GUN TALK: Doubletap

[Diopolis]

I've never for the life of me understood why someone, other than certain types of collectors, would buy a .38 special when you can get a .357 that can also be used as a .38 special.

For some applications (mostly bullseye target shooting) the .38 Special is considered a great round. Plus, in the case of snubbies, they can be made smaller.

I shoot .38 special out of my .357 magnum revolver for bullseye shooting. Although regarding snubbies that's probably true.

[Germanic Templars]

Hey there! One of my new ventures into NSG, and specifically to these kind of threads! A warm hello and all! ^^

Going to the topic, so... given my time in Burma and later in Singapore, I have never handled real guns that extensively before. And my RL experience with guns came from my conscript duties in SG.

Most of the time, I handled a SAR 21, which is pretty good and fine on its own. I have just fired the standard-issue rifle, no attachments or anything weird along the way. We have also simulated firing this before and as dumb grunts as we are, one of us fired without checking for backblast and "burned and killed" the 5 of us behind who were still preparing. Dude was going for a "tank" that was coming our way, BUT forgot to check that!

So in conclusion, it's mostly just me and my SAR-21. I threw a frag grenade once, and I honestly thought I was gonna lose my right hand because that was my first time. Fortunately, I am still here with my limbs intact.

I have also tried a M16 (I think it's a M16, not a M4). Basically a long-barrel one and I immediately realise why Southeast Asians are never meant to use these weapons. Suffice to say, I immediately missed my SAR 21.

EDIT: It's a M16. I fired it exactly once as part of some supplementary training.

M16A2 is what I was trained with and used in my 5 years of active enlistment in US Army as well as the 2 years so far in my reserves. Never had an issue with the weapon itself when I used them, more so with the magazines and the double feeding (this only happened in BCT).

I own a CMME Mk4 rifle (basically an AR-15) and changed a few things on it to help reduce recoil as well as add railing to it so I can add grips and such to it. Honestly, I love my rifle considering it doesn't look like the $700 rifle I bought back in 2014 due to the changes I made to it.

As far as my favorite firearm I got to fire in the Army, which would be M240B because of the heavy "dakka" feel to it because of the 7.62 NATO rounds it fires.

[Germanic Templars]

And this the beauty of it right there... On another note, why the fuck is a single-action .38 special revolver more expensive than a double-action?

What model is it?

No model in particular really, just something I have noticed when looking at .38 revolvers.

And this the beauty of it right there... On another note, why the fuck is a single-action .38 special revolver more expensive than a double-action?

Niche market.

Should have seen that there.

[Hurtful Thoughts]

Niche market.

I've never for the life of me understood why someone, other than certain types of collectors, would buy a .38 special when you can get a .357 that can also be used as a .38 special.

Single actions are regarded as more accurate, most likely used to be a "precision" revolver in a previous life.

Hey there! One of my new ventures into NSG, and specifically to these kind of threads! A warm hello and all! ^^

Going to the topic, so... given my time in Burma and later in Singapore, I have never handled real guns that extensively before. And my RL experience with guns came from my conscript duties in SG.

Most of the time, I handled a SAR 21, which is pretty good and fine on its own. I have just fired the standard-issue rifle, no attachments or anything weird along the way. We have also simulated firing this before and as dumb grunts as we are, one of us fired without checking for backblast and "burned and killed" the 5 of us behind who were still preparing. Dude was going for a "tank" that was coming our way, BUT forgot to check that!

So in conclusion, it's mostly just me and my SAR-21. I threw a frag grenade once, and I honestly thought I was gonna lose my right hand because that was my first time. Fortunately, I am still here with my limbs intact.

I have also tried a M16 (I think it's a M16, not a M4). Basically a long-barrel one and I immediately realise why Southeast Asians are never meant to use these weapons. Suffice to say, I immediately missed my SAR 21.

EDIT: It's a M16. I fired it exactly once as part of some supplementary training.

