[Abortion Thread] (YET ANOTHER POLL!) Taking measure.

[Datlofff]

And by killing the fetus you are robbing it of the chance to ever experience said life.

Potential is a completely abstract quality. if a fetus was aborted before 24 weeks, it would have never knew that it even existed and would not have experienced the slightest inconvenience.

So you're saying that potential doesnt matter basically? So a fetus that could one day grow to be a full fledged thinking, feeling person is useless because it won't care that it's dead right now? You are aware that fetus are conscious right?

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

Potential is a completely abstract quality. if a fetus was aborted before 24 weeks, it would have never knew that it even existed and would not have experienced the slightest inconvenience.

So you're saying that potential doesnt matter basically? So a fetus that could one day grow to be a full fledged thinking, feeling person is useless because it won't care that it's dead right now? You are aware that fetus are conscious right?

It has been scientifically proven that a fetus does not become conscious until 24-30 weeks

[The New California Republic]

So you're saying that potential doesnt matter basically?

Yup, my sperm can potentially help create a life, but that doesn't stop me doing things with it that will not result in that potential being fulfilled...

[Dogmeat]

Potential is a completely abstract quality. if a fetus was aborted before 24 weeks, it would have never knew that it even existed and would not have experienced the slightest inconvenience.

So you're saying that potential doesnt matter basically? So a fetus that could one day grow to be a full fledged thinking, feeling person is useless because it won't care that it's dead right now? You are aware that fetus are conscious right?

Potential really doesn't matter. If you come onto my property and chop down an ancient oak, I will of course be quite pissed off. But pick an acorn off the ground, and I won't care in the slightest.

[Estanglia]

Potential is a completely abstract quality. if a fetus was aborted before 24 weeks, it would have never knew that it even existed and would not have experienced the slightest inconvenience.

So you're saying that potential doesnt matter basically?

Yup.

You are aware that fetus are conscious right?

They're not until 24 weeks at least.

[The Alma Mater]

The only reason you can actually experience life is because you are conscious and have emotions - and it has been scientifically proven that a fetus does not become conscious until 24-30 weeks (and 92% of abortions happen before 12 weeks, let alone 24)

And by killing the fetus you are robbing it of the chance to ever experience said life.

And who is being robbed, exactly ?
You cannot rob someone who does not exist and never will exist.

[The New California Republic]

And by killing the fetus you are robbing it of the chance to ever experience said life.

And who is being robbed, exactly ?
You cannot rob someone who does not exist and never will exist.

Yup. The nullification is total.

[Godular]

Potential is a completely abstract quality. if a fetus was aborted before 24 weeks, it would have never knew that it even existed and would not have experienced the slightest inconvenience.

So you're saying that potential doesnt matter basically? So a fetus that could one day grow to be a full fledged thinking, feeling person is useless because it won't care that it's dead right now? You are aware that fetus are conscious right?

No, no they are not.

[San Lumen]

Potential is a completely abstract quality. if a fetus was aborted before 24 weeks, it would have never knew that it even existed and would not have experienced the slightest inconvenience.

So you're saying that potential doesnt matter basically? So a fetus that could one day grow to be a full fledged thinking, feeling person is useless because it won't care that it's dead right now? You are aware that fetus are conscious right?

And what if its a toxic pregnancy? The life of the fetus matters more than the mother?

[Estanglia]

So you're saying that potential doesnt matter basically? So a fetus that could one day grow to be a full fledged thinking, feeling person is useless because it won't care that it's dead right now? You are aware that fetus are conscious right?

And what if its a toxic pregnancy? The life of the fetus matters more than the mother?

Clearly the mother should just let the fetus kill it, after all the baby could potentially become the next (insert famous person here). /s

[San Lumen]

And what if its a toxic pregnancy? The life of the fetus matters more than the mother?

Clearly the mother should just let the fetus kill it, after all the baby could potentially become the next (insert famous person here). /s

Pro lifers here dont seem to want to answer that question.

[Estanglia]

Clearly the mother should just let the fetus kill it, after all the baby could potentially become the next (insert famous person here). /s

Pro lifers here dont seem to want to answer that question.

I know. Every time you or another person asks that question, the pro-lifer who is against all abortions either ignores it or doesn't fully answer it.

[Telconi]

Clearly the mother should just let the fetus kill it, after all the baby could potentially become the next (insert famous person here). /s

Pro lifers here dont seem to want to answer that question.

