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Bombadil
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Founded: Oct 13, 2011
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Bombadil » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:47 pm

Oil exporting People wrote:Turkey and China have both been, for lack of a better term, hammered by the U.S. this year. Combined with Trump's stance on Japan, I wonder how much influence George Friedman's geopolitical thinking has had on Trump; we know back in 2012 Mitt Romney was reading up on his thinking. I personally own The Next 100 Years and The Next Decade, with Friedman largely being right with incredible accuracy so far.


America's not without consequence either, factories are closing in Trump heartlands because of these tariffs..

Despite his promising to be “the greatest jobs producer that God ever created” after winning the presidency, Trump’s recent slew of overseas tariffs has led to an increasing number of job losses at home.

America’s largest nail manufacturer, Mid-Continent Nail, became the first company to lay off employees as a result of Trump’s tariffs in mid-June. The Missouri-based company made its nails with steel imported from Mexico, but Trump’s 25% tax on steel dealt a blow to production. Sixty employees lost their jobs, and the whole company—which employs 500—could be out of business by Labor Day, said the Washington Post.

REC Silicon, which produces polysilicon for solar equipment, laid off 100 employees Monday as a “direct result of the ongoing solar trade dispute between China and the United States,” said company officials. The manufacturer has been closed off to the Chinese market since 2014, affecting overall sales. The Washington state-based company has reduced production to about a quarter of capacity due to these trade disputes.

Industry coalitions have warned that tariff increases will cause job losses in the future. The Solar Energy Industries Association estimated that new tariffs imposed by the Trump administration will lead to the loss of 23,000 jobs in the U.S. solar sector. BMW and General Motors each sent letters to the Commerce Department warning that new tariffs could lead to higher car prices and job cuts at production plants. Volvo had promised to hire 4,000 new employees for a new plant in South Carolina, but has said it may have to break this promise as a result of new tariffs.

Harley-Davidson announced it would be moving some of its U.S. production elsewhere after retaliatory tariffs from the European Union raised U.S. motorcycle tariffs from 6% to 31%, adding nearly $2,200 to the average cost of one of its bikes. The company has not said how many jobs will be affected by this move.

U.S. Steel and Century Aluminum have announced it will hire new workers as a result of Trump’s tariffs, creating a combined 800 jobs, but this number is dwarfed by the number that could be lost in the coming months.

While the White House has argued that these tariffs will bring jobs back to the U.S., the U.S. Chamber of Commerce argues in a new campaign that 2.6 million American jobs could be lost as a result of “recent and proposed trade actions by the Trump administration.”


It's a race as to whether China can hold its nerve and pour in reserves or whether the clamour grows enough that Trump feels the criticism.. because let's face it Trump is less concerned with economic policy than his own image.
Eldest, that's what I am...Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn...he knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless — before the Dark Lord came from Outside..

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New haven america
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Posts: 44091
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:50 pm

Sovaal wrote:
New haven america wrote:Yes, because I can actually empathize with people. Why do you think the "Fuck you, I got mine" mentality is fucking stupid as hell?

Do you empathize with others?

Tends to help win I see them in person. People on the internet, where all pretenses of civility are dropped? Not so much.

What about universal shared humanity?
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Proctopeo
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Posts: 12370
Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:51 pm

New haven america wrote:
Sovaal wrote:Tends to help win I see them in person. People on the internet, where all pretenses of civility are dropped? Not so much.

What about universal shared humanity?

On the internet, you can't know if the other user isn't actually a dog in disguise.
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Sovaal
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Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Sovaal » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:54 pm

New haven america wrote:
Sovaal wrote:Tends to help win I see them in person. People on the internet, where all pretenses of civility are dropped? Not so much.

What about universal shared humanity?

Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes where the total population of people you personally knew at most was 150. There's limits to the human understanding.
Most of the time I have no idea what the hell I'm doing or talking about.

”Many forms of government have been tried and will be tried in this world of sin and woe.
No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is
the worst form of government, except for all the others that have been tried from time to time." -
Winston Churchill, 1947.

