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Enforced monogamy; was Peterson right?

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LimaUniformNovemberAlpha
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Enforced monogamy; was Peterson right?

Postby LimaUniformNovemberAlpha » Sun May 20, 2018 8:36 am

https://www.salon.com/2018/05/19/right- ... to-appease

“The cure for that is enforced monogamy," Peterson said.

It was the type of assertion that usually precedes a laugh and a clarification that it was a joke. But Peterson did not say this in jest.

"Mr. Peterson does not pause when he says this," Bowles wrote of this specific interaction. "Enforced monogamy is, to him, simply a rational solution. Otherwise women will all only go for the most high-status men, he explains, and that couldn’t make either gender happy in the end."

This is not an entirely unreasonable notion, being that it's often seen in the animal kingdom. Of course, it doesn't help that, for all the left's supposed lack of a feeling of superiority to those who can't get laid, it's their favourite cheap shot in response to any opinion they don't like, from niceguyism to stereotypes about cheerleaders, even when there isn't any evidence the cheap shot is true, let alone is. Note that it was not used in response to women expressing similar opinions, (or any "gender-flip" of them) as it simply wouldn't make sense there.

I used to think the taboo against casual sex was driven either by a sentimental attachment to the ideal of monogamy, or by a need to protect babies from being born to single mothers, or both. To some extent, I still figure all that may be part of it. But this might be another part. Why else would so many men so fervently insist on opposing casual sex even though this would shut them out of it as well?

Of course, the other side of it is that those cut out for sex, but not for relationships, may be denied the former by such an arrangement. But then what does that say about their priorities?

I also wonder if this might be what the whole "men must make the first move" thing is about too. If women made the first move, they might mostly take turns having sex with the same few guys, but in a society where men make the first move, most women are married by the age of 30.
Last edited by LimaUniformNovemberAlpha on Sun May 20, 2018 8:50 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Len Hyet » Sun May 20, 2018 8:41 am

I'm going to wait until the author of the NY Times article releases the full transcript of the meeting or Peterson himself does before I draw conclusions. Dollars to donuts I'm willing to bet there's some context missing.
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Postby Hirota » Sun May 20, 2018 9:38 am

Not the full transcript (at least, not that I can see on my phone) but Peterson's response is on his site:

https://jordanbpeterson.com/uncategoriz ... -monogamy/
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Len Hyet
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Postby Len Hyet » Sun May 20, 2018 9:46 am

Hirota wrote:Not the full transcript (at least, not that I can see on my phone) but Peterson's response is on his site:

https://jordanbpeterson.com/uncategoriz ... -monogamy/

“enforced monogamy” does not mean government-enforced monogamy. “Enforced monogamy” means socially-promoted, culturally-inculcated monogamy, as opposed to genetic monogamy – evolutionarily-dictated monogamy, which does exist in some species (but does not exist in humans). This distinction has been present in anthropological and scientific literature for decades.”


Welp, figured there was something missing.

Alright, /thread, let's move on folks.
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LimaUniformNovemberAlpha
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Postby LimaUniformNovemberAlpha » Sun May 20, 2018 9:57 am

Len Hyet wrote:
Hirota wrote:Not the full transcript (at least, not that I can see on my phone) but Peterson's response is on his site:

https://jordanbpeterson.com/uncategoriz ... -monogamy/

“enforced monogamy” does not mean government-enforced monogamy. “Enforced monogamy” means socially-promoted, culturally-inculcated monogamy, as opposed to genetic monogamy – evolutionarily-dictated monogamy, which does exist in some species (but does not exist in humans). This distinction has been present in anthropological and scientific literature for decades.”


Welp, figured there was something missing.

Alright, /thread, let's move on folks.

No, let's not. My OP is clearly designed to apply to either interpretation of the phrase.
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2. The CCP is not a Communist Party, as it has shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.
3. Xi Jinping and his cronies are not Communists, as they have shown absolutely zero interest in achieving Communism.

How do we know this? Because the first step toward Communism is Socialism, and none of the aforementioned are even remotely Socialist in any way, shape, or form.

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Postby Conserative Morality » Sun May 20, 2018 10:19 am

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Postby Caracasus » Sun May 20, 2018 10:27 am

So monogamy strongly promoted by social institutions? Yeah, that is already overwhelmingly the case though. Monogamous relationships are far more common than any other and are considered to be the norm throughout social institutions... The US and UK have just finished watching an extravagant celebration of monogomy...

I'm a little lost as to what else this guy could be getting at here frankly.
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Postby Greed and Death » Sun May 20, 2018 10:31 am

As I read it he is talking about socially enforced monogamy. That is for the most part what we have now, with poly couples losing social status (and few government benefits).

I have noticed Peterson is a target for misquoting and editing of late.
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Greed and Death
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Postby Greed and Death » Sun May 20, 2018 10:35 am

Caracasus wrote:So monogamy strongly promoted by social institutions? Yeah, that is already overwhelmingly the case though. Monogamous relationships are far more common than any other and are considered to be the norm throughout social institutions... The US and UK have just finished watching an extravagant celebration of monogomy...

