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Telconi
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24575
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Telconi » Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:29 pm

Vassenor wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
The same way having a ban cover one arbitrarily created class of firearm doesn't violate the right to bear arms, one would imagine.


But I thought rights weren't absolute.


Hey, if you wanna make my rights 'not absolute' is it not fair that I get to make your rights 'not absolute'?
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Jerzylvania
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7506
Founded: Aug 10, 2016
Father Knows Best State

Postby Jerzylvania » Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:39 pm

I Am Part of the Resistance Inside the Trump Administration

Schizoprenic administration detected. Here's the whole thing in case you can't access the NYT...

President Trump is facing a test to his presidency unlike any faced by a modern American leader.

It’s not just that the special counsel looms large. Or that the country is bitterly divided over Mr. Trump’s leadership. Or even that his party might well lose the House to an opposition hellbent on his downfall.

The dilemma — which he does not fully grasp — is that many of the senior officials in his own administration are working diligently from within to frustrate parts of his agenda and his worst inclinations.

I would know. I am one of them.

To be clear, ours is not the popular “resistance” of the left. We want the administration to succeed and think that many of its policies have already made America safer and more prosperous.

But we believe our first duty is to this country, and the president continues to act in a manner that is detrimental to the health of our republic.

That is why many Trump appointees have vowed to do what we can to preserve our democratic institutions while thwarting Mr. Trump’s more misguided impulses until he is out of office.

The root of the problem is the president’s amorality. Anyone who works with him knows he is not moored to any discernible first principles that guide his decision making.

Although he was elected as a Republican, the president shows little affinity for ideals long espoused by conservatives: free minds, free markets and free people. At best, he has invoked these ideals in scripted settings. At worst, he has attacked them outright.

In addition to his mass-marketing of the notion that the press is the “enemy of the people,” President Trump’s impulses are generally anti-trade and anti-democratic.

Don’t get me wrong. There are bright spots that the near-ceaseless negative coverage of the administration fails to capture: effective deregulation, historic tax reform, a more robust military and more.

But these successes have come despite — not because of — the president’s leadership style, which is impetuous, adversarial, petty and ineffective.

From the White House to executive branch departments and agencies, senior officials will privately admit their daily disbelief at the commander in chief’s comments and actions. Most are working to insulate their operations from his whims.

Meetings with him veer off topic and off the rails, he engages in repetitive rants, and his impulsiveness results in half-baked, ill-informed and occasionally reckless decisions that have to be walked back.

“There is literally no telling whether he might change his mind from one minute to the next,” a top official complained to me recently, exasperated by an Oval Office meeting at which the president flip-flopped on a major policy decision he’d made only a week earlier.

The erratic behavior would be more concerning if it weren’t for unsung heroes in and around the White House. Some of his aides have been cast as villains by the media. But in private, they have gone to great lengths to keep bad decisions contained to the West Wing, though they are clearly not always successful.

It may be cold comfort in this chaotic era, but Americans should know that there are adults in the room. We fully recognize what is happening. And we are trying to do what’s right even when Donald Trump won’t.

The result is a two-track presidency.

Take foreign policy: In public and in private, President Trump shows a preference for autocrats and dictators, such as President Vladimir Putin of Russia and North Korea’s leader, Kim Jong-un, and displays little genuine appreciation for the ties that bind us to allied, like-minded nations.

Astute observers have noted, though, that the rest of the administration is operating on another track, one where countries like Russia are called out for meddling and punished accordingly, and where allies around the world are engaged as peers rather than ridiculed as rivals.

On Russia, for instance, the president was reluctant to expel so many of Mr. Putin’s spies as punishment for the poisoning of a former Russian spy in Britain. He complained for weeks about senior staff members letting him get boxed into further confrontation with Russia, and he expressed frustration that the United States continued to impose sanctions on the country for its malign behavior. But his national security team knew better — such actions had to be taken, to hold Moscow accountable.

This isn’t the work of the so-called deep state. It’s the work of the steady state.

