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Monarchist Discussion Thread II: The Crown will Rise Again!

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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What kind of Monarchist are you?

Absolutist
48
14%
Theocratic/ Papal
12
4%
Semi-Constitutional
45
13%
Constitutional (Modern Britain)
55
16%
Constitutional (Pre-Orange Britain)
12
4%
Constitutional (Elective)
11
3%
Constitutional (Other)
13
4%
Not a Monarchist
139
41%
 
Total votes : 335

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Hammer Britannia
Senator
 
Posts: 4087
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Father Knows Best State

Postby Hammer Britannia » Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:21 am

Seraven wrote:Is it possible for French monarchy to be restored?

It's more likely for Chad to become a developed nation shm
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Seraven
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Posts: 3570
Founded: Jun 10, 2012
Moralistic Democracy

Postby Seraven » Sun Nov 25, 2018 9:57 pm

Frievolk wrote:
Seraven wrote:Is it possible for French monarchy to be restored?

It is possible. Just not very likely. Almost not likely at all, tbh. You'd get more results looking for a restoration in Germany, Austria, or Russia tbh.


Hmm, I am not sure with the Germans, though. Has there been any indications of the remains of Wilhelm's descendants?
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Frievolk
Minister
 
Posts: 3368
Founded: Jun 14, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Frievolk » Sun Nov 25, 2018 10:15 pm

Seraven wrote:
Frievolk wrote:It is possible. Just not very likely. Almost not likely at all, tbh. You'd get more results looking for a restoration in Germany, Austria, or Russia tbh.


Hmm, I am not sure with the Germans, though. Has there been any indications of the remains of Wilhelm's descendants?

Well, I mean there is a heir to the Hohenzollern dynasty. Also to various other dynasties that ruled the smaller states in the German Empire, but that's not even the point. Iirc, the latest censuses (censi?) showed something along the lines of 2 out of every 5 Germans somewhat supporting a restoration (similar in Austria, a lot more in Russia). French heirs (either the legitimists, the orleanists, or the Bonapartes) have way less popularity than that.
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Diopolis
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Founded: May 15, 2012
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Diopolis » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:55 pm

Frievolk wrote:
Seraven wrote:
Hmm, I am not sure with the Germans, though. Has there been any indications of the remains of Wilhelm's descendants?

Well, I mean there is a heir to the Hohenzollern dynasty. Also to various other dynasties that ruled the smaller states in the German Empire, but that's not even the point. Iirc, the latest censuses (censi?) showed something along the lines of 2 out of every 5 Germans somewhat supporting a restoration (similar in Austria, a lot more in Russia). French heirs (either the legitimists, the orleanists, or the Bonapartes) have way less popularity than that.

French monarchists are also divided up amongst themselves.
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Reikoku
Senator
 
Posts: 3645
Founded: Apr 01, 2017
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Reikoku » Mon Nov 26, 2018 5:29 pm

Diopolis wrote:
Frievolk wrote:Well, I mean there is a heir to the Hohenzollern dynasty. Also to various other dynasties that ruled the smaller states in the German Empire, but that's not even the point. Iirc, the latest censuses (censi?) showed something along the lines of 2 out of every 5 Germans somewhat supporting a restoration (similar in Austria, a lot more in Russia). French heirs (either the legitimists, the orleanists, or the Bonapartes) have way less popularity than that.

French monarchists are also divided up amongst themselves.


Legitimist > Orléanist

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Diopolis
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Founded: May 15, 2012
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Diopolis » Mon Nov 26, 2018 5:49 pm

Reikoku wrote:
Diopolis wrote:French monarchists are also divided up amongst themselves.


Legitimist > Orléanist

Exactly. Prince Louis Alfonse Bourbon is the exact kind of ruler France needs rn.
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Engleberg
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Founded: Apr 08, 2016
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Engleberg » Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:09 pm

Seraven wrote:
Frievolk wrote:It is possible. Just not very likely. Almost not likely at all, tbh. You'd get more results looking for a restoration in Germany, Austria, or Russia tbh.


Hmm, I am not sure with the Germans, though. Has there been any indications of the remains of Wilhelm's descendants?


There is a current heir in the line for the Imperial throne. May this century see their restoration.
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Diopolis
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Founded: May 15, 2012
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Diopolis » Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:11 pm

Frievolk wrote:
Seraven wrote:
Hmm, I am not sure with the Germans, though. Has there been any indications of the remains of Wilhelm's descendants?

Well, I mean there is a heir to the Hohenzollern dynasty. Also to various other dynasties that ruled the smaller states in the German Empire, but that's not even the point. Iirc, the latest censuses (censi?) showed something along the lines of 2 out of every 5 Germans somewhat supporting a restoration (similar in Austria, a lot more in Russia). French heirs (either the legitimists, the orleanists, or the Bonapartes) have way less popularity than that.

