[Abortion Thread] (YET ANOTHER POLL!) Taking measure.

[Kombinita Socialisma Demokratio]

If medically necessary: any stage
If the fetus has no chance of survival anyway/already dead: Hopefully no one is against this; any stage
If the fetus can be transferred to an artificial womb or incubator with x % chance of survival: any stage (x required goes up as the technology improves; it needs tested on human fetuses anyway)
Rape or mother and father no longer together: Am unsure if ever without one of the above exceptions
Anything else: No, not without one of the above exceptions

In addition though, provide free sterilizations, birth control, and anything needed for a child for anyone desiring. If any couple has had more than two pregnancies to term, sterilize them. Make the chemtrail conspiracy of spreading anti-fertility chemicals true. Make all medical care free (along with any painkillers during birth).

Man A: Wife was pregnant with twins, one was not going to survive and was already brain dead. Doctor said that if at least that one was not aborted, then the other and his wife would die. Still against it. His wife almost died.
Man B: Has teenage daughter. Said if his daughter were raped and she would die without an abortion, that he would not allow it (parental consent was required here at that time, I believe). Said he would also keep the child (whom he was certain would be biracial) as a reminder of how good God was.
Both of these men believed it to be immoral to not have four or more children (miscarriages and stillborns count), as the world is 'underpopulated' and 'Genesis said to replenish the earth, not replace'. They also believe in mandatory capital punishment for theft and all crimes more serious (and abortion, for the mother and doctor; also for being lbgt), and that those who don't do not care enough... They also believe that for miscarriages, and when the embryo dies (even if one cell), it will go to heaven and develop at a normal rate until seven years old.

I cannot understand that. And people believing in capital punishment for such a wide range of crimes are not pro-life, just anti-abortion.

[Ifreann]

My man, did you read what Joy posted? There are people who, in Ireland, (before the referenda) that had pregnancies where the fetus couldn't have gone to term, and c-section wasn't possible. The lady died of sepsis seven days later.

It gets worse.

A woman in Ireland -- with cancer (link's behind a paywall) -- was denied a termination, despite medical advice, because her life was "not in immediate danger"). She travelled to Britain, and did live, but it used to be a regular occurrence in Ireland apparently.

Sending women to England for an abortion was a national pastime until recently.

[Auze]

Before I forget
Link to previous thread: https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=415543
Might want to place it in the OP

[Irish Laren]

As I said: Abortion should be illegal, no matter what

My man, did you read what Joy posted? There are people who, in Ireland, (before the referenda) that had pregnancies where the fetus couldn't have gone to term, and c-section wasn't possible. The lady died of sepsis seven days later.

I am a woman

[Vassenor]

My man, did you read what Joy posted? There are people who, in Ireland, (before the referenda) that had pregnancies where the fetus couldn't have gone to term, and c-section wasn't possible. The lady died of sepsis seven days later.

I am a woman

And that disproves the rest of what was said how?

[Geneviev]

I am a woman

And that disproves the rest of what was said how?

It's not supposed to.

[Iyrwuld]

That's a good question which shines a light on the truth behind abortions; what constitutes life, in my opinion, is dependent on trimester. From what I've heard prior, second trimester abortions are rare if not entirely outlawed. When people are "in between", it could potentially be reference to this, or alternately be referring to the fact that rape can cause pregnancy and that some may believe this to be a pivotal point on their decisions.

[The South Falls]

My man, did you read what Joy posted? There are people who, in Ireland, (before the referenda) that had pregnancies where the fetus couldn't have gone to term, and c-section wasn't possible. The lady died of sepsis seven days later.

I am a woman

Sorry for misgendering you. I didn't mean it. And anyway, I call everybody "my man or my guy or my mate"

[The V O I D]

There is no “line” - women always have the right to abort pregnancies at any given time.

Early term abortions result in the termination of the fetus - unfortunate, but necessary, as forcing women to carry an unwanted pregnancy is just pointless, reasonless torture.

Late term abortions, especially ones after viability of the fetus is achieved, do not necessarily need to have termination; just remove the fetus and put it in the ICU for infants/fetuses until such time as they are stable, then put up for adoption or into state care.

No “lines” necessary - the pregnancy can be terminated at will, the women get control of their bodies.

[Neutraligon]

There is no “line” - women always have the right to abort pregnancies at any given time.

Early term abortions result in the termination of the fetus - unfortunate, but necessary, as forcing women to carry an unwanted pregnancy is just pointless, reasonless torture.

Late term abortions, especially ones after viability of the fetus is achieved, do not necessarily need to have termination; just remove the fetus and put it in the ICU for infants/fetuses until such time as they are stable, then put up for adoption or into state care.

No “lines” necessary - the pregnancy can be terminated at will, the women get control of their bodies.

Who will pay for the ICU?

[Ifreann]

There is no “line” - women always have the right to abort pregnancies at any given time.

Early term abortions result in the termination of the fetus - unfortunate, but necessary, as forcing women to carry an unwanted pregnancy is just pointless, reasonless torture.