Given the instability many witnessed, there were early whispers within the cabinet of invoking the 25th Amendment, which would start a complex process for removing the president. But no one wanted to precipitate a constitutional crisis. So we will do what we can to steer the administration in the right direction until — one way or another — it’s over.

The bigger concern is not what Mr. Trump has done to the presidency but rather what we as a nation have allowed him to do to us. We have sunk low with him and allowed our discourse to be stripped of civility.

Senator John McCain put it best in his farewell letter. All Americans should heed his words and break free of the tribalism trap, with the high aim of uniting through our shared values and love of this great nation.

We may no longer have Senator McCain. But we will always have his example — a lodestar for restoring honor to public life and our national dialogue. Mr. Trump may fear such honorable men, but we should revere them.

There is a quiet resistance within the administration of people choosing to put country first. But the real difference will be made by everyday citizens rising above politics, reaching across the aisle and resolving to shed the labels in favor of a single one: Americans.

The writer is a senior official in the Trump administration.
Last edited by Jerzylvania on Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
NFL Thread 2018 season game-picks CHAMPION.
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Below: Check today's "new" official Jerzylvania anthem choices! Vote for your choice via TG! Cancer is like carbon. All life on this planet is comprised of it. Same with cancer. Ubiquitous. Carbon dating is also a thing.
Helsinki - Helsinki - Helsinki ...Make America Grovel Again! ~ Donald Trump is Burning

User avatar
Ifreann
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 130564
Founded: Aug 07, 2005
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Ifreann » Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:45 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Before you all lose the run of yourselves badgering Vass, people aren't allowed to do that. Over 70 people were arrested, as was reported two lines below the line you just quoted. Trump is objectively wrong here. And you should really all know better than to believe him when he has been lying pretty much incessantly for years now.


Trump is wrong in the vein that yes they aren't "allowed" to do it, but we allow it to happen by letting in random morons and it's embarrassing.

If you find it embarrassing that the general public is allowed to view government proceedings, well, bully for you, but you aren't Donald Trump. Does Trump find it embarrassing that the public is allowed into the public gallery? He doesn't say that. He says it's embarrassing that people are allowed to interrupt the Senate and scream and protest. Which they are not allowed to do and were arrested for doing. No amount of scare quotes can make Trump right here.


Telconi wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Before you all lose the run of yourselves badgering Vass, people aren't allowed to do that. Over 70 people were arrested, as was reported two lines below the line you just quoted. Trump is objectively wrong here. And you should really all know better than to believe him when he has been lying pretty much incessantly for years now.


They were allowed in were they not?

Yes Telconi, the public is allowed into the public gallery of the Senate. Trump wasn't calling that an embarrassment. Gravlen's already posted the transcript of his interview with the Daily Caller.
I’m amazed that people allow the interruption to continue. You know, there are some people that just keep screaming at the same people. In the old days we used to throw them out. Today I guess they just keep screaming. I thought Sen. Hatch was good because he was very indignant at the interruptions by a woman that was up there that just kept going on and on. I don’t know why they don’t, why they don’t take care of a situation like that because it’s terrible. I think it’s embarrassing for the country to allow protesters, you don’t even know which side the protesters were on. But to allow someone to stand up and scream from the top of their lungs and nobody does anything about it is frankly — I think it’s an embarrassment.

But he's wrong. They, the staff of the Sergeant-at-arms who provide security in and around the Senate, who I presume to be the relevant authorities here, don't allow that. They arrested over 70 people for that.
Mistake Not My Current State Of Joshing Gentle Banter For The Awesome And Terrible Majesty Of The Towering Seas Of Snark That Are Themselves The Mere Milquetoast Shallows Fringing My Vast Oceans Of Sarcasm
He/Him

Dangerous this Jack o' Hearts.
With his kiss
the riot
starts

User avatar
Telconi
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24575
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Telconi » Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:48 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Trump is wrong in the vein that yes they aren't "allowed" to do it, but we allow it to happen by letting in random morons and it's embarrassing.

