Democratic Socialism in the U.S and How to Pay for It?

[Tobleste]

Here have a chart that doesn't ignore two thirds of federal spending. Remember that this is only federal, and that most of the funding for public welfare programs is collected at state and local levels.

(Image)

Still, the US military is overfunded - if the US halved it's military budget, it would still be the world's most powerful military force, and the US government would have an additional $340 billion to spend on democratic "socialist" (still capitalist really) reforms.

Also the US healthcare system is a weird hybrid system that is pretty inefficient given the expense. A Koch funded group studied Medicare for all and found that it would reduce the national spending on healthcare by about €2 trillion.

https://newrepublic.com/minutes/150286/ ... ng-studies

“The net change across the whole ten-year period is a savings of $2.054 trillion,” Bruenig notes. “When talking about Medicare for All, it is important to distinguish between two concepts: national health expenditures and federal health expenditures. National health expenditures refer to all health spending from any source whether made by private employers, state Medicaid programs, or the federal government. It is national health expenditures that, according to the report, will decline by $2.054 trillion.”

Edit: Of course US conservatives would rather the extra €2 trillion was wasted then have a universal system that helped the poor because they're afraid it might help someone they hate.

[Tobleste]

You mean to tell me she didn't say the above quote?

Hmm....

That quote where the word "cheaper" does not appear anywhere? If I'm telling you anything it's that you are reading things that don't exist. So maybe I was wrong and you aren't lying, you're just hallucinating.

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Actually she claimed her miracle healthcare plan will be so cheap that the government would also be able to pay for everyone's funeral... and that they should... while refusing to explain why it'd be so cheap.

The fuck is wrong with you people? Did someone spike the water supply?

On another thread I theorized that republican types hate her because she's female, young, Hispanic and left wing meaning she's 4 of the 5 groups they despise. Their vitriolic insults whenever she gets mentioned backs me up imo.

[Washington Resistance Army]

That quote where the word "cheaper" does not appear anywhere? If I'm telling you anything it's that you are reading things that don't exist. So maybe I was wrong and you aren't lying, you're just hallucinating.

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The fuck is wrong with you people? Did someone spike the water supply?

On another thread I theorized that republican types hate her because she's female, young, Hispanic and left wing meaning she's 4 of the 5 groups they despise. Their vitriolic insults whenever she gets mentioned backs me up imo.

I don't think any of the people who insult her here are Republican types though

[Washington Resistance Army]

Here have a chart that doesn't ignore two thirds of federal spending. Remember that this is only federal, and that most of the funding for public welfare programs is collected at state and local levels.

Still, the US military is overfunded - if the US halved it's military budget, it would still be the world's most powerful military force, and the US government would have an additional $340 billion to spend on democratic "socialist" (still capitalist really) reforms.

Our military would also cease to be relevant on the international level. Unless all you Euro's wanna quadruple your military spending to better resist the Russians that isn't gonna happen.

[Tokora]

Still, the US military is overfunded - if the US halved it's military budget, it would still be the world's most powerful military force, and the US government would have an additional $340 billion to spend on democratic "socialist" (still capitalist really) reforms.

Our military would also cease to be relevant on the international level. Unless all you Euro's wanna quadruple your military spending to better resist the Russians that isn't gonna happen.

I'm confused, how does the most powerful military in world ONLY start to matter if it gets even more powerful than it already is?

[Washington Resistance Army]

Our military would also cease to be relevant on the international level. Unless all you Euro's wanna quadruple your military spending to better resist the Russians that isn't gonna happen.

I'm confused, how does the most powerful military in world ONLY start matter if it gets even more powerful than it already is?

Because it's already plagued with problems despite what some here think. Cutting a full half of the budget would ruin the military. Most all of our foreign bases would be closed, R&D would cease, troop numbers would get cut down etc etc.

[Ifreann]

I'm confused, how does the most powerful military in world ONLY start matter if it gets even more powerful than it already is?

Because it's already plagued with problems despite what some here think. Cutting a full half of the budget would ruin the military. Most all of our foreign bases would be closed, R&D would cease, troop numbers would get cut down etc etc.