Mosins are quite a bit more front heavy. (and just plain heavier... imagine duct taping two M16s together)

Best way I picture it is pretend your trigger-hand (that or support it at the edge of the magazine-well) is the trunion to a cannon and your cheek is a counterwieght, your non-dom hand is pretty much just to prevent the wind from catching the bayonet and pulling your shots wild.

At wich point it is perfectly acceptable to make tank-turret noises when traversing the rifle.

[The Two Jerseys]

Mosins are quite a bit more front heavy. (and just plain heavier... imagine duct taping two M16s together)

Best way I picture it is pretend your trigger-hand (that or support it at the edge of the magazine-well) is the trunion to a cannon and your cheek is a counterwieght, your non-dom hand is pretty much just to prevent the wind from catching the bayonet and pulling your shots wild.

At wich point it is perfectly acceptable to make tank-turret noises when traversing the rifle.

Da tovarish, is good design, both rifle and exercise equipment to make you stronk!

[Pax Nerdvana]

That's a nice little list!

I would try to get a Marlin 336 in .30-30, a 12 GA pump shotgun of some sort, a Ruger 10/22, and possibly an AR, budget allowing.

A 10/22 is on my radar, assuming I still have any money left. I still have about 4k .22 LR and nothing to shoot them with. I traded my last .22 ri9fle for a .44 revolver.

I would say that's a fair trade. I don't think the 10/22s are terribly expensive, iirc.

Hey there! One of my new ventures into NSG, and specifically to these kind of threads! A warm hello and all! ^^

Going to the topic, so... given my time in Burma and later in Singapore, I have never handled real guns that extensively before. And my RL experience with guns came from my conscript duties in SG.

Most of the time, I handled a SAR 21, which is pretty good and fine on its own. I have just fired the standard-issue rifle, no attachments or anything weird along the way. We have also simulated firing this before and as dumb grunts as we are, one of us fired without checking for backblast and "burned and killed" the 5 of us behind who were still preparing. Dude was going for a "tank" that was coming our way, BUT forgot to check that!

So in conclusion, it's mostly just me and my SAR-21. I threw a frag grenade once, and I honestly thought I was gonna lose my right hand because that was my first time. Fortunately, I am still here with my limbs intact.

I have also tried a M16 (I think it's a M16, not a M4). Basically a long-barrel one and I immediately realise why Southeast Asians are never meant to use these weapons. Suffice to say, I immediately missed my SAR 21.

EDIT: It's a M16. I fired it exactly once as part of some supplementary training.

Hey Val! I always forget your country has conscription. My personal experience is limited to .22s and 20 GA. That doesn't stop me from researching though. The SAR 21 looks like something from science fiction.

[Valentine Z]

Hey Val! I always forget your country has conscription. My personal experience is limited to .22s and 20 GA. That doesn't stop me from researching though. The SAR 21 looks like something from science fiction.

Hello to you too! ^^ Hehe, it's in the name, isn't it? SAR-21, sounds futuristic, oooh!

I heard that they are going to replace the SAR-21 for this one, but... I'm not very sure myself. Trade/Defence secrets, I suppose!

I also learned that the M16S1 was phased out not just because of the height issues, but because of the fact that SG cannot export them, or make ARs based on them. At least, the latter parts are something I read on Wikipedia, but my first-hand experience seems to say otherwise (i.e. height and stature issues). Maybe I am just a small guy!

M16A2 is what I was trained with and used in my 5 years of active enlistment in US Army as well as the 2 years so far in my reserves. Never had an issue with the weapon itself when I used them, more so with the magazines and the double feeding (this only happened in BCT).

I own a CMME Mk4 rifle (basically an AR-15) and changed a few things on it to help reduce recoil as well as add railing to it so I can add grips and such to it. Honestly, I love my rifle considering it doesn't look like the $700 rifle I bought back in 2014 due to the changes I made to it.

As far as my favorite firearm I got to fire in the Army, which would be M240B because of the heavy "dakka" feel to it because of the 7.62 NATO rounds it fires.