Despite plenty of us having answered essentially this exact question.

[Godular]

Pro lifers here dont seem to want to answer that question.

Despite plenty of us having answered essentially this exact question.

Are you one of the under-no-circumstances pro-lifers being spoken of?

[Estanglia]

Pro lifers here dont seem to want to answer that question.

Despite plenty of us having answered essentially this exact question.

San Lumen is talking about the hardcore, no abortions ever people, not regular pro lifers.

[EldrichVoid1-3]

So long as the mother wants an abortion, the abortion should occur. The reason behind the abortion shouldn't matter. Having a child can mess your, and the child's, life up. Ignoring natural urges is also extremely unlikely. Better to save the child from a life of endless issues and possibly growing up to be criminal. Though, such a save is rather grim, a lot of aspects of life are.

[The New California Republic]

Judge throws out challenge to Scots abortion pill move

Scottish women will still be allowed to take abortion pills at home after a legal challenge against the move was thrown out. Scotland became the first part of the UK to let women take the drug misoprostol at home last year. The Society for the Protection of Unborn Children (SPUC) challenged the decision at the Court of Session. However, judge Lady Wise has now ruled that the Scottish government's move was "not unlawful". SPUC said it was "extremely disappointed" with the decision and that it would appeal against the ruling.

The vast majority of abortions in Scotland take place at less than nine weeks gestation, and are medical rather than surgical procedures. The medical treatment involves taking two different drugs - first misfepristone, which blocks hormones which maintain the pregnancy, and then misoprostol, which can be taken on the same or following days. Within an hour of taking the second tablet, women often experience heavy bleeding - usually on the way home from the clinic. Scottish ministers moved to let women take misoprostol at home, saying this would allow them to be "in control of their treatment and as comfortable as possible during this procedure". This already happens in other countries such as France and Sweden, and the British Pregnancy Advisory Service has been lobbying for the law in the UK to be changed.

No abortion clinics for pro-life people to picket if women have the abortion at home.

[Dylar]

Judge throws out challenge to Scots abortion pill move

Scottish women will still be allowed to take abortion pills at home after a legal challenge against the move was thrown out. Scotland became the first part of the UK to let women take the drug misoprostol at home last year. The Society for the Protection of Unborn Children (SPUC) challenged the decision at the Court of Session. However, judge Lady Wise has now ruled that the Scottish government's move was "not unlawful". SPUC said it was "extremely disappointed" with the decision and that it would appeal against the ruling.

The vast majority of abortions in Scotland take place at less than nine weeks gestation, and are medical rather than surgical procedures. The medical treatment involves taking two different drugs - first misfepristone, which blocks hormones which maintain the pregnancy, and then misoprostol, which can be taken on the same or following days. Within an hour of taking the second tablet, women often experience heavy bleeding - usually on the way home from the clinic. Scottish ministers moved to let women take misoprostol at home, saying this would allow them to be "in control of their treatment and as comfortable as possible during this procedure". This already happens in other countries such as France and Sweden, and the British Pregnancy Advisory Service has been lobbying for the law in the UK to be changed.

No abortion clinics for pro-life people to picket if women have the abortion at home.

Picket the homes! Everyone has to sleep under the stars!!

[Datlofff]

Pro lifers here dont seem to want to answer that question.

I know. Every time you or another person asks that question, the pro-lifer who is against all abortions either ignores it or doesn't fully answer it.

You want me to answer this? okay, pretty easy actually. If the pregnancy is deemed "toxic" by whatever definition you are giving that. (Bearing in mind the death rate of mothers during pregnancy is already less than 2%). Then It should be up to the mother then, because in the situation you've presented, if the mother carries the baby to term, the baby lives, but she dies. And if she aborts it, she lives and the baby dies. So in this situation its entirely up to the mother to sacrifice herself for her unborn child, or kill the child. A life for a life per say.

[Godular]

Judge throws out challenge to Scots abortion pill move

Scottish women will still be allowed to take abortion pills at home after a legal challenge against the move was thrown out. Scotland became the first part of the UK to let women take the drug misoprostol at home last year. The Society for the Protection of Unborn Children (SPUC) challenged the decision at the Court of Session. However, judge Lady Wise has now ruled that the Scottish government's move was "not unlawful". SPUC said it was "extremely disappointed" with the decision and that it would appeal against the ruling.

