Saudi Arabia VS Canada human rights activists

[Sovaal]

Amen. Saudis are asshole but at least they did the right thing here, that foreign countries have no right to interfere with how other country run themselves and especially diplomats that main responsibility is to keep friendly relation to say such things. They also send important message that western countries can't just act all they want without repercussion.

Why shouldn't foreign countries stand up for human rights?

Countries the west interferes with don't tend to turn out so good.

[Dogmeat]

You know, for all the talk of liberals being special snowflakes, it's ultra-conservatives who seem to be the specialist snowflakes of them all.

Can't handle even the slightest criticism.

[Sovaal]

You know, for all the talk of liberals being special snowflakes, it's ultra-conservatives who seem to be the specialist snowflakes of them all.

Can't handle even the slightest criticism.

Extremists on both sides tend to not like criticisms of any kind, if in power they tend to sick their secret police on you.

[Thanatttynia]

Why shouldn't foreign countries stand up for human rights?

Countries the west interferes with don't tend to turn out so good.

Agreed, but that doesn't mean repressive governments should be appeased purely because human rights are a barrier to the acquisition of wealth under capitalism.

[Union of Socialist Alpine Republics]

I find it funny that a country with a large history of human rights abuse in the past (The native american and metis genocide and hanging of Louis Riel, and also the attack on villages in Québec who supported the Patriotes for asking a responsible government which resulted in many killings and many women being raped), is actually accusing another country of commiting human rights abuse. And I find Saudi's response even more funnier.

[Sovaal]

I find it funny that a country with a large history of human rights abuse in the past (The native american and metis genocide and hanging of Louis Riel, and also the attack on villages in Québec who supported the Patriotes for asking a responsible government which resulted in many killings and many women being raped), is actually accusing another country of commiting human rights abuse. And I find Saudi's response even more funnier.

If we're going that route no country should criticise another ever.

[Thanatttynia]

I find it funny that a country with a large history of human rights abuse in the past (The native american and metis genocide and hanging of Louis Riel, and also the attack on villages in Québec who supported the Patriotes for asking a responsible government which resulted in many killings and many women being raped), is actually accusing another country of commiting human rights abuse. And I find Saudi's response even more funnier.

The funniest thing is claiming the scale of human rights abuses in the present day is at all comparable between Canada and Saudi Arabia.

[North Arkana]

I find it funny that a country with a large history of human rights abuse in the past (The native american and metis genocide and hanging of Louis Riel, and also the attack on villages in Québec who supported the Patriotes for asking a responsible government which resulted in many killings and many women being raped), is actually accusing another country of commiting human rights abuse. And I find Saudi's response even more funnier.

And it is with zero surprise that I am forced to bring this up again.

Of course the huuuuuuuuuge, difference between the two is that Canada has a hundred years or so of not acting like that, Saudi Arabia has zero.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

I find it funny that a country with a large history of human rights abuse in the past (The native american and metis genocide and hanging of Louis Riel, and also the attack on villages in Québec who supported the Patriotes for asking a responsible government which resulted in many killings and many women being raped), is actually accusing another country of commiting human rights abuse. And I find Saudi's response even more funnier.

Whataboutism is a fallacy you know.

Put it this way:

If you have two cats and one cat makes a massive mess while the other only adds a bit of mess, what cat do you blame more?

The cat who did most of the mess or the other cat who only contributed a tiny bit of mess?

Your analogy is misrepresentative of what happened. It's more like if the first cat moved a vase to the very edge of a table, but didn't knock it over, and the second one did knock it over. You can't blame the first one for the second one actually committing to the fuckup.

At the same time, actions are what counts.

The first one did all of the work.

[Thanatttynia]

Your analogy is misrepresentative of what happened. It's more like if the first cat moved a vase to the very edge of a table, but didn't knock it over, and the second one did knock it over. You can't blame the first one for the second one actually committing to the fuckup.

At the same time, actions are what counts.

The first one did all of the work.

And the second one committed the action.

[United Muscovite Nations]

He still finalized the deal, which means he approved of the deal.

Harper set up, started talks, finalized talks, and did all of the leg work for the deal.

All Trudeau did was say yes to the deal that was already done by Harper.

That doesn't excuse it. Like Torocca said, he could have said no, that's part of what new governments do.

