The Islamic Discussion Thread ٤: It's Always Sunni In Arabia

[The Knockout Gun Gals]

Coming from you I take this as further proof that my original statement is correct.

Shariah doesn't apply to non-Muslims. Which brings me to another question. Let's say a utopian nation practices Shariah law. This is why Muslims aren't allowed to kill each other in said utopia. Then a person from a death cult moves in. Would the utopia be able to punish the cultist for murder? Please explain.

But Shariah does apply to Non-muslims, in form of Jizya.

[The Knockout Gun Gals]

I have a huge problem:
So, my parents don't know I'm a Muslim... or I'd be disowned.
And now I'm going to a Christian Private school.
And I think a girl has a crush on me
And I like her back.
I hate islamophobics

Maybe I'm not the best kind of people to give an advice in a situation like this (since I was born a Muslim already), but if I may ask, why do you decide to convert to Islam?
If you have already decided to remain true to Islam, then maybe you can rethink the reason on why you decide to become a Muslim. Perhaps you can also deepen your knowledge about the religion, and pray, asking for some direction from God, if you have some free time.

About the Christian private school, it can be hard, sure. Both of my parents are Muslims, and they used to go to Christian private schools during their elementary and high school years, if I remember correctly, because of the condition of where they used to live. From their stories, I don't see any particular problem with being there....unless the situation in your place is entirely different.

My mother was also a non-Muslim in her younger years, and my grandma was only a Muslim right before her death (before that, she was a follower of Kejawen). So you are the one who can decide on how you want to live your life.
Cheers!

Christian school is not exactly a bad thing when you think about it. It allows to interact with people with different religions and that's a good thing. Opening your mind to the world sounds fair.

[Jolthig]

Shariah doesn't apply to non-Muslims. Which brings me to another question. Let's say a utopian nation practices Shariah law. This is why Muslims aren't allowed to kill each other in said utopia. Then a person from a death cult moves in. Would the utopia be able to punish the cultist for murder? Please explain.

But Shariah does apply to Non-muslims, in form of Jizya.

Jizya is just a tax to pay to an Islamic state in exchange for protection. It isnt any different from myself paying taxes to the US government in exchange for my own protection, and government services.

[New haven america]

Coming from you I take this as further proof that my original statement is correct.

1. Shariah doesn't apply to non-Muslims. Which brings me to another question. 2.Let's say a utopian nation practices Shariah law. 3.This is why Muslims aren't allowed to kill each other in said utopia. 4.Then a person from a death cult moves in. 5. Would the utopia be able to punish the cultist for murder? Please explain.

1. Yes it does
2. That's an oxymoron. As is any utopia with a state mandated religion/religious law.
3. If it was a utopia then there shouldn't be any reason to kill people. Not just because the law doesn't allow it, but because society is set up in such a way that no one would have any reason to do so.
4. Why would a utopia even allow someone like this in to begin with?
5. Yes. As we can see in any country that practices Sharia Law, considering Sharia tends to be the country's only legal system (Country's with only Sharia Law include: Mauritania, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Qatar, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, The Maldives, and Brunei).

[The Alma Mater]

2. That's an oxymoron. As is any utopia with a state mandated religion/religious law.
3. If it was a utopia then there shouldn't be any reason to kill people. Not just because the law doesn't allow it, but because society is set up in such a way that no one would have any reason to do so.

Utopia requires mind control then ? Because "my religion demands a sacrifice" does not require any other reason.

[New haven america]

2. That's an oxymoron. As is any utopia with a state mandated religion/religious law.
3. If it was a utopia then there shouldn't be any reason to kill people. Not just because the law doesn't allow it, but because society is set up in such a way that no one would have any reason to do so.

Utopia requires mind control then ? Because "my religion demands a sacrifice" does not require any other reason.

Some would argue that yes, utopias could require mind control/mental conditioning.

But then we get into the argument about whether that's actually a utopia, or just a really nice dystopia.

[Jolthig]

Utopia requires mind control then ? Because "my religion demands a sacrifice" does not require any other reason.

Some would argue that yes, utopias could require mind control/mental conditioning.

But then we get into the argument about whether that's actually a utopia, or just a really nice dystopia.

That's dystopia. Not utopia.

