The General Car Thread - The Facelift.

[Petrolheadia]

I really like the idea of a pick up as a second vehicle, but I don't want a truck, I want it to be a car.

What do, wait 25 years to important a ute from a land down under or get a Jetta or a Dodge Charger and send it to this?

Or just suck it up and truck it up?

Suck it up and truck up. The newer the truck, the more like a car it feels anyway... well, a traditional RWD BOF car with a live rear axle. Which is exactly what you'll get with a ute.

After sitting inside an XTS and a ATS at a used dealer lot, I found them to be actually underwhelming - maybe not to drive, but certainly in how you feel inside. Far too tight with too little head and hip room, dominated by giant consoles and windshields far too close to your face. The Chrysler 300 was the closest to feeling spacious. Trucks, meanwhile, were much more impressive.... a little too much, if anything, as the consoles in non-bench models felt ridiculously wide. I may very well get a CPO/used truck or SUV instead of a car. Problem for me is that Ford seems to make the most competent ones. Either way, give a new-ish truck a try, it will likely surprise you.

Maybe buy a second-hand Escalade or Navigator?

Speaking of, the reason I was at car lots was my girlfriend is looking for a new(er) car. Her family is far more endowed than mine, and they're insisting she get something newer and safer than her Saturn and are willing to pay dearly for such. She has, to my chagrin, gravitated to getting a new Prius. I'm not so concerned with the practical or economic issues, it seems to be a competent enough car and a fair-ish deal; but the *other* implications of driving a Prius would be such I would never really feel comfortable with driving it for her. Same as with my mom's Forester.

The car version of toxic masculinity?

On a more serious note, what about a hybrid version of a traditional sedan like a Toyota Camry or Hyundai Sonata, or a CUV like a Kia Niro? And used Tesla Model S prices keep going down, so you may as well wait and make yourself a two-luxury-car family.

My sister wrecked her car and might get a 2004 Jeep Liberty.

The Honda CR-V or Subaru Forester seem to be better compact SUVs.

[Patridam]

Maybe buy a second-hand Escalade or Navigator?

Since this is still probably two years off from now, I was thinking about a 2015-2017 F150 Lariat Supercab (example). A Lariat supercab in particular is a good value proposition used, you can get one in the vein of $25k with V8, 4WD - thats true of other F150s. But, it costs no more than the equivalent XL or XLT trim with the same drivetrain/cab, and has leather cooled seats and similar "excess" features. I think its because most of the people who bother with that stuff want the crew cab, which is all of 10 grand more in the same trim all for some more rear leg room.

As for your suggestion, I would never use the third row of an SUV - even the back seats of whatever I buy wouldn't be used often - so an SUV seems excessive and a pickup bed might in fact be more useful. Plus if I was gonna get one, I'd probably go for a well equipped Tahoe or Yukon over an Escalade.

The car version of toxic masculinity?

On a more serious note, what about a hybrid version of a traditional sedan like a Toyota Camry or Hyundai Sonata, or a CUV like a Kia Niro? And used Tesla Model S prices keep going down, so you may as well wait and make yourself a two-luxury-car family.

One, I reject the idea that masculinity is toxic, but.... as well as being vaguely effeminate cars, the more concerning implication is the politics one gets into with a car. You ever see the South Park episode about hybrid drivers?

Eh, she doesn't care *that* much about fuel economy, she in fact rejected the plug in Prius Prime directly. 53% of Prius owners like it because "it says something about me and my politics" and she falls into that camp. Plus she likes it because of very odd, specific reasons, from the styling down to the funny little shifter to the center gauges. So other cars that don't shout "environmentalist" like her reusable straws, however efficient they may be, defeat her purpose.

My sister wrecked her car and might get a 2004 Jeep Liberty.

Yeah, steer her away from a Liberty. I have been in a friend's 2007 Compass and it was miserable - the nice trim, but literally every surface was hard plastic, including the arm rests - and the engine sounded angrier and louder than any other <properly working> car I've been in; so I can only imagine the misery of a Liberty. Maybe try what Petrolheadia said, or a first gen Escape, or some of the last Saturn crossovers.

