiculous.

[Uxupox]

Not by law, there’s a “stand your ground” law where this happens that makes it illegal for police officers to retreat unless, y’know, superior firepower.

Haha, what? That's ridiculous.

definately agree with that. it's also just as ridiculous as duty to retreat laws.