Yeah, I honestly have no issues with it. No jamming, or feeding issues, or any other kind that would plague especially an inexperienced user like me. We went to the range with the rifle for one day and... eh, it was okay. I do miss my bullpup SAR-21, but it's always fun to shoot something different for once.

Mosins are quite a bit more front heavy. (and just plain heavier... imagine duct taping two M16s together)

Best way I picture it is pretend your trigger-hand (that or support it at the edge of the magazine-well) is the trunion to a cannon and your cheek is a counterwieght, your non-dom hand is pretty much just to prevent the wind from catching the bayonet and pulling your shots wild.

At wich point it is perfectly acceptable to make tank-turret noises when traversing the rifle.

All I can think of in the field during my very first shoots are "Oh God, please don't let the recoil clock me in the face!"

Fortunately, it never did! My times in the 2-year conscript were pretty uneventful, which is something you need to wish for. No "I shot Recruit Val in the leg!" accidents, or no one having a ND (Negligent Discharge, AKA "You are fucked for firing when you are not supposed to.")

-----

Given the laws in Burma and SG, I am not allowed to own a gun. If I go to US, however, first thing I will do is to refresh myself on proper gun discipline, get all the training I need.. and maybe shoot a few rounds. People always call me a hippie who hates guns, but my friends and family know that deep down, I have the desire and need to Dakka. I would totally go to a range and fire a few shots.

My favorite weapon so far is an AS-50 sniper rifle. That thing sounds so beefy in Far Cry 2, and I always have fun using that rifle in the game. So... one of my life's goals (though not a huge priority), is to shoot a sniper rifle.

[Hurtful Thoughts]

All I can think of in the field during my very first shoots are "Oh God, please don't let the recoil clock me in the face!"

Fortunately, it never did! My times in the 2-year conscript were pretty uneventful, which is something you need to wish for. No "I shot Recruit Val in the leg!" accidents, or no one having a ND (Negligent Discharge, AKA "You are fucked for firing when you are not supposed to.")

Best way to picture a Mosin's recoil is to picture trying to keep an inward swinging door from being busted off its hinges by leaning into the rifle a two-by-four pressed against the door as the biggest bloke you know tries to kick it in.

Not exactly pleasant, and you do feel something definately not pleasant if you've got the stock riding on your collarbone (either further out or further down unless you've got a plate-carrier/trauma-pad to eat the recoil for you).

Still, there's something about the smell of burnt nugget-powder that's addictive.

Still, the Mosin isn't nearly as bad as getting issued an LPO flamethrower.

[Dylar]

Still, the Mosin isn't nearly as bad as getting issued an LPO flamethrower.

I need

[The Two Jerseys]

Still, the Mosin isn't nearly as bad as getting issued an LPO flamethrower.

I need

Somehow "Ivan, the ognemet!" doesn't have the same ring to it as the classic "Hans, ze flammenwerfer!"

[The Chuck]

I need

Somehow "Ivan, the ognemet!" doesn't have the same ring to it as the classic "Hans, ze flammenwerfer!"

What about "James! The Browning!"

[Valentine Z]

Somehow "Ivan, the ognemet!" doesn't have the same ring to it as the classic "Hans, ze flammenwerfer!"

What about "James! The Browning!"

"James, get the people burner!"

[The Two Jerseys]

What about "James! The Browning!"

"James, get the people burner!"

"Jimmy, hotfoot!"

[Genivaria]

What about "James! The Browning!"

"James, get the people burner!"

[Hurtful Thoughts]

Funny you should mention that

[Pax Nerdvana]

Hey Val! I always forget your country has conscription. My personal experience is limited to .22s and 20 GA. That doesn't stop me from researching though. The SAR 21 looks like something from science fiction.

Hello to you too! ^^ Hehe, it's in the name, isn't it? SAR-21, sounds futuristic, oooh!

I heard that they are going to replace the SAR-21 for this one, but... I'm not very sure myself. Trade/Defence secrets, I suppose!

