On the Dachau Massacre

[Uxupox]

That isn't their decision to make according to the law of land warfare however.

Seemed like it was according to Patton after an investigation by the Army into the matter.

Gen. Patton just threw the case out without even reading it. The JAG dude that was tasked in investigating the task however concluded that there was a violation of the law of land warfare and such can only advise and not delegate punishment.

The guys just got lucky tbh if it was Ike or Bradley unto whom the case was being delegated then there would have been punishment. The circumstances however pointed otherwise.

[Uxupox]

That isn't their decision to make according to the law of land warfare however.

Wartime law only makes sense when applied to an enemy that isn't following a policy such as War of Annihilation, where "no consideration could be taken of International law."
As said above, international law isn't really law, because it has no actual form of judiciary (and force) behind it, exceptional cases ignored. If your enemy is specifically fighting a war where "no consideration could be taken of International law", you're no longer obliged to obey it either.

That's very untrue or else the insurgents would have been completely lined up and killed en mass in both Afghanistan and Iraq since a policy of COIN is completely dismemberment of the support of an insurgency through multiple uses up to which includes this one.

[Infected Mushroom]

This shows that the USA has no moral high ground over Nazi Germany. Especially when added up with Jim Crow and Japanese internment.

IM, c'mon. The USA didn't genocide ~17 million and start a world war that killed ~70 million.

What matters is the decision to execute them following a procedure more coherent than "GI mad."

I'm pretty sure the procedure that led up to the deaths of those SS guards was more coherent than "GI mad." I'm pretty sure it was more along the lines of, "these GIs saw clear, obvious, irrefutable evidence of an industrialized atrocity committed in part by these SS concentration camp guards volunteering from Hungary's pool of Nazis, including murders right before their very eyes even as they tried to get the Nazi guards to surrender, and reasonably came to the conclusion that they needed to be punished for their crimes against humanity."

But they still shot those guards in cold blood? And Patton went: “shrugs*”

It’s not very nice

[Torrocca]

IM, c'mon. The USA didn't genocide ~17 million and start a world war that killed ~70 million.



I'm pretty sure the procedure that led up to the deaths of those SS guards was more coherent than "GI mad." I'm pretty sure it was more along the lines of, "these GIs saw clear, obvious, irrefutable evidence of an industrialized atrocity committed in part by these SS concentration camp guards volunteering from Hungary's pool of Nazis, including murders right before their very eyes even as they tried to get the Nazi guards to surrender, and reasonably came to the conclusion that they needed to be punished for their crimes against humanity."

But they still shot those guards in cold blood? And Patton went: “shrugs*”

It’s not very nice

IM, they were Nazi Hungarian SS troops who volunteered to aide in the Holocaust.

[North Arkana]

IM, c'mon. The USA didn't genocide ~17 million and start a world war that killed ~70 million.



I'm pretty sure the procedure that led up to the deaths of those SS guards was more coherent than "GI mad." I'm pretty sure it was more along the lines of, "these GIs saw clear, obvious, irrefutable evidence of an industrialized atrocity committed in part by these SS concentration camp guards volunteering from Hungary's pool of Nazis, including murders right before their very eyes even as they tried to get the Nazi guards to surrender, and reasonably came to the conclusion that they needed to be punished for their crimes against humanity."

But they still shot those guards in cold blood? And Patton went: “shrugs*”

It’s not very nice

They shot them in very hot blood I'd say, because the guards were responsible for much more awful things than just "not very nice." But who am I kidding, you've said Nazis make for valuable allies regarding your viewpoints in the past.

[Infected Mushroom]

But they still shot those guards in cold blood? And Patton went: “shrugs*”

It’s not very nice

IM, they were Nazi Hungarian SS troops who volunteered to aide in the Holocaust.

Yes?

[Infected Mushroom]

But they still shot those guards in cold blood? And Patton went: “shrugs*”

It’s not very nice

They shot them in very hot blood I'd say, because the guards were responsible for much more awful things than just "not very nice." But who am I kidding, you've said Nazis make for valuable allies regarding your viewpoints in the past.