Speaking of that, I'm learning a lot about dystopia through Orwell's 1984

[New haven america]

Some would argue that yes, utopias could require mind control/mental conditioning.

But then we get into the argument about whether that's actually a utopia, or just a really nice dystopia.

That's dystopia. Not utopia.

Speaking of that, I'm learning a lot about dystopia through Orwell's 1984

Can you really be sure though?

Cause everyone's happy, they're well fed, well entertained, there's no murder, no war, no sexual violence, etc... everything's peaceful. It's just that the higher ups used an unethical way to create that seemingly perfect society.

[Jolthig]

That's dystopia. Not utopia.

Speaking of that, I'm learning a lot about dystopia through Orwell's 1984

Can you really be sure though?

Cause everyone's happy, they're well fed, well entertained, there's no murder, no war, no sexual violence, etc... everything's peaceful. It's just that the higher ups used an unethical way to create that seemingly perfect society.

You mentioned mind control, and mental conditioning.

[New haven america]

Can you really be sure though?

Cause everyone's happy, they're well fed, well entertained, there's no murder, no war, no sexual violence, etc... everything's peaceful. It's just that the higher ups used an unethical way to create that seemingly perfect society.

You mentioned mind control, and mental conditioning.

Yeah, and?

Still results in a seemingly utopian society.

[Jolthig]

You mentioned mind control, and mental conditioning.

Yeah, and?

Still results in a seemingly utopian society.

Because Dystopia requires extreme indoctrination, and not to mention, chaos.

Utopia, I am unsure; other than it's simply a perfect society where there is no war or violence at all.

[Kowani]

You mentioned mind control, and mental conditioning.

Yeah, and?

Still results in a seemingly utopian society.

One man’s utopia is another’s dystopia.

[Frievolk]

You mentioned mind control, and mental conditioning.

Yeah, and?

Still results in a seemingly utopian society.

The problem is that you're assuming the way you achieve a utopia has anything to do with whether or not it is a utopia at all. Of course, the line between a utopia and a dystopia is a very thin one, and one's utopia is another's dystopia, but that's irrelevant here. Also, isn't this kinda a threadjack?

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Shariah doesn't apply to non-Muslims. Which brings me to another question. Let's say a utopian nation practices Shariah law. This is why Muslims aren't allowed to kill each other in said utopia. Then a person from a death cult moves in. Would the utopia be able to punish the cultist for murder? Please explain.

But Shariah does apply to Non-muslims, in form of Jizya.

Ok but that's about the only thing. To say that "Shari'ah applies to non-Muslims" without specifying (not saying that you didn't) would be inaccurate.

[Jolthig]

Jummah Mubarak, brothers.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Jummah Mubarak, brothers.

Jumu'ah Mubaarak

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Islamism. Only with Allah SWT will people prosper.

Speaking of which, I have an answer to the question that you asked earlier:

-snip-


In terms of Al-Islam what problems do you have with it?

-snip-

My main problems are of a theological nature; I reject one of the premises of the Abrahamic religions (in your case, Islam), namely that God/Prime Mover/First Cause sees fit to intervene in the Creation. As such, however beneficial religion may be on a societal level, I cannot in good conscience support theocratic ideologies without violating my sense of integrity. I apologize if I'm being rude.

Why do you have a problem with Allah SWT helping the creation?

[Jolthig]

Islamism. Only with Allah SWT will people prosper.

Speaking of which, I have an answer to the question that you asked earlier:

-snip-


In terms of Al-Islam what problems do you have with it?

-snip-

My main problems are of a theological nature; I reject one of the premises of the Abrahamic religions (in your case, Islam), namely that God/Prime Mover/First Cause sees fit to intervene in the Creation. As such, however beneficial religion may be on a societal level, I cannot in good conscience support theocratic ideologies without violating my sense of integrity. I apologize if I'm being rude.

I know for a fact that I dont adhere to theocracy, but I'll answer this: Allah intervenes in his creation because they are signs of his existence to humanity. He usually intervenes to save his small amount of followers from persecution, especially when those who are arrogant exceed all bounds by brutally persecuting his servants. Allah intervenes to send miracles to his servants or to punish sinners when they exceed all bounds and ignore prophetical warnings. This is the theology of the Quran.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Tracing the Forgotten Women Scholars of Islam via islamboard app http://www.hibamagazine.com/tracing-the ... -of-islam/

[Jolthig]

Tracing the Forgotten Women Scholars of Islam via islamboard app http://www.hibamagazine.com/tracing-the ... -of-islam/

We all know the best female scholar is Aisha (ra).

