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US immigration breaking up families

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Should illegal families be separated

Yes
123
30%
No
254
62%
Not Sure
30
7%
 
Total votes : 407

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Fartsniffage
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Posts: 42051
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:25 pm

The Portland Territory wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:Do you really need to taunt the children and put them in cages?

No, but is this the fault of the Trump Administration?


Yes. They are the ones doing it.

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Nanatsu no Tsuki
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Posts: 203946
Founded: Feb 10, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:25 pm

The administration is thinking about housing the kids in tent cities because foster homes and shelters are running out of room. Tent cities...
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Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Supposedly heartless, & a d*ck.||Is maith an t-earra an tsíocháin.||No TGs
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Liriena
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Ex-Nation

Postby Liriena » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:26 pm

The Portland Territory wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:Do you really need to taunt the children and put them in cages?

No, but is this the fault of the Trump Administration?

Yes, actually. We know it was entirely this administration's policy, despite them bullshitting about "Democrats pushing a law on us".
be gay do crime


I am:
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Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
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For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
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Liriena
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Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Liriena » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:27 pm

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:The administration is thinking about housing the kids in tent cities because foster homes and shelters are running out of room. Tent cities...

Joe Arpaio must be so excited.

Oh, and a lot of these facilities are privately run.

Yeah, that's right: some corporate fuckheads are making money out of this.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

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Fartsniffage
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Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:27 pm

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:The administration is thinking about housing the kids in tent cities because foster homes and shelters are running out of room. Tent cities...


In Texas where temperatures hit 40C.

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Hakons
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Founded: Jul 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Hakons » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:27 pm

Liriena wrote:
Hakons wrote:
All of this needs evidence. I know immigration authorities can be rough, but America is still a pretty good place to be detained, globally speaking.

https://theintercept.com/2018/04/11/imm ... e-ice-dhs/

And

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/05/26/poli ... index.html


Those are, presumably, rare and, obviously, violate U.S. law and law enforcement codes. The difference between U.S. detention facilities and concentration camps is that people in the former have manifest natural rights while the people in the latter tend to have a low life expectancy. There are clearly problems with the U.S. system, but the overwhelming majority of the time a stay in U.S. detention will be better than a stay in the majority of other detention facilities in the world, let alone concentration camps.
“All elements of the national life must be made to drink in the Life which proceedeth from Him: legislation, political institutions, education, marriage and family life, capital and labour.” —Pope Leo XIII

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Fartsniffage
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Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:29 pm

Hakons wrote:


Those are, presumably, rare and, obviously, violate U.S. law and law enforcement codes. The difference between U.S. detention facilities and concentration camps is that people in the former have manifest natural rights while the people in the latter tend to have a low life expectancy. There are clearly problems with the U.S. system, but the overwhelming majority of the time a stay in U.S. detention will be better than a stay in the majority of other detention facilities in the world, let alone concentration camps.


The vast majority of countries don't put children in cages.

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Liriena
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Ex-Nation

Postby Liriena » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:30 pm

Hakons wrote:


Those are, presumably, rare and, obviously, violate U.S. law and law enforcement codes. The difference between U.S. detention facilities and concentration camps is that people in the former have manifest natural rights while the people in the latter tend to have a low life expectancy. There are clearly problems with the U.S. system, but the overwhelming majority of the time a stay in U.S. detention will be better than a stay in the majority of other detention facilities in the world, let alone concentration camps.

I don't give a shit how awful North Korean labor camps are compared to these detention centers. What you just did is called the fallacy of relative privation, and it's giving me vicarious embarrassment.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

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Nanatsu no Tsuki
Post-Apocalypse Survivor
 
Posts: 203946
Founded: Feb 10, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:30 pm

Liriena wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:The administration is thinking about housing the kids in tent cities because foster homes and shelters are running out of room. Tent cities...

Joe Arpaio must be so excited.

Oh, and a lot of these facilities are privately run.

Yeah, that's right: some corporate fuckheads are making money out of this.


This video speaks volumes: https://www.bbc.com/news/av/embed/p05tqlmb/44523541
Slava Ukraini
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Supposedly heartless, & a d*ck.||Is maith an t-earra an tsíocháin.||No TGs
RIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
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Posts: 34994
Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:30 pm

Fartsniffage wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:The actual fuck


Broken link.

should work now?