If you find it embarrassing that the general public is allowed to view government proceedings, well, bully for you, but you aren't Donald Trump. Does Trump find it embarrassing that the public is allowed into the public gallery? He doesn't say that. He says it's embarrassing that people are allowed to interrupt the Senate and scream and protest. Which they are not allowed to do and were arrested for doing. No amount of scare quotes can make Trump right here.


Telconi wrote:
They were allowed in were they not?

Yes Telconi, the public is allowed into the public gallery of the Senate. Trump wasn't calling that an embarrassment. Gravlen's already posted the transcript of his interview with the Daily Caller.
I’m amazed that people allow the interruption to continue. You know, there are some people that just keep screaming at the same people. In the old days we used to throw them out. Today I guess they just keep screaming. I thought Sen. Hatch was good because he was very indignant at the interruptions by a woman that was up there that just kept going on and on. I don’t know why they don’t, why they don’t take care of a situation like that because it’s terrible. I think it’s embarrassing for the country to allow protesters, you don’t even know which side the protesters were on. But to allow someone to stand up and scream from the top of their lungs and nobody does anything about it is frankly — I think it’s an embarrassment.

But he's wrong. They, the staff of the Sergeant-at-arms who provide security in and around the Senate, who I presume to be the relevant authorities here, don't allow that. They arrested over 70 people for that.


They should stop allowing random people into the gallery.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Ifreann
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 130564
Founded: Aug 07, 2005
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Ifreann » Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:57 pm

Telconi wrote:
Ifreann wrote:If you find it embarrassing that the general public is allowed to view government proceedings, well, bully for you, but you aren't Donald Trump. Does Trump find it embarrassing that the public is allowed into the public gallery? He doesn't say that. He says it's embarrassing that people are allowed to interrupt the Senate and scream and protest. Which they are not allowed to do and were arrested for doing. No amount of scare quotes can make Trump right here.



Yes Telconi, the public is allowed into the public gallery of the Senate. Trump wasn't calling that an embarrassment. Gravlen's already posted the transcript of his interview with the Daily Caller.
I’m amazed that people allow the interruption to continue. You know, there are some people that just keep screaming at the same people. In the old days we used to throw them out. Today I guess they just keep screaming. I thought Sen. Hatch was good because he was very indignant at the interruptions by a woman that was up there that just kept going on and on. I don’t know why they don’t, why they don’t take care of a situation like that because it’s terrible. I think it’s embarrassing for the country to allow protesters, you don’t even know which side the protesters were on. But to allow someone to stand up and scream from the top of their lungs and nobody does anything about it is frankly — I think it’s an embarrassment.

But he's wrong. They, the staff of the Sergeant-at-arms who provide security in and around the Senate, who I presume to be the relevant authorities here, don't allow that. They arrested over 70 people for that.


They should stop allowing random people into the gallery.

Nah, the public should be allowed into the public gallery. Even though it's the 21st century and there are plenty of other ways to watch the government in action, people should still be able to walk off the streets of the capital and watch what their government is doing. It is, after all, their government. If people are disruptive, they can be removed.
Mistake Not My Current State Of Joshing Gentle Banter For The Awesome And Terrible Majesty Of The Towering Seas Of Snark That Are Themselves The Mere Milquetoast Shallows Fringing My Vast Oceans Of Sarcasm
He/Him

Dangerous this Jack o' Hearts.
With his kiss
the riot
starts

User avatar
The Black Forrest
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34969
Founded: Antiquity
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby The Black Forrest » Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:58 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Telconi wrote:
They should stop allowing random people into the gallery.

Nah, the public should be allowed into the public gallery. Even though it's the 21st century and there are plenty of other ways to watch the government in action, people should still be able to walk off the streets of the capital and watch what their government is doing. It is, after all, their government. If people are disruptive, they can be removed.