I mean I would condone it if it was Jews/minorities seeking revenge (to avenge their honour)... but the Americans really had no moral ground for the execution of non combatants (they may have been combatants in other contexts but while they were guards, I don't think so)

[West Leas Oros 2]

My question to everyone on this topic. Do you find it hypocritical to say that mass murder is wrong, except when done to the right people? I can’t justify killing, but I realize the world isn’t like that. If you have to kill, you have to. If you don’t, then DONT FUCKING KILL.

[Infected Mushroom]

My question to everyone on this topic. Do you find it hypocritical to say that mass murder is wrong, except when done to the right people? I can’t justify killing, but I realize the world isn’t like that. If you have to kill, you have to. If you don’t, then DONT FUCKING KILL.

depends

the only scenario where I would say mass killing is okay is where one party has a legitimate claim of doing so to avenge honour (ex they killed my family, I will now kill them); but even then there are limits and some restraint is expected

otherwise, its not okay

here in this case, there really isn't any grounds for the GIs to say so; they didn't have anything to do with the stuff that happened in the eastern front

[Torrocca]

IM, they were Nazi Hungarian SS troops who volunteered to aide in the Holocaust.

Yes?

... So they deserved it on the basis that they aided and abetted in the systematic, industrialized genocide of millions of people.

[Infected Mushroom]

Yes?

... So they deserved it on the basis that they aided and abetted in the systematic, industrialized genocide of millions of people.

that I don't really agree with

[West Leas Oros 2]

My question to everyone on this topic. Do you find it hypocritical to say that mass murder is wrong, except when done to the right people? I can’t justify killing, but I realize the world isn’t like that. If you have to kill, you have to. If you don’t, then DONT FUCKING KILL.

depends

the only scenario where I would say mass killing is okay is where one party has a legitimate claim of doing so to avenge honour (ex they killed my family, I will now kill them); but even then there are limits and some restraint is expected

otherwise, its not okay

here in this case, there really isn't any grounds for the GIs to say so; they didn't have anything to do with the stuff that happened in the eastern front

I see your point. I for one believe killing should be used as a last resort of self defense. If your life is in danger and you absolutely MUST kill them, ok. But I realize the world doesn’t have the same moral standpoint. I never thought of good and evil people, no one is evil for merely existing. Actions are good and evil. Actions are what we must judge.

[Infected Mushroom]

depends

the only scenario where I would say mass killing is okay is where one party has a legitimate claim of doing so to avenge honour (ex they killed my family, I will now kill them); but even then there are limits and some restraint is expected

otherwise, its not okay

here in this case, there really isn't any grounds for the GIs to say so; they didn't have anything to do with the stuff that happened in the eastern front

I see your point. I for one believe killing should be used as a last resort of self defense. If your life is in danger and you absolutely MUST kill them, ok. But I realize the world doesn’t have the same moral standpoint. I never thought of good and evil people, no one is evil for merely existing. Actions are good and evil. Actions are what we must judge.

I see...

[The New California Republic]

This shows that the USA has no moral high ground over Nazi Germany. Especially when added up with Jim Crow and Japanese internment.

Yup, when America starts rounding people up, shoving them into cattle wagons, and then sending them into gas chambers, then we can talk...

[West Leas Oros 2]

This shows that the USA has no moral high ground over Nazi Germany. Especially when added up with Jim Crow and Japanese internment.

Yup, when America starts rounding people up, shoving them into cattle wagons, and then sending them into gas chambers, then we can talk...

I mean, morality is more than just being better than the other guy. I could be a murderer, and my enemy could be a murderer and a rapist, but that doesn’t make what I did right

[Communist Xomaniax]

Given how lightly the nazis at Nuremberg got off I'm glad they shot captured SS. Should have had a policy of shooting them on sight.

[Thermodolia]

This shows that the USA has no moral high ground over Nazi Germany. Especially when added up with Jim Crow and Japanese internment.