I'm a little lost as to what else this guy could be getting at here frankly.

But in the last 20 or 30 years it has become less socially enforced.

It also likely has to do with we no longer tell children part of their job is to find a partner and reproduce.

There is also less social pressure to marry resulting in serial monogamy becoming more of the norm rather than committed monogamy.
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Postby United Muscovite Nations » Sun May 20, 2018 10:55 am

Reading his clarification, he's of course right in this case.
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Postby Greed and Death » Sun May 20, 2018 11:14 am

United Muscovite Nations wrote:Reading his clarification, he's of course right in this case.

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The East Marches II
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Postby The East Marches II » Sun May 20, 2018 11:27 am

Conserative Morality wrote:Jesus Christ


I too wish for the same societal problems as in Africa and the ME :^)

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Postby Conserative Morality » Sun May 20, 2018 11:35 am

The East Marches II wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:Jesus Christ


I too wish for the same societal problems as in Africa and the ME :^)

"The problem in the ME and Africa is that women have too much freedom"

Have you ever considered becoming a comedian, TEM?
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Postby The Empire of Pretantia » Sun May 20, 2018 11:36 am

Greed and Death wrote:
I have noticed Peterson is a target for misquoting and editing of late.

Bound to happen once you reach a certain level of popularity and/or notoriety.
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Postby The East Marches II » Sun May 20, 2018 11:36 am

:!:
Conserative Morality wrote:
The East Marches II wrote:
I too wish for the same societal problems as in Africa and the ME :^)

"The problem in the ME and Africa is that women have too much freedom"

Have you ever considered becoming a comedian, TEM?


Women have the freedom? I didn't assign the blame to them my friend :^)

Try not to copy a certain poster on this site and blame sexism as the reason others disagree with them.

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Postby Conserative Morality » Sun May 20, 2018 11:48 am

The East Marches II wrote:Women have the freedom? I didn't assign the blame to them my friend :^)

May want to reread the OP then before objecting to my expressing exasperation at the OP.
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Postby The East Marches II » Sun May 20, 2018 11:50 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
The East Marches II wrote:Women have the freedom? I didn't assign the blame to them my friend :^)

May want to reread the OP then before objecting to my expressing exasperation at the OP.


I ignored our quality OP and was commenting on what he actually said. If you read Salon, you lose brain cells. That's why I read the other links :^)

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Postby Improved werpland » Sun May 20, 2018 12:04 pm

The Empire of Pretantia wrote:
Greed and Death wrote:
I have noticed Peterson is a target for misquoting and editing of late.

Bound to happen once you reach a certain level of popularity and/or notoriety.

When you say “enforced monogamy” people are going to interpret that literally.

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Postby Conserative Morality » Sun May 20, 2018 12:06 pm

The East Marches II wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:May want to reread the OP then before objecting to my expressing exasperation at the OP.


I ignored our quality OP and was commenting on what he actually said. If you read Salon, you lose brain cells. That's why I read the other links :^)

Where it says the same thing, only "But I don't endorse breaking out the billy clubs!"?
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Postby Dogmeat » Sun May 20, 2018 12:07 pm

It's very hard not to notice how OP's description of how women behave mirrors certain people's fantasies about how they'd like women to behave. I put it to you that when your fantasies start informing your political opinions, it's time to take a step back.
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Postby Kvatchdom » Sun May 20, 2018 12:10 pm

Fucking no.
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Postby Philjia » Sun May 20, 2018 12:10 pm

Go fuck yourself, you sad man.

Oh hold on, there's a clarification of what he meant.

Well, in light of that, I'd like to revise my response to "go fuck yourself, you sad man".

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Postby The East Marches II » Sun May 20, 2018 12:12 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:
The East Marches II wrote:
I ignored our quality OP and was commenting on what he actually said. If you read Salon, you lose brain cells. That's why I read the other links :^)

Where it says the same thing, only "But I don't endorse breaking out the billy clubs!"?


Yes, moral condemnation is the same physical violence :^)

This must be why they think the UN is worth anything.
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Postby Conserative Morality » Sun May 20, 2018 12:14 pm

The East Marches II wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:Where it says the same thing, only "But I don't endorse breaking out the billy clubs!"?


Yes, moral condemnation is the same physical violence :^)

Never said that. But I get it, if you aren't shaming those sluts who knows what they could do? Make their own decisions regarding sexual partners? Smh.
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Postby The East Marches II » Sun May 20, 2018 12:16 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:
The East Marches II wrote:
Yes, moral condemnation is the same physical violence :^)

Never said that. But I get it, if you aren't shaming those sluts who knows what they could do? Make their own decisions regarding sexual partners? Smh.


>Enforcing social norms by disapproving is bad except when it comes to disapproving of racism and slut shaming

Progressives everyone

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