[Abortion Thread] (YET ANOTHER POLL!) Taking measure.

[Bombadil]

..having said that I did see an argument that banning abortion helps to uncover incest and paedophilia because the evidence can't be quietly aborted.

Implying they wouldn't just go to some back-alley abortionist or use a coat-hanger or herbal medicine to try to do it themselves...

That would be immoral.

[The Free Joy State]

..having said that I did see an argument that banning abortion helps to uncover incest and paedophilia because the evidence can't be quietly aborted.

Implying they wouldn't just go to some back-alley abortionist or use a coat-hanger or herbal medicine to try to do it themselves...

In Brazil, for example, Misoprostol is generally used for illegal abortions (about a million a year)

It can't be banned. It's on the WHO's list of essential medicines. It treats miscarriage.

[Alouite]

Implying they wouldn't just go to some back-alley abortionist or use a coat-hanger or herbal medicine to try to do it themselves...

In Brazil, for example, Misoprostol is generally used for illegal abortions (about a million a year)

It can't be banned. It's on the WHO's list of essential medicines. It treats miscarriage.

How could they know how many abortions occur if they are occurring illegally? Are they collecting the miscarriages somewhere? Seems very dubious. Also, who is to say you cannot regulate something on the WHO's list of essential medicines? Several medicines require prescriptions in order to access if they are known to be used additionally for harmful purposes. Why wouldn't that apply in this hypothetical scenario?

[Vassenor]

Implying they wouldn't just go to some back-alley abortionist or use a coat-hanger or herbal medicine to try to do it themselves...

I think you will find that though some would do anything to abort, an abortion ban would successfully and significantly reduce the abortion rate.

And that is a good thing why?

[USS Monitor]

Implying they wouldn't just go to some back-alley abortionist or use a coat-hanger or herbal medicine to try to do it themselves...

I think you will find that though some would do anything to abort, an abortion ban would successfully and significantly reduce the abortion rate.

For people who have something to cover up and they'll be facing criminal charges if it comes out? They've already broken the law anyway, so I don't see how they have much to lose, and I don't see why you would expect them to respect the law when it comes to abortion.

[USS Monitor]

Implying they wouldn't just go to some back-alley abortionist or use a coat-hanger or herbal medicine to try to do it themselves...

That would be immoral.

They're pedos...

[Beggnig]

Stop murdering children.

[Gormwood]

Stop murdering children.

Much better to leave them fending for themselves and die or drift into a life of crime.

[Bombadil]

That would be immoral.

They're pedos...

In Alabama that's fine, hell you can almost be governor..

[Gormwood]

They're pedos...

In Alabama that's fine, hell you can almost be governor..

Senator.

[The Free Joy State]

In Brazil, for example, Misoprostol is generally used for illegal abortions (about a million a year)

It can't be banned. It's on the WHO's list of essential medicines. It treats miscarriage.

How could they know how many abortions occur if they are occurring illegally? Are they collecting the miscarriages somewhere? Seems very dubious.

Estimates on illegal abortions (which can range up to 4 million in Brazil) are compiled in part based on the number of complications that go to hospital (unsafe abortions are one of the main causes of maternal mortality in the developing world, which is why abortion must be legal and safe), and on non-judgmental experts talking to women on the ground. But I am not a WHO statistician.

Also, who is to say you cannot regulate something on the WHO's list of essential medicines?

Restrict essential medicines (in the case of Misoprostol, one that costs literally pennies). Yes, I'm sure the UN and the World Health Organisation would go for that.

Several medicines require prescriptions in order to access

Pretty sure Misoprostol does. Guess what... those who perform illegal abortions operate... outside the law.

if they are known to be used additionally for harmful purposes. Why wouldn't that apply in this hypothetical scenario?

You mean the literal scenario happening daily in South America?

Well, there are doctors who perform abortions illegally and plenty of people know they do it and do nor report it.

Because a person's bodily autonomy is something that must be defended, and because no-one knows when they may be the next one who needs help.

Stop murdering children.

Oh dear... a drive-by.

There are three things wrong with your statement: "stop", "murdering", and "children".

#1. A child is: "2) a person 14 years and under. A "child" should be distinguished from a "minor" who is anyone under 18 in almost all states."

--> A "person" "shall include every infant member of the species homo sapiens who is born alive at any stage of development."

So, foetuses are not children.

#2. Murder is the illegal killing of a person. Person has been covered and abortion is not illegal. So, there is no murder.

#3. Most pro-choice people do not actually perform abortions, so we are not performing any action for you to tell us to stop doing it.

[New haven america]

They replied to posts that were discussing Alabama's new abortion law, which bans it in cases of incest and rape, saying that we need to look at "The Other Side" (Pro-life, which is their own side...) and why they decided to do this.