I also learned that the M16S1 was phased out not just because of the height issues, but because of the fact that SG cannot export them, or make ARs based on them. At least, the latter parts are something I read on Wikipedia, but my first-hand experience seems to say otherwise (i.e. height and stature issues). Maybe I am just a small guy!

M16A2 is what I was trained with and used in my 5 years of active enlistment in US Army as well as the 2 years so far in my reserves. Never had an issue with the weapon itself when I used them, more so with the magazines and the double feeding (this only happened in BCT).

I own a CMME Mk4 rifle (basically an AR-15) and changed a few things on it to help reduce recoil as well as add railing to it so I can add grips and such to it. Honestly, I love my rifle considering it doesn't look like the $700 rifle I bought back in 2014 due to the changes I made to it.

As far as my favorite firearm I got to fire in the Army, which would be M240B because of the heavy "dakka" feel to it because of the 7.62 NATO rounds it fires.

Yeah, I honestly have no issues with it. No jamming, or feeding issues, or any other kind that would plague especially an inexperienced user like me. We went to the range with the rifle for one day and... eh, it was okay. I do miss my bullpup SAR-21, but it's always fun to shoot something different for once.

Mosins are quite a bit more front heavy. (and just plain heavier... imagine duct taping two M16s together)

Best way I picture it is pretend your trigger-hand (that or support it at the edge of the magazine-well) is the trunion to a cannon and your cheek is a counterwieght, your non-dom hand is pretty much just to prevent the wind from catching the bayonet and pulling your shots wild.

At wich point it is perfectly acceptable to make tank-turret noises when traversing the rifle.

All I can think of in the field during my very first shoots are "Oh God, please don't let the recoil clock me in the face!"

Fortunately, it never did! My times in the 2-year conscript were pretty uneventful, which is something you need to wish for. No "I shot Recruit Val in the leg!" accidents, or no one having a ND (Negligent Discharge, AKA "You are fucked for firing when you are not supposed to.")

-----

Given the laws in Burma and SG, I am not allowed to own a gun. If I go to US, however, first thing I will do is to refresh myself on proper gun discipline, get all the training I need.. and maybe shoot a few rounds. People always call me a hippie who hates guns, but my friends and family know that deep down, I have the desire and need to Dakka. I would totally go to a range and fire a few shots.

My favorite weapon so far is an AS-50 sniper rifle. That thing sounds so beefy in Far Cry 2, and I always have fun using that rifle in the game. So... one of my life's goals (though not a huge priority), is to shoot a sniper rifle.

When it comes to service arms, militaries always say they're going to phase them out, and then they don't. The M1911 and it's variants remained in US military service for 70 odd years.

Funny you should mention that

I wish I had a flamethrower.

[Valentine Z]

When it comes to service arms, militaries always say they're going to phase them out, and then they don't. The M1911 and it's variants remained in US military service for 70 odd years.

I know, right? According to Wikipedia, they say, "The rifle was to be available to both military and law enforcement markets by early 2015."

Which... okay, maybe a select group or section of SAF (Singapore Armed Forces), along with the international markets, got the rifle already. But we are still with our tried and tested SAR-21. I think it's also because of our non-offensive nature of the military; there's no point in replacing ALL of the thousands of SAR-21s when the rifles more or less work in the same mechanics. I suppose if they want to train us with the new rifle, they can always give us maybe 10-20 of them, like they did with the M16. We have to share the M16s!

[Pax Nerdvana]

When it comes to service arms, militaries always say they're going to phase them out, and then they don't. The M1911 and it's variants remained in US military service for 70 odd years.

I know, right? According to Wikipedia, they say, "The rifle was to be available to both military and law enforcement markets by early 2015."

Which... okay, maybe a select group or section of SAF (Singapore Armed Forces), along with the international markets, got the rifle already. But we are still with our tried and tested SAR-21. I think it's also because of our non-offensive nature of the military; there's no point in replacing ALL of the thousands of SAR-21s when the rifles more or less work in the same mechanics. I suppose if they want to train us with the new rifle, they can always give us maybe 10-20 of them, like they did with the M16. We have to share the M16s!