Indeed.
*I am a master proofreader after I click Submit.
* There is actually a War on Christmas. But Christmas started it, with it's unparalleled aggression against the Thanksgiving Holiday, and now Christmas has seized much Lebensraum in November, and are pushing into October. The rest of us seek to repel these invaders, and push them back to the status quo ante bellum Black Friday border. -Trotskylvania
* Silence Is Golden But Duct Tape Is Silver.
* I felt like Ayn Rand cornered me at a party, and three minutes in I found my first objection to what she was saying, but she kept talking without interruption for ten more days. - Max Barry talking about Atlas Shrugged

User avatar
Telconi
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24575
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Telconi » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:05 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Telconi wrote:
They should stop allowing random people into the gallery.

Nah, the public should be allowed into the public gallery. Even though it's the 21st century and there are plenty of other ways to watch the government in action, people should still be able to walk off the streets of the capital and watch what their government is doing. It is, after all, their government. If people are disruptive, they can be removed.


Or not, CSPAN exists.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Nixonnia
Secretary
 
Posts: 37
Founded: Feb 21, 2015
Corporate Police State

Postby Nixonnia » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:08 pm

Jerzylvania wrote:I Am Part of the Resistance Inside the Trump Administration

Schizoprenic administration detected. Here's the whole thing in case you can't access the NYT...

President Trump is facing a test to his presidency unlike any faced by a modern American leader.

It’s not just that the special counsel looms large. Or that the country is bitterly divided over Mr. Trump’s leadership. Or even that his party might well lose the House to an opposition hellbent on his downfall.

The dilemma — which he does not fully grasp — is that many of the senior officials in his own administration are working diligently from within to frustrate parts of his agenda and his worst inclinations.

I would know. I am one of them.

To be clear, ours is not the popular “resistance” of the left. We want the administration to succeed and think that many of its policies have already made America safer and more prosperous.

But we believe our first duty is to this country, and the president continues to act in a manner that is detrimental to the health of our republic.

That is why many Trump appointees have vowed to do what we can to preserve our democratic institutions while thwarting Mr. Trump’s more misguided impulses until he is out of office.

The root of the problem is the president’s amorality. Anyone who works with him knows he is not moored to any discernible first principles that guide his decision making.

Although he was elected as a Republican, the president shows little affinity for ideals long espoused by conservatives: free minds, free markets and free people. At best, he has invoked these ideals in scripted settings. At worst, he has attacked them outright.

In addition to his mass-marketing of the notion that the press is the “enemy of the people,” President Trump’s impulses are generally anti-trade and anti-democratic.

Don’t get me wrong. There are bright spots that the near-ceaseless negative coverage of the administration fails to capture: effective deregulation, historic tax reform, a more robust military and more.

But these successes have come despite — not because of — the president’s leadership style, which is impetuous, adversarial, petty and ineffective.

From the White House to executive branch departments and agencies, senior officials will privately admit their daily disbelief at the commander in chief’s comments and actions. Most are working to insulate their operations from his whims.

Meetings with him veer off topic and off the rails, he engages in repetitive rants, and his impulsiveness results in half-baked, ill-informed and occasionally reckless decisions that have to be walked back.

“There is literally no telling whether he might change his mind from one minute to the next,” a top official complained to me recently, exasperated by an Oval Office meeting at which the president flip-flopped on a major policy decision he’d made only a week earlier.

The erratic behavior would be more concerning if it weren’t for unsung heroes in and around the White House. Some of his aides have been cast as villains by the media. But in private, they have gone to great lengths to keep bad decisions contained to the West Wing, though they are clearly not always successful.

It may be cold comfort in this chaotic era, but Americans should know that there are adults in the room. We fully recognize what is happening. And we are trying to do what’s right even when Donald Trump won’t.

The result is a two-track presidency.

Take foreign policy: In public and in private, President Trump shows a preference for autocrats and dictators, such as President Vladimir Putin of Russia and North Korea’s leader, Kim Jong-un, and displays little genuine appreciation for the ties that bind us to allied, like-minded nations.

Astute observers have noted, though, that the rest of the administration is operating on another track, one where countries like Russia are called out for meddling and punished accordingly, and where allies around the world are engaged as peers rather than ridiculed as rivals.