[Petrolheadia]

One, I reject the idea that masculinity is toxic, but.... as well as being vaguely effeminate cars, the more concerning implication is the politics one gets into with a car. You ever see the South Park episode about hybrid drivers?

Eh, she doesn't care *that* much about fuel economy, she in fact rejected the plug in Prius Prime directly. 53% of Prius owners like it because "it says something about me and my politics" and she falls into that camp. Plus she likes it because of very odd, specific reasons, from the styling down to the funny little shifter to the center gauges. So other cars that don't shout "environmentalist" like her reusable straws, however efficient they may be, defeat her purpose.

Few people go into such deep thoughts about passing cars' drivers. And it goes both ways - she'll have to associate with your F-150.

[Auzkhia]

My sister wrecked her car and might get a 2004 Jeep Liberty.

Yeah, steer her away from a Liberty. I have been in a friend's 2007 Compass and it was miserable - the nice trim, but literally every surface was hard plastic, including the arm rests - and the engine sounded angrier and louder than any other <properly working> car I've been in; so I can only imagine the misery of a Liberty. Maybe try what Petrolheadia said, or a first gen Escape, or some of the last Saturn crossovers.

My parents got her a BMW X3 at an auction, Saturn Vue was an option but it has some trouble codes and too many miles for their taste. There were three Jeep Liberty vehicles there, but most had some codes on it and were beaten up a bit.

[Vassenor]

Yeah, steer her away from a Liberty. I have been in a friend's 2007 Compass and it was miserable - the nice trim, but literally every surface was hard plastic, including the arm rests - and the engine sounded angrier and louder than any other <properly working> car I've been in; so I can only imagine the misery of a Liberty. Maybe try what Petrolheadia said, or a first gen Escape, or some of the last Saturn crossovers.

My parents got her a BMW X3 at an auction, Saturn Vue was an option but it has some trouble codes and too many miles for their taste. There were three Jeep Liberty vehicles there, but most had some codes on it and were beaten up a bit.

Sheesh I wish I could afford to run anything like that.

[Auzkhia]

My parents got her a BMW X3 at an auction, Saturn Vue was an option but it has some trouble codes and too many miles for their taste. There were three Jeep Liberty vehicles there, but most had some codes on it and were beaten up a bit.

Sheesh I wish I could afford to run anything like that.

Jeeps are so bad that a BMW is better. Her Compass was a money pit, my Dad tries to fix things himself, it was the only time he sent it to the dealer.

Her dream car is a Jeep Wrangler, mind you, and she wants to live in New York or Los Angeles. I don't think that car is suitable for big cities.

[Patridam]

Few people go into such deep thoughts about passing cars' drivers. And it goes both ways - she'll have to associate with your F-150.

I dunno, she actively wants me to have a truck. That among many other stereotypically masculine things - such as she never wants me to be a "house husband" without a job - are to ensure I don't end up, in her words "a soyboy with low testosterone or much estrogen. Studies link it to low performance and even being gay." She drives her mom's truck a lot anyway, so she can certainly stand to drive one.

[Auzkhia]

Tough news for the manual supremacists

In my experience, Audi's manuals are weird and have a fussy clutch.

Few people go into such deep thoughts about passing cars' drivers. And it goes both ways - she'll have to associate with your F-150.

I dunno, she actively wants me to have a truck. That among many other stereotypically masculine things - such as she never wants me to be a "house husband" without a job - are to ensure I don't end up, in her words "a soyboy with low testosterone or much estrogen. Studies link it to low performance and even being gay." She drives her mom's truck a lot anyway, so she can certainly stand to drive one.

As if there's anything wrong with that...

[Patridam]

As if there's anything wrong with that...

No, there's nothing wrong, but I can understand why it would be in my girlfriend's best interest for me to remain straight.

[Cannot think of a name]

As if there's anything wrong with that...

No, there's nothing wrong, but I can understand why it would be in my girlfriend's best interest for me to remain straight.

If driving a truck is the only thing keeping that from happening I have bad news for your girlfriend...

[The Two Jerseys]

No, there's nothing wrong, but I can understand why it would be in my girlfriend's best interest for me to remain straight.

If driving a truck is the only thing keeping that from happening I have bad news for your girlfriend...