"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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Sick Jumps
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Posts: 503
Founded: Jul 09, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Sick Jumps » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:55 pm

Proctopeo wrote:
Sovaal wrote:I mean the Nazis at least where anti smoking, so one could make the claim that antismoking groups share some concerning similarities with fascists.

Getting lung cancer, then, is the most anti-fascist one can be. Fight the power, smoke two packs a day!

Bash the fash with Joe Camel today!

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Proctopeo
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Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:55 pm

Sovaal wrote:
New haven america wrote:What about universal shared humanity?

Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes where the total population of people you personally knew at most was 150. There's limits to the human understanding.

Fifty is a tragedy. Fifty thousand is a statistic.
Arachno-anarchism || NO GODS NO MASTERS || Free NSG Odreria

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New haven america
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Posts: 44091
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:57 pm

Sovaal wrote:
New haven america wrote:What about universal shared humanity?

Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes

And you notice that we're not hunter gatherers anymore, right?

Everyone else in the developed world excluding the US seems to have figured this out (On a nationwide basis. mind you), so why can't the US?
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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That's all folks~

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Proctopeo
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Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:58 pm

New haven america wrote:
Sovaal wrote:Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes

And you notice that we're not hunter gatherers anymore, right?

The human brain hasn't.
Arachno-anarchism || NO GODS NO MASTERS || Free NSG Odreria

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New haven america
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Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:59 pm

Proctopeo wrote:
New haven america wrote:And you notice that we're not hunter gatherers anymore, right?

The human brain hasn't.

If you stepped out of your US-centric bubble every once in a while you'd learn that that is far from the truth.
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Human of the male variety
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That's all folks~

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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54796
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:00 pm

New haven america wrote:
Sovaal wrote:Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes

And you notice that we're not hunter gatherers anymore, right?

Everyone else in the developed world excluding the US seems to have figured this out (On a nationwide basis. mind you), so why can't the US?


Because we also happen to be the world police and don't like taxes sooooooo
Hellenic Polytheist, Socialist

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Oil exporting People
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8281
Founded: Jan 31, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Oil exporting People » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:00 pm

Sick Jumps wrote:Friedman is a bit of a meme. He's predicted some fairly wacky off-base stuff, read "the Coming War With Japan". I like Stratfor, though.


Japan has more destroyers than the Anglo-French combined, same for their GDP and their GDP PPP per capita also rivals the Anglo-French. They've begun projecting power elsewhere, openly admit the Helicopter Destroyers are backdoor carriers now, leaks say they're looking at missile tech and have been discussing acquiring nuclear weapons. They've also been making signals they'll follow their own policy in regards to foreign affairs. In the long run, friction over control of the Pacific is likely once China fades away.

Trump also doesn't read books, so I don't know how much of an influence Friedman could have had on him.


Source?
National Syndicalist
“The blood of the heroes is closer to God than the ink of the philosophers and the prayers of the faithful.” - Julius Evola
Endorsing Greg "Grab 'em by the Neck" Gianforte and Brett "I Like Beer" Kavanaugh for 2020

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Valrifell
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Posts: 31063
Founded: Aug 18, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Valrifell » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:00 pm

Sovaal wrote:
Valrifell wrote:
Fascism isn't a concrete ideology, but he does share concerning similarities to fascist leaders. Trumpism could just be the American version of a wishy-washy ideological movement.

I mean the Nazis at least where anti smoking, so one could make the claim that antismoking groups share some concerning similarities with fascists.


That's not concerning, though. I'm talking about the machismo, the distaste for a free and independent press, and rampant militarism. Oh, my bad, those are just symptoms of tinpot dictators not fascists. You're right, that's much better.
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Telconi
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Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:00 pm

New haven america wrote:
Telconi wrote:
1. I'm not the one calling you a masochist for making the best choice for your own well being am I?

2. Sure, and Trump's policies have got some growing pains too.

1. The problem is that your part of a bigger group that actively acts out masochistic tendencies, and will be fucked over by Trump. Yet you continue holding onto the delusion that him and the Republicans are going to help you when that's been historically proven to not be the case as recently as 2007.
2. No they won't, they're just going to suck, just like almost every other Republican President's decision since Nixon (Excluding HW, he was mostly ok).


1)What delusion is this then?