On Russia, for instance, the president was reluctant to expel so many of Mr. Putin’s spies as punishment for the poisoning of a former Russian spy in Britain. He complained for weeks about senior staff members letting him get boxed into further confrontation with Russia, and he expressed frustration that the United States continued to impose sanctions on the country for its malign behavior. But his national security team knew better — such actions had to be taken, to hold Moscow accountable.

This isn’t the work of the so-called deep state. It’s the work of the steady state.

Given the instability many witnessed, there were early whispers within the cabinet of invoking the 25th Amendment, which would start a complex process for removing the president. But no one wanted to precipitate a constitutional crisis. So we will do what we can to steer the administration in the right direction until — one way or another — it’s over.

The bigger concern is not what Mr. Trump has done to the presidency but rather what we as a nation have allowed him to do to us. We have sunk low with him and allowed our discourse to be stripped of civility.

Senator John McCain put it best in his farewell letter. All Americans should heed his words and break free of the tribalism trap, with the high aim of uniting through our shared values and love of this great nation.

We may no longer have Senator McCain. But we will always have his example — a lodestar for restoring honor to public life and our national dialogue. Mr. Trump may fear such honorable men, but we should revere them.

There is a quiet resistance within the administration of people choosing to put country first. But the real difference will be made by everyday citizens rising above politics, reaching across the aisle and resolving to shed the labels in favor of a single one: Americans.

The writer is a senior official in the Trump administration.


Holy crap. There's a new deep throat in town.
Always remember others may hate you, but those who hate you don't win unless you hate them. And then you destroy yourself.

Pat - my one and only true love... second only to political power.

User avatar
Ifreann
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 130564
Founded: Aug 07, 2005
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Ifreann » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:10 pm

Telconi wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Nah, the public should be allowed into the public gallery. Even though it's the 21st century and there are plenty of other ways to watch the government in action, people should still be able to walk off the streets of the capital and watch what their government is doing. It is, after all, their government. If people are disruptive, they can be removed.


Or not, CSPAN exists.

Well, whatever, Trump's problem is that people are allowed to do something people were arrested for doing.
Mistake Not My Current State Of Joshing Gentle Banter For The Awesome And Terrible Majesty Of The Towering Seas Of Snark That Are Themselves The Mere Milquetoast Shallows Fringing My Vast Oceans Of Sarcasm
He/Him

Dangerous this Jack o' Hearts.
With his kiss
the riot
starts

User avatar
Telconi
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24575
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Telconi » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:16 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Or not, CSPAN exists.

Well, whatever, Trump's problem is that people are allowed to do something people were arrested for doing.


Yeah, and?
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Gravlen
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11186
Founded: Jul 01, 2005
Father Knows Best State

Postby Gravlen » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:22 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Or not, CSPAN exists.

Well, whatever, Trump's problem is that people are allowed to do something people were arrested for doing.

“He’s an idiot. It’s pointless to try to convince him of anything. He’s gone off the rails. We’re in Crazytown. I don’t even know why any of us are here. This is the worst job I’ve ever had.”

:)
EnragedMaldivians wrote:That's preposterous. Gravlens's not a white nationalist; Gravlen's a penguin.

Unio de Sovetaj Socialismaj Respublikoj wrote:There is no use arguing the definition of murder with someone who has a picture of a penguin with a chainsaw as their nations flag.

User avatar
Ifreann
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 130564
Founded: Aug 07, 2005
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Ifreann » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:24 pm

Telconi wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Well, whatever, Trump's problem is that people are allowed to do something people were arrested for doing.


Yeah, and?

And that's fucking demented, and therefore the posters lining up to agree with him just to be contrarian should stop doing so.
Mistake Not My Current State Of Joshing Gentle Banter For The Awesome And Terrible Majesty Of The Towering Seas Of Snark That Are Themselves The Mere Milquetoast Shallows Fringing My Vast Oceans Of Sarcasm
He/Him

Dangerous this Jack o' Hearts.
With his kiss
the riot
starts

User avatar
Washington Resistance Army
Post Czar
 
Posts: 40526
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:26 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Yeah, and?