Isn't the german monarchist movement currently dominated by neonazis trying to avoid persecution under anti-nazi laws by claiming to be monarchists instead?
I could see Hungary restoring their monarchy before Austria, tbh.
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Trumptonium1
Senator
 
Posts: 4022
Founded: Apr 03, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Trumptonium1 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:21 pm

Diopolis wrote:
Frievolk wrote:Well, I mean there is a heir to the Hohenzollern dynasty. Also to various other dynasties that ruled the smaller states in the German Empire, but that's not even the point. Iirc, the latest censuses (censi?) showed something along the lines of 2 out of every 5 Germans somewhat supporting a restoration (similar in Austria, a lot more in Russia). French heirs (either the legitimists, the orleanists, or the Bonapartes) have way less popularity than that.

Isn't the german monarchist movement currently dominated by neonazis trying to avoid persecution under anti-nazi laws by claiming to be monarchists instead?
I could see Hungary restoring their monarchy before Austria, tbh.


Hungarians aren't stupid.

Although I'm sure many would agree with Orban becoming President-for-Life so he can make some longer term policy decisions, but then absolute democracy is still pretty important and the only reason he's in that position is because he has their continued support.
Last edited by Trumptonium1 on Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bienenhalde
Minister
 
Posts: 2506
Founded: Mar 11, 2017
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Bienenhalde » Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:27 pm

Engleberg wrote:
Seraven wrote:
Hmm, I am not sure with the Germans, though. Has there been any indications of the remains of Wilhelm's descendants?


There is a current heir in the line for the Imperial throne. May this century see their restoration.


I agree. In fact it would be nice to see a Hohenzollern as Emperor of Europe.
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Reikoku
Senator
 
Posts: 3645
Founded: Apr 01, 2017
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Reikoku » Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:43 pm

Bienenhalde wrote:
Engleberg wrote:
There is a current heir in the line for the Imperial throne. May this century see their restoration.


I agree. In fact it would be nice to see a Hohenzollern as Emperor of Europe.


The majority of nationalists and monarchists in Europe would probably beg to differ.

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Kubra
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Posts: 11037
Founded: Apr 15, 2006
Libertarian Police State

Postby Kubra » Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:25 pm

Reikoku wrote:
Bienenhalde wrote:
I agree. In fact it would be nice to see a Hohenzollern as Emperor of Europe.


The majority of nationalists and monarchists in Europe would probably beg to differ.
monarchism always seems fine and dandy until one has to get into particulars, such as who ought to get the crown.
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Auze
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1380
Founded: Oct 31, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Auze » Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:46 pm

Engleberg wrote:
Seraven wrote:
Hmm, I am not sure with the Germans, though. Has there been any indications of the remains of Wilhelm's descendants?


There is a current heir in the line for the Imperial throne. May this century see their restoration.

Why not start small if you must do stuff like this? Restore, I dunno, Ethiopia's monarchy instead.
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Reikoku
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Founded: Apr 01, 2017
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Reikoku » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:41 pm

Kubra wrote:
Reikoku wrote:
The majority of nationalists and monarchists in Europe would probably beg to differ.
monarchism always seems fine and dandy until one has to get into particulars, such as who ought to get the crown.


That's true for just about all ideologies. As a socialist, you must know this. :p
Last edited by Reikoku on Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Kubra
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Posts: 11037
Founded: Apr 15, 2006
Libertarian Police State

Postby Kubra » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:53 pm

Reikoku wrote:
Kubra wrote: monarchism always seems fine and dandy until one has to get into particulars, such as who ought to get the crown.


That's true for just about all ideologies. As a socialist, you must know this. :p
Well hey at least those debates are one of policy, rather than "is it more embarassing to be ruled by an inbred austrian or a pompous frenchman?"
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Reikoku
Senator
 
Posts: 3645
Founded: Apr 01, 2017
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Reikoku » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:55 pm

Kubra wrote:
Reikoku wrote:
That's true for just about all ideologies. As a socialist, you must know this. :p
Well hey at least those debates are one of policy, rather than "is it more embarassing to be ruled by an inbred austrian or a pompous frenchman?"


Is that what we're calling abstract debates about the nature of dialectical materialism?

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Kubra
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Posts: 11037
Founded: Apr 15, 2006
Libertarian Police State

Postby Kubra » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:04 pm

Reikoku wrote:
Kubra wrote: Well hey at least those debates are one of policy, rather than "is it more embarassing to be ruled by an inbred austrian or a pompous frenchman?"


Is that what we're calling abstract debates about the nature of dialectical materialism?
Oh, that's a young man's game. The old have the good sense to leave off the matter, apart from the old people who coined it and its worst aspects (looking at you, Engels).
“Atomic war is inevitable. It will destroy half of humanity: it is going to destroy immense human riches. It is very possible. The atomic war is going to provoke a true inferno on Earth. But it will not impede Communism.”
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Frievolk
Minister
 
Posts: 3368
Founded: Jun 14, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Frievolk » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:57 pm

Bienenhalde wrote:
Engleberg wrote:
There is a current heir in the line for the Imperial throne. May this century see their restoration.


I agree. In fact it would be nice to see a Hohenzollern as Emperor of Europe.

Much as I hate it, A.E.I.O.U.