[Agarntrop]

I find it funny that a country with a large history of human rights abuse in the past (The native american and metis genocide and hanging of Louis Riel, and also the attack on villages in Québec who supported the Patriotes for asking a responsible government which resulted in many killings and many women being raped), is actually accusing another country of commiting human rights abuse. And I find Saudi's response even more funnier.

The Quebec attacks happened 150 years ago, the arrest and whipping of political opponents in Saudi Arabia goes on to this day.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

At the same time, actions are what counts.

The first one did all of the work.

And the second one committed the action.

That the first one started and would have committed if he wasn't elected out.

It wasn't the second one's idea to start it, and he wouldn't have made the deal at all.

[Torrocca]

I find it funny that a country with a large history of human rights abuse in the past (The native american and metis genocide and hanging of Louis Riel, and also the attack on villages in Québec who supported the Patriotes for asking a responsible government which resulted in many killings and many women being raped), is actually accusing another country of commiting human rights abuse. And I find Saudi's response even more funnier.

Whataboutism is a fallacy you know.

Your analogy is misrepresentative of what happened. It's more like if the first cat moved a vase to the very edge of a table, but didn't knock it over, and the second one did knock it over. You can't blame the first one for the second one actually committing to the fuckup.

At the same time, actions are what counts.

The first one did all of the work.

Doesn't matter when Trudeau had the power to refuse to commit to the crime yet didn't refuse.

[Thanatttynia]

And the second one committed the action.

That the first one started and would have committed if he wasn't elected out.

It wasn't the second one's idea to start it, and he wouldn't have made the deal at all.

Trudeau had the power to stop it and didn't. Therefore, he is responsible for it. Governments aren't required to blindly follow whatever plan the previous government started.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

Whataboutism is a fallacy you know.


At the same time, actions are what counts.

The first one did all of the work.

Doesn't matter when Trudeau had the power to refuse to commit to the crime yet didn't refuse.

But the crime was already set up by someone else. That someone else was already doing it when he came in.

This is going in circles so I think I'll stop here.

[Shofercia]

Hold the line Canada. The free world is with you. We are coming.

Who's we?

And if "The Free World" hasn't done anything to the Sauds already, being the corrupt, brutalist, puritan, radicalism endorsing state they are, they're not going to do anything about them being mean to Canucks.

Yep: https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/ ... -expelled/

The international community must speak up for detained human rights defenders in Saudi Arabia, Amnesty International said today, after the Canadian ambassador to the country was expelled after calling for their release. “The international community must push Saudi Arabian authorities to end this draconian crackdown and targeted repression of human rights defenders in the country”, said Samah Hadid, Amnesty International’s Middle East Director of Campaigns.

“Instead of pursuing human rights reform, the government of Saudi Arabia has chosen to lash out with punitive measures in the face of criticism. States with significant influence in Saudi Arabia - such as the USA, UK and France - have now remained silent for far too long. “The world cannot continue to look the other way as this relentless persecution of human rights defenders in Saudi Arabia continues. It is now time for other governments to join Canada in increasing the pressure on Saudi Arabia to release all prisoners of conscience immediately and unconditionally, and end the crackdown on freedom of expression in the country.”

Looks like the World can continue to look the other way.

Antisemitism, boo-fucking-hoo.

Fascist Arab supremacists? What? Even when the Houthis have allegedly had black Yemenis among their ranks, Hezbollah operate with Pakistani, Afghan and Iranian members and Assad fights alongside non-Arabs such as Armenians and Druze?

I should ignore the rest of your text given your first sentence, but yes. the Houthis and the Hezbollah are ideologically arab Nationalist. Ba'athism as an ideology is almost literally national socialism if it replaced Arab with Aryan in the appropriate place. Hitler employed Jews and Slavs in his government, doesn't make him any less of a German Supremacist.

So where were these Ba'ath death camps, killing off 90% of the prisoners solely for their religion/ethnicity/uncut penis, with over 10 million deaths? If you're going to go full "mah opponent is Hitler" I'm not going to tolerate that shit.

Yeah, thats what I said, If they did that would mean if they went though with killing thousands people.

Ah, okay. Realistically, it be near suicidal for them to go through with such an action.

Near suicidal? If they went through with it, they'd have NATO liberating their ass, and the rest of the World going "why, KSA, why?" It'd be 100% suicidal. Unlike kicking out the ambassador, that image was completely inappropriate, and I agree with Herp. If that's near suicidal, what does it take to be totally suicidal?

