LWDT VI: Kropotkin's Bread Dead Redemption.

[The South Falls]

Young soviet got it bad cuz I'm red

He did kill millions, there's no going around that.

Under his rule millions of people died yes, but not as a result of him that's what I mean.

As a result of his policies, yea.

Who says he killed people with his bare hands?


(Other than his second wife)

[Kaggeceria]

Stalin's Genocides



And I responded to that question already. You want me to repeat what I said? I never made that claim. I was referring to Stalinists, not to all Marxist-Leninists.

De-Kulakisation cannot be considered a genocide, neither can the myth of the Holodomor.

>the myth of the Holodomor

And what would you call The Great Terror?

[Liriena]

Geesh, dude. Denying Stalin's atrocities is not the right move. The right move is proclaiming that you want to beat his high score.

Gonna make Stalin look like an anarchist

That's called Marxism-Leninism-Pinguism.

I'm more of a radical Jeb!ist

[Eodor]

Under his rule millions of people died yes, but not as a result of him that's what I mean.

As a result of his policies, yea.

Who says he killed people with his bare hands?


(Other than his second wife)

Famines in Soviet territory had been happening periodically for centuries, they were pretty much gotten rid of during Stalin's time.

[Dumb Ideologies]

Evil is purely subjective.

As your are a professor you should probably know this, professor.

How post-modern of you.

None can handle the absence of truth and value unveiled by the elite pomowrexual.

[Kaggeceria]

Gonna make Stalin look like an anarchist

That's called Marxism-Leninism-Pinguism.

I'm more of a radical Jeb!ist

[Eodor]

Gonna make Stalin look like an anarchist

That's called Marxism-Leninism-Pinguism.

I'm more of a radical Jeb!ist

Comrade Jeb! for world president

[Liriena]

That's called Marxism-Leninism-Pinguism.

I'm more of a radical Jeb!ist

Comrade Jeb! for world president

Mandatory clapping worldwide!
Building a time machine to kill baby Hitler!
A lifetime supply of guacamole in every home!

[The South Falls]

As a result of his policies, yea.

Who says he killed people with his bare hands?


(Other than his second wife)

Famines in Soviet territory had been happening periodically for centuries, they were pretty much gotten rid of during Stalin's time.

By killing all the people who would have died.

That's called Marxism-Leninism-Pinguism.

I'm more of a radical Jeb!ist

*maximum Jeb intensifies*

[The Multiversal Communist Collective]

Ahh yes, the old Stalin killed 500 gorillion Kulaks with his bare hands meme. Nice one.

Perhaps you could find the descendants of the people who were killed and tell them that.

[The Multiversal Communist Collective]

Under his rule millions of people died yes, but not as a result of him that's what I mean.

Well, you could say the same thing about Hitler. He did not run the gas chambers. The SS officers ran them on his behalf. I am not sure what your point is.

[Kaggeceria]

I just picked up a reference on the fly. Here is another one:

Hitler vs. Stalin: Who Killed More?

Ahh yes, the old Stalin killed 500 gorillion Kulaks with his bare hands meme. Nice one.

This literally sounds like the 6 gorillion meme Neo-Nazis use. You are literally the Stalinist version of a Holocaust-denier.

[Uxupox]

Evil is purely subjective.

As your are a professor you should probably know this, professor.

How post-modern of you.

He is not wrong. People have different individualistic values based on their cultural aspect of relativism. A person in India for example might see the expression feminism as detrimental to society while in France a person might believe the complete opposite.

[Proctopeo]

Evil is purely subjective.

As your are a professor you should probably know this, professor.

How post-modern of you.

I prefer the "individual morality exists and is valid, but there are some things that are indeed morally wrong universally, even if some people happen disagree" stance. Appeals to both the concept of the individual and to the "genocide is bad" angle.

[Uxupox]

As a result of his policies, yea.

Who says he killed people with his bare hands?


(Other than his second wife)

Famines in Soviet territory had been happening periodically for centuries, they were pretty much gotten rid of during Stalin's time.

no.

[The South Falls]

Famines in Soviet territory had been happening periodically for centuries, they were pretty much gotten rid of during Stalin's time.

no.

Can't have any famines if everyone is dead.

[Northeast American Federation]

(Image)

no.

Can't have any famines if everyone is dead.

That's one way to achieve full communism. Everyone is equal if everyone starved to death.

[The Multiversal Communist Collective]

That's one way to achieve full communism. Everyone is equal if everyone starved to death.

Evidence?

[Nekokuni]

Evil is purely subjective.

As your are a professor you should probably know this, professor.

How post-modern of you.

Moral relativism is a philosophical concept that has been around since the beginning of thought.

[The Multiversal Communist Collective]

Moral relativism is a philosophical concept that has been around since the beginning of thought.