Nice! On the subject of the M16/M4, I think back in the '80s and '90s the US government had planned on replacing them, but then the Cold War ended and those plans were mostly shelved. I think anyway. I could be wrong.

[Valentine Z]

I know, right? According to Wikipedia, they say, "The rifle was to be available to both military and law enforcement markets by early 2015."

Which... okay, maybe a select group or section of SAF (Singapore Armed Forces), along with the international markets, got the rifle already. But we are still with our tried and tested SAR-21. I think it's also because of our non-offensive nature of the military; there's no point in replacing ALL of the thousands of SAR-21s when the rifles more or less work in the same mechanics. I suppose if they want to train us with the new rifle, they can always give us maybe 10-20 of them, like they did with the M16. We have to share the M16s!

Nice! On the subject of the M16/M4, I think back in the '80s and '90s the US government had planned on replacing them, but then the Cold War ended and those plans were mostly shelved. I think anyway. I could be wrong.

Interesting, still! ^^ Based on my personal thought, war is a horrible, horrible thing. But at the same time, I have to admit that war also accelerated tech and development. You don't want to lag behind with the surviving, after all. So there's that. ^^;

I have a good experience with the M16 because the range that I went to for the rifle is indoors, and it's very clean. The floor is... well, building floor. So there's no dirt or mud doing what they do worst on a rifle.

I had a SAR-21 jam on me twice, but that was my own fault as a recruit who pulled the charging handle wrong. Missed those two shots. :/

[Pax Nerdvana]

Nice! On the subject of the M16/M4, I think back in the '80s and '90s the US government had planned on replacing them, but then the Cold War ended and those plans were mostly shelved. I think anyway. I could be wrong.

Interesting, still! ^^ Based on my personal thought, war is a horrible, horrible thing. But at the same time, I have to admit that war also accelerated tech and development. You don't want to lag behind with the surviving, after all. So there's that. ^^;

I have a good experience with the M16 because the range that I went to for the rifle is indoors, and it's very clean. The floor is... well, building floor. So there's no dirt or mud doing what they do worst on a rifle.

I had a SAR-21 jam on me twice, but that was my own fault as a recruit who pulled the charging handle wrong. Missed those two shots. :/

Most of my experience has been with .22 bolt actions. Never had one jam or misfire on me. I've also never had a 20 GA misfire on me, despite putting dozens of rounds through both a semi-auto and a pump action while skeet shooting. War is a cruel necessity.

[Diopolis]

Interesting, still! ^^ Based on my personal thought, war is a horrible, horrible thing. But at the same time, I have to admit that war also accelerated tech and development. You don't want to lag behind with the surviving, after all. So there's that. ^^;

I have a good experience with the M16 because the range that I went to for the rifle is indoors, and it's very clean. The floor is... well, building floor. So there's no dirt or mud doing what they do worst on a rifle.

I had a SAR-21 jam on me twice, but that was my own fault as a recruit who pulled the charging handle wrong. Missed those two shots. :/

Most of my experience has been with .22 bolt actions. Never had one jam or misfire on me. I've also never had a 20 GA misfire on me, despite putting dozens of rounds through both a semi-auto and a pump action while skeet shooting. War is a cruel necessity.

.22 semi-auto though, seems to jam on me a lot.

[Valentine Z]

Interesting, still! ^^ Based on my personal thought, war is a horrible, horrible thing. But at the same time, I have to admit that war also accelerated tech and development. You don't want to lag behind with the surviving, after all. So there's that. ^^;

I have a good experience with the M16 because the range that I went to for the rifle is indoors, and it's very clean. The floor is... well, building floor. So there's no dirt or mud doing what they do worst on a rifle.

