14th Malaysian General Election Superthread II

[Kubumba Tribe]

Allah (SWT) is not just my god, and you didn't answer the question.

I honestly don't know if the Quran specifically bans oral and anal sex, and that's why I didn't answer.

Anal sex is haram, Oral sex isn't talked about. But the ulama disapprove.

Yes, he's also the god of a billion other people

Plus 6 billion more

not all of whom interpret his texts the same way you do; this means your specific view of him is unique

Except I don't put my opinions into my Deen. Al-Islam is based off the Holy Qur'an and Sunnah, not me.

[Senkaku]

No, he shouldn't. Punishing people for where they stick their genitals (provided all parties have consented) is horrifying.

Says who?

My friend, allow me to introduce you to a little thing we here in Western civilization call "human rights."

[Kubumba Tribe]

Says who?

My friend, allow me to introduce you to a little thing we here in Western civilization call "human rights."

>Implying they only exist in the West
Also, I don't see anywhere where Allah (SWT) said punishing sodomy is horrific in this post, either.

[Eibenland]

My friend, allow me to introduce you to a little thing we here in Western civilization call "human rights."

>Implying they only exist in the West
Also, I don't see anywhere where Allah (SWT) said punishing sodomy is horrific in this post, either.

What did Allah say the punishment should be?

[Cekoviu]

I honestly don't know if the Quran specifically bans oral and anal sex, and that's why I didn't answer.
Yes, he's also the god of a billion other people

Plus 6 billion more

That's what you think, but you really don't have any evidence for that, nor would the other 6 billion agree with your particular religion.

not all of whom interpret his texts the same way you do; this means your specific view of him is unique

Except I don't put my opinions into my Deen. Al-Islam is based off the Holy Qur'an and Sunnah, not me.

Except you do, because the Quran is ultimately interpreted by the reader. I'm not heavily familiar with the text, but allow me to use a section from the Bible as a comparison (1 John 1:10, KJV):

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

If I were in a particularly literal mood, I could interpret this to mean our lies are literally turning Jesus into a liar just by exposure, or I could actually interpret the spirit of the verse, which is that saying we have not sinned would imply that God is a liar because he says that all people sin.
This analytical process can be done to every verse of every chapter in both the Bible and the Quran, and the true meaning is further obfuscated by your chosen edition, which can drastically change the content of a verse. There is no one pure Islam aside from the one practiced by Muhammad, because all other types will be influenced by what the Muslim wants to hear. Although you could claim Quranic-only Islam is more pure, it's by no means uninfluenced by opinions.

This is more of a discussion for the Islam thread, so we should get back to the original point, which you've so far not made a case for: why does Al-Islam get to be the basis for Malaysia's law?

[Cekoviu]

My friend, allow me to introduce you to a little thing we here in Western civilization call "human rights."

>Implying they only exist in the West
Also, I don't see anywhere where Allah (SWT) said punishing sodomy is horrific in this post, either.

I never claimed he did. Actually, using Allah as a basis for not punishing it is also pretty bad (though slightly less so), because you're still operating under a theocracy.

[Cekoviu]

I honestly don't know if the Quran specifically bans oral and anal sex, and that's why I didn't answer.

Anal sex is haram,

Could you point me to where that's stated?

Oral sex isn't talked about. But the ulama disapprove.

Ah, so you don't use Allah's word only for your basis, you also use the words of cherrypicked scholars. This further diminishes the accuracy of your form of Islam.

[Nouveau Yathrib]

This is a rather shocking turn of events: "Mahathir Mohamad's alliance wins 113 seats in parliament, ending the 60-year reign of the ruling Barisan Nasional."

Al Jazeera- Malaysia's opposition pulls off shocking election win

[Britannic Unity]

It's funny because UMNO lost, and this pleases me to no end.

[Tebuh]

Congratulations to my brothers across the border for getting rid of corrupt Razak. I would've hoped for a Gagasan Sejahtera victory, but Malaysia without Razak is a better Malaysia.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Plus 6 billion more

That's what you think, but you really don't have any evidence for that.

http://legacy.quran.com/3/51

Except you do, because the Quran is ultimately interpreted by the reader.

You should learn about Al-Islam before saying anymore.

This is more of a discussion for the Islam thread, so we should get back to the original point, which you've so far not made a case for: why does Al-Islam get to be the basis for Malaysia's law?

That's not even the original point.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

>Implying they only exist in the West
Also, I don't see anywhere where Allah (SWT) said punishing sodomy is horrific in this post, either.

What did Allah say the punishment should be?

http://legacy.quran.com/24/2

Plus 6 billion more

That's what you think, but you really don't have any evidence for that.

http://legacy.quran.com/3/51

Except you do, because the Quran is ultimately interpreted by the reader.

You should learn about Al-Islam before saying anymore.

This is more of a discussion for the Islam thread, so we should get back to the original point, which you've so far not made a case for: why does Al-Islam get to be the basis for Malaysia's law?