It has, but one of the problems relates to terminology. For instance, I can reject ethnocentrism (which I do), accept cultural relativism (which I do) and reject moral relativism (which I also do). In other words, by rejecting ethnocentrism, I reject that my own culture should provide some universal standard of the good. By accepting cultural relativism, I recognize that different cultures have their own moral codes, values, norms, and customs. However, by rejecting moral relativism, I accept that there is some universal standard of goodness (even if I do not fully understand it). That alternative to moral relativism is called moral realism.

What the PoMos (postmodernists) of the 1970s and 1980s argued is that there is no universal standard of goodness (whether understood or not). PoMos commonly expressed that idea, following Jean-François Lyotard, as a denial of metanarratives or universal truth statements. In other words, to, Lyotard, all truth, including moral truth, is relative. The problem with that view, which is why it has been increasingly rejected, is that moral relativism, and PoMo in general, results in a kind of circular thinking. For instance, if truth is relative, then the statement, truth is relative, must be relative, too. You then end up with nihilism (nothingness).

Therefore, philosophers and theorists, over the few several decades, have been grappling with the subject and trying to come up with successful refutations of moral relativism. There have been many attempts, and some of them contradict one another. Still, most philosophers and social theorists are uncomfortable with the implications of moral relativism.

[Napkiraly]

1. Judging one person by the crimes of another of their ethnicity is pretty much racism. To assert that it was justified or legitimate is ridiculous.
2. How high do the rates have to be to visit punishment on an entire ethnic group?
3. Ethnic cleansing simply means you push people from a particular ethnicity from an area. That's what it is.

1) You are ignoring the context of this. Had the government actually been racist they would have thrown all the deportees in gulags. They did not, and instead just moved them.

2) Again, you are ignoring the context of this. The Red Army did not have the time to go and root out every German collaborator.

3) That’s not what it is typically taken to mean though.

Hello Adolf.

The Soviet Union did not commit genocide during WWII or at any other period.

The Polish Opertaion, Decossackization, arguably the ethnic cleansing of the various Caucasus peoples can be upgraded to genocide, Crimean Tatars.

[Korouse]

Where did this happen? Many people starved and died, but so did people who voluntarily evacuated from the frontline because there was a specific policy of capturing Soviet food supplies and destroying their farms. I've never heard of deliberate and hateful killings happening from all of the academic articles I've read, and I'm pretty sure "burn down barns (or a church) with hundreds of people inside" is a trope regularly ascribed to Nazi-like bad guys in films lol.

This is what I had in mind.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khaibakh_massacre

This whole article seems pretty dubious, and I wouldn't doubt something like this would become a popular point of contention considering the phony war on terror that Putin is waging in Chechnya. I also wouldn't doubt that an NKVD official would lie, but if the entire vertex of this discussion is on Stalin, then we should look at the provisions he typically ordered for minorities during deportation:


"d) To each train of special settlers, the USSR People's Commissariat of Public Health (comrade Miterev) is to assign, within a time frame to be coordinated with the USSR NKVD, one physician and two nurses, as well as an appropriate supply of medicines, and to provide medical and first-aid care to special settlers in transit;"

"e) The USSR People's Commissariat of Trade (comrade Liubimov) will provide all trains carrying special settlers with hot food and boiling water on a daily basis."

"The settlement of the special settlers will occur in state farm communities, existing collective farms, farms affiliated with enterprises, and in factory communities, for employment in agriculture and industry;"

"e) To grant plots of farm land to the newly arrived special settlers and to help them build homes by providing construction materials;"

https://digitalarchive.wilsoncenter.org/document/111000

The Soviet Union had made hundreds of nations before the 30s as apart of their nationalities policy, and that was necessarily done on ethnic lines. The same logic had applied here, only in context of depriving them of their national governance and moving them away to a place where they could work. Most people wouldn't call food/medicine shortages caused by war with the Nazis a "mass murder" on the fault of said government, I don't think they would call the theoretical logic behind granting people nationhood under a multicultural federation would be "fascistic" either. There's more comparison toward imperialist Britain than there is the Nazis, considering quite a lot of the settlers were placed in economically vital regions to work in timber or mining industries post-war.

[Korouse]

Ahh yes, the old Stalin killed 500 gorillion Kulaks with his bare hands meme. Nice one.

This literally sounds like the 6 gorillion meme Neo-Nazis use. You are literally the Stalinist version of a Holocaust-denier.

Pretty funny considering you literally did holocaust denying in the RWDT when I talked to you. Just shows how dishonest you are. There's no proof that the famine was constructed.

[Proctopeo]

This literally sounds like the 6 gorillion meme Neo-Nazis use. You are literally the Stalinist version of a Holocaust-denier.

Pretty funny considering you literally did holocaust denying in the RWDT when I talked to you. Just shows how dishonest you are. There's no proof that the famine was constructed.

"you did X so it's okay if I do X too!!"

[Korouse]

Pretty funny considering you literally did holocaust denying in the RWDT when I talked to you. Just shows how dishonest you are. There's no proof that the famine was constructed.

"you did X so it's okay if I do X too!!"

I didn't say it was okay for Eodor to do it, I think it's in bad taste.