LWDT V: Completing the Five Thread Plan

[MERIZoC]

Serious question: What do you do when you discover that your dentist is Salafi (Arabic, سَلَفِيّ, Salafiyy) — also known as Wahhabi (Arabic, وَهّابِيّ, Wahhābiyy)? I suspected it for a while, but it was confirmed on my last visit. She loves Turkey's right-wing authoritarian and Salafi leader, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan. She loves the Salafi state of Saudi Arabia. She hates King Hussein (Arabic, المَلِك حُسَيْن, ʾal-Malik Ḥusay°n) of Jordan, who is Sunni (Arabic, سُنِّيّ, Sunniyy) but not Salafi. All Salafis (Arabic, سَلَفِيِّينَ, Salafiyīna) are Sunnis (Arabic, أَهْل السُنَّة, ⫯Ah°l Sunnaẗ), but most Sunnis are not Salafis.

Erdogan (Turkish, Erdoğan) isn't Salafi (Arabic, سَلَفِيّ, Salafiyy), he's a Naqshbandi (Arabic, نقشبندية‎, Naqshbandīyah) Sufi (Arabic, صُوفِيّ‎, ṣūfiyy), and I'm not sure why (Arabic, لماذا ا) it matters what your dentist (Arabic, دكتورالاسنان) believes lol

[Democratic Communist Federation]

I would immediately see about getting another dentist.

She is an excellent dentist. However, I plan to raise the issue with her directly when I see her in 2 weeks. I hope I am mistaken, but I doubt it.

[Democratic Communist Federation]

I mean, do you wanna potentially fund ISIS?

The vast majority of Salifis are not violent and have nothing to do with any terrorist activities. Still, I am going to take precautions.

[Democratic Communist Federation]

Just because someone believes in islamic law doesn't mean they're a terrorist. Being a useful idiot for feds is, though.

Most Muslims believe in Islamic law. However, Salafis have a very rigid interpretation of it which is rejected by other Muslims.

[Democratic Communist Federation]

Continue having them as your dentist.
It doesn't affect the quality of their work.

I will see. However, if she discovers my religion, which to her would likely be seen as extremely heretical, that could cause problems.

[North Assyria]

Report them to the proper authorities.

Also why the fuck would ya know that? All I talk about with my dentist is my teeth, where i went on vacation and how my family is doing.

I’ve gone to the same dentist since I was little

You're already assuming she's a terrorist? Wow.

Anyway, that's good of your area you've gone to the same dentist for those many years.

“Is YOUR dentist part of ISIS? If you think so, call this number now: 1-847-336-8478” (1-8IS-dentist)

[Democratic Communist Federation]

Erdogan (Turkish, Erdoğan) isn't Salafi (Arabic, سَلَفِيّ, Salafiyy), he's a Naqshbandi (Arabic, نقشبندية‎, Naqshbandīyah) Sufi (Arabic, صُوفِيّ‎, ṣūfiyy), and I'm not sure why (Arabic, لماذا ا) it matters what your dentist (Arabic, دكتورالاسنان) believes lol

He is Naqshbandi-Khalidi which, unlike other Naqshbandi orders, has had a long-term relation with Salafism. There are many different chains (Arabic, سَلَاسِل, salāsil) in Naqshbandi.

The reason it matters to me is because members of my religion have a long history of being killed by extremist Muslims. Of course, most Muslims are not extremist, and, for what it's worth, I count many among my friends.

[Nekokuni]

What do you think about attempts to merge socialism with religion? (i.e Christian socialism, Buddhist socialism, etc.) is this a legitimate form of Leftism, or a potential gateway into theocracy and/or hierarchy? I consider myself a devout Buddhist, but I'd be reluctant to merge the two. That feels like it would be a disservice to both.

[Frievolk]

What do you think about attempts to merge socialism with religion? (i.e Christian socialism, Buddhist socialism, etc.) is this a legitimate form of Leftism, or a potential gateway into theocracy and/or hierarchy? I consider myself a devout Buddhist, but I'd be reluctant to merge the two. That feels like it would be a disservice to both.

Idk about Christian Socialism, because it, for the most part, seems harmless, but I know for a fact that mixing Islam and Socialism leads to the Mujahideen-e-Khalgh, which is a terrible idea for all parties involved.

[Asigna]

If State schools mandated prayer for all existing religions, prayer time will take up 90% of school time.

[Nekokuni]

If State schools mandated prayer for all existing religions, prayer time will take up 90% of school time.