The Portland Territory wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:Do you really need to taunt the children and put them in cages?

No, but is this the fault of the Trump Administration?


Yes.

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San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 87312
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby San Lumen » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:30 pm

Fartsniffage wrote:
Hakons wrote:
Those are, presumably, rare and, obviously, violate U.S. law and law enforcement codes. The difference between U.S. detention facilities and concentration camps is that people in the former have manifest natural rights while the people in the latter tend to have a low life expectancy. There are clearly problems with the U.S. system, but the overwhelming majority of the time a stay in U.S. detention will be better than a stay in the majority of other detention facilities in the world, let alone concentration camps.


The vast majority of countries don't put children in cages.

and ICE and the Border Patrol should stop separating children and putting them in cages in defiance of the racist in the White House.

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Liriena
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Posts: 60885
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Liriena » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:31 pm

Fartsniffage wrote:
Hakons wrote:
Those are, presumably, rare and, obviously, violate U.S. law and law enforcement codes. The difference between U.S. detention facilities and concentration camps is that people in the former have manifest natural rights while the people in the latter tend to have a low life expectancy. There are clearly problems with the U.S. system, but the overwhelming majority of the time a stay in U.S. detention will be better than a stay in the majority of other detention facilities in the world, let alone concentration camps.


The vast majority of countries don't put children in cages.

And the fact that other countries may be even crueler about it does not exonerate your own cruelty.

You don't get a free pass because you're not literally putting these children in gas chambers.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

User avatar
Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 60885
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Liriena » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:32 pm

Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Liriena wrote:Joe Arpaio must be so excited.

Oh, and a lot of these facilities are privately run.

Yeah, that's right: some corporate fuckheads are making money out of this.


This video speaks volumes: https://www.bbc.com/news/av/embed/p05tqlmb/44523541

That was painful.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

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San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 87312
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby San Lumen » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:33 pm

Liriena wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
This video speaks volumes: https://www.bbc.com/news/av/embed/p05tqlmb/44523541

That was painful.

That makes me ashamed to call myself American.

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Diarcesia
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Founded: Aug 21, 2016
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Diarcesia » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:34 pm

Assuming this is true, it appears to me that the current admin has no intention for immigration reform and would just want to flaunt how an exclusive club American residency/citizenship is and how "filthy third-worlders" are rendered ineligible by default. Maybe I wouldn't be so irked if not for the fact that the US had their fair share of screwing many of those nations in the past. Classic bullying. I shudder to think what would happen if one of those children (assuming they're natural born) becomes the president someday. They would be capable of great good or great evil, and you'd better hope that it's the former.

Because that's just what may happen. You heard it here first.

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Nanatsu no Tsuki
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Posts: 203946
Founded: Feb 10, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Nanatsu no Tsuki » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:35 pm

Liriena wrote:
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
This video speaks volumes: https://www.bbc.com/news/av/embed/p05tqlmb/44523541

That was painful.


I can understand the law, you know. I get that said laws need to be enforced but this? The US is hardly the only country doing such a thing but still. This is incredibly sad and I don't think people have been thinking properly about the consequences.
Slava Ukraini
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Supposedly heartless, & a d*ck.||Is maith an t-earra an tsíocháin.||No TGs
RIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria

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Hakons
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Founded: Jul 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Hakons » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:36 pm

Liriena wrote:
Fartsniffage wrote:
The vast majority of countries don't put children in cages.

And the fact that other countries may be even crueler about it does not exonerate your own cruelty.

You don't get a free pass because you're not literally putting these children in gas chambers.


I'm on your bloody side, but you folks make it difficult when you think the U.S. is literally running concentration camps. We are not, and to suggest otherwise is erroneous and pushes people away from you and your anti-americanism.
“All elements of the national life must be made to drink in the Life which proceedeth from Him: legislation, political institutions, education, marriage and family life, capital and labour.” —Pope Leo XIII

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Conserative Morality
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Ex-Nation

Postby Conserative Morality » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:38 pm

Hakons wrote:
Liriena wrote:And the fact that other countries may be even crueler about it does not exonerate your own cruelty.

You don't get a free pass because you're not literally putting these children in gas chambers.