You’re one to talk.

Especially considering that you wanted to murder all dogs, sentence noisy people to death, and have proposed other outrageous totalitarian ideas.

[The New California Republic]

This shows that the USA has no moral high ground over Nazi Germany. Especially when added up with Jim Crow and Japanese internment.

You’re one to talk.

Especially considering that you wanted to murder all dogs, sentence noisy people to death, and have proposed other outrageous totalitarian ideas.

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=448307&p=34489130#p34489130

[Infected Mushroom]

This shows that the USA has no moral high ground over Nazi Germany. Especially when added up with Jim Crow and Japanese internment.

You’re one to talk.

Especially considering that you wanted to murder all dogs, sentence noisy people to death, and have proposed other outrageous totalitarian ideas.

it is impossible to "murder" dogs; murder can only apply to humans

sentence noisy people to death? Don't remember this

all of my totalitarian ideas have been reasonable

[Infected Mushroom]

Given how lightly the nazis at Nuremberg got off I'm glad they shot captured SS. Should have had a policy of shooting them on sight.

but this would have been callous and cruel

as Charles yelled out at the end of X Men First Class:

THEY'RE JUST FOLLOWING ORDERS!

[The Grand Duchy Of Nova Capile]

This shows that the USA has no moral high ground over Nazi Germany. Especially when added up with Jim Crow and Japanese internment.

You’re one to talk.

Especially considering that you wanted to murder all dogs, sentence noisy people to death, and have proposed other outrageous totalitarian ideas.

Please stop with the ad hominem. Not to mention that judging someone based on the laws they've put into motion on NationStates is pretty ridiculous. A lot of people create nations exactly opposite their political ideologies just because it's fun. Implying that Mushroom wants those things to happen in real life is ludicrous.

[Fartsniffage]

You’re one to talk.

Especially considering that you wanted to murder all dogs, sentence noisy people to death, and have proposed other outrageous totalitarian ideas.

Please stop with the ad hominem. Not to mention that judging someone based on the laws they've put into motion on NationStates is pretty ridiculous. A lot of people create nations exactly opposite their political ideologies just because it's fun. Implying that Mushroom wants those things to happen in real life is ludicrous.

He has created threads in NSG advocating exactly those things.

[Torrocca]

Given how lightly the nazis at Nuremberg got off I'm glad they shot captured SS. Should have had a policy of shooting them on sight.

but this would have been callous and cruel

as Charles yelled out at the end of X Men First Class:

THEY'RE JUST FOLLOWING ORDERS!

>Voluntarily join the Waffen SS, voluntarily commit atrocities as part of the grander scope of the Holocaust, torture and rape perhaps thousands of enslaved people in a massive extermination camp, willingly continue to commit atrocities and help fuel the fires of an industrialized genocide
>"They're just following orders!"
>Get shot for following orders
>"Wow this is so sad Alexa play Despacito"

[Infected Mushroom]

but this would have been callous and cruel

as Charles yelled out at the end of X Men First Class:

THEY'RE JUST FOLLOWING ORDERS!

>Voluntarily join the Waffen SS, voluntarily commit atrocities as part of the grander scope of the Holocaust, torture and rape perhaps thousands of enslaved people in a massive extermination camp, willingly continue to commit atrocities and help fuel the fires of an industrialized genocide
>"They're just following orders!"
>Get shot for following orders
>"Wow this is so sad Alexa play Despacito"

something like that, except you make the first part sound too voluntary

[Torrocca]

>Voluntarily join the Waffen SS, voluntarily commit atrocities as part of the grander scope of the Holocaust, torture and rape perhaps thousands of enslaved people in a massive extermination camp, willingly continue to commit atrocities and help fuel the fires of an industrialized genocide
>"They're just following orders!"
>Get shot for following orders
>"Wow this is so sad Alexa play Despacito"

something like that, except you make the first part sound too voluntary

You act like foreign Nazi volunteers to the SS weren't foreign Nazi volunteers to the SS.