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The General Car Thread - The Facelift.

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Auzkhia
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Postby Auzkhia » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:54 pm

NeoOasis wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:

To start off, what do you think about Tesla?



Between crap build quality and questionable value for money, I find a lot of the design choices of the Model 3 to be extremely questionable. Their pursuit of simplicity has made the car more difficult and more dangerous to operate.

Personally, I'd rather have a Nissan Leaf or wait for BMW and VW to drop their new electrics. Worst comes to worst, I'll be waiting a couple of years regardless of what I do.

Yeah, I'd say Tesla is a tech company that happens to make cars, rather a car company.
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Postby NeoOasis » Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:14 pm

Auzkhia wrote:
NeoOasis wrote:
Between crap build quality and questionable value for money, I find a lot of the design choices of the Model 3 to be extremely questionable. Their pursuit of simplicity has made the car more difficult and more dangerous to operate.

Personally, I'd rather have a Nissan Leaf or wait for BMW and VW to drop their new electrics. Worst comes to worst, I'll be waiting a couple of years regardless of what I do.

Yeah, I'd say Tesla is a tech company that happens to make cars, rather a car company.


That excuse won't fly with investors. It's not flying with me to be honest. I'd expect a tech company to understand that build quality and timely release of announced products is important. Instead we have Tesla doing some truly shoddy assembly, and falling behind targets and release dates by a huge margin.

At least Musk finally read that memo, and we've been seeing a concerted effort both to increase quality and up the output of the Model 3... Granted if any quality gains will be retained with the quantity gain remains to be seen.

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Auzkhia
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Postby Auzkhia » Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:24 pm

NeoOasis wrote:
Auzkhia wrote:Yeah, I'd say Tesla is a tech company that happens to make cars, rather a car company.


That excuse won't fly with investors. It's not flying with me to be honest. I'd expect a tech company to understand that build quality and timely release of announced products is important. Instead we have Tesla doing some truly shoddy assembly, and falling behind targets and release dates by a huge margin.

At least Musk finally read that memo, and we've been seeing a concerted effort both to increase quality and up the output of the Model 3... Granted if any quality gains will be retained with the quantity gain remains to be seen.

That's not an excuse, I don't think they will surpass any of the established US based automakers, though, their brand is just hyped up to near cult like devotion.
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Postby Aboveland » Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:24 pm

Auzkhia wrote:
NeoOasis wrote:
Between crap build quality and questionable value for money, I find a lot of the design choices of the Model 3 to be extremely questionable. Their pursuit of simplicity has made the car more difficult and more dangerous to operate.

Personally, I'd rather have a Nissan Leaf or wait for BMW and VW to drop their new electrics. Worst comes to worst, I'll be waiting a couple of years regardless of what I do.

Yeah, I'd say Tesla is a tech company that happens to make cars, rather a car company.

The locking of the previous thread brought me here :)

I can't really give much of an opinion on how good or bad Tesla is, I'm just a little convinced the media is kinda witch hunting the company. Sites like Jalopnik, which I really do enjoy, just can't have enough of bashing Telsa. Their points are given as facts when, in reality, there's a bias sticking it's pointy end in there.
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Auzkhia
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Postby Auzkhia » Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:29 pm

Aboveland wrote:
Auzkhia wrote:Yeah, I'd say Tesla is a tech company that happens to make cars, rather a car company.

The locking of the previous thread brought me here :)

I can't really give much of an opinion on how good or bad Tesla is, I'm just a little convinced the media is kinda witch hunting the company. Sites like Jalopnik, which I really do enjoy, just can't have enough of bashing Telsa. Their points are given as facts when, in reality, there's a bias sticking it's pointy end in there.

Criticism isn't necessarily bashing, but to the fanboys, it is.
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Costa Fierro
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Postby Costa Fierro » Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:07 pm

Auzkhia wrote:
NeoOasis wrote:
Between crap build quality and questionable value for money, I find a lot of the design choices of the Model 3 to be extremely questionable. Their pursuit of simplicity has made the car more difficult and more dangerous to operate.

Personally, I'd rather have a Nissan Leaf or wait for BMW and VW to drop their new electrics. Worst comes to worst, I'll be waiting a couple of years regardless of what I do.

Yeah, I'd say Tesla is a tech company that happens to make cars, rather a car company.


Not even that. Tech companies don't leverage the fuck out of themselves with other businesses run by the same CEO. Tech companies don't sell bonds and stock offers to stave off bankruptcy. Tech companies don't suck up federal and state subsidies and still haven't made a profit on any of their products.
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Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:56 am

Costa Fierro wrote:
Auzkhia wrote:Yeah, I'd say Tesla is a tech company that happens to make cars, rather a car company.


Not even that. Tech companies don't leverage the fuck out of themselves with other businesses run by the same CEO. Tech companies don't sell bonds and stock offers to stave off bankruptcy. Tech companies don't suck up federal and state subsidies and still haven't made a profit on any of their products.

Tech companied don't sue every reviewer who fails to praise them.
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Postby Costa Fierro » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:10 am

Petrolheadia wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:
Not even that. Tech companies don't leverage the fuck out of themselves with other businesses run by the same CEO. Tech companies don't sell bonds and stock offers to stave off bankruptcy. Tech companies don't suck up federal and state subsidies and still haven't made a profit on any of their products.

Tech companied don't sue every reviewer who fails to praise them.


And tech companies also don't cite "user error" for design faults.
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Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:17 am

Costa Fierro wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:Tech companied don't sue every reviewer who fails to praise them.


And tech companies also don't cite "user error" for design faults.