You might have to finally stop the War in Afghanistan.

[The Lone Alliance]

She's like a slot machine for dumbass quotes.

I guess you forgot how many dumbass quotes Trump has made.

How true how true.

Actually she claimed her miracle healthcare plan will be so cheap that the government would also be able to pay for everyone's funeral... and that they should... while refusing to explain why it'd be so cheap.

The fuck is wrong with you people? Did someone spike the water supply?[/quote]
I actually was agreeing with you and saying that they were wrong in saying that "There would be no funerals" under her healthcare plan. That was fake news.

But she did say that she believed that the government should pay for funerals as well. Her statement was also very light on how to pay for all that.

It seems people don't like informing themselves on what the budget is actually for.

Entitlements are what it's for as well. That and the fact is the USA pays more per capita and total on healthcare than any other nation. How would us using Canadas system be more expensive when we pay more than they do now?

Because the healthcare industry overcharges people tremendously because
1. You either pay us or you die.
2. The insurance company soaks up most of the costs
3. "We might get sued therefore we need tons of extra money for legal things.
4. Some people can't pay so we must overcharge everyone else to make up for it.

[Ifreann]

I actually was agreeing with you and saying that they were wrong in saying that "There would be no funerals" under her healthcare plan. That was fake news.

But she did say that she believed that the government should pay for funerals as well. Her statement was also very light on how to pay for all that.

Is that in the video of the interview?

[The Lone Alliance]

I actually was agreeing with you and saying that they were wrong in saying that "There would be no funerals" under her healthcare plan. That was fake news.

But she did say that she believed that the government should pay for funerals as well. Her statement was also very light on how to pay for all that.

Is that in the video of the interview?

I got that from the transcript. Really though if I was wrong I'm kind of disappointed because funeral arrangements in the US are expensive, and I could see a rational reason to include it as part of healthcare.

[Great Minarchistan]

Yes to the first, no to the second.

I was thinking along the lines of Mondragon which has levels of stock for each level of employment going from unskilled to the CEO.

The unskilled guy gets one share while the CEO gets 14. Which means that the CEO gets 14x what the Unskilled guy is making, it’s also the amount of votes that they get. The company doesn’t have set wages but runs off of the profits they make. The more their profits and revenue go up the more the employees get paid

Mondragon seems to be pretty inefficient though. Do you have their income/expenditure statements?

[Uxupox]

Because it's already plagued with problems despite what some here think. Cutting a full half of the budget would ruin the military. Most all of our foreign bases would be closed, R&D would cease, troop numbers would get cut down etc etc.

You might have to finally stop the War in Afghanistan.

The moment the United States leaves Afghanistan it wouldn't even take a month for the Taliban to be once again become the governmental authority in the region.

[Thermodolia]

Here have a chart that doesn't ignore two thirds of federal spending. Remember that this is only federal, and that most of the funding for public welfare programs is collected at state and local levels.

Still, the US military is overfunded - if the US halved it's military budget, it would still be the world's most powerful military force, and the US government would have an additional $340 billion to spend on democratic "socialist" (still capitalist really) reforms.

We have already explained why this is bullshit. Anyway we shouldn’t be sacrificing our power and protection for bullshit

[Thermodolia]

On another thread I theorized that republican types hate her because she's female, young, Hispanic and left wing meaning she's 4 of the 5 groups they despise. Their vitriolic insults whenever she gets mentioned backs me up imo.

I don't think any of the people who insult her here are Republican types though

I’m not.

[Thermodolia]

I was thinking along the lines of Mondragon which has levels of stock for each level of employment going from unskilled to the CEO.

The unskilled guy gets one share while the CEO gets 14. Which means that the CEO gets 14x what the Unskilled guy is making, it’s also the amount of votes that they get. The company doesn’t have set wages but runs off of the profits they make. The more their profits and revenue go up the more the employees get paid

Mondragon seems to be pretty inefficient though. Do you have their income/expenditure statements?

Who fucking cares about being efficient. Chasing efficiency for efficiency is extremely dumb

[Thermodolia]

You might have to finally stop the War in Afghanistan.