2)That was sarcasm

Also, please dont edit my post, you're perfectly welcome to drop the pretense of caring about me, but to edit it out of a post is wrong.
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Proctopeo
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Founded: Sep 26, 2016
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Postby Proctopeo » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:00 pm

New haven america wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:The human brain hasn't.

If you stepped out of your US-centric bubble every once in a while you'd learn that that is far from the truth.

[x] doubt
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Sovaal
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Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Sovaal » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:00 pm

New haven america wrote:
Sovaal wrote:Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes

And you notice that we're not hunter gatherers anymore, right?

You realize that the human brain hasn't dramatically evolved n the odd ten thousand years we stopped, huh?

Everyone else in the developed world excluding the US seems to have figured this out (On a nationwide basis. mind you), so why can't the US?
Figured out what? That evolutionary that we're still the same as we where some 80 thousand years ago when the first behaviorally modern humans evolved? It appears you havent. As for a single payer health system or not I really dont give a fuck, anything would proabbly be better than whats around now.
Most of the time I have no idea what the hell I'm doing or talking about.

”Many forms of government have been tried and will be tried in this world of sin and woe.
No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is
the worst form of government, except for all the others that have been tried from time to time." -
Winston Churchill, 1947.

"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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Oil exporting People
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Posts: 8281
Founded: Jan 31, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Oil exporting People » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:01 pm

Bombadil wrote:America's not without consequence either, factories are closing in Trump heartlands because of these tariffs.


No, we've got off scott free.

It's a race as to whether China can hold its nerve and pour in reserves or whether the clamour grows enough that Trump feels the criticism.. because let's face it Trump is less concerned with economic policy than his own image.


No, the Chinese are fucked regardless of what they do. At this point it's either cry uncle to stem the pain or they're going down in flames; he's done broke them.
National Syndicalist
“The blood of the heroes is closer to God than the ink of the philosophers and the prayers of the faithful.” - Julius Evola
Endorsing Greg "Grab 'em by the Neck" Gianforte and Brett "I Like Beer" Kavanaugh for 2020

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Valrifell
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Founded: Aug 18, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Valrifell » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:03 pm

Sovaal wrote:
New haven america wrote:What about universal shared humanity?

Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes where the total population of people you personally knew at most was 150.


The human mind is designed for complex social interactions and cooperation, you can reduce that to "simple hunter-gatherer tribes" if you'd like, but the progression to civilization and larger city-states was a feature of those predispositions, not a bug.
HAVING AN ALL CAPS SIG MAKES ME FEEL SMART

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Sovaal
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Postby Sovaal » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:04 pm

New haven america wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:The human brain hasn't.

If you stepped out of your US-centric bubble every once in a while you'd learn that that is far from the truth.

It hardly is. We're stille ssentially and behaviorally the same as we where ten thousand years ago, before the first true cities appeared.
Most of the time I have no idea what the hell I'm doing or talking about.

”Many forms of government have been tried and will be tried in this world of sin and woe.
No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is
the worst form of government, except for all the others that have been tried from time to time." -
Winston Churchill, 1947.

"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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Sovaal
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Founded: Mar 17, 2017
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Postby Sovaal » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:05 pm

Valrifell wrote:
Sovaal wrote:Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes where the total population of people you personally knew at most was 150.


The human mind is designed for complex social interactions and cooperation, you can reduce that to "simple hunter-gatherer tribes" if you'd like, but the progression to civilization and larger city-states was a feature of those predispositions, not a bug.

Human society has expanded far beyond what we can actually truly comprehend.
Most of the time I have no idea what the hell I'm doing or talking about.

”Many forms of government have been tried and will be tried in this world of sin and woe.
No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is
the worst form of government, except for all the others that have been tried from time to time." -
Winston Churchill, 1947.

"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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Valrifell
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Founded: Aug 18, 2013
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Postby Valrifell » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:06 pm

Sovaal wrote:
New haven america wrote:If you stepped out of your US-centric bubble every once in a while you'd learn that that is far from the truth.

It hardly is. We're stille ssentially and behaviorally the same as we where ten thousand years ago, before the first true cities appeared.