[United Muscovite Nations]

Doesn't matter when Trudeau had the power to refuse to commit to the crime yet didn't refuse.

But the crime was already set up by someone else. That someone else was already doing it when he came in.

This is going in circles so I think I'll stop here.

So, if you're handed a gun to kill someone that someone else kidnapped, and you shoot the person, you have no responsibility?

[Shofercia]

At the risk of sounding like a whataboutist, the West does this as well.

1. Yes this is whataboutism.
2. What terrorists do we sponsor?
3. Interesting that you try to compare a specific nation with a broad cultural/geo-political group, makes it easier for ya huh?

2. Those lovely heart eating folks that the FSA is allied with. No argument on 1 and 3.

Also, this is where I disagree with Herp: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... 761939.png

[Torrocca]

Doesn't matter when Trudeau had the power to refuse to commit to the crime yet didn't refuse.

But the crime was already set up by someone else. That someone else was already doing it when he came in.

This is going in circles so I think I'll stop here.

ffs, committing a crime that someone else set up doesn't absolve you of the crime committed.

[Genivaria]

1. Yes this is whataboutism.
2. What terrorists do we sponsor?
3. Interesting that you try to compare a specific nation with a broad cultural/geo-political group, makes it easier for ya huh?

2. Those lovely heart eating folks that the FSA is allied with. No argument on 1 and 3.

Also, this is where I disagree with Herp: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... 761939.png

Not familiar with any heart eating honestly but I'll grant that the FSA is at best grey.

[Kubumba Tribe]

2. Those lovely heart eating folks that the FSA is allied with. No argument on 1 and 3.

Also, this is where I disagree with Herp: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... 761939.png

Not familiar with any heart eating honestly but I'll grant that the FSA is at best grey.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Syrian_Army

[Page]

At the risk of sounding like a whataboutist, the West does this as well.

1. Yes this is whataboutism.
2. What terrorists do we sponsor?
3. Interesting that you try to compare a specific nation with a broad cultural/geo-political group, makes it easier for ya huh?

What terrorists has the west sponsored?

For starters

- Contras in Nicaragua
- Right-wing guerrillas in Colombia
- Mujaheddin in Afghanistan

But that's decades ago. It's not like we've sponsored any terrorists lately... except for those radical Islamist terrorists in Syria who got training and a bunch of American weapons (oh, sorry, I meant to say "moderate rebels" ). And if you want to include state terror, the US and UK are giving financial and military support to a literal genocide in Yemen.

[Shofercia]

2. Those lovely heart eating folks that the FSA is allied with. No argument on 1 and 3.

Also, this is where I disagree with Herp: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... 761939.png

Not familiar with any heart eating honestly but I'll grant that the FSA is at best grey.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22519770

A video which appears to show a Syrian rebel taking a bite from the heart of a dead soldier has been widely condemned. US-based Human Rights Watch identified the rebel as Abu Sakkar, a well-known insurgent from the city of Homs, and said his actions were a war crime. The main Syrian opposition coalition said he would be put on trial. The video, which cannot be independently authenticated, seems to show him cutting out the heart.

"I swear to God we will eat your hearts and your livers, you soldiers of Bashar the dog," the man says, referring to President Bashar al-Assad as he stands over the soldier's corpse. Abu Sakkar has appeared in videos firing rockets at Shia villages in Lebanon in April 2013 and posing with bodies of Hezbollah fighters
HRW said the attacks on the Shia villages appeared to be indiscriminate and a war crime. Human Rights Watch (HRW) says Abu Sakkar is the leader of a group called the Independent Omar al-Farouq Brigade, an offshoot of the Free Syrian Army (FSA) Al-Farouq Brigades.

He was not put on trial, (shocker,) but was killed in combat. As for who killed him - that depends on who you listen to, and what sources you read, but most confirmed that he's dead, and won't be chomping on any more hearts. Someone should've told him that winning hearts and minds wasn't meant to be taken literally, and it wasn't about dinner.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

Ah, okay. Realistically, it be near suicidal for them to go through with such an action.

Near suicidal? If they went through with it, they'd have NATO liberating their ass, and the rest of the World going "why, KSA, why?" It'd be 100% suicidal. Unlike kicking out the ambassador, that image was completely inappropriate, and I agree with Herp. If that's near suicidal, what does it take to be totally suicidal?

I'm not sure but I do wonder, if this did happen, would America like to make the south part of Saudi Arabia the 51st state and we will take the north as the 11th province?