The moment the United States leaves Afghanistan it wouldn't even take a month for the Taliban to be once again become the governmental authority in the region.

Sometimes I think we should leave Europe and Afghanistan. And then watch as everyone begs us to come back.

[Washington Resistance Army]

Because it's already plagued with problems despite what some here think. Cutting a full half of the budget would ruin the military. Most all of our foreign bases would be closed, R&D would cease, troop numbers would get cut down etc etc.

You might have to finally stop the War in Afghanistan.

And leave all you Euro's to defend yourselves and pull out of South Korea and stop bombing people like Daesh etc etc.

[Ifreann]

Is that in the video of the interview?

I got that from the transcript. Really though if I was wrong I'm kind of disappointed because funeral arrangements in the US are expensive, and I could see a rational reason to include it as part of healthcare.

There's a transcript?

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You might have to finally stop the War in Afghanistan.

The moment the United States leaves Afghanistan it wouldn't even take a month for the Taliban to be once again become the governmental authority in the region.

Then I guess you're going to be at war forever.

[Uxupox]

I got that from the transcript. Really though if I was wrong I'm kind of disappointed because funeral arrangements in the US are expensive, and I could see a rational reason to include it as part of healthcare.

There's a transcript?

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The moment the United States leaves Afghanistan it wouldn't even take a month for the Taliban to be once again become the governmental authority in the region.

Then I guess you're going to be at war forever.

tbh I could care less about Afghanistan however a Taliban Afghanistan is just a catastrophe waiting to happen with their Pakistani neighbor with their nuclear capability.

[Great Minarchistan]

Still, the US military is overfunded - if the US halved it's military budget, it would still be the world's most powerful military force, and the US government would have an additional $340 billion to spend on democratic "socialist" (still capitalist really) reforms.

A bit too weird to see a technocrat missing comparative numbers and using nominal ones instead. By a gdp metric, the US military is actually slightly above the world's average, with Saudi Arabia and Russia above them.

[Great Minarchistan]

Mondragon seems to be pretty inefficient though. Do you have their income/expenditure statements?

Who fucking cares about being efficient. Chasing efficiency for efficiency is extremely dumb

You know, chasing efficiency allows people to work less while having a higher purchasing power, while allowing for minimal waste on production. I thought you were pro-worker and pro-environment?

[Wysten]

That quote where the word "cheaper" does not appear anywhere? If I'm telling you anything it's that you are reading things that don't exist. So maybe I was wrong and you aren't lying, you're just hallucinating.

---

The fuck is wrong with you people? Did someone spike the water supply?

On another thread I theorized that republican types hate her because she's female, young, Hispanic and left wing meaning she's 4 of the 5 groups they despise. Their vitriolic insults whenever she gets mentioned backs me up imo.

I mean some of us insult here because she's a idiot for saying such great things like the upper middle class doesn't exist or that single payer will cover funeral expenses.

[Ifreann]

On another thread I theorized that republican types hate her because she's female, young, Hispanic and left wing meaning she's 4 of the 5 groups they despise. Their vitriolic insults whenever she gets mentioned backs me up imo.

I mean some of us insult here because she's a idiot for saying such great things like the upper middle class doesn't exist or that single payer will cover funeral expenses.

Yes, I'm sure you are insulting her because of things that she didn't actually say.

[Washington Resistance Army]

I mean some of us insult here because she's a idiot for saying such great things like the upper middle class doesn't exist or that single payer will cover funeral expenses.

Yes, I'm sure you are insulting her because of things that she didn't actually say.

http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/08/08/o ... re-america

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa ... l-n2508254

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Thanatttynia]

On another thread I theorized that republican types hate her because she's female, young, Hispanic and left wing meaning she's 4 of the 5 groups they despise. Their vitriolic insults whenever she gets mentioned backs me up imo.

I mean some of us insult here because she's a idiot for saying such great things like the upper middle class doesn't exist or that single payer will cover funeral expenses.

Some of you insult her because of wilful misrepresentations and misreadings of what she actually said? Colour me surprised