On the bright side, he now has the perfect excuse for spending all day Sundays laying on the couch drinking beer and watching sports!

[Patridam]

No, there's nothing wrong, but I can understand why it would be in my girlfriend's best interest for me to remain straight.

If driving a truck is the only thing keeping that from happening I have bad news for your girlfriend...

See, know you got me in a goddamn corner now ya smug jerk, because there's nothing less convincing than asserting you're secure in your masculinity. Suffice it to say, no, she doesn't have anything to worry about. She just finds "toxically masculine" things/behaviors attractive.

But, this a threat on an imaginary country-running website about cars, so I don't think we ought to dig any more into my life.

[The South Falls]

If driving a truck is the only thing keeping that from happening I have bad news for your girlfriend...

On the bright side, he now has the perfect excuse for spending all day Sundays laying on the couch drinking beer and watching sports!

You don't need an excuse for that.

[Auzkhia]

What you rather have a panther body Ford/Mercury/Lincoln, a Buick Park Avenue/Lesabre with the 3.8, a northstar Cadillac Deville, or the Dodge Charger/Chrysler 300?

I made my choice already. But out of those cars, which would you go for? They're all fullsize American sedans with V6s and V8s from the mid 2000s, and can be had luxury cars.

---

As if there's anything wrong with that...

No, there's nothing wrong, but I can understand why it would be in my girlfriend's best interest for me to remain straight.

Bisexuality and pansexuality are a thing, you can still keep your girls. 10/10 would recommend, I'm sexually fluid and Mercurial, which is why I drive a Mercury.

Which answers my question which steers it back to cars, since we took a pit stop in sexual orientation.

[The Two Jerseys]

What you rather have a panther body Ford/Mercury/Lincoln, a Buick Park Avenue/Lesabre with the 3.8, a northstar Cadillac Deville, or the Dodge Charger/Chrysler 300?

I made my choice already. But out of those cars, which would you go for? They're all fullsize American sedans with V6s and V8s from the mid 2000s, and can be had luxury cars.

I'm leaning towards the LeSabre or DeVille.

Though the correct answer is a B-body or D-body.

[Petrolheadia]

What you rather have a panther body Ford/Mercury/Lincoln, a Buick Park Avenue/Lesabre with the 3.8, a northstar Cadillac Deville, or the Dodge Charger/Chrysler 300?

I made my choice already. But out of those cars, which would you go for? They're all fullsize American sedans with V6s and V8s from the mid 2000s, and can be had luxury cars.

Depends on what I'd be looking for:
- comfort - Town Car,
- handling - Charger,
- cheap ownership - Buick.

[Petrolheadia]

Generally in the USSR people were assigned a car if they were on a decent enough position, but people with enough money could buy their cars.

Here is a price list from 1983:
– GAZ-24 Volga – 11 200 rubles
– VAZ-2121 Niva – 10 300 rubles
– VAZ-2107 – 9000 rubles
– VAZ-2106 – 8400 rubles
– Moskvitch 2140SL – 8000 rubles
– VAZ-2105 – 8000 rubles
– VAZ-2103 – 7500 rubles
– Moskvitch 2140 – 7500 rubles
– VAZ-2102 – 7400 rubles
– VAZ-2101 – 6400 rubles
– ZAZ-968M Zaporozhetz – 5600 rubles.

The average monthly salary was 150 rubles, so a base Lada would cost as much to buy to the average Soviet citizen as a Maserati Quattroporte or Mercedes 500SEL to the average American.

It's hard to find an exclusivity analogue for being given one, but a new Cadillac Fleetwood or Eldorado could be somewhere around that territory.

[New Wolvers]

I just wish that Italy issued polish-like license plates honestly, so I can customize it and give it a normal teast like MRK1NRD instead of the format AA 000AA, as well as I wish Italy didn't applied mega taxes on how powerful your car is.

[Costa Fierro]

I really like the idea of a pick up as a second vehicle, but I don't want a truck, I want it to be a car.

What do, wait 25 years to important a ute from a land down under or get a Jetta or a Dodge Charger and send it to this?

Or just suck it up and truck it up?