Late term abortions, especially ones after viability of the fetus is achieved, do not necessarily need to have termination; just remove the fetus and put it in the ICU for infants/fetuses until such time as they are stable, then put up for adoption or into state care.

No “lines” necessary - the pregnancy can be terminated at will, the women get control of their bodies.

Who will pay for the ICU?

Obama?

[The V O I D]

There is no “line” - women always have the right to abort pregnancies at any given time.

Early term abortions result in the termination of the fetus - unfortunate, but necessary, as forcing women to carry an unwanted pregnancy is just pointless, reasonless torture.

Late term abortions, especially ones after viability of the fetus is achieved, do not necessarily need to have termination; just remove the fetus and put it in the ICU for infants/fetuses until such time as they are stable, then put up for adoption or into state care.

No “lines” necessary - the pregnancy can be terminated at will, the women get control of their bodies.

Who will pay for the ICU?

The State. Such a program would require increased funding into foster / adoptive care and state children's health care systems, but there are governmental sectors that are bloated and can afford cuts to allow for such a thing.

Point being that there is no “line” and that there also shouldn't be one. Pregnancy should be continuously optional for women. There should always be an “out” in the event a woman decides she does not wish to remain pregnant at any given time.

Minor edit: before anyone asks - yes, I support the right of bodily sovereignty of any/all born individuals. Everyone has the right to do whatever they please with their bodies, except for violate another person's bodily sovereignty. That's why I believe women should always have abortion (or, rather, pregnancy termination) as an option.

[The Blaatschapen]

I draw the line at "hey the foetus can live without the mother thanks to modern technology" then we can just go for adoption.

Besides that, I'm not a doctor nor am I pregnant, so it is not my business. Hence, I am pro-choice.

[Delta-9 Tetrahydrocannabinol]

According to some research, up to 90% of Roman Catholic women use birth control. And the Catholics on NSG are mad at me for deciding to leave the Church rather than remain within and continue to disobey it.

All of them?

No, not every single one of them, however I would say most are, from my encounters. I may add that Catholics on NSG tend to be more conservative in regards to Church dogma than their non-NSG counterparts....

[Katganistan]

Condoms are okay.

However, abortion should be an emergency procedure in cases of rape and incest, and nothing else. Otherwise, you are terminating a life. If you don't have a right to live, do you even have rights? Besides, it's not a pressing women's health issue if it can be resolved by using birth control or committing sexual abstinence.

It is a pressing woman's health issue, full stop.

[Katganistan]

I think a woman has enough right to her body that she can choose if she wants to have an Abortion.

No, abortion is a crime

Clearly, it isn't.

[Mystic Warriors]

It's none of my business what a woman does with HER body.

[Katganistan]

Yes, and it's child murder

Alright, back to the old routine. if you're not born, you're not a child.

[Cappuccina]

It's none of my business what a woman does with HER body.

If it involves another person, it should.

[Katganistan]

It's none of my business what a woman does with HER body.

If it involves another person, it should.

And yet, before viability, it does not.

Those beating the dead horse of adoption -- there are 425000 kids in the foster system, only approx. 100000 of whom are eligible for adoption. 20000 of these -- fully ONE FIFTH, or 20%, NEVER are adopted and when they age out are cut loose.

Furthermore the lovely sentiment of "infant ICUs after viability" is laudable, but folks view anyone on social welfare as parasites sucking on the government teat. There is a very loud bunch screaming about their tax dollars going to fund people in need of food and shelter, and now you want to add preemies (who will need a lot of very expensive medical care) and infants to the already strained system.

It's not feasible, no matter how laudable.

[The South Falls]

It's none of my business what a woman does with HER body.

If it involves another person, it should.

So the sovereignty of a non human goes over that of the mother?

[Godular]

Finally got home to my computer so I could think up a decent poll.

Before anybody says anything about that last option: Well, it IS unreasonable!

[The South Falls]

Finally got home to my computer so I could think up a decent poll.

Before anybody says anything about that last option: Well, it IS unreasonable!

At least 60 people will pick it.

[Godular]

Finally got home to my computer so I could think up a decent poll.

Before anybody says anything about that last option: Well, it IS unreasonable!

At least 60 people will pick it.

If only because they'll think it's a joke option. Or to be edgy... six of one...

[Kombinita Socialisma Demokratio]

There is no “line” - women always have the right to abort pregnancies at any given time.

Early term abortions result in the termination of the fetus - unfortunate, but necessary, as forcing women to carry an unwanted pregnancy is just pointless, reasonless torture.

Late term abortions, especially ones after viability of the fetus is achieved, do not necessarily need to have termination; just remove the fetus and put it in the ICU for infants/fetuses until such time as they are stable, then put up for adoption or into state care.

No “lines” necessary - the pregnancy can be terminated at will, the women get control of their bodies.

Who will pay for the ICU?

Perhaps [compassionate] anti-abortionists?

---

At least 60 people will pick it.

If only because they'll think it's a joke option. Or to be edgy... six of one...

Well the men in my earlier spoiler would pick it...