[Samudera Darussalam]

Christian school is not exactly a bad thing when you think about it. It allows to interact with people with different religions and that's a good thing. Opening your mind to the world sounds fair.

Indeed, it's not bad. I just think that perhaps it will be hard for some, especially who come from religious minorities, if they are not prepared to attend one. However ofc it depends on the person themselves.

[Kowani]

Speaking of which, I have an answer to the question that you asked earlier:



My main problems are of a theological nature; I reject one of the premises of the Abrahamic religions (in your case, Islam), namely that God/Prime Mover/First Cause sees fit to intervene in the Creation. As such, however beneficial religion may be on a societal level, I cannot in good conscience support theocratic ideologies without violating my sense of integrity. I apologize if I'm being rude.

I know for a fact that I dont adhere to theocracy, but I'll answer this: Allah intervenes in his creation because they are signs of his existence to humanity. He usually intervenes to save his small amount of followers from persecution, especially when those who are arrogant exceed all bounds by brutally persecuting his servants. Allah intervenes to send miracles to his servants or to punish sinners when they exceed all bounds and ignore prophetical warnings. This is the theology of the Quran.

Yes, well Muslims have been persecuted throughout history, and I’ve yet to see fire rain down from the heavens or any other sort of divine intervention. (Besides, an interventionist god has to intervene all the time in order to call himself omnibenevolent, and we all know that doesn’t happen.)

[Jolthig]

I know for a fact that I dont adhere to theocracy, but I'll answer this: Allah intervenes in his creation because they are signs of his existence to humanity. He usually intervenes to save his small amount of followers from persecution, especially when those who are arrogant exceed all bounds by brutally persecuting his servants. Allah intervenes to send miracles to his servants or to punish sinners when they exceed all bounds and ignore prophetical warnings. This is the theology of the Quran.

Yes, well Muslims have been persecuted throughout history, and I’ve yet to see fire rain down from the heavens or any other sort of divine intervention. (Besides, an interventionist god has to intervene all the time in order to call himself omnibenevolent, and we all know that doesn’t happen.)

Well for one, I dont believe fire will rain down from heaven. And two, a prophet hasn't been sent for a while until (in my beliefs as I dont represent every single Muslim here, but myself and Ahmadis) Mirza Ghulam Ahmad came.

The way we view miracles and divine intervention is that they aren't poofs. Rather, natural things happening at the right time

[El-Amin Caliphate]

I know for a fact that I dont adhere to theocracy, but I'll answer this: Allah intervenes in his creation because they are signs of his existence to humanity. He usually intervenes to save his small amount of followers from persecution, especially when those who are arrogant exceed all bounds by brutally persecuting his servants. Allah intervenes to send miracles to his servants or to punish sinners when they exceed all bounds and ignore prophetical warnings. This is the theology of the Quran.

Yes, well Muslims have been persecuted throughout history, and I’ve yet to see fire rain down from the heavens or any other sort of divine intervention. (Besides, an interventionist god has to intervene all the time in order to call himself omnibenevolent, and we all know that doesn’t happen.)

Don't put your human emotions on to Allah SWT. Allah SWT knows best what he is doing and has the best plan. One of the cornerstone of Al-Islam is Sabr (patience), Sabr until the help of Allah SWT comes however long that may be.

[A m e n r i a]

Yes, well Muslims have been persecuted throughout history, and I’ve yet to see fire rain down from the heavens or any other sort of divine intervention. (Besides, an interventionist god has to intervene all the time in order to call himself omnibenevolent, and we all know that doesn’t happen.)

Don't put your human emotions on to Allah SWT. Allah SWT knows best what he is doing and has the best plan. One of the cornerstone of Al-Islam is Sabr (patience), Sabr until the help of Allah SWT comes however long that may be.

Besides, it's never that simple. One of the things you can learn from scifi is that the balance of the multiverse is delicate and every single thing has a potential of messing up timelines and making things even worse then they already are.