Fuck, I knew anthropology and the behavioral sciences were a bust.
HAVING AN ALL CAPS SIG MAKES ME FEEL SMART

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Proctopeo
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Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:06 pm

Valrifell wrote:
Sovaal wrote:Universally humanity is a mixed bag. Universally the human mind is designed/evolved for a far more primitive existence of hunter-gatherer tribes where the total population of people you personally knew at most was 150.


The human mind is designed for complex social interactions and cooperation, you can reduce that to "simple hunter-gatherer tribes" if you'd like, but the progression to civilization and larger city-states was a feature of those predispositions, not a bug.

This does not, however, mean that we've in any way adapted to actually know beyond 150 or so people. We only began to actually progress to civilization a scant 10,000 years ago. Evolution does not work that fast, at least in organisms that reproduce so slowly as humans.
Arachno-anarchism || NO GODS NO MASTERS || Free NSG Odreria

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Valrifell
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Posts: 31063
Founded: Aug 18, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Valrifell » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:07 pm

Proctopeo wrote:
Valrifell wrote:
The human mind is designed for complex social interactions and cooperation, you can reduce that to "simple hunter-gatherer tribes" if you'd like, but the progression to civilization and larger city-states was a feature of those predispositions, not a bug.

This does not, however, mean that we've in any way adapted to actually know beyond 150 or so people. We only began to actually progress to civilization a scant 10,000 years ago. Evolution does not work that fast, at least in organisms that reproduce so slowly as humans.


Know in the strictest sense of the word, there still exists a basic level of care for fellow man.
HAVING AN ALL CAPS SIG MAKES ME FEEL SMART

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Sovaal
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Founded: Mar 17, 2017
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Postby Sovaal » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:07 pm

Valrifell wrote:
Sovaal wrote:It hardly is. We're stille ssentially and behaviorally the same as we where ten thousand years ago, before the first true cities appeared.


Fuck, I knew anthropology and the behavioral sciences were a bust.

I didn't know that the most accepted definition that I've seen for behaviorally modern humans was bust.
Most of the time I have no idea what the hell I'm doing or talking about.

”Many forms of government have been tried and will be tried in this world of sin and woe.
No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is
the worst form of government, except for all the others that have been tried from time to time." -
Winston Churchill, 1947.

"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44091
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:07 pm

Sovaal wrote:
New haven america wrote:And you notice that we're not hunter gatherers anymore, right?

1.You realize that the human brain hasn't dramatically evolved n the odd ten thousand years we stopped, huh?

Everyone else in the developed world excluding the US seems to have figured this out (On a nationwide basis. mind you), so why can't the US?
2. Figured out what? 3.That evolutionary that we're still the same as we where some 80 thousand years ago when the first behaviorally modern humans evolved? 4.It appears you havent. 5.As for a single payer health system or not I really dont give a fuck, anything would proabbly be better than whats around now.

1. … Yeah, it kinda has, and will always do so.
2. That you can be sympathetic and empathetic towards people who aren't part of your immediate in-group
3. Except we're not, we've apparently moved from the Tribal stage of empathy to the Societal stage of empathy, I say apparently because the US shows otherwise
4. That's cute, and not an argument
5. That's true, but others would disagree
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That's all folks~

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Sovaal
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Posts: 13695
Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Sovaal » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:08 pm

Valrifell wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:This does not, however, mean that we've in any way adapted to actually know beyond 150 or so people. We only began to actually progress to civilization a scant 10,000 years ago. Evolution does not work that fast, at least in organisms that reproduce so slowly as humans.


Know in the strictest sense of the word, there still exists a basic level of care for fellow man.
Yes. Nobody here is denying that. However as many can agree the internet detaches eachother from their humanity to the perception of the individual.
Most of the time I have no idea what the hell I'm doing or talking about.

”Many forms of government have been tried and will be tried in this world of sin and woe.
No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is
the worst form of government, except for all the others that have been tried from time to time." -
Winston Churchill, 1947.

"Rifles, muskets, long-bows and hand-grenades are inherently democratic weapons. A complex weapon makes the strong stronger, while a simple weapon – so long as there is no answer to it – gives claws to the weak.” - George Orwell

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