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The General Car Thread - The Facelift.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:58 am
by Petrolheadia
Last thread - viewtopic.php?f=20&t=360203

Welcome to the next General Car Thread.
Here,you can have any car discussion - love 'em, hate' em, talk about what you own, want, love, mention all cars: muscle, tuner, Euro, offroad, electric, self-driving... anything car-related goes.


To start off, what do you think about Tesla?

I think their cars themselves are quite good, but the build quality and quantity problems, as well as the inability to make a profit, makes them a bit worse as a company.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 1:18 am
by Costa Fierro
Tesla as a company is utter dogshit. Tesla cars as products are nothing unusual for American manufacturers in terms of quality. But that doesn't surprise me given that the NUMMI plant wasn't turning out very many decent vehicles prior to (old) GM's collapse.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:14 am
by Freezic Vast
Costa Fierro wrote:Tesla as a company is utter dogshit. Tesla cars as products are nothing unusual for American manufacturers in terms of quality. But that doesn't surprise me given that the NUMMI plant wasn't turning out very many decent vehicles prior to (old) GM's collapse.

Apparently, Telsa recently got an F by the BBB.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/tesl ... ss-bureau/

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:54 am
by Petrolheadia
Costa Fierro wrote:Tesla as a company is utter dogshit. Tesla cars as products are nothing unusual for American manufacturers in terms of quality. But that doesn't surprise me given that the NUMMI plant wasn't turning out very many decent vehicles prior to (old) GM's collapse.

Yeah, shitty cars like the Toyota Corolla or Hilux.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:09 am
by Costa Fierro
Petrolheadia wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:Tesla as a company is utter dogshit. Tesla cars as products are nothing unusual for American manufacturers in terms of quality. But that doesn't surprise me given that the NUMMI plant wasn't turning out very many decent vehicles prior to (old) GM's collapse.

Yeah, shitty cars like the Toyota Corolla or Hilux.


The Corolla was a Toyota product and the Hilux was only produced there for four years, being succeeded by the Tacoma in the mid-size pickup line.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:21 am
by Petrolheadia
Costa Fierro wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:Yeah, shitty cars like the Toyota Corolla or Hilux.


The Corolla was a Toyota product and the Hilux was only produced there for four years, being succeeded by the Tacoma in the mid-size pickup line.

But they were US-made quality vehicles, weren't they?

Tesla's problem is not US manufacturing, it is setting crazy goals without much regard for quality.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:01 am
by Freezic Vast
Petrolheadia wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:Tesla as a company is utter dogshit. Tesla cars as products are nothing unusual for American manufacturers in terms of quality. But that doesn't surprise me given that the NUMMI plant wasn't turning out very many decent vehicles prior to (old) GM's collapse.

Yeah, shitty cars like the Toyota Corolla or Hilux.

I'm sorry but when I hear someone call the Hilux shit, I must mention that the Hilux is almost indestructible and incredibly reliant as a truck. And we've seen it take such abuse and still have it's engine run. (Top Gear anyone?)

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:13 am
by Petrolheadia
Freezic Vast wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:Yeah, shitty cars like the Toyota Corolla or Hilux.

I'm sorry but when I hear someone call the Hilux shit, I must mention that the Hilux is almost indestructible and incredibly reliant as a truck. And we've seen it take such abuse and still have it's engine run. (Top Gear anyone?)

It was sarcasm.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:22 am
by Skylus
I want this

Image

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:24 am
by Costa Fierro
Petrolheadia wrote:But they were US-made quality vehicles, weren't they?


As quality as you can get for American automotive manufacturing. Would rather have a Japanese made one of either.

Tesla's problem is not US manufacturing, it is setting crazy goals without much regard for quality.


So manufacturing. Which is what I said.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:46 am
by Petrolheadia
Costa Fierro wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:But they were US-made quality vehicles, weren't they?


As quality as you can get for American automotive manufacturing. Would rather have a Japanese made one of either.

Tesla's problem is not US manufacturing, it is setting crazy goals without much regard for quality.


So manufacturing. Which is what I said.

Yeah, but the Corolla proves you can have a good NUMMI car.

And the reason the Model S is not one is not US manufacturing - it's Elon Musk's approach.

Skylus wrote:I want this

(Image)

Mercury Cougar, the Mustang's lifestyle cousin.

Or the Falcon's lifestyle2 cousin.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:14 am
by Petrolheadia
And as the new thread started, the car choosing scenarios come back.