Diopolis wrote:
Frievolk wrote:Well, I mean there is a heir to the Hohenzollern dynasty. Also to various other dynasties that ruled the smaller states in the German Empire, but that's not even the point. Iirc, the latest censuses (censi?) showed something along the lines of 2 out of every 5 Germans somewhat supporting a restoration (similar in Austria, a lot more in Russia). French heirs (either the legitimists, the orleanists, or the Bonapartes) have way less popularity than that.

Isn't the german monarchist movement currently dominated by neonazis trying to avoid persecution under anti-nazi laws by claiming to be monarchists instead?
I could see Hungary restoring their monarchy before Austria, tbh.

A lot of them are indeed far-right nationalists -the Kaiserreich having been a far-right nationalist regime and all- but I personally doubt most of them are Nazis tbh.
Last edited by Frievolk on Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
OOC
Libertarian Constitutionalist
Part-time Anarchist
Anti-Monotheist
Iranian Nationalist
Templates
♔ The Frievolker Empire || Frievolker Kaiserreik
♔ The Realm in the Sun || De Reik in de Sonne
♔ Led by Kaiser Johann, Part of the Erstwelt
Never forget that the Muslims literally made up a new meaningless name for him when they forgot the name of Adam's Firstborn.

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Autarkheia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 769
Founded: Jun 22, 2018
Corporate Police State

Postby Autarkheia » Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:15 am

I'm confused how neo-Nazis could claim to be monarchists when Nazi Germany didn't have a monarchy, even a symbolic one. It would be easier to do what crypto-fascists always do and just claim to be a "nationalist", or even a "conservative".
We are free to believe that this is the century of authority, a century tending to the right, a Fascist century. If the XIXth century was the century of the individual (liberalism implies individualism) we are free to believe that this is the "collective" century, and therefore the century of the State.

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Frievolk
Minister
 
Posts: 3368
Founded: Jun 14, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Frievolk » Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:46 am

Autarkheia wrote:I'm confused how neo-Nazis could claim to be monarchists when Nazi Germany didn't have a monarchy, even a symbolic one. It would be easier to do what crypto-fascists always do and just claim to be a "nationalist", or even a "conservative".

The Nazi Germany supposedly supported the Monarchy (I mean, not enough to go the Mussolini route and have one be the emperor as figurehead but anyway) and a lot of the German Royalty also supported the Nazis (again, only insofar as their own way of life wasn't threatened. Crown prince Wilhelm was an exception)
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Libertarian Constitutionalist
Part-time Anarchist
Anti-Monotheist
Iranian Nationalist
Templates
♔ The Frievolker Empire || Frievolker Kaiserreik
♔ The Realm in the Sun || De Reik in de Sonne
♔ Led by Kaiser Johann, Part of the Erstwelt
Never forget that the Muslims literally made up a new meaningless name for him when they forgot the name of Adam's Firstborn.

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Diopolis
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Posts: 11268
Founded: May 15, 2012
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Diopolis » Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:38 pm

Autarkheia wrote:I'm confused how neo-Nazis could claim to be monarchists when Nazi Germany didn't have a monarchy, even a symbolic one. It would be easier to do what crypto-fascists always do and just claim to be a "nationalist", or even a "conservative".

Nazi Germany used many similar symbols to Imperial Germany, and protected seigneural rights.
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Salus Maior
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Salus Maior » Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:02 pm

Frievolk wrote:
Autarkheia wrote:I'm confused how neo-Nazis could claim to be monarchists when Nazi Germany didn't have a monarchy, even a symbolic one. It would be easier to do what crypto-fascists always do and just claim to be a "nationalist", or even a "conservative".

The Nazi Germany supposedly supported the Monarchy (I mean, not enough to go the Mussolini route and have one be the emperor as figurehead but anyway) and a lot of the German Royalty also supported the Nazis (again, only insofar as their own way of life wasn't threatened. Crown prince Wilhelm was an exception)


Hitler and Kaiser Wilhelm hated each other, I think it's pretty clear by the fact that they did not restore the crown that they were not royalists.
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Hippie Kiwis
Minister
 
Posts: 2695
Founded: Jan 31, 2014
Father Knows Best State

Postby Hippie Kiwis » Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:48 pm

Fascism and monarchy have an interesting relationship, ranging from hatred in Germany, symbiosis in Italy, and cooperation in Japan
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Teachian
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 161
Founded: Sep 23, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Teachian » Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:13 pm

Salus Maior wrote:Hitler and Kaiser Wilhelm hated each other, I think it's pretty clear by the fact that they did not restore the crown that they were not royalists.


I think Wilhelm (correctly) suspected that he would be nothing more than a puppet for the Nazis, and Hitler felt that Wilhelm would be more trouble than he was worth. Building ties with other movements that opposed the Weimar Republic was useful, but unlike Italy or Japan, there was no reason to even give them nominal influence.

It’d probably take some ridiculously determined demands and effective opposition to force the Nazis to make any concession to bring back the monarchy, so I think it’s safe to say they weren’t Monarchists in any meaningful way.
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Anarcho-Fascist Japan
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 10
Founded: Nov 26, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Anarcho-Fascist Japan » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:22 pm

Who would be the American monarch?
There is no one alive that would fit the job unless they descend from Lincoln or Washington
Last edited by Anarcho-Fascist Japan on Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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