And that's fucking demented, and therefore the posters lining up to agree with him just to be contrarian should stop doing so.


I don't think you understand what we're agreeing with.

User avatar
The Black Forrest
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34969
Founded: Antiquity
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby The Black Forrest » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:27 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Ifreann wrote:And that's fucking demented, and therefore the posters lining up to agree with him just to be contrarian should stop doing so.


I don't think you understand what we're agreeing with.


Soooooo? Maybe a better explanation should follow?
*I am a master proofreader after I click Submit.
* There is actually a War on Christmas. But Christmas started it, with it's unparalleled aggression against the Thanksgiving Holiday, and now Christmas has seized much Lebensraum in November, and are pushing into October. The rest of us seek to repel these invaders, and push them back to the status quo ante bellum Black Friday border. -Trotskylvania
* Silence Is Golden But Duct Tape Is Silver.
* I felt like Ayn Rand cornered me at a party, and three minutes in I found my first objection to what she was saying, but she kept talking without interruption for ten more days. - Max Barry talking about Atlas Shrugged

User avatar
Washington Resistance Army
Post Czar
 
Posts: 40526
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:28 pm

The Black Forrest wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
I don't think you understand what we're agreeing with.


Soooooo? Maybe a better explanation should follow?


It's been pretty clear lol, a number of people have said yes Trump is right that it's fucking embarrassing we allow these idiots into the capital.

User avatar
Telconi
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24575
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Telconi » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:28 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Yeah, and?

And that's fucking demented, and therefore the posters lining up to agree with him just to be contrarian should stop doing so.


Murder is illegal, do you consider those who want gun free zones in schools 'fucking demented'?

The Police stopping a man who has done nothing wrong and then harassing him, or worse, framing him for drug possession or something is illegal, do you consider people who advocate for police body cameras to be 'fucking demented'?

We could go on...
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Thyerata
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 408
Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Thyerata » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:42 pm

In other news, a certain Bret kavanaugh is appearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee...

Y'know, as someone who has a law degree in England, I'm astonished that politics has anything to do with judicial appointments. They're two separate things. We have a Supreme Court in the UK, but appointments are recommended by a non-political appointments body that is mostly made up of lawyers and laypeople who aren't politicians. There is a bit of consultation with politicians, but it's mostly consultation on a fait accompli.

Why is there so much political bitching over a judge?
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Gravlen
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Postby Gravlen » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:43 pm

Telconi wrote:
Ifreann wrote:And that's fucking demented, and therefore the posters lining up to agree with him just to be contrarian should stop doing so.


Murder is illegal, do you consider those who want gun free zones in schools 'fucking demented'?

The Police stopping a man who has done nothing wrong and then harassing him, or worse, framing him for drug possession or something is illegal, do you consider people who advocate for police body cameras to be 'fucking demented'?

We could go on...

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EnragedMaldivians wrote:That's preposterous. Gravlens's not a white nationalist; Gravlen's a penguin.

Unio de Sovetaj Socialismaj Respublikoj wrote:There is no use arguing the definition of murder with someone who has a picture of a penguin with a chainsaw as their nations flag.

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Postby Telconi » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:43 pm

Thyerata wrote:In other news, a certain Bret kavanaugh is appearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee...

Y'know, as someone who has a law degree in England, I'm astonished that politics has anything to do with judicial appointments. They're two separate things. We have a Supreme Court in the UK, but appointments are recommended by a non-political appointments body that is mostly made up of lawyers and laypeople who aren't politicians. There is a bit of consultation with politicians, but it's mostly consultation on a fait accompli.

Why is there so much political bitching over a judge?


Because a judge is a person, a person has opinions, and opinions effect decisions.
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The Black Forrest
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Postby The Black Forrest » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:43 pm

Thyerata wrote:In other news, a certain Bret kavanaugh is appearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee...