I had a SAR-21 jam on me twice, but that was my own fault as a recruit who pulled the charging handle wrong. Missed those two shots. :/

Most of my experience has been with .22 bolt actions. Never had one jam or misfire on me. I've also never had a 20 GA misfire on me, despite putting dozens of rounds through both a semi-auto and a pump action while skeet shooting. War is a cruel necessity.

Indeed, indeed. I am known by my friends as a militant pacifist. Someone that wants peace for almost all the time, but he carries a thorny bush to throw at people when going gets tough!

Seems like you have a pretty good track record with guns, much better than me. Ohh, you know what's the worst part about firing a rifle, or anything basically?

Cleaning. Ugh. Military-style cleaning.

Rifle must be well-oiled, no carbon build-up, etc etc. I can understand why they asked though; one time a dude forgot to clean and oil the rifle, and it started to rust up. The armskote / armoury noticed, of course. GG WP to the dude, but he was cleared on the accounts that it was just a recruit mistake, and it was nothing major like losing a rifle part, or a live round.

[Pax Nerdvana]

Most of my experience has been with .22 bolt actions. Never had one jam or misfire on me. I've also never had a 20 GA misfire on me, despite putting dozens of rounds through both a semi-auto and a pump action while skeet shooting. War is a cruel necessity.

.22 semi-auto though, seems to jam on me a lot.

From my understanding, semi-autos can be finicky when it comes to ammo.

Most of my experience has been with .22 bolt actions. Never had one jam or misfire on me. I've also never had a 20 GA misfire on me, despite putting dozens of rounds through both a semi-auto and a pump action while skeet shooting. War is a cruel necessity.

Indeed, indeed. I am known by my friends as a militant pacifist. Someone that wants peace for almost all the time, but he carries a thorny bush to throw at people when going gets tough!

Seems like you have a pretty good track record with guns, much better than me. Ohh, you know what's the worst part about firing a rifle, or anything basically?

Cleaning. Ugh. Military-style cleaning.

Rifle must be well-oiled, no carbon build-up, etc etc. I can understand why they asked though; one time a dude forgot to clean and oil the rifle, and it started to rust up. The armskote / armoury noticed, of course. GG WP to the dude, but he was cleared on the accounts that it was just a recruit mistake, and it was nothing major like losing a rifle part, or a live round.

Losing the trigger or some other vital bit would suck, especially if it belongs to the government. Cleaning may take time, but it's needed. Build up of gunk can seriously affect accuracy and functioning. My grandfather has an old .22 bolt action that apparently shoots 4 feet to the left. I think it's probably due to a badly adjusted scope and a lack of cleaning.

[Valentine Z]

Losing the trigger or some other vital bit would suck, especially if it belongs to the government. Cleaning may take time, but it's needed. Build up of gunk can seriously affect accuracy and functioning. My grandfather has an old .22 bolt action that apparently shoots 4 feet to the left. I think it's probably due to a badly adjusted scope and a lack of cleaning.

Ohhh, the cruel zeroing errors. It'll be gone with age, it will also be gone if you accidentally drop the rifle. Have fun trying to pass the shooting range!

It's not that big of a deal for me or most people, but it's a big deal for those that wants to be specialists or officers.

[Pax Nerdvana]

Losing the trigger or some other vital bit would suck, especially if it belongs to the government. Cleaning may take time, but it's needed. Build up of gunk can seriously affect accuracy and functioning. My grandfather has an old .22 bolt action that apparently shoots 4 feet to the left. I think it's probably due to a badly adjusted scope and a lack of cleaning.

Ohhh, the cruel zeroing errors. It'll be gone with age, it will also be gone if you accidentally drop the rifle. Have fun trying to pass the shooting range!

It's not that big of a deal for me or most people, but it's a big deal for those that wants to be specialists or officers.

The zeroing will also change if you change the loading. Different bullet weights, different propellants, differences in primers, can all affect accuracy.

I want to improve my long range shooting. It's something of a fantasy of mine to be able to make a 300 yard shot without a scope.