Unless the users are holding it wrong.
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Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:21 am

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Postby Freezic Vast » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:34 am


I always knew those vans could kill, it's why I don't particularly like them at all.
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Auzkhia
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Postby Auzkhia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:53 am

Costa Fierro wrote:
Auzkhia wrote:Yeah, I'd say Tesla is a tech company that happens to make cars, rather a car company.


Not even that. Tech companies don't leverage the fuck out of themselves with other businesses run by the same CEO. Tech companies don't sell bonds and stock offers to stave off bankruptcy. Tech companies don't suck up federal and state subsidies and still haven't made a profit on any of their products.

That's true too, Clarkson had a team of layers when he reviewed the Model X in TGT.

Though I think people are kinda missing the point of that statement, let me rephrase it. I don't think Tesla will ever displace any of the big 3 American automakers, not even Chrysler, they struggle a lot, but they just seem to survive somehow, nowadays, it's suburban country folk buying Dodge Rams and Jeeps keeping them afloat, the Challenger seems to be successful as its owners rate it highly, and Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep dealers give out subprime loans, though that's not them only, Nissan and Kia do that too.
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Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:58 am

Auzkhia wrote:
Costa Fierro wrote:
Not even that. Tech companies don't leverage the fuck out of themselves with other businesses run by the same CEO. Tech companies don't sell bonds and stock offers to stave off bankruptcy. Tech companies don't suck up federal and state subsidies and still haven't made a profit on any of their products.

That's true too, Clarkson had a team of layers when he reviewed the Model X in TGT.

From what I've heard, Musk has a childish approach to criticism - if he does something, he is always the best.

I have a bit of that sometimes, but I'm not running a company that makes tens of thousands of cars.
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Auzkhia
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Postby Auzkhia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:02 am

Petrolheadia wrote:
Auzkhia wrote:That's true too, Clarkson had a team of layers when he reviewed the Model X in TGT.

From what I've heard, Musk has a childish approach to criticism - if he does something, he is always the best.

I have a bit of that sometimes, but I'm not running a company that makes tens of thousands of cars.

It doesn't help that there are internet white knights singing his praises, as if he is Jesus 2.0. Of course Tesla, isn't alone, take the Nissan GT-R for example. A lot of car enthusiasts go through the fanatical phase where you have 15 year old fanboys insisting that their car is best car, as life is a game of top trumps.

Silicon Valley Billionaires won't save the world. They say so, because saving the world is the best marketing tactic, especially with this "conscious consumerism" trend.
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Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:05 am

Auzkhia wrote:
Petrolheadia wrote:From what I've heard, Musk has a childish approach to criticism - if he does something, he is always the best.

I have a bit of that sometimes, but I'm not running a company that makes tens of thousands of cars.

It doesn't help that there are internet white knights singing his praises, as if he is Jesus 2.0. Of course Tesla, isn't alone, take the Nissan GT-R for example. A lot of car enthusiasts go through the fanatical phase where you have 15 year old fanboys insisting that their car is best car, as life is a game of top trumps.

Silicon Valley Billionaires won't save the world. They say so, because saving the world is the best marketing tactic, especially with this "conscious consumerism" trend.

To be fair, "saving the world" isma better investment pitch than "making cars".
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Postby Soviet Spud Land » Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:57 pm

Apparently, Jeep is going stop production of the Wrangler JK this week. Plus, Audi had some recalls for coolant pump problems
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Postby Auzkhia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:58 pm

Soviet Spud Land wrote:Apparently, Jeep is going stop production of the Wrangler JK this week. Plus, Audi had some recalls for coolant pump problems

There's a new Jeep Wrangler, haven't you heard?

Tragic, though Audis can be a bit fussy sometimes.
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Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 2:29 pm

Soviet Spud Land wrote:Apparently, Jeep is going stop production of the Wrangler JK this week. Plus, Audi had some recalls for coolant pump problems

To be fair, that would only be real news if they stopped making the Wrangler altogether.
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Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 3:05 pm


I think consumer versions of cars like this or The Beast wouldn't sell badly.

Strip all the classified stuff, sell it, profit.
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Auzkhia
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Postby Auzkhia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:11 pm

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Postby Freezic Vast » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:17 pm


That looks like a Rolls-Royce, a Chrysler, and a Cadillac all in one, and it looks okay, but it is seriously uncool.
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Postby Petrolheadia » Wed Apr 25, 2018 10:21 pm

Freezic Vast wrote:

That looks like a Rolls-Royce, a Chrysler, and a Cadillac all in one, and it looks okay, but it is seriously uncool.

If this guy drives it, it's automatically sub-zero.
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Postby Patridam » Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:37 am

Aboveland wrote:I can't really give much of an opinion on how good or bad Tesla is, I'm just a little convinced the media is kinda witch hunting the company. Sites like Jalopnik, which I really do enjoy, just can't have enough of bashing Telsa. Their points are given as facts when, in reality, there's a bias sticking it's pointy end in there.


Traditional car enthusiast sites/magazines will by default not like Teslas because the company treats them more like $50,000 iPhones than cars.

However almost every other type of site/news source as well as most people inevitably have nothing but positive things to say about Tesla and Ol' Musky.

Petrolheadia wrote:If this guy drives it, it's automatically sub-zero.


I'm fairly certain the point is to *be* driven in it, rather than to drive it.
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Postby Freezic Vast » Thu Apr 26, 2018 3:25 am

Petrolheadia wrote:
Freezic Vast wrote:That looks like a Rolls-Royce, a Chrysler, and a Cadillac all in one, and it looks okay, but it is seriously uncool.

If this guy drives it, it's automatically sub-zero.

Who was the man who designed it, and/or what company gave him the money for it? And if we can get pictures of Putin actually driving it it'll move up to sub-zero then, maybe.
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