Y'know, as someone who has a law degree in England, I'm astonished that politics has anything to do with judicial appointments. They're two separate things. We have a Supreme Court in the UK, but appointments are recommended by a non-political appointments body that is mostly made up of lawyers and laypeople who aren't politicians. There is a bit of consultation with politicians, but it's mostly consultation on a fait accompli.

Why is there so much political bitching over a judge?


Do we have to wear a powdered wig to answer?
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Postby Vassenor » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:44 pm

So does anyone have any response to Trump's protester comments that don't involve whataboutism regarding guns?
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Gravlen
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Postby Gravlen » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:45 pm

Thyerata wrote:In other news, a certain Bret kavanaugh is appearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee...

Y'know, as someone who has a law degree in England, I'm astonished that politics has anything to do with judicial appointments. They're two separate things. We have a Supreme Court in the UK, but appointments are recommended by a non-political appointments body that is mostly made up of lawyers and laypeople who aren't politicians. There is a bit of consultation with politicians, but it's mostly consultation on a fait accompli.

Why is there so much political bitching over a judge?

Because the courts in the US have become politicized, and under the prevailing two-party system it is important to hold political control of that branch of government as well.
EnragedMaldivians wrote:That's preposterous. Gravlens's not a white nationalist; Gravlen's a penguin.

Unio de Sovetaj Socialismaj Respublikoj wrote:There is no use arguing the definition of murder with someone who has a picture of a penguin with a chainsaw as their nations flag.

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Thyerata
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Postby Thyerata » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:45 pm

Telconi wrote:
Thyerata wrote:In other news, a certain Bret kavanaugh is appearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee...

Y'know, as someone who has a law degree in England, I'm astonished that politics has anything to do with judicial appointments. They're two separate things. We have a Supreme Court in the UK, but appointments are recommended by a non-political appointments body that is mostly made up of lawyers and laypeople who aren't politicians. There is a bit of consultation with politicians, but it's mostly consultation on a fait accompli.

Why is there so much political bitching over a judge?


Because a judge is a person, a person has opinions, and opinions effect decisions.


In the UK, judges are people, they have opinions (but they're very good at impartiality) and I'm sure their opinions affect decisions. Still, no politics here
Last edited by Thyerata on Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
From the Desk of the Honourable Matthew Merriweather Ph.D. (Law, 2040) LLM Public and International Law, 2036) LLB Law (2035) (all from Thyerata State University)
Thytian Ambassador to the World Assembly and Security Council

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The Black Forrest
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Postby The Black Forrest » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:46 pm

Thyerata wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Because a judge is a person, a person has opinions, and opinions effect decisions.


In the UK, judges are people, they have opinions (but they're very good at impartiality) and I'm sure their opinions affect decisions. Still doesn't get away from the ridiculous over-involvement of politics.


That's a growing concern. The SCOTUS is turning into a political branch.....
*I am a master proofreader after I click Submit.
* There is actually a War on Christmas. But Christmas started it, with it's unparalleled aggression against the Thanksgiving Holiday, and now Christmas has seized much Lebensraum in November, and are pushing into October. The rest of us seek to repel these invaders, and push them back to the status quo ante bellum Black Friday border. -Trotskylvania
* Silence Is Golden But Duct Tape Is Silver.
* I felt like Ayn Rand cornered me at a party, and three minutes in I found my first objection to what she was saying, but she kept talking without interruption for ten more days. - Max Barry talking about Atlas Shrugged

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Postby Freezic Vast » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:46 pm

The Black Forrest wrote:
Thyerata wrote:In other news, a certain Bret kavanaugh is appearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee...

Y'know, as someone who has a law degree in England, I'm astonished that politics has anything to do with judicial appointments. They're two separate things. We have a Supreme Court in the UK, but appointments are recommended by a non-political appointments body that is mostly made up of lawyers and laypeople who aren't politicians. There is a bit of consultation with politicians, but it's mostly consultation on a fait accompli.

Why is there so much political bitching over a judge?


Do we have to wear a powdered wig to answer?

:lol2: Okay that was funny.
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