The vast majority of abortions in Scotland take place at less than nine weeks gestation, and are medical rather than surgical procedures. The medical treatment involves taking two different drugs - first misfepristone, which blocks hormones which maintain the pregnancy, and then misoprostol, which can be taken on the same or following days. Within an hour of taking the second tablet, women often experience heavy bleeding - usually on the way home from the clinic. Scottish ministers moved to let women take misoprostol at home, saying this would allow them to be "in control of their treatment and as comfortable as possible during this procedure". This already happens in other countries such as France and Sweden, and the British Pregnancy Advisory Service has been lobbying for the law in the UK to be changed.

No abortion clinics for pro-life people to picket if women have the abortion at home.

What exactly can SPUC appeal about this?

[Nettunia]

Get out of my uterus.

I like my eggs scrambled, thanks.

[The New California Republic]

What exactly can SPUC appeal about this?

They appealed it on the basis that abortions should only be carried out at a medical facility (where they can picket it coincidentally ), but the Judge presiding over the case said that was complete bullshit:

Pro-life group SPUC challenged the decision in Scotland's highest court, arguing that such a move contravenes the 1967 Abortion Act. It said abortions could only legally be carried out in a medical facility, and argued that allowing women to take the tablet at home could put their health at risk. However, Lady Wise rejected this, saying: "It seems to me that patients who self-administer medication at home may still be described as being treated by their medical practitioner, who remains in charge of that treatment." Drawing an example to diabetics injecting themselves with insulin, she added: "Regardless of place, there is no need for a doctor to hand the medication to the woman personally." Dismissing the challenge, the judge wrote: "I have concluded that the decision of the respondents to approve a woman's home as a place where one stage of the termination of pregnancy can be carried out is not unlawful on either of the grounds contended for by the petitioner."

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

What exactly can SPUC appeal about this?

They appealed it on the basis that abortions should only be carried out at a medical facility (where they can picket it coincidentally ), but the Judge presiding over the case said that was complete bullshit:

Pro-life group SPUC challenged the decision in Scotland's highest court, arguing that such a move contravenes the 1967 Abortion Act. It said abortions could only legally be carried out in a medical facility, and argued that allowing women to take the tablet at home could put their health at risk. However, Lady Wise rejected this, saying: "It seems to me that patients who self-administer medication at home may still be described as being treated by their medical practitioner, who remains in charge of that treatment." Drawing an example to diabetics injecting themselves with insulin, she added: "Regardless of place, there is no need for a doctor to hand the medication to the woman personally." Dismissing the challenge, the judge wrote: "I have concluded that the decision of the respondents to approve a woman's home as a place where one stage of the termination of pregnancy can be carried out is not unlawful on either of the grounds contended for by the petitioner."

Whether taking the abortion pill at home is legal or not makes no difference to the number of fetuses killed

[The New California Republic]

They appealed it on the basis that abortions should only be carried out at a medical facility (where they can picket it coincidentally ), but the Judge presiding over the case said that was complete bullshit.

Whether taking the abortion pill at home is legal or not makes no difference to the number of fetuses killed

Exactly. It was just a frivolous case whereby pro-life people were trying to throw a spanner in the works of accessibility to abortions by picking up on some technicality, and the judge saw it for the spuriousness that it was.

I personally do think that they fought against it because such abortions are far harder for them to influence through picketing and the like, since the prescriptions are issued by ordinary doctors practices, and fulfilled by ordinary pharmacies, meaning there are far too many targets for the picketeers to go after, and they were a bit butthurt about that...

[Genivaria]

I know. Every time you or another person asks that question, the pro-lifer who is against all abortions either ignores it or doesn't fully answer it.

You want me to answer this? okay, pretty easy actually. If the pregnancy is deemed "toxic" by whatever definition you are giving that. (Bearing in mind the death rate of mothers during pregnancy is already less than 2%). Then It should be up to the mother then, because in the situation you've presented, if the mother carries the baby to term, the baby lives, but she dies. And if she aborts it, she lives and the baby dies. So in this situation its entirely up to the mother to sacrifice herself for her unborn child, or kill the child. A life for a life per say.

(Bearing in mind the death rate of mothers during pregnancy is already less than 2%).

Bearing in mind that if you told me I had to do a action which had a 2% chance of killing me I'd tell you to piss off.