Well, I have eight million gods, so it's going to take more than that.

[Asigna]

If State schools mandated prayer for all existing religions, prayer time will take up 90% of school time.

No, it'd be a daily 5-10 minute thing at the start of school.

Okay, id support that if my reverence for the flying sphaggetti monster is recognized, also Odin and Jupiter.

AVE JUPITER.

[Asigna]

If State schools mandated prayer for all existing religions, prayer time will take up 90% of school time.

No, it'd be a daily 5-10 minute thing at the start of school.

Okay, id support that if my reverence for the flying sphaggetti monster is recognized, also Odin and Jupiter.

AVE JUPITER.

[Nekokuni]

No, it'd be a daily 5-10 minute thing at the start of school.

Okay, id support that if my reverence for the flying sphaggetti monster is recognized, also Odin and Jupiter.

AVE JUPITER.

Well, Ásatrú is believed in with about as much seriousness as the FSM is, so that comparison makes sense.

[Asigna]

Well, I have eight million gods, so it's going to take more than that.

Erm it'd be 5-10 minutes total for all religions.

Every religion would have the ability to pray at once.

Do you even know how many religions are there in the world?

[Torrocca]

Well, I have eight million gods, so it's going to take more than that.

Erm it'd be 5-10 minutes total for all religions.

Every religion would have the ability to pray at once.

Only Eminem has the power to name off eight million gods in ten minutes, though!

[Asigna]

Erm it'd be 5-10 minutes total for all religions.

Every religion would have the ability to pray at once.

Only Eminem has the power to name off eight million gods in ten minutes, though!

Amen brother. Alongside XXXtentacion. The reason why America is in steep morla decline is that we dont pray to the true gods.

We shall return to the old ways and worship Jupiter.

[Asigna]

Do you even know how many religions are there in the world?

That's why they all pray at the same time.

In silence you mean? What if i dont want to join in prayer?

I'd try to set up a department to enforce that liberty and punish people/groups/institutions who humiliate, harass, or punish people who refuse to pray or stuff.

Oh wait, that basically answers everything. I am now an enlightened being.

[Nekokuni]

Well, Ásatrú is believed in with about as much seriousness as the FSM is, so that comparison makes sense.

I disagree, the Dutch government rightly smacked down the FSM as nothing but mockery by edgy atheists to piss off Christians.
I find that very much agreeable, and a win for religious liberty as well as respect, and basic human decency.

I find such parody religions which increase bile to be barbaric and uncivilized.

FSM was made to criticize Young Earth Creationism, and the privileges that religious groups believe they're entitled to. But unfortunately, it's a joke that has outlived any funniness or social commentary. While it's not my cup of tea, you're being unfair to them.

[Frievolk]

Erm it'd be 5-10 minutes total for all religions.

Every religion would have the ability to pray at once.

Do you even know how many religions are there in the world?

You're not supposed to pray to all gods though. Just your own.

[Asigna]

I disagree, the Dutch government rightly smacked down the FSM as nothing but mockery by edgy atheists to piss off Christians.
I find that very much agreeable, and a win for religious liberty as well as respect, and basic human decency.

I find such parody religions which increase bile to be barbaric and uncivilized.

FSM was made to criticize Young Earth Creationism, and the privileges that religious groups believe they're entitled to. But unfortunately, it's a joke that has outlived any funniness or social commentary. While it's not my cup of tea, you're being unfair to them.

Indeed, im calling bias.

Seriousness and even the very word of religion had a very fluid meaning it is up to subjective interpretation. Ergo it is utterly fitting and proper for modern scientific societies grounded upon reason and logic to do away with having hands on upon matters of vague definition such as religion.

[Asigna]

In silence you mean? What if i dont want to join in prayer?



Oh wait, that basically answers everything. I am now an enlightened being.

Of course, to force you to join in prayer would be barbaric, but to force you to not be able to have a moment when you get to school(if you can't wake up on time) would also be barbaric. Tyranny must be always opposed. Those who accept tyranny are those who are responsible for the suffering of their future descendants. Religion is under attack, by all sides these days. Ironic as it used to attack others, but I feel they're acting as barbaric as the religious used to to others.

That said, I roll my eyes at those who insist on a global atheist conspiracy, they're so detached from reality. We religious folk are simply facing unfair backlash from what our ancestors did which are ironically against what are religion preached.

So... Which is it, should we return to the past when religion was never attacked and was at its glorious age (oh how Xtians just long for the days we didnt have to listen to the gays, we just burned them) or today when none of that is happening? Or maybe in the old ways during the time of the Church fathers when the rivals were simply killed like the Manichaeians and the silly Gnostics.