That depends. There's plenty of older classics you could import that could easily be fixed up with US parts, like the old One Tonner and HQ utes made by Holden in the 70's or the old Falcon utes based on the XF. The former especially basically used GM engines from the State's anyway, and have ample room to fit small block V8's in them.

Better yet, try and find one of these.

[Petrolheadia]

I just wish that Italy issued polish-like license plates honestly, so I can customize it and give it a normal teast like MRK1NRD instead of the format AA 000AA, as well as I wish Italy didn't applied mega taxes on how powerful your car is.

Here in Poland, you have to have your voivodship's identifier on custom plates (e.g. if you live in Mazovian, it has to start with W0, W1, W2, etc.).

And I don't get why so few people get vanity plates, they're cheaper than most new car options.

[Trumptonium1]

I just wish that Italy issued polish-like license plates honestly, so I can customize it and give it a normal teast like MRK1NRD instead of the format AA 000AA, as well as I wish Italy didn't applied mega taxes on how powerful your car is.

Here in Poland, you have to have your voivodship's identifier on custom plates (e.g. if you live in Mazovian, it has to start with W0, W1, W2, etc.).

And I don't get why so few people get vanity plates, they're cheaper than most new car options.

They're very pretentious, and a lot of people like displaying their powiat, especially if you're not from a crappy place.

I've never seen a Porsche/Maserati or anything alike with custom plates. They're always DW, KR, W(/), WP(/), S(/), TK/TKI, RZ/RZE, RST, LLE, WWL, KTT, GPU, GD, GA, GSP, OP, PO... and rarely anything else, let alone customs.

[Vassenor]

...No Jenny the Fiat 500 is not really a good idea.

[New Wolvers]

I just wish that Italy issued polish-like license plates honestly, so I can customize it and give it a normal teast like MRK1NRD instead of the format AA 000AA, as well as I wish Italy didn't applied mega taxes on how powerful your car is.

Here in Poland, you have to have your voivodship's identifier on custom plates (e.g. if you live in Mazovian, it has to start with W0, W1, W2, etc.).

And I don't get why so few people get vanity plates, they're cheaper than most new car options.

yeah I have been in Poland, precisely in Jelenia Gora, and I know how it works but to be fair, having a vanity plate for me is something to make my car unique in a way.

[Petrolheadia]

Here in Poland, you have to have your voivodship's identifier on custom plates (e.g. if you live in Mazovian, it has to start with W0, W1, W2, etc.).

And I don't get why so few people get vanity plates, they're cheaper than most new car options.

They're very pretentious, and a lot of people like displaying their powiat, especially if you're not from a crappy place.

I've never seen a Porsche/Maserati or anything alike with custom plates. They're always DW, KR, W(/), WP(/), S(/), TK/TKI, RZ/RZE, RST, LLE, WWL, KTT, GPU, GD, GA, GSP, OP, PO... and rarely anything else, let alone customs.

I don't have much of a memory for license plates, but most of the vanity plate stuff is luxury cars - Jaguars, BMWs, Audis, etc.

[Trumptonium1]

They're very pretentious, and a lot of people like displaying their powiat, especially if you're not from a crappy place.

I've never seen a Porsche/Maserati or anything alike with custom plates. They're always DW, KR, W(/), WP(/), S(/), TK/TKI, RZ/RZE, RST, LLE, WWL, KTT, GPU, GD, GA, GSP, OP, PO... and rarely anything else, let alone customs.

I don't have much of a memory for license plates, but most of the vanity plate stuff is luxury cars - Jaguars, BMWs, Audis, etc.

I wouldn't call either of the three marques luxury, more so upper middle class midlife crisis, which fits in with the whole pretentious thing.

I mean some models might fit the technical definition of 'luxury/exec' or own-brand marketing 'luxury', but I don't think cars which are in the top 10 highest selling new models/marques can be called luxurious. Then again something like Porsche would expectably be top 10 somewhere like Monaco or UAE, but for the sake of my point I'll say it's valid.

I've seen a lot of Porsches while on holiday and genuinely don't think I've seen a custom plate. They're pretty rare in general but the ones I distinctly remember were on Jeeps, Audis, Mercs, Infinitis and one BMW on either fake or real Dubai plates.