I'm on your bloody side, but you folks make it difficult when you think the U.S. is literally running concentration camps. We are not, and to suggest otherwise is erroneous and pushes people away from you and your anti-americanism.

... it's not really much different from a concentration camp. Do remember that concentration camps are not for killing people, unlike extermination camps. I don't really see a lot of difference between this and the original Boer Concentration Camps used by the British, except that they're indoors and have less disease.
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Conserative Morality
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Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Conserative Morality » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:38 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Liriena wrote:That was painful.

That makes me ashamed to call myself American.

I'm not. I'm ashamed that the people involved in this call themselves Americans.
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
Caesar and Imperator of RWDT
Got a blog up again. || An NS Writing Discussion

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Liriena
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Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Liriena » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:39 pm

Hakons wrote:
Liriena wrote:And the fact that other countries may be even crueler about it does not exonerate your own cruelty.

You don't get a free pass because you're not literally putting these children in gas chambers.


I'm on your bloody side, but you folks make it difficult when you think the U.S. is literally running concentration camps. We are not, and to suggest otherwise is erroneous and pushes people away from you and your anti-americanism.

So what's the big difference between these "detention centers" and the Japanese internment camps?

Definitely not humane conditions or respect for due process. Probably not color-blindness.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
if you passed biology and know
gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧

I disown most of my previous posts

User avatar
San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 87312
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby San Lumen » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:39 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:
Hakons wrote:
I'm on your bloody side, but you folks make it difficult when you think the U.S. is literally running concentration camps. We are not, and to suggest otherwise is erroneous and pushes people away from you and your anti-americanism.

... it's not really much different from a concentration camp. Do remember that concentration camps are not for killing people, unlike extermination camps. I don't really see a lot of difference between this and the original Boer Concentration Camps used by the British, except that they're indoors and have less disease.


The videos and and stories from these camps remind me of the internment camps for Japanese Americans in 1942. George Takai was among those interned. He warned about this and not letting it happen again but it seems the Republican base eats this up.

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Grinning Dragon
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Posts: 11114
Founded: May 16, 2011
Anarchy

Postby Grinning Dragon » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:40 pm

Fartsniffage wrote:
The Portland Territory wrote:No, but is this the fault of the Trump Administration?


Yes. They are the ones doing it.

Happened during the bho years.
Obama’s Immigration Agencies Separated Children From Their Families, Too

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The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34994
Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:40 pm

Hakons wrote:


Those are, presumably, rare and, obviously, violate U.S. law and law enforcement codes. The difference between U.S. detention facilities and concentration camps is that people in the former have manifest natural rights while the people in the latter tend to have a low life expectancy. There are clearly problems with the U.S. system, but the overwhelming majority of the time a stay in U.S. detention will be better than a stay in the majority of other detention facilities in the world, let alone concentration camps.


It's still shitty to put a child in a cage.

Speaking as an neighbor to the US: I love the US, but what the fuck are you doing?

Stop putting kids in cages.

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Hakons
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Posts: 5619
Founded: Jul 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Hakons » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:41 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:
Hakons wrote:
I'm on your bloody side, but you folks make it difficult when you think the U.S. is literally running concentration camps. We are not, and to suggest otherwise is erroneous and pushes people away from you and your anti-americanism.

... it's not really much different from a concentration camp. Do remember that concentration camps are not for killing people, unlike extermination camps. I don't really see a lot of difference between this and the original Boer Concentration Camps used by the British, except that they're indoors and have less disease.


And have better nutrition. And provide education. And have better medecine. And provide better legal sources. And have better civil rights. Ect...
“All elements of the national life must be made to drink in the Life which proceedeth from Him: legislation, political institutions, education, marriage and family life, capital and labour.” —Pope Leo XIII

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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42051
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:41 pm

Hakons wrote:
Liriena wrote:And the fact that other countries may be even crueler about it does not exonerate your own cruelty.

You don't get a free pass because you're not literally putting these children in gas chambers.


I'm on your bloody side, but you folks make it difficult when you think the U.S. is literally running concentration camps. We are not, and to suggest otherwise is erroneous and pushes people away from you and your anti-americanism.


Children in cages on concrete floors supplied with roll matts and a foil blanket.

Sort it the fuck out.

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