That's not even the original point.

>Implying they only exist in the West
Also, I don't see anywhere where Allah (SWT) said punishing sodomy is horrific in this post, either.

I never claimed he did. Actually, using Allah as a basis for not punishing it is also pretty bad (though slightly less so), because you're still operating under a theocracy.

Exactly

Anal sex is haram,

Could you point me to where that's stated?

https://sunnah.com/abudawud/30/1

Ah, so you don't use Allah's word only for your basis, you also use the words of cherrypicked scholars. This further diminishes the accuracy of your form of Islam.

You should learn about Al-Islam before saying anymore. You should also stop making assumptions.

[Cekoviu]

That's what you think, but you really don't have any evidence for that.

http://legacy.quran.com/3/51

The Quran is not evidence.

Except you do, because the Quran is ultimately interpreted by the reader.

You should learn about Al-Islam before saying anymore.

Nice dodge.

This is more of a discussion for the Islam thread, so we should get back to the original point, which you've so far not made a case for: why does Al-Islam get to be the basis for Malaysia's law?

That's not even the original point.

It was, and once again, you've failed to answer it.

[Cekoviu]

Could you point me to where that's stated?

https://sunnah.com/abudawud/30/1

Ah, that is pretty explicit.

Ah, so you don't use Allah's word only for your basis, you also use the words of cherrypicked scholars. This further diminishes the accuracy of your form of Islam.

You should learn about Al-Islam before saying anymore. You should also stop making assumptions.

I haven't made any assumptions beyond what you've said, m8.

[Idzequitch]

After some delay, apparently spurred by constitutional questions (they haven't transitioned power between parties before, after all), Mahathir Mohamed has officially been sworn in as PM of Malaysia.

[San Lumen]

After some delay, apparently spurred by constitutional questions (they haven't transitioned power between parties before, after all), Mahathir Mohamed has officially been sworn in as PM of Malaysia.

Wonderful to know there was a peaceful transition of power and the former PM left office without any shenanigans and respected the will of the people

[Ascysia]

Pakatan Harapan's election success is a victory for advocates of liberal democracy in such a volatile region.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

It was, and once again, you've failed to answer it.

No it wasn't. This was:

Quite a few human rights organizations, for one.

Oh ok, but not Allah (SWT)?

[Cekoviu]

It was, and once again, you've failed to answer it.

No it wasn't. This was:

Oh ok, but not Allah (SWT)?

Lmao no.

[Kubumba Tribe]

No it wasn't. This was:

Lmao no.

Oh ok. So since Allah (SWT) said otherwise, y'all's points are moot.
Case closed.

[Cekoviu]

Lmao no.

Oh ok. So since Allah (SWT) said otherwise, y'all's points are moot.
Case closed.

Um, no it's not.

[Nerovia]

The election of the new prime minister is a great step forward for Malaysia. It will be really interesting to see what this new PM will do in the coming weeks.

[Major-Tom]

I've been meaning to post this here, but since my aforementioned post congratulating the new government (I think it was 2 days ago), I quickly learned that when he was PM, Malaysia was still a very illiberal democracy where Mahathir was known to violate human rights and suppress freedom of the press. I'm just saying, it's great that BN and Najib Razak lost (they were crooks), but Malaysia may not see much change at all.

Props to Neu Leonstein for encouraging me to do research. I knew Marathir was PM, but I didn't know he had served for such a long time, or that he is far, far from a saint or someone who will likely end corruption and systemic illiberalism in Malaysia.

But perhaps I'm being pessimistic.

[Idzequitch]

I've been meaning to post this here, but since my aforementioned post congratulating the new government (I think it was 2 days ago), I quickly learned that when he was PM, Malaysia was still a very illiberal democracy where Mahathir was known to violate human rights and suppress freedom of the press. I'm just saying, it's great that BN and Najib Razak lost (they were crooks), but Malaysia may not see much change at all.

Props to Neu Leonstein for encouraging me to do research. I knew Marathir was PM, but I didn't know he had served for such a long time, or that he is far, far from a saint or someone who will likely end corruption and systemic illiberalism in Malaysia.

But perhaps I'm being pessimistic.

Rather a strange situation isn't it? He leads as PM for 22 years in the ruling party, grooms the current PM, bails on him, and then the most establishment candidate to ever exist becomes the one who leads the opposition to victory.

Then if that's not enough for you, add in the fact that the guy the opposition really wanted as PM (Anwar) is a political prisoner convicted of sodomy. And the establishment/opposition guy who won the election and who is supposedly going to hand the position to Anwar, also had him jailed for sodomy in the late 90's.

You couldn't write a story like this. Will be fascinating to see what pans out.

[Bakery Hill]

I honestly don't know if the Quran specifically bans oral and anal sex, and that's why I didn't answer.

Anal sex is haram, Oral sex isn't talked about. But the ulama disapprove.

Indeed, the learned Mufti Khaled Mohammed Khaled is particularly opposed to it.