Imagine it is 1992. You are a 38-year-old married accountant with a 9-year-old daughter and a 3-year-old son. You live in Germany's eastern seaside borderlands. You are looking for a reliable, decently economical and well-equipped family car to replace the 1987 Trabant 601. The options are:
- 1985 VW Passat 1.8 wagon (127kkm),
- 1985 Nissan Bluebird 2.0 sedan (119 kkm),
- 1984 Audi 100 2.0 turbodiesel wagon (165 kkm),
- 1984 Mercedes 190 (134 kkm),
- 1986 Renault 21 1.6 wagon (132 kkm),
- 1982 BMW 520i (117kkm),
- 1983 Mercedes 200D sedan (157 kkm),
- 1986 Ford Scorpio 2.0 liftback (99kkm),
- 1986 Opel Kadett 1.6 5dr hatchback (47kkm).

Which one would you buy?

I think the Audi would be a good family car.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:43 am
by Elwher

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:45 am
by Petrolheadia

It's not the apocalypse, it's just the turn of an era.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:49 am
by Aillyria
Skylus wrote:I want this

(Image)

Nice, an old Cougar. An old lady in my neighborhood has a green one, beautiful car.

On Tesla, I'm not a fan of e-cars or hybrids generally. Tesla as an idea, a business model, isn't a terrible concept, but Elon Musk needs to up his game.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:01 am
by Petrolheadia
Speaking of Ferrari, I'd love if they made the X80 Proto a real car.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:29 am
by Licana
Petrolheadia wrote:To start off, what do you think about Tesla?


They're extremely overhyped.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:58 am
by Auzkhia
New thread? New thread!
The 500 was not a replacement for the Crown Vic. It was specifically a replacement for the Taurus which was discontinued in 2006 for consumers, and 2007 for fleet buyers. Didn't stop em from bringing the name plate back almost immediately after refreshing the 500. I'm still a bit amazed that Ford managed to turn the slow and droll 500 into something that actually looks passable as a car. And then turned it into something like the Chrysler 300, but without the prestige/presence. (tbh both cars need a fresh design)

Remember the Crown Vic was kept around for more than a few years after the Taurus was killed, and then brought back again.

For that matter the Fusion stepped in to fill the new mid-size void left by the Taurus moving up. If Ford was indeed planning to replace the CV with the 500... I question their sanity with that move.

Fusion replaced the old Taurus, and the Volvo S80 derived Five Hundred/Taurus replaced the Crown Victoria, in 2007 Ford discontinued the Crown Victoria in retail markets, but kept making for fleet sales, especially police interceptors, so Ford intended the new Taurus/Five Hundred to fulfill the entry level full size sedan segment. The Town Car did well for limousine fleet sales. The Mercury Grand Marquis was the best selling car for Mercury, the Milan was popular too, but was the new sable. In fact, in Canada, they stopped selling all Mercury cars except the Grand Marquis. I wish for a new panther body that isn't FWD, but Ford would just say a buy a mustang, and try to use that as an all purpose enthusiast car.

At least the speed machine won't go away if oil disappears. The Ferrari the Ferrari is a hybrid, though.

Though, I'd miss the charming V8 and V12 engines, singing a lovely chorus of bass and tenor.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:50 pm
by Elwher
Petrolheadia wrote:

It's not the apocalypse, it's just the turn of an era.


When Ferrari's are silent, the Four Horsemen cannot be far behind.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 1:00 pm
by Petrolheadia
Elwher wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:It's not the apocalypse, it's just the turn of an era.


When Ferrari's are silent, the Four Horsemen cannot be far behind.

We've spent thousands of years without Ferraris, silence isn't much compared to that.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 1:26 pm
by Auzkhia

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 2:49 pm
by Petrolheadia

Has anybody else ever made a sedan SUV?

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:21 pm
by Auzkhia
Petrolheadia wrote:

Has anybody else ever made a sedan SUV?

Volvo and Subaru maybe, if you consider a lifted S60 or Legacy to be SUV.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:24 pm
by Cannot think of a name
Petrolheadia wrote:

Has anybody else ever made a sedan SUV?

There's the AMC Eagle...
Image

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:39 pm
by NeoOasis
Petrolheadia wrote:

To start off, what do you think about Tesla?



Between crap build quality and questionable value for money, I find a lot of the design choices of the Model 3 to be extremely questionable. Their pursuit of simplicity has made the car more difficult and more dangerous to operate.

Personally, I'd rather have a Nissan Leaf or wait for BMW and VW to drop their new electrics. Worst comes to worst, I'll be waiting a couple of years regardless of what I do.