[Asigna]

FSM was made to criticize Young Earth Creationism, and the privileges that religious groups believe they're entitled to. But unfortunately, it's a joke that has outlived any funniness or social commentary. While it's not my cup of tea, you're being unfair to them.

No, I simply believe that's it's sole purpose is to further hatred against the religious. Not a secret or publicly stated goal, but that's all it's doing.

While I adore certain parody religions, I don't think they should be accepted as legitimate. It harms the religious even further and can be used to harass them. For the sake of religious liberty, and safety from tyranny, these need to be stopped.

Islam lampoons the idea of Christianity which Christ died at the cross.

And for their saying, ‘We did slay the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah;’ whereas they slew him not, nor crucify him, but he was made to appear to them like one crucified; and those who differ therein are certainly in a state of doubt about it; they have no definite knowledge thereof, but only pursue a conjecture; and they did not convert this conjecture into certainty.
Holy Qur’an, Chapter 4, verse 158

The biblical depictions of pagans are nothing but can be described as parodies.

And if you argue "But FSM does not have a noble goal apart from trolling", wrong, FSM stands for reason and truth above all. I have as every right to say that Abrahanic religions are a parody and bastardization of Pagans. If Christians find the FSM offensive, you dont know how offended Muslims are when they see Christianity and their insistence on the superiority cross or prophet worshiping.

So which is it? By whose definition are we going to follow on defining what constitutes a legitimate religion?

[Asigna]

So... Which is it, should we return to the past when religion was never attacked and was at its glorious age (oh how Xtians just long for the days we didnt have to listen to the gays, we just burned them) or today when none of that is happening? Or maybe in the old ways during the time of the Church fathers when the rivals were simply killed like the Manichaeians and the silly Gnostics.

I refuse to acknowledge that first choice except to call it out on it's bull.





Now, here's a question:

What do most leftists here think of the French Revolution? Good, or bad?

I myself think it was a horribly bloody affair, but led to more good than bad. Napoleon partially intentionally stabilized Europe, and allowed nationalism to flourish, which would set the stage for both Nationalism, and the EU, which is to me a win for both modern sides. Not to mention it revolutionized economics, standardized a lot of scientific methods, smoothed out intercontinental trade, and helped kickstart the first industrial revolution. It also led to the end of the Papal States, which led to reduced religious conflict and religious interference, allowing liberties to become more accepted. Sure, the Pope tried to stop it during the Rise of Italy but Italy put a stop to that, and was only able to do so because of Napoleon. This has led to a much more stable, less fragile and bloody Europe than it may have been today, so I am a very enthusiastic supporter of it.


Pity of all those massacres though, horrible atrocities they were. I condemn them to the utmost degree.

The French revolution is the nail in the coffin of Christianity in Europe. A flame of enlightenment had been beginning since the scientific revolution.

[Orostan]

So... Which is it, should we return to the past when religion was never attacked and was at its glorious age (oh how Xtians just long for the days we didnt have to listen to the gays, we just burned them) or today when none of that is happening? Or maybe in the old ways during the time of the Church fathers when the rivals were simply killed like the Manichaeians and the silly Gnostics.

I refuse to acknowledge that first choice except to call it out on it's bull.





Now, here's a question:

What do most leftists here think of the French Revolution? Good, or bad?

I myself think it was a horribly bloody affair, but led to more good than bad. Napoleon partially intentionally stabilized Europe, and allowed nationalism to flourish, which would set the stage for both Nationalism, and the EU, which is to me a win for both modern sides. Not to mention it revolutionized economics, standardized a lot of scientific methods, smoothed out intercontinental trade, and helped kickstart the first industrial revolution. It also led to the end of the Papal States, which led to reduced religious conflict and religious interference, allowing liberties to become more accepted. Sure, the Pope tried to stop it during the Rise of Italy but Italy put a stop to that, and was only able to do so because of Napoleon. This has led to a much more stable, less fragile and bloody Europe than it may have been today, so I am a very enthusiastic supporter of it.


Pity of all those massacres though, horrible atrocities they were. I condemn them to the utmost degree.

The French Revolution was a historical necessity, and I approve of it. No revolution is clean, especially when every country around intervenes against it, but the French Revolution establishing a bourgeois system was an important step forward in history.

Also, with all the stuff the aristocracy was doing I doubt the revolution could have been much cleaner than it was.