So either they're ok with rape and incest (Which I don't think they are, least I hope they aren't), or they're fine with laws like this getting passed so long as they win more ground... I honestly can't decide which is worse. Either that, or they just picked a really shitty post to reply to, in which case, I'll take back what I said.

1. That is some seriously shady stuff you are doing right there. 2. Have some decency and 3. respect for others rather than assuming that they have the worst intentions and then making a post insinuating they should be punished for being alright with rape and incest. Just because someone is opposed to your position on abortion and is a moderator with a pro-life perspective doesn't make them "ok with both rape and incest", that is obviously libelous garbage and you should know better than to throw terms like that around at people to damage their reputation just because you disagree with their politics.

1. No it's not
2.
3. It not my fault that Luna brought up listening to and accepting the position of "The Other Side" (Pro-choice) in response to a discussion talking about Alabama's pro-incest/rape abortion law. Maybe they should've had the forethought not to get involved in that discussion to being with?

[The New California Republic]

Stop murdering children.

It is neither murder nor is the fetus a child. We have been over this repeatedly. Words mean things. You can't just garble words in a sentence and expect to make the slightest bit of sense.

[New haven america]

Stop murdering children.

It is neither murder nor is the fetus a child. We have been over this repeatedly. Words mean things. You can't just garble words in a sentence and expect to make the slightest bit of sense.

Lies!

[The Alma Mater]

Stop murdering children.

You first. Stop witholding your precious blood from dying kids, you monster.

[Asherahan]

The woman should have the right to abort the first trimester and after that for any medical reasons.

[The New California Republic]

The woman should have the right to abort the first trimester and after that for any medical reasons.

Why 12 weeks? Why not 24, as is the case in several places?

[Asherahan]

The woman should have the right to abort the first trimester and after that for any medical reasons.

Why 12 weeks? Why not 24, as is the case in several places?

Depending on the stages of the development of the fetus the abortive method changes. As I do not know when the cut off mark for the easy, reliable, safe and quick abortion method is I just settled for the first trimester where I know 100% that abortion method works.

[The New California Republic]

Why 12 weeks? Why not 24, as is the case in several places?

Depending on the stages of the development of the fetus the abortive method changes. As I do not know when the cut off mark for the easy, reliable, safe and quick abortion method is I just settled for the first trimester where I know 100% that abortion method works.

Here in the UK such abortions are performed up to 24 weeks, so no need for such a 12 week cutoff point.

[Asherahan]

Depending on the stages of the development of the fetus the abortive method changes. As I do not know when the cut off mark for the easy, reliable, safe and quick abortion method is I just settled for the first trimester where I know 100% that abortion method works.

Here in the UK such abortions are performed up to 24 weeks, so no need for such a 12 week cutoff point.

I looked at some stuff and I am gonna pass on that the fetus is way too much formed to ethically be aborted. At least in my opinion.

[The New California Republic]

Here in the UK such abortions are performed up to 24 weeks, so no need for such a 12 week cutoff point.

I looked at some stuff and I am gonna pass on that the fetus is way too much formed to ethically be aborted. At least in my opinion.

The reason for the 24 week cutoff is that consciousness begins and fetal viability goes over 50%.

[Asherahan]

I looked at some stuff and I am gonna pass on that the fetus is way too much formed to ethically be aborted. At least in my opinion.

The reason for the 24 week cutoff is that consciousness begins and fetal viability goes over 50%.

I respect and understand what your saying but i request that you do the same for my opinion.

Which is:

Abortion on Demand covered by the state for the first trimester and afterwards in case of Medical Complications or Reasonable Grounds.

[The Alma Mater]

The reason for the 24 week cutoff is that consciousness begins and fetal viability goes over 50%.

I respect and understand what your saying but i request that you do the same for my opinion.

Which is:

Abortion on Demand covered by the state for the first trimester and afterwards in case of Medical Complications or Reasonable Grounds.

A randomly chosen moment like "first trimester" will ofc. get less respect than a moment supported by reasoning like "the moment the fetus develops the ability to experience things".

[The New California Republic]

The reason for the 24 week cutoff is that consciousness begins and fetal viability goes over 50%.

I respect and understand what your saying but i request that you do the same for my opinion.

Which is:

Abortion on Demand covered by the state for the first trimester and afterwards in case of Medical Complications or Reasonable Grounds.

Women can also be unaware that they are pregnant at the 12 week stage.

[Asherahan]

I respect and understand what your saying but i request that you do the same for my opinion.

Which is:

Abortion on Demand covered by the state for the first trimester and afterwards in case of Medical Complications or Reasonable Grounds.

A randomly chosen moment like "first trimester" will ofc. get less respect than a moment supported by reasoning like "the moment the fetus develops the ability to experience things".

Thankfully we are not discussing policy that will impact the lives of real people and are